check my succubus sorcerer mirror mephit build for anything illegal

[newguydude1]

the build starts out as an illumian sorcerer and then turns into a succubus sorcerer via major ritual of unlearning from savage species

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the carry combo
this combo is named the carry combo because its gonna carry my character all the way to epic.
before i begin let me say the simulacras are advanced versions of the creature with double the standard hd so that when halved its the normal stat block as-is.

sorcerer + mirror mephit
day 1
1. mirror mephit makes simulacrum of great old master neogi
2. great old master neogi makes a bunch of neogi spawn in cages

day 2
3. mirror mephit makes simualcrum of a kocrachon
4. kocrachon simulacrum casts its at will liquid pain sla on all the neogi spawn until required number of doses is obtained and then kills the neogi

day 3
5. mirror mephit makes a simulacrum of a djinni
6. djinni uses its permanent duration minor creation to create scroll crafting materials

day 4
7. mirror mephit makes a simulacrum of a silit 7hd cl16
8. using cooperative crafting rules, my sorcerer provides scribe scroll and liquid pain, mirror mephit provides the spell simulacrum, and the silit provides the caster level 16.

day 5
9. mirror mephit makes a simulacrum of a firre 8hd cl2

day 6
10. scroll of simulacrum is finished crafting.
11. firre casts owls wisdom on my sorcerer to lessen the chance of scroll mishaps.
12. my sorcerer casts the scroll to create a simulacrum of a khastigur 15hd cl18

day 7-10
13. using cooperative crafting rules, my sorcerer provides scribe scroll and liquid pain, mirror mephit provides the spell simulacrum, and the khastigur provides the caster level 18.
14. my sorcerer casts the scroll to create a simulacrum of a sorrowsworn demon 18hd cl20

day 11-14
15. using cooperative crafting rules, my sorcerer provides scribe scroll and liquid pain, mirror mephit provides the spell simulacrum, and the sorrowsworn demon provides the caster level 20.
16. my sorcerer casts the scroll to create a simulacrum of a balor or titan.

important thing to note is
a. this combo can be accomplished with a mirror mephit and a 1st level sorcerer with scribe scroll.
b. a balor or titan simulacrum can carry me to epic
c. put these together and i can do whatever the **** i want with my sorcerer and ill still be ok, like sacrificing 12 class levels to become a succubus

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sorcerer build 1-5
race: illumian
class: sorcerer1/cleric1/sorcerer3
acf: animal companion instead of familiar
feats
flaw: noncombatant
flaw: pathetic: strength
1
f1 natural bond
f1 fell animate
d2 healing devotion
3

very straight forward. naenhoon fell animate to turn my animal companions into zombies and heal them with healing devotions.
empty feat slots is because im still figuring it out. retraining them out is also a concern.

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sorcerer6-13
class: sorcerer9/cleric1/wyrmwizard 2/wizard1
acf: retrained back to familiar
feats
flaw: noncombatant
flaw: pathetic: strength
1 practiced spellcaster
F1 scribe scroll
F1 extend spell
3 improved familiar
6 arcane preparation
9 assume supernatural ability: share spells
12 silent spell
w13 persistent spell

i added consumptive field to my spell list with wyrm wizard.
wizard level is solely for the extra metamagic feat. multiclass penalty doesnt matter because im turning into a succubus this level.

succubus transformation
1. mirror mephit creates a simulacrum of me 6hd cl6
2. my simulacrum casts persistent suffer the flesh on itself to boost its cl to 9
3. i cast girallons blessing on myself (for somatic compontent), polymorph into a symbiote, attach myself to my simulacrum, and then use share spells to cast persistent silent consumptive field, and use neogi spawns to fuel it, boosting my simulacrums cl to 12.
4. my simulacrum performs the major ritual of unlearning on me for me.
5. i lose 12 sorcerer levels and become a succubus.

im fine because my mirror mephit is still with me. improved familiar just lets me obtain a familiar. once i obtain a familiar even if i lose caster level my familiar wont disband on me because its already obtained, permanently.

the carry combo is still performable so im fine. balor or titan simulacrum will carry me to epic while i slowly regain my sorcerer levels.

