Quill of Law (2e -> 5e) what 3 laws would you write?

[rlc]

None contradict the others. The first makes it so that if you know what is on the paper and choose to read it anyway it affects you, the second only stops alignment change, and the third only works against spells and effects with mental saving throws. The quill, from what I can read, offers no saving throw.

Edit:assuming your low enough level.

I think you missed the word “not” in the third law, and that’s probably why they said it’s a paradox. And there’s a saving throw under certain conditions.

[Valmark]

I think you missed the word “not” in the third law, and that’s probably why they said it’s a paradox. And there’s a saving throw under certain conditions.

Even with "not" they would still clash, since the first allows you (in theory) to be willingly influenced while the other would forbid any effect. Regardless of the fact that I think only Scrying allows you to fail the save willingly, thinking about it.

EDIT: Calm Emotions does that too, and that's covered by both laws.

[GeoffWatson]

1: You will never allow spells and effects to control your mind, unless you willingly decide in advance to accept the control.

2: You will never let an a spell or magical effect alter you alignment.

3: You will allow yourself to be controlled by any external spell or effect that could be resisted with strength of personality or willpower.

I read it, and then argue to the gm that I should get advantage on mental saves because I'm mentally compelled not to fail them.

I'm sure your character will do their best to obey the laws, but I don't see why it should give any advantage.

[Incorrect]

I would not use it as a governing tool; I would use it for a massive advantage in combat (or for avoiding combat). Maybe with a time limit, to avoid the most disastrous friendly fire.

1. For the next 60 seconds, cease all combat activity.
2. For the next 60 seconds, end any and all active spells on your person.
3. For the next 60 seconds, place all your magic items in front of you.

Then strap it to your shield, and cover it until needed.
Use it for what ever purpose fits your alignment.

Would that work?

[Xervous]

I would not use it as a governing tool; I would use it for a massive advantage in combat (or for avoiding combat). Maybe with a time limit, to avoid the most disastrous friendly fire.

1. For the next 60 seconds, cease all combat activity.
2. For the next 60 seconds, end any and all active spells on your person.
3. For the next 60 seconds, place all your magic items in front of you.

Then strap it to your shield, and cover it until needed.
Use it for what ever purpose fits your alignment.

Would that work?

Why stop there? Get a crack team of scribes to write down portions of a killer joke equivalent in another language. Put it on the barbarian’s shield.

“All who read this must hold their breath until they die.” Is suboptimal to be sure, but it kills anyone who reads it.

[NecessaryWeevil]

So does the quill magically give you the ability to do what is commanded?

"You will never allow spells and effects to control you mind."
"You will hold your breath until you die."

If the item can render you immune to mind control and take over your autonomic bodily functions (breathing while unconsicious)
then...
"You will instantly become level 20 in whatever class you choose. Oh, and gain a 60' flying speed and diamond-hard skin, because why not."

[Mastikator]

There's a hack that gives you infinite wishes laws

1) You must read and know the law of the state

2) You may not break the law [unless it is to save your life or the life of someone else. (this part may make the law more robust by giving people an out when they need it, thereby not allowing them to escape the law if lives are at stake)]

3) Only the ruler update the law or the quill of law

...

Then you just make sure the law is readily available and you're golden. The constitution or whatever can then outline any number of laws that you can update. Any additional rules you need can be written into your own law book.

[IsaacsAlterEgo]

This would roughly be the equivalent of say, lobotomizing people in order to ensure compliance with the law. I suppose it's slightly better as there's no permanent damage, but even the most well-meaning laws would be an evil act to enforce in this way. The only real thing a Good ruler would do with this item would be to bury it deep underground in a sarcophagus of molten lead.

That being said, an evil group could get some use out of it by forcing an entire village to become their eternal servants by supplying laws like "any material wealth you accumulate that is not strictly necessary for your continued survival must be handed over to Adventuring Group #2060b on the first of every month." or something like that, with additional laws to ensure productivity or secrecy.

[noob]

This would roughly be the equivalent of say, lobotomizing people in order to ensure compliance with the law. I suppose it's slightly better as there's no permanent damage, but even the most well-meaning laws would be an evil act to enforce in this way. The only real thing a Good ruler would do with this item would be to bury it deep underground in a sarcophagus of molten lead.

That being said, an evil group could get some use out of it by forcing an entire village to become their eternal servants by supplying laws like "any material wealth you accumulate that is not strictly necessary for your continued survival must be handed over to Adventuring Group #2060b on the first of every month." or something like that, with additional laws to ensure productivity or secrecy.

Why