D&D Subclass Contest Chat Thread 2: Joke Entries Win with Alarming Frequency

[BerzerkerUnit]

And here we go again :)

Spoiler: Bardic College: Library Sciences

Show

A little bit of bolding would make things a lot easier to read :)

Collection of Tomes - Clarification, is this any ability check that utilizes Wis, Int, or Cha or a direct check against Wis, Int, or Cha? This makes a significant difference since otherwise you are effectively giving expertise on more than half the skills (something terribly broken).

Loose Characters - This is an interesting feature, how do you get rid of someone you summoned? How long do they stay summoned?

As a side note, it is unusual that you don't have a use of bardic inspiration usage at level 3

Worlds Collide - How long does this last? What is stopping you from summoning an area in the center of a volcano and sticking people in there?

You have a good theme going here, but I think it needs to be more fleshed out. More of the how longs and more clarification on what you can exactly do.

Thanks for the feedback. You aren't creating life, it's more like conjuring someone from an alternate reality. You can get rid of your summons the same ways you can get rid of anyone you don't like, kick to curb and/or murder. I guess you can also summon new people until the one you want gone loses their charmed status and wanders off. Then you're just giving the DM a plot where one of your cast offs Kill Bills you.

This feature was supposed to require bardic inspiration, but because of its relative strength I decided scaling on proficiency was less likely to lead to abuse.

Collection of Tomes was supposed to be expertise on skills you're already proficient in and proficiency in a mental/social ones (a modest benefit given jack of all trades is already giving you half that bonus and only provided you pull out a book (which you might not have access to if you're a hostage, etc. The book would require a free hand, the object interaction to draw, etc, so it's not unlimited use even if there's no cap on its use).

Worlds Collide in a volcano would just wreck an area of the lava as described. If you summon it above the lava and let it drop in I'd think the DM would be well within their rights to say it sinks or breaks apart on impact and rendered to slag

[Damon_Tor]

Titan's Grip - I love the support for dual wielding heavy weapons, but maybe categorize by the two-handed property rather than the damage dice? If you can dual wield lances unmounted, why not glaives? Also love the support for weapon summon abilities. I just in general love when subclasses take abilities outside of immediate context into proper consideration.

I don't actually consider the interchangeability of similar weapons a new rule, but rather an extension of the way the "improvised weapon" rules allow an object which is similar to a given weapon to be used as that weapon: this is why it's in a sidebar. A greatsword is similar enough to a large short sword to make use of this rule. So to be clear, you aren't dual wielding lances, you are treating two lances as improvised large spears. The problem with a similar exchange for glaives is that there are no small, one-handed polearms, though you could have a very similar build by dual wielding large whips (2d4 is near enough to 1d10)

Argaen Forge - It seems a little odd to have an entire level dedicated to giving yourself the ability to access your class's required tools. Don't get me wrong, I LIKE this - it's great to have the option to simply upgrade what you have rather than having to go bargain hunting for exactly what you need.

I don't see it as any different from classes/subclasses that have "your attacks with X count as magical". It fills a need, but isn't very exciting.

But the second clause has me a little confused. The ability to do a full week's labor in a day, with no limiters except an exhaustion point? If it's as universally applicable as it sounds, then that means with a few artificer levels, you have a magic item manufactorium with an absolutely massive 7x speed boost. I like the sound of it - just be sure you're ok with having a universal 7x crafting speed boost on demand.

I don't have balance concerns about this: by the time this combo would come online casters (and full-classed artificers) will already have fabricate.

Destroyer - Hm. The feature is fine, it just highlights for me that it seems odd that you're normally completely unable to attack at all with a large weapon while not raging.

That's true. All barbarian subclasses focus on rage, and any combat abilities they gain from the subclass are tied to the rage mechanic. As far as I know there aren't any exceptions to this, so this barbarian lacking access to their subclass feature outside of rage isn't a unique limitation.

This feature also gives no combat bonuses, so be sure you're ok with the only combat capabilities granted over ten levels being a few more damage dice with a weapon that is only situationally even usable, and even then with an attack penalty.

I think of this ability is an invitation for violent creativity with destructible terrain elements, which I think would be fun as heck, in or out of combat. One of my favorite spells right now is shatter for exactly this reason, it's great to be able to blow the floor out from under someone's feet or drop a tree on someone.

Further, I've always thought of the Path of the Totem as one of the best designed barbarian subclasses, and it also features out-of-combat abilities at 6th and 10th levels. But I'll reconsider. Maybe some defensive benefit while fighting larger opponents?

Titanic Mastery - Seems odd that this is the capstone rather than the first benefit. Other than that, they look like fun options. Does Titan Sweep make you attack EVERY creature in your reach, including allies?

Yes. It also attacks objects. I recommend you don't use it around load-bearing walls. Or do.

And it seems odd to me that one would consider the cover granted by enemies in the way when throwing a massive weapon at all, and the kill clause is also very situational. Instead, consider forcing each creature hit to make a Strength save or be shoved into an adjacent square by the impact. If a creature makes their save, the attack against the next creature in the line is at -1 (stacking as one goes).

Mostly the kill clause for cover ignorance is for objects providing cover (even total cover), creating synergy with the Destroyer feature. I feel like making every creature roll a save on top of every attack roll could be a lot of rolls in one turn, especially since the ability can be used a whole lot, every turn while raging.

Have your read the Path of Unshackled Steel barbarian subclass? It does something very, very similar to this, but approaches it from a different angle. It does some things better, and other things worse, I recommend reading it if you haven't already.

I'll check it out, thanks.

Don't forget Cloud and Sephiroth as examples from another genre, although you don't need more support for why this is here, you have plenty.