i am vulnerable. if my mirror mephit dies before i hit sorcerer 3 i am screwed. so i do everything i can to prevent that from happening, like stockpiling scrolls of simulacrum and hiding it here and there so if my mirror mephit does bite the dust i can just make a simulacrum of one and be ok from there. last resort, i just hunt monsters that cant fly and spam charm monster on it until i succeed, thus defeating the encounter, and gain xp until i hit level 3.

once im in epic ill grab improved metamagic epic feat and drop my persistent spell down. then ill cast persistent suffer the flesh, persistent consumptive field, persistent greater consumptive, and shadow conjuration mimicking create magic tattoo for a grand total of double my cl + 6. im making simulacra of epic monsters.

and thats it. please tell me if you find a flaw or think you can improve my build. thank you.

[Anthrowhale]

For off-list spells, Dragonblood Spell-pact seems potentially easier than Fiend-blooded. For additional spells known, Mother Cyst is handy.

I'm not sure if Maho-Tsukai is available (it's a Rokugan class in OA, so 1st party in an off-beat setting), but that gives you spell access as wizard with sorcerer-like spellcasting. It's evilish, so maybe you want to avoid.

The only strong metamagic reducer I can think of that you maybe haven't ruled out is metanode spell which requires two feats. "Maybe", because this is FR-specific. It also ties you to locations and requires years to setup via node genesis. On the plus side, it's also a caster level booster. (There is also spelldancer 1, although the feat tax to enter appears prohibitive in your case.)

Some prestige classes for feat-strapped sorcerers are Ruathar -> Unseen Seer and Paragnostic Apostle. Maybe also consider Fatespinner although it's value is marginal. Sacred Exorcist could be good if you want to go there.

[Jack_Simth]

The familiar is treated as having your hit die count. Dark Chaos Shuffle one of it's default feats into Practiced Spellcaster, perhaps? Application order (feat first) potentially means the spell level boosting still fully applies.

[Piggy Knowles]

If you're concerned about the mirror mephit dying, having a clone grown and ready is probably a good idea. Also nice because you don't need the dead body to clone it, but just a cubic inch of preserved flesh, which you can harvest in advance while the familiar is still alive. Best to keep a few of those stored away in various places so that if your hidden fortress is ever raided, you can still clone new allies.

[newguydude1]

For off-list spells, Dragonblood Spell-pact seems potentially easier than Fiend-blooded. For additional spells known, Mother Cyst is handy.

i dont think so. the dragon needs to expend xp as well. npcs only have xp if the dm says so

The familiar is treated as having your hit die count. Dark Chaos Shuffle one of it's default feats into Practiced Spellcaster, perhaps? Application order (feat first) potentially means the spell level boosting still fully applies.

sla caster level is not arcane spellcaster level so i can apply practiced spellcaster. but i forgot about familiars being treated like it has masters hd.

If you're concerned about the mirror mephit dying, having a clone grown and ready is probably a good idea. Also nice because you don't need the dead body to clone it, but just a cubic inch of preserved flesh, which you can harvest in advance while the familiar is still alive. Best to keep a few of those stored away in various places so that if your hidden fortress is ever raided, you can still clone new allies.

i thought about this, and the cubic inch can be ignored with eschew materials, not sure about summon component. but can outsiders be cloned? if yes then this solves lots of my problems too.

but outsiders dont have a soul. their body and soul is one and the same. its why raise dead doesnt work. do you have somewhere that says outsiders can be cloned? cause like i said this solves a hell of a lot of problems for me.

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on another note another thread showed that true creation can create liquid pain, so a shadow true creation either from shades or shadowcraft mage will let me create scrolls of simulacrum all by myself if i know the simulacrum spell.
but the lack of feats is unreal.
1 versatile spellcaster
f1 scribe scroll
f1 eschew materials
3 improved familiar
6 blood calls to blood
9 spell focus: illusion
12 heighten spell
15 arcane preparation
d18 extend spell
18 persistent spell

at 18 i have to retrain into domain access sorcerer so i can get the planning domain for extend spell at the cost of 9 spell knowns.

[Piggy Knowles]

i thought about this, and the cubic inch can be ignored with eschew materials, not sure about summon component. but can outsiders be cloned? if yes then this solves lots of my problems too.

but outsiders dont have a soul. their body and soul is one and the same. its why raise dead doesnt work. do you have somewhere that says outsiders can be cloned? cause like i said this solves a hell of a lot of problems for me.

From a fluff perspective maybe, but the spell lacks the restriction that spells like raise dead, resurrection, etc al. have. Those spells don't work on outsiders by RAW because they have specific clauses saying constructs, elementals and outsiders can't be raised. No such clause exists for clone. I don't see anything in the text of the spell that would prohibit it from working on an outsider.

[newguydude1]

From a fluff perspective maybe, but the spell lacks the restriction that spells like raise dead, resurrection, etc al. have. Those spells don't work on outsiders by RAW because they have specific clauses saying constructs, elementals and outsiders can't be raised. No such clause exists for clone. I don't see anything in the text of the spell that would prohibit it from working on an outsider.

ok so this is my concern from the outsider type

When an outsider is slain, no soul is set loose. Spells that restore souls to their bodies, such as raise dead, reincarnate, and resurrection, don’t work on an outsider. It takes a different magical effect, such as limited wish, wish, miracle, or true resurrection to restore it to life.

and clone talks about how a loose soul goes into the cloned body. these are rule text so its not just fluff.

[gogogome]

Fiend-blooded has a humanoid race requirement. So turning yourself into a warforged will make you lose the benefits of the prestige class.

[newguydude1]

i am aware i have spammed quite a few number of threads this past week, and rather than make a new sorcerer mirror mephit thread, i just decided to recycle this one. here is the original first post.

Spoiler: original first post

Show

ok so the build goal is simple
main goal: free expendable powerful simulacrum forever including epic

secondary goal 1: immortality
secondary goal 2: minionmancy at all levels

class requirement: sorcerer. i already got a wizard dweomerkeeper build. im doing all this so i can play sorcerer cause i like sorcerer more. a lot more.

banned stuff:
items. i dont want to be reliant on an entire nations supply chain. so no gold. no spellcasting services. no magic shop. unless i can make it anywhere anytime (like scroll crafting materials) no items.
divine. trying to make this character forgotten realms compatible. no deity worship either so arcane disciple is out too.
regional stuff. southern magician for example. this character is supposed to be universal. while spells and feats that can be just used as is in other settings is acceptable (magical artisan for example), prcs or feats that depend on the setting like dragonmarks or rashemi elemental summoning and such is not. so no dragonmarks, no southern magician, no
dragon magazine, all 2nd and 3rd party materials, all web content unless its an errata or an enhancement to a specific sourcebook
incantatrix and dweomerkeeper. im trying to optimize downward from dweomerkeeper. incantatrix has just a bad of a reputation as dweomerkeeper and planar shepherd so im staying away from it.

my character is 25pb

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so the main concept around this build is the mirror mephit. because unlike everything else, going sorcerer does not delay your acquisition of him. hes the reason sorcerer is possible. if it werent for the mirror mephit id still be a wizard.
current plans:
1. have mirror mephit use simulacrum as an sla to make powerful expendable simulacra for free
2. boost its caster level (8) via the following spells (applied via share spells familiar class feature, because all of these are personal range):
adept spirit +1
suffer the flesh +4-5
consumptive field +4
greater consumptive field +4
total: 22.

now the problem here is that the 22 is a hard cap. i cant make it scale in epic. which brings us to

3. cooperative crafting scribe scroll with the mirror mephit.
i provide the feat and caster level
mirror mephit provides the spell as an sla thus ignoring all material and xp cost
i use ambrosia or liquid pain to fuel the xp cost of the scroll
scroll materials are made via major creation via a djinni simulacrum who has permanent duration minor creation
thus achieving free simulacra.

so lets say level 20, stacking all of the +cl from above results in 20 + 5 + 10 + 10 + 1 (create magic tattoo) = cl 46. im making 46hd simulacra. and thats gonna increase throughout epic. (cant use adept spirit for myself because it only lasts 1minute and i need it to last 8 hours to use in scroll crafting)

now here are the problems
1. i need all of the +cl stuff to last at least 8 hours a day to use in scroll crafting, but all of those spells last rounds. so persistent spell is mandatory. but man, metamagic reducers are hard and expensive to stack! like really hard! and really expensive! to the point i cant persist greater consumptive field until epic level.
2. i am helpless without my mirror mephit. if he dies for some reason, im done adventuring for the next 1 year and a day. revive outsider isnt gonna cut it because im pretty sure in a situation my mirror mephit does die, im gonna have to abandon its corpse to survive myself.