I did make note of Cloud when discussing examples, but I didn't provide an illustration.

Titan's Grip - I do have some more questions about "large weapons." Do they lose other properties? What is considered finesse for dex attacks or heavy for GWM? Also, as it is right now, you are allowed large bows and crossbows. Is that okay with you?

A greatsword you are treating as a large shortsword has all the properties of a shortsword and none of the properties of a greatsword: it is light and finesse, it is not two-handed nor heavy. The ability is limited to melee weapons: "starting at third level, you can wield melee weapons made for large creatures (hereafter simply called "large weapons") while raging."

Argean Forge - I consider this a fluff ability personally. It's cool thematically and theatrically, but really only makes a difference in the character once they pick up a magical weapon (and I imagine that any DM allowing this class would allow you to find mundane large weapons fairly easily). I feel like level 6 needs something else, maybe an extra skill proficiency or something like that.

Well it does give you a tool proficiency, as well as the work-week-in-a-day ability. Out-of-combat benefits to be sure, but I think they're better benefits than things like Spirit Walker or Consult the Spirits.

Destroyer - Again, this is a cool ability but still pretty fluffy. I am not sure about your games, but the attacking on object doesn't happen all that often that an extra levels worth of skills should be devoted to it. I'm not sure what would fit in here best, but you need another minor or circumstantial ability to make level 10 feel worthwhile getting to.[/quote]

Maybe I'm blessed with more creative players than most, because my table attacks/casts spells at environmental elements all the time. That said, you're the second person to bring up this objection, so I'll rethink the way the class is set up.

Titan Sweep - This is a brutal ability, especially with a reach weapon (and a Bugbear). Sure it's somewhat edge case, but a Bugbear with an oversized reach weapon can make an attack with the weapon against all creatures and objects in a 15 foot radius. That has potential to be a lot of creatures and a lot of damage each round.[/quote]

Sounds great to me.

For the level 14 ability, I don't see myself using anything other than Titan Sweep and Titanic Toss. The other two abilities are good, but nothing compared to the effectiveness of those two in normal situations.

That's fine, I feel like there's room for several play styles here. And bugbears are explicitly one of the races I would like to see attracted to this class, so I'm pleased there's synergy.

As a side note in your Q&A, as a Giant Ape you don't know how to wield weapons. So, it would be cool but still not that effective.

Sure, you'd lose your proficiency, and the Giant Ape's fists already do 3d10 damage (with a 2x multiattack) so yes you're right it wouldn't be a very good tactic.

Overall, I think you have a really cool subclass here, it fits well into the Manga/Comic/Video Game/movie trope and fits the theme really well. As I mentioned in the comments, you have a few levels that are pretty dead and should be boosted.

Right now I'm thinking about scrapping Argean Forge, moving Destroyer up to 6th level, then putting in a defensive ability in at 10th, probably something to help you tank hits from larger opponents, but I don't really know exactly what form that ability will take yet.

[CountDVB]

And here we go again :)

Spoiler: Sorcerous Origin: Draconic Elementalist

Show

Draconic Element - The damage absorption is a problem here that it allows you to gain HP. If you gain HP through fire and an ally has control flames, create bonfire, or any other cantrip that does fire damage you will never not be at full HP. The better way to do this would be to give THP all the time (no matter how many HP you have). Since current THP are replaced with new THP it helps.

-Lightning - How many lightning attack paralyze? I can't think of any off the top of my head.

Elemental Dragon’s Roar - I'm not saying it's wrong, but it is odd that you don't have variable damage in this at all. Straight damage is not used all that ften.

Dracoelemental Body - So you AC is now 13+Dex+Cha? Seems like that will end up being pretty high for a sorcerer (as in a minimum of 18 AC in a caster class). Other than the AC change, this seems fine to me.

Dragon Force - This seems fine to me.

There is some overlap with the Draconic Sorcerer, but there is enough of a difference that they feel unique.

Well, they are based on Dragon magic, which is probably why, but well, couldn't resist given how much Fairy Tail is.

I like the temporary HP idea so I'll use that.

As for the for the lightning attack thing, well I can't think of anything else right now so I'd appreciate some suggestions.

Straight damage I figured could be for some fun

I thought base unarmored AC was 10? so with Dracoelemental body, your new unarmored base AC would be 10 + Dex modifier + Charisma modifier

Thank you very much

[Lvl45DM!]

Honestly I was torn between doing a Dunedain Ranger from Lord of The Rings or a Knight of the Round Table from Holy Grail.

But I take my DnD seriously I guess. And Rangers dont get enough love.

So allow me to present my rough-as Conclave of the Dunedain.

[nickl_2000]

More entries? More reviews

Spoiler: Primal Path: Path of the Reaver

Show

Alright, I saw path of the Reaver and immediately went to a different place than Dragonage.

Blood Frenzy - The interesting thing on this is that it encourages the barbarian to be sword and board rather than a GWM barbarian. I'm actually glad to see that as a S&B style player (since you resist less damage it it better to not get hit as much). This class really does want you to be doing critical damage, with the extra die that will make a 19 very exciting.

Devour - This is a bit of a bookkeeping nightmare for the player/DM. For any particular creature the player kills, they will need to keep track of the CR and all the saves for this creature. I don't see the CR as a big deal really, but the saves are a little bit more of a struggle (especially if the DM doesn't want to give the players the saves on a particular creature since they will be running into more of them in the future). It may be simpler for saves to give advantage on the saving throws rather than use the consumed creatures saves instead. Although now that I read it again, the CR thing isn't a big deal because it only lasts until the end of your next turn.