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before i begin im only allowed 1 simulacrum at any time. its the condition my dm imposed on me for allowing simulacrum. so even during downtime i can only have 1 simulacrum assisting me.

ok so my sorcerer build is
sorcerer16/fiend-blooded 4
fiend-blooded adds consumptive field and greater consumptive field to my spell known without delaying my spellcasting. so its better than wizard. but i dont need anymore from that prc, and base sorcerer is terrible so recommend me some prcs.
i skimmed through this
https://forums.giantitp.com/showthre...roved-Sorcerer

anyways heres a bunch of tricks i thought of.
acf: animal companion instead of familiar
levels 1-5
1 versatile spellcaster
h1 spell focus: evocation
f1 fell animate
f1 metamagic school focus: evocation
3 natural bond

so at level 2-3 with the magic of metamagic reducers i cast fell animate sonic snap to turn my riding dog companions into riding dog zombies. ill have 2 zombies at level 2 and 3 zombies at level 3.
sonic snap (0) + 3 (fell animate) - 1 (metamagic school focus: evocation) = 2.
with versatile spellcaster i can cast fell animate sonic snap at level 1.

at level 4-5 i upgrade to bison zombies and get a giant bat animal companion. bison zombies are controlled via control undead because they eat up too much of my zombie control hd limit.

at level 6 i cast animate weapon on a colossal greatsword made out of stone and concentrate on it all day.


level 7 sorcerer build (achieved via heavy retraining)
acf: retrained back to familiar not animal companion
1 versatile spellcaster
h1 spell focus: evocation
f1 scribe scroll
f1 eschew materials
3 blood calls to blood
6 improved familiar
9 extend spell
12 persistent spell
15 arcane thesis: consumptive field, 18 dragontouched
18 practical metamagic:persistent spell

at level 7 i finally get my mirror mephit, and with adept spirit + suffer the flesh i increase its caster level by 5 to make simulacra of 13hd monsters.

at level 10 i polymorph into a great old master neogi, and use its ex special attack to spawn neogi spawns. oodles of them. and then i use them to fuel consumptive field. making my new simulacra hd cap 13 + 4 + 1 (from suffer the flesh. i need 10cl to be able to get +5 from the spell.) = 18hd.
i first make a simulacrum of a monster with cleric casting. then he casts imbue spell ability on both of us to give us lesser restoration. then i cast bears endurance on the mirror mephit so he doesnt die when he sacrifices 10 con for suffer the flesh. then finally, after we make the 18hd simulacrum, we both cast lesser resotration on the mirror mephit so he wont die when bears endurance runs out.

at level 12 i achieve immortality.
i first make a simulacrum of myself (6hd)
i cast shadow conjuration on my simulacrum to give it +1 caster level via create magic tattoo (simulacrum cl 7)
then i have the simulacrum perform ritual of vitality (savage species major ritual) on me and turn me into a warforged scout at 1000xp cost.
this does not disqualify me from fiend-blooded because im still a descendant of a fiend, and my new robot body doesnt change that fact.

at level 14 i get greater consumptive field from fiend-blooded which boosts my mirror mephits simulacrum hd cap to its final 22hd.

at level 16 i finally can persist consumptive field. so....
i first create a KOCRACHON simulacrum because it has liquid pain.
then i polymorph into a great old master neogi and make a ton of neogi spawn.
then i cage and inflict pain on said neogi spawn (havent decided between disease, torture, etc.) and have the KOCRACHON spam its liquid pain sla to create 70 doses of liquid pain.
then i kill all the neogi spawn via a persistent consumptive field cast on me
then i create a simulacrum of a djinni
the djinni now creates all the scroll crafting materials i need via its permanent duration major creation sla
finally i use the liquid pain, mirror mephit, scroll materials, and my cl 30 caster level to create a 30hd simulacrum.