"A creature whose essence was devoured this way cannot be returned to life by means of spells, unless a spell of 7th level or higher is used." can be simplified by "A creature whose essence was devoured this way cannot be returned to life by a spell of lower than 7th level."

Terrifying Fury - Okay, I was bothered by this at first thinking it would trigger to often when you have advantage (especially with elven accuracy). However, since it only last until the end of your next turn it isn't as bad.

So, overall you have hit your aim. This is definitely a glass canon style barbarian, which is a very different design space than most barbarians. You did a good job making sure that you can't abuse this with multiclassing. It looks good to me :)

Spoiler: Ranger Conclave: The Dunedain

Show

Dunedain Endurance - The part of this feature where you lose exhaustion during a short rest is a duplicate of the 10th level Tireless feature of Tasha's option ranger abilities. It's very fitting to the theme and the character, but it may be worth changing that some (maybe something that prevent exhaustion rather than curing it) to prevent overlap of abilities.

Hands of a Healer - Personal pet peeve here. If they do have medicine proficiency, they don't get anything from this. Either give expertise or the choice of another ranger skill if they do have it. That way it isn't worthless.

Ancient Lore - I don't see the need to make this only for only 1 creature type. You only get to use it once per long rest, and there is a save vs the charm affect. You could easily open this to all creature types and it wouldn't cause any problems at all. Also, you didn't mention the action cost for Friend.

Will of the Dunedain - Seems fine to me.

The Return of The King - You forgot to mention the level here. Also, did you mean to limit the amount of times you can do this? I think at will is a little much. Especially if you can get something like a flaming sphere up and do damage with your bonus action.

Well, they are based on Dragon magic, which is probably why, but well, couldn't resist given how much Fairy Tail is.

I like the temporary HP idea so I'll use that.

As for the for the lightning attack thing, well I can't think of anything else right now so I'd appreciate some suggestions.

Straight damage I figured could be for some fun

I thought base unarmored AC was 10? so with Dracoelemental body, your new unarmored base AC would be 10 + Dex modifier + Charisma modifier

Thank you very much

Base unarmored AC is 10, but you are a sorcerer and will be casting Mage armor with a 1st level slot to get 3 extra AC (because why wouldn't you). That is where I got 13 + Dex + Cha. Mage Armor is not considered armor nor is it a shield. This gets even higher if you have magical items that boost your AC.

Let me think on the lightning ability. Shocking Grasp removes your reaction. Lightning Lure pulls people towards you. That's all that spells that do lightning damage do, everything else is straight lightning damage. Damage resistance would be the easy fallback damage type. Grounding someone else so they don't take lightning damage would be cool. Maybe if you take lightning damage, you can use your reaction to grab someone and pass some of the damage along to them (since electric charge passes through one object to another). That is what I have right now, but I will think on more.

[Lvl45DM!]

Spoiler: Ranger Conclave: The Dunedain

Show

Dunedain Endurance - The part of this feature where you lose exhaustion during a short rest is a duplicate of the 10th level Tireless feature of Tasha's option ranger abilities. It's very fitting to the theme and the character, but it may be worth changing that some (maybe something that prevent exhaustion rather than curing it) to prevent overlap of abilities.

Hands of a Healer - Personal pet peeve here. If they do have medicine proficiency, they don't get anything from this. Either give expertise or the choice of another ranger skill if they do have it. That way it isn't worthless.

Ancient Lore - I don't see the need to make this only for only 1 creature type. You only get to use it once per long rest, and there is a save vs the charm affect. You could easily open this to all creature types and it wouldn't cause any problems at all. Also, you didn't mention the action cost for Friend.

Will of the Dunedain - Seems fine to me.

The Return of The King - You forgot to mention the level here. Also, did you mean to limit the amount of times you can do this? I think at will is a little much. Especially if you can get something like a flaming sphere up and do damage with your bonus action.

Endurance: Ugh really? I didnt get Tashas. I just wanted a Strider ability that wasnt just extra movement. Call it twice as long to gain levels of endurance naturally?

Hands of a Healer:Yeah they can pick another skill seems fair.

Ancient Lore:Ah yeah thats cos I toned it down from all creatures in 30ft without making something else stronger. Yknow cos Aragorn had an army. But then i realized thats an encounter ender and I dont like those sort of abilities.

Return of the King:I was sorta on the fence about that, but I wasnt thinking about BA. Definitely a limit. Whats sorta annoying is that thematically its a CHA ability but making it tied to CHA would be clunky on the rest of the chassis.

[nickl_2000]

Endurance: Ugh really? I didnt get Tashas. I just wanted a Strider ability that wasnt just extra movement. Call it twice as long to gain levels of endurance naturally?

Hands of a Healer:Yeah they can pick another skill seems fair.

Ancient Lore:Ah yeah thats cos I toned it down from all creatures in 30ft without making something else stronger. Yknow cos Aragorn had an army. But then i realized thats an encounter ender and I dont like those sort of abilities.

Return of the King:I was sorta on the fence about that, but I wasnt thinking about BA. Definitely a limit. Whats sorta annoying is that thematically its a CHA ability but making it tied to CHA would be clunky on the rest of the chassis.

Endurance:
-You can do a forced march extra without getting exhaustion
-once per long rest you can shrug off an effect that would cause a level of exhaustion (similar function, but not overlapping).
-You can go without sleep for a longer period of time

Just a few ideas.

[Damon_Tor]

Hands of a Healer - Personal pet peeve here. If they do have medicine proficiency, they don't get anything from this. Either give expertise or the choice of another ranger skill if they do have it. That way it isn't worthless.

IIRC, there's already a provision in the general rules that if you would ever gain a proficiency you already have, you can get a different proficiency of the same type of your choice instead. It's possible I'm misremembering that though.

[Lvl45DM!]

IIRC, there's already a provision in the general rules that if you would ever gain a proficiency you already have, you can get a different proficiency of the same type of your choice instead. It's possible I'm misremembering that though.

It is! PHB 125

[Twelvetrees]

Cannibal Witch is ready for review. I'm not happy with how poorly the 6th and 10th level features work together so if someone has a better idea for the 6th level feature, I'd love to hear. it.

[nickl_2000]

IIRC, there's already a provision in the general rules that if you would ever gain a proficiency you already have, you can get a different proficiency of the same type of your choice instead. It's possible I'm misremembering that though.

It is! PHB 125

I always assumed that applied to backgrounds only since it was in the background section. Especially since the newer books (Tasha's) use this language for the armorer

"You also gain proficiency with smith’s tools. If you already have this tool proficiency, you gain proficiency with one other type of artisan’s tools of your choice."


Either way, it doesn't hurt to put it in there for clarities sake.

Cannibal Witch is ready for review. I'm not happy with how poorly the 6th and 10th level features work together so if someone has a better idea for the 6th level feature, I'd love to hear. it.

Spoiler: Cannibal Witch Review

Show

Okay, so both the level 2 features feel like fluff features to me. They are neat and they are thematic, but they won't make a huge difference in the game. There is nothing in there that yells to me, this is what I will be doing all that time that fits the theme and makes me more powerful.

Maybe your house can have a charm affect where while it is standing all creatures within a certain distance must make a save or be charmed and forced to move towards the cottage and spend their action eating it? Or maybe if they do eat it they must make a con save or have their speed slowed for 1 minute (because they are so full of sweet). Something that has either direct or indirect combat implications.

Fatten Them Up - That is a lot of temp hp. When you are level 10 you are giving 50 hp, considering a fighter at that level would have 86 you are adding over 50% more hp to them. This gets to be even more when it's factored into a barbarian who gets damage resistances. Personally, I would look to make this a smaller about and allow you to do it once per person per short rest. That way is has an impact on the game, but it is spread more evenly around. Another possible issue here is the feeding of it to enemies or people that aren't enemies. You can force feed them food and give them disadvantage from your suggestion and charm spells forever basically. The concept is a cool one, but how does the NPC avoid that?

Into the Oven - How many people can be in the oven at once?

Cook and Eat Them - Do my a favor and say that your regain hit points equal to their hit dice (rounded down). That way it's extremely clear that you can't just start throwing CR 1/8 creature in there until you are at full hit points.


So, I don't see an issue with the level 6 and 10 features not working together. Both of the are related to your theme and it makes it so you get a feature when your house has been destroyed.

[Lvl45DM!]

I always assumed that applied to backgrounds only since it was in the background section. Especially since the newer books (Tasha's) use this language for the armorer

"You also gain proficiency with smith’s tools. If you already have this tool proficiency, you gain proficiency with one other type of artisan’s tools of your choice."


Either way, it doesn't hurt to put it in there for clarity's sake.

It specifies "any source". But it doesn't hurt, no.

[Lvl 2 Expert]

I actually got an idea these last few days. I think I'll be competing this round, if someone doesn't beat me to the execution.

[Ilerien]

Spoiler: Primal Path: Path of the Reaver

Show

Alright, I saw path of the Reaver and immediately went to a different place than Dragonage.

Blood Frenzy - The interesting thing on this is that it encourages the barbarian to be sword and board rather than a GWM barbarian. I'm actually glad to see that as a S&B style player (since you resist less damage it it better to not get hit as much). This class really does want you to be doing critical damage, with the extra die that will make a 19 very exciting.

Devour - This is a bit of a bookkeeping nightmare for the player/DM. For any particular creature the player kills, they will need to keep track of the CR and all the saves for this creature. I don't see the CR as a big deal really, but the saves are a little bit more of a struggle (especially if the DM doesn't want to give the players the saves on a particular creature since they will be running into more of them in the future). It may be simpler for saves to give advantage on the saving throws rather than use the consumed creatures saves instead. Although now that I read it again, the CR thing isn't a big deal because it only lasts until the end of your next turn.

"A creature whose essence was devoured this way cannot be returned to life by means of spells, unless a spell of 7th level or higher is used." can be simplified by "A creature whose essence was devoured this way cannot be returned to life by a spell of lower than 7th level."

Terrifying Fury - Okay, I was bothered by this at first thinking it would trigger to often when you have advantage (especially with elven accuracy). However, since it only last until the end of your next turn it isn't as bad.

So, overall you have hit your aim. This is definitely a glass canon style barbarian, which is a very different design space than most barbarians. You did a good job making sure that you can't abuse this with multiclassing. It looks good to me :)

Thank you for taking a look!
Your suggested wording improvements are sound and much appreciated! :)

I have to admit, I don't entirely like the saving throw boost option of Devour precisely for the same reason: if devoured creature's CR is just one number to keep track of, saves are the whole 6 more, so a DM would have to look up the save modifiers when their player uses this option. I'm reluctant to give an advantage and call it a day because it should be dependent in some way of the creature devoured. Maybe just give a CR/2 bonus? Would be more powerful, but not really a big deal I think.

Elven accuracy doesn't work with strength-based attacks, so it won't work with reckless attack (that gives advantage only to strength-based attacks).
The effect of Terrifying Fury itself is kind of in line with 10th level feature of Berserker. Doesn't take up an action itself and affects more targets, sure, but actually triggering it requires some measure of luck. Has particularly good DC out of the box for pretty much any barbarian, but once an enemy makes the save, it's immune to further occurrences of this feature.