and thats all i got so far.
main goal achieved.
all secondary goals achieved

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backup strategy
if mirror mephit dies
use lesser planar binding to get a mirror mephit
and then start using cooperative crafting rules from there. i can make as much liquid pain as i want with a single mirror mephit under my control.
i cant use the planar bound mirror mephit for "normal" purposes because i cant use share spells on him and all of my +cl stuff is range personal range

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some random thoughts
i thought about getting true resurrection on my character via wyrm wizard so that with ignore material components in epic i can keep my mirror mephit alive forever and ever.
i wont get miracle though. miracles are granted by a god. i dont want to be beholden to gods. so miracle is out.

i thought about getting earth dreamer prc cause earthglide is super useful in running away or being completely immune to my opponent, but it has a feat tax which requires 13 wis. warforged already hurts my cha by 2 so i dont think i can afford 13 wis.

i might take a dip in mindbender for telepathy so i can communicate with my monsters while staying inside a box 24/7. but the skill tax is high and i need my skill points into crafting scroll materials.

i thought about fatespinner but it doesnt really do anything for me. but its not like im using my class levels for anything else. so... iunno.

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list of failures
shadowcraft mage
what drew me here is shadow miracles so that i get my miracles without needing a god, and i can have it replicate simulacrum for free. but as someone else pointed out, since im using shadow evocation rules, a simple will save to disbelieve will render my simulacrum incapable of harming my enemies. so nope. shadowcraft mage is a failure.

illumian
not immortal so relying on his abilities forever is not something i want

divine metamagic
only works on divine spells even if you somehow got turn undead charges on your arcane class

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ok so what do i need help with here?
1. prestige classes. base sorcerer is awful.
2. earlier warforged. 12th level is a little late. somehow i want to get my simulacrum of myself's caster level to 7 earlier.
3 a way to persist greater consumptive field before epic levels
4. a better backup strategy than planar binding mirror mephits.
5. ambrosia instead of liquid pain cause liquid pain is evil

[Zanos]

i dont think so. the dragon needs to expend xp as well. npcs only have xp if the dm says so

Draconomicon pg. 24 specifically gives dragons an allowance to use such spells:

A dragon typically has a cushion of 100 to 600 XP times its spellcaster level. It can use these XP in spellcasting without risking the loss of a level.

[newguydude1]

does this work? is it legal?

level 5
class: sorcerer1/cleric1/wizard3
acf: animal companion instead of familiar for the sorcerers familiar
feats
flaw: noncombatant
flaw: pathetic: strength
1 sacred vow
f1 practiced spellcaster
f1 vow of poverty
d2 extend spell
w3 persistent spell
3 improved familiar

wizard class familiar is untouched so i can get a familiar
i am using a tattoo spellbook and the tattoos are created by level up so theyre free so doesnt violate vow of poverty
vow of poverty is retrained in at level 5 so i can use undead in levels 1-4

why vow of poverty at 5? because

Alternatively, an ascetic spellcaster can sacrifice experience points in place of expensive components, with 1 XP equivalent to 5 gp value of components

at level 5 i cast persistent suffer the flesh by sacrificing 50xp for the material component.
i also cast continual flame on two simple weapons, like quarterstaffs which costs me an additional 20xp
with caster level 7 i now obtain mirror mephit by using up "magical materials" (aka the continual flame quarterstaffs) at level 5, 2 levels earlier than normal.

cleric dip is because i need extend spell and turn undead charges.
wizard dip is because i need a bonus magic feat for persistent spell and familiar for improved familiar because im currently using my sorcerer familiar for animal companions and fell animate.

the end result is gonna be like
sorcerer1/cleric1/wizard9/wyrmwizard2 for consumptive field on my wizard.
then ritual of unlearning is gonna kill all my cleric and wizard levels and i can level up as sorcerer as normal.