[Damon_Tor]

Changelog: I removed the Argean Forge ability from the Path of the Titan and moved Destroyer to 6th level. At 10th level they gain "Clash", a defensive reaction to being hit with a melee weapon attack, reducing the damage by the result of a strength (athletics) check. If you reduce the damage to zero you totally overpower the incoming attack and get to make a free melee weapon attack against the opponent.

This is supposed to model the iconic weapon clash, especially popular between characters with massive freaking weapons:

Spoiler: Example

Show

EDIT: Thinking about it, Inuyasha might be my closest archetype, using his (racially derived) claws most of the time then pulling out his magical x-box-hueg sword when something really needs its ass kicked. This is especially true at the start of the story, then relying more and more on his sword as the story progresses (ie, as he gains barbarian levels and can rage more often). And he is definitely an emotional, reckless fighter, fitting the barbarian class to a T.

[Damon_Tor]

re: Battling Bowman

How about a grappling-hook arrow?

Great subclass. I'd like it if you replaced some of the instances of the word "arrow" with the more generic "projectile". It would be good, I think, to allow the class to function with crossbows and slings as well. (IIRC, kobolds have, or maybe had in past editions, an NPC type that uses a sling to launch clay pots filled with glue or smoke bombs. This subclass could model that mechanic.)

[nickl_2000]

re: Battling Bowman

How about a grappling-hook arrow?

Great subclass. I'd like it if you replaced some of the instances of the word "arrow" with the more generic "projectile". It would be good, I think, to allow the class to function with crossbows and slings as well. (IIRC, kobolds have, or maybe had in past editions, an NPC type that uses a sling to launch clay pots filled with glue or smoke bombs. This subclass could model that mechanic.)

Thanks for taking a look.

Good call, while this is modelled after the Green Arrow and Hawkeye, it was intended to be applicable to all projectiles (bolts, arrows, thrown daggers, darts, sling bullets, etc).

I added in the grappling hook projectile trick shot since that it pretty iconic. I actually left it out since it seemed pretty abusable, but I think I locked it down well enough to keep it to the intended purposes

[MoleMage]

Alright I'm torn. Which of these would people like to see?

Mantis Kinden Ranger (based on Adrian Tchaikovsky's Shadows of the Apt book series) [Includes a "birthright" mechanic that I haven't figured out yet but probably just means mutual exclusivity with other birthrights.]
Way of the Mists (based on Brandon Sanderson's Mistborn series)
Hollowborn Fighter (Based on the video game Hollow Knight)
Malaised One Fighter (Based on the video game Dead Cells) [Includes a "roguelike" inspired mechanic where each day you get random boons or penalties, encouraging you to adjust your playstyle on the fly]
Way of the Watcher (Based on the video game Slay the Spire) [Honestly might just use still yet more stances; it's her thing in-game]

[nickl_2000]

Alright I'm torn. Which of these would people like to see?

Mantis Kinden Ranger (based on Adrian Tchaikovsky's Shadows of the Apt book series) [Includes a "birthright" mechanic that I haven't figured out yet but probably just means mutual exclusivity with other birthrights.]
Way of the Mists (based on Brandon Sanderson's Mistborn series)
Hollowborn Fighter (Based on the video game Hollow Knight)
Malaised One Fighter (Based on the video game Dead Cells) [Includes a "roguelike" inspired mechanic where each day you get random boons or penalties, encouraging you to adjust your playstyle on the fly]
Way of the Watcher (Based on the video game Slay the Spire) [Honestly might just use still yet more stances; it's her thing in-game]

I personally vote for Way of the Mist, but that is because it is the only one of those I've read or played.

[RickAsWritten]

Way of the Watcher (Based on the video game Slay the Spire) [Honestly might just use still yet more stances; it's her thing in-game]

Hah, I've spent the last few days chewing over how I could get the Defect or the Silent to transfer over to 5e mechanics. That game is so, so good. Can't go wrong with Mistborn (or anything BrandoSando) either.

[MoleMage]

Hah, I've spent the last few days chewing over how I could get the Defect or the Silent to transfer over to 5e mechanics. That game is so, so good. Can't go wrong with Mistborn (or anything BrandoSando) either.

It was a tossup between Silent and Watcher for me to put on that list.

EDIT: I think the Defect needs a whole class; its mechanics just don't line up with anything in 5e so far.

[Lvl45DM!]

Added a few adjustments to the Dunedain ranger.

[RickAsWritten]

My entry is up. A fighter subclass based on everyone's favorite Irish corporate hitman, Zane from Borderlands 3. Truth be told, in regards to the balance...I'm not sure if I "hit a cows arse with a banjo," but it's done and it stays mostly true to the character.

Fighter Archetype: Magitech Mercenary

[Phhase]

More text.

Spoiler: What if Ranger was good?

Show

Sorry I meant to say, Arrowman Artificer.

I like Quick quiver. Does it function like a magazine for a crossbow? Potentially making it effectively a repeater? Would be sweet. Also, if you're proficient with improvised weapons (c.f. Tavern Brawler feat, I think) can you store pretty much anything of a certain size in the quiver? The part where it says that items stored are not lost on destruction makes me think it'd be a REALLY good alternative to leomund's secret chest in a pinch.

Interesting to make the specialized ammunition a maneuver-like system rather than, well, just specialized ammunition. That you can make. It's not a problem just a quirk to me. The fact that you inevitably learn all the maneuvers does feel odd though, kinda like Legolas is a wasted subclass feature. What if you learn more at certain milestones after the first level and just have something else in that spot? + to uses on rolling initiative is usually a capstone ribbon (which is odd since the capstone already does that).

I think calling Speedy Extra Attack would be good, since that's what it is. Something about specific rules interactions between class features and the "Extra Attack" feature specifically. I forget the details, but there's some sort of mechanical significance to it somewhere. Unless you foresaw that and are ok with odd stacking interactions, naturally.

Hmm, What dyou think about grappling or restraining your target with the bola arrow instead, spellpower as escape DC? For the Glue then I'd maybe try the effect that the UA artificer tanglefoot bag formula has, an AOE of diffucult terrain and then starting your turn in it reduces your speed by half again, so effectively 1/4 speed zone.

What happens if you shoot a creature with a grapple? Can you pull then out of the sky? Out of a fall? Like a harpoon towards you?

Rain arrows are pretty badass. Does it enable the use of Call Lightning?

I like the capstone, looks good. Overall, pretty good!

Spoiler: Reaver

Show

I like blood frenzy. The near death mechanics and trading resistances for damage is a cool idea. Does the critical strike enhancer stack with other sources of such effects? Also the wording on the last feature is a little confusing, say the "When you are at half or less of your max hp, then..." part first.

Devour is also a cool feature. I like having choices. I assume the Extra necrotic damage is 1d8 minimum for a CR 1 Creature? You've got some bag-of-rats protection in there, and I kind of like that you don't have to be raging to use this feature. Does the necrotic damage double on a crit like a smite? Do you declare it before or after an attack hits? Useless in single combat, though, which I think is a fair trade off given its power and the flavor of the archetype.

I like aura of pain too, lots of good features here! The Devour Synergy is great. I just wonder if you'd consider a flat save penalty over disadvantage. Although literally that's only because I associate AoE pain debuff effects with 3.5e Symbol of pain which inflicts flat penalties (I think).

Terrifying Fury is ok. I'm not sure how good it is considering it only lasts one turn, relies on crits, and has an immunity clause, but I think the otherwise unlimited use balances it out? It's cool, at any rate.

Good entry, very cohesive, concise, and interesting! Gives me Guts vibes.

Spoiler: Aragorn

Show

Only note for Endurance is that the definition of "natural exhaustion gain rate" is a very blurry concept you may want to look into.

Endurance and maxed short rests are both niche but very good in a hardcore campaign. Good design.

I like the idea of having favored friends as a variant on favored enemies, that's a cool idea. To be clear, you get resistance whether or not the attempt succeeds, right? I also like that that you get some hard benefits alongside the soft informational benefits that might not be as useful if you accidentally memorize monster statblocks the way I do (although it'd still be amazing against nonstandard enemies).

Everything looks fine! Good recreation of that one guy from that one trilogy. I probably wouldn't play as this, but I'd be happy to have one in the party.

Spoiler: Gingerbread House Resident

Show

Just summon a wholeass gingerbread house. I love it, that's hilarious.

Oooh, I like the idea of trading off making enemies tougher to make them softer for your spells, interesting.

How many creatures can fit in the oven at once? Does it affect allies too? And what's the max creature size? That could be pretty OP in the right scenario. Especially since you effectively have to make 2 saving throws in a row to successfully escape the oven, because you make the first save at the end of your turn, then start your turn next to it again forcing another save.

Cook and eat is a bit meh though, although the fact that it fails bag of rats makes it obtusely useful.

Overall a pretty sweet meme subclass lol.

Spoiler: Borderlander

Show

Missed one "defender" when retrofitting the text, in the mending clause. I like the ranged attack fire support. If you communicate with it remotely, does that mean you can make skill checks at basically any range?

Barrier seems decent.

Cloner is ok. Lacking in any depth, but mechanically solid, I think? It it good enough? I dunno.

Since only one ability has either one of the specified clauses, I don't think you need to be so general with Kill Skill.

Does the duplicate gain the benefits of any buff spells or other enhancers like magic weapons that you are currently benefiting from? That could be pretty sweet. Also, what does "One use of the indomitable ability" mean? I didn't see any such ability.

Overall decent. I trust it's faithful to the source material, but I personally feel it lacks something. I dunno, I'm probably wrong.

<Dragonelement Sorc>
Having looked over the change to Dragonelement Sorcerer, I think you're trying to cram an entire subclass with a separate playstyle into a single class feature. I understand the angle, and as is it's okay as a feature, but I still think the ability-burst is a better idea both flavor and balance-wise. Funnily enough, the actual Pyro from TF2 suffers from a similar problem that I tried to fix rather thn emulate with my design. That's part of the reason I went for Axtinguisher rather than Airblast for my Pyro Sorcerer, because Pyro as a TF2 class is already in a strange identity confusion crisis between close and medium range, and offense/DoT/Burst/Ambush/Support/Other features. For a sorcerer, I wanted a reason to get into melee range that was in line with the offensive nature of the class without compromising its identity. What sort of reason would an offensive midrange class that has less HP than it could have to get into close range where it's dangerous? Well, for an offensive class with DoT components, you wouldn't want to be in melee range for very long, right? So how about trading consistent damage over time for an instant burst of damage for a finishing blow? Ideally, your opponent will either be killed by it, or will perish soon after limiting your exposure to danger - pretty much the same way the actual Axtinguisher works in TF2! Conversely, Dracoelemental Body is like the Sharpened Volcano Fragment. As a weapon, it's either redundant, or completely outclassed by anything else the class can do, and even if you can make it work in a given situation, it's still not because of anything unique it itself offers that anything else you have doesn't also offer. On a different class, the Sharpened Volcano Fragment would be a great weapon (As Dracoelemental Body would be great on, say, Monk or Fighter or maybe Warlock) but for Sorcerer it's...kind of just there. But that's all just opinion, do as you will.

<Titan Barbarian>
Apropos of reshaping terrain as a core class feature of Giant Weapon Barbarian - don't get me wrong, I LOVE environmental combat. I'm personally of the opinion that if I am making a basic vanilla weapon attack with no frills on any given turn, something is wrong. However, it's very DM-dependent, and I usally try to accomplish this sort of thing using systems at least one step removed from my base class features. What you've done is make the core fighting style of the class completely dependent on the DM for being effective in a given situation through emergent gameplay. I like the idea, I just think it could use some backup. And while I do cede that many Barbarian class features are keyed to rage, I think that being able to swing your weapon at all is a step too far. That's part of what I like about the Path of Unshacked Steel version of this subclass - it's not about using the weapon it all, it about how you use it and how effective you are when doing so (c.f. disadvantage by default, offest by Momentum and Brutality mechanics). Also, while you're right about equivalency and the improvised weapon rules (an interesting point that I hadn't considered), I still think that with the rules as they are, you ought to be able to dual wield glaives if you can dual wield lances. Just because there's no name for the other version of the weapon doesn't mean it shouldn't work imo. It would be like...a glaive used as an improvised large spear that deals slashing damage instead, I guess. Point is, while I do love the elegancy of dovetailing into existing rules, I don't think that ought to allow for fringe arbitrary limitations as I see it.

[Lvl45DM!]

More text.

Spoiler: Aragorn

Show

Only note for Endurance is that the definition of "natural exhaustion gain rate" is a very blurry concept you may want to look into.

Endurance and maxed short rests are both niche but very good in a hardcore campaign. Good design.

I like the idea of having favored friends as a variant on favored enemies, that's a cool idea. To be clear, you get resistance whether or not the attempt succeeds, right? I also like that that you get some hard benefits alongside the soft informational benefits that might not be as useful if you accidentally memorize monster statblocks the way I do (although it'd still be amazing against nonstandard enemies).

Everything looks fine! Good recreation of that one guy from that one trilogy. I probably wouldn't play as this, but I'd be happy to have one in the party.

Thanks. Yeah you get the hard benefits regardless of success. I figured since its running off creature type they might not get to use it much, and that would suck, so I made it a little stronger.

About Endurance, I might need to read the rules clearer, but its for things like forced marches or weather. But there isnt a neat list in the books of what causes exhaustion.

I just realized, it makes a half decent Witcher subclass with the ancient lore thing. Just switch Medicine to making alchemy and some stuff like that.

[Ilerien]

Good entry, very cohesive, concise, and interesting! Gives me Guts vibes.

Thank you for your feedback! :)

Spoiler: Blood Frenzy

Show

I like blood frenzy. The near death mechanics and trading resistances for damage is a cool idea. Does the critical strike enhancer stack with other sources of such effects? Also the wording on the last feature is a little confusing, say the "When you are at half or less of your max hp, then..." part first.

Critical range increase shouldn't stack with similar effects. As I understand, it works on the same principle as base AC: you may choose any option you have to determine it, but only one of them. So 14th level Reaver with 3 levels of Champion fighter would crit on 19-20 normally or on 18-20 when using reckless attack while in blood frenzy.
The wording indeed could use some improvements, I'll look into it more closely.

Spoiler: Devour

Show

Devour is also a cool feature. I like having choices. I assume the Extra necrotic damage is 1d8 minimum for a CR 1 Creature? You've got some bag-of-rats protection in there, and I kind of like that you don't have to be raging to use this feature. Does the necrotic damage double on a crit like a smite? Do you declare it before or after an attack hits? Useless in single combat, though, which I think is a fair trade off given its power and the flavor of the archetype.

Your assumption is correct: it will be 1d8 if CR 1 creature is devoured. Necrotic damage doubles on crit: it's additional dice after all. You declare it after the attack hits, much like a rogue does with sneak attack (hence "when you hit with..." clause).

Spoiler: Aura of Pain

Show

I like aura of pain too, lots of good features here! The Devour Synergy is great. I just wonder if you'd consider a flat save penalty over disadvantage. Although literally that's only because I associate AoE pain debuff effects with 3.5e Symbol of pain which inflicts flat penalties (I think).

5e's Symbol of Pain says "Each target must make a Constitution saving throw and becomes incapacitated with excruciating pain for 1 minute on a failed save." I like 3.5 version, but flat bonuses and penalties are seldom used in 5e.

Spoiler: Terrifying Fury

Show

Terrifying Fury is ok. I'm not sure how good it is considering it only lasts one turn, relies on crits, and has an immunity clause, but I think the otherwise unlimited use balances it out? It's cool, at any rate.

I tried to capture the feeling of reasonably high reward (frightening everyone around) triggered by chance. Though one has the ability to influence the probability: just frenzy and go on with reckless attack! I do think it would become unreasonably powerful if its duration is extended or if immunity clause is lifted: with 2 attacks per round and crit on 18-20 it's very likely a reaver will crit at least once per 2-3 rounds. Woe to the weak-willed who fail their save repeatedly. :)

[RickAsWritten]

Spoiler: Borderlander

Show

Missed one "defender" when retrofitting the text, in the mending clause. I like the ranged attack fire support. If you communicate with it remotely, does that mean you can make skill checks at basically any range?

Barrier seems decent.

Cloner is ok. Lacking in any depth, but mechanically solid, I think? It it good enough? I dunno.

Since only one ability has either one of the specified clauses, I don't think you need to be so general with Kill Skill.

Does the duplicate gain the benefits of any buff spells or other enhancers like magic weapons that you are currently benefiting from? That could be pretty sweet. Also, what does "One use of the indomitable ability" mean? I didn't see any such ability.

Overall decent. I trust it's faithful to the source material, but I personally feel it lacks something. I dunno, I'm probably wrong.

Made a couple changes based on your feedback. Thanks!

• Fixed typos
• Added speed boost Action to SNTNL
• Altered wording for cover from Barrier
• Added speed boost to Kill Skill
• Clarified Doubled Agent

[nickl_2000]

More text.

Sorry I meant to say, Arrowman Artificer.

I like Quick quiver. Does it function like a magazine for a crossbow? Potentially making it effectively a repeater? Would be sweet. Also, if you're proficient with improvised weapons (c.f. Tavern Brawler feat, I think) can you store pretty much anything of a certain size in the quiver? The part where it says that items stored are not lost on destruction makes me think it'd be a REALLY good alternative to leomund's secret chest in a pinch.

Interesting to make the specialized ammunition a maneuver-like system rather than, well, just specialized ammunition. That you can make. It's not a problem just a quirk to me. The fact that you inevitably learn all the maneuvers does feel odd though, kinda like Legolas is a wasted subclass feature. What if you learn more at certain milestones after the first level and just have something else in that spot? + to uses on rolling initiative is usually a capstone ribbon (which is odd since the capstone already does that).

I think calling Speedy Extra Attack would be good, since that's what it is. Something about specific rules interactions between class features and the "Extra Attack" feature specifically. I forget the details, but there's some sort of mechanical significance to it somewhere. Unless you foresaw that and are ok with odd stacking interactions, naturally.

Hmm, What dyou think about grappling or restraining your target with the bola arrow instead, spellpower as escape DC? For the Glue then I'd maybe try the effect that the UA artificer tanglefoot bag formula has, an AOE of diffucult terrain and then starting your turn in it reduces your speed by half again, so effectively 1/4 speed zone.

What happens if you shoot a creature with a grapple? Can you pull then out of the sky? Out of a fall? Like a harpoon towards you?

Rain arrows are pretty badass. Does it enable the use of Call Lightning?

I like the capstone, looks good. Overall, pretty good!

Since you are playing an artificer, you have access to the repeating infusion and the XBE feat. I didn't want to replicate those, so I didn't give that effect on purpose.

As for the maneuver system, in my mind canon the magical quiver is building the arrow as you draw it out, having it do whatever you need it to do. That was you have the almost magical ability to pull just the arrow you need for the situation. Plus, I didn't want someone to have to pick at a short rest, it's a bookkeeping hassle I didn't want to have to introduce.

Thanks, yes since I named it Speedy, it would have technically stacked with extra attack and it should. I resolved that issue.

I change the trick shots to be 4 at 3, 8 at 9, 12 at 15 and only left if get a trick shot if you have none as part of the capstone. Then added in a 9th level ability to allow you to nock two arrows at once and make two attacks against a single target in place of a single attack a few times a day (i.e. nova damage).

Touched up the Bola and Glue arrows based on your suggestion. As for the grappling arrow, it has this rider at the end "This trick shot can only be used against an object, and one that is not being carried by a creature." I did that on purpose to avoid the concept of a grappling hook hitting something and the problem involved in that.

As for rain arrows, you are creating a storm. I see no reason why you couldn't use them to make it storm and make the Druid's Call Lightning spell do more damage. Seems like awesome team work to me and the thing I love seeing in a game.



Thank you for all the suggestions and comments!

[nickl_2000]

Spoiler: Magitech Mercenary

Show

SNTNL - So, the stat block on this seems mostly good, although Zoomer need some sort of range to it. Looks like a companion style fighter. There are a few wonky things with the duration though.

1) You Summon it as a bonus action, and you need a bonus action to command it to do anything other than dodge. So, one the first turn you summon it, the SNTNL will be twiddling it's thumbs. If this isn't intentional, you may want to consider putting in something that allows you to summons and command on the first turn in the same bonus action.

2) It's summoned for 1 minute. Mending takes 1 minute to cast (and isn't normally accessible to the fighter without a feat or multiclassing). So, unless you are doubling the summon time, you can't actually heal it at all.

3) Speaking of doubling the summon time. Does the time grow exponentially or does it grow by 1 minute each time? I.e. is the progression 1,2,3,4,5 (etc) minutes, or 1,2,4,8,16,32 (etc) minutes.

I don't know the theme all that well, but would it be fitting to give the PC mending as well?

Barrier - Seems okay. The action cost is pretty high, but it's a large barrier and half-cover for all your allies is pretty darn good. Same question with the summoning time.

Kill Skill - Small typo in the first sentence. When you get to 1 hour is that the max length on the abilities? Or does it keep increasing by an hour each time you kill a CR1+ creature?

Doubled Agent - So, bonus attack once per round when you have mirror image up. Makes sense, and is sensibly limited.

Question on all the kill someone to get a new ability. If I'm level 10 and kill a CR 2 critter, do I get a Clone, Barrier, and SNTNL back or just one of them?



This is certainly an interesting subclass. I really like the teamwork aspect that it offers for a fighter, which isn't always available. There were a few questions above about durations. Other than than the only other comment I have is that there is a lot of competition for your bonus action each turn. It's not necessarily a bad thing, but it does limit the power of the subclass a little bit. Overall though, this is a really solid entry and a good subclass that I would enjoy seeing at my table.

[Snowben Gaming]

So I discovered this for the first time yesterday and I made the Dragonstone Warrior: a fighter subclass based on Corrin from Fire Emblem Fates. It's... not good, to say the least. I made it in about an hour or so, and I'm pretty sure it's only my 2nd ever homebrew subclass. So critique is more than welcome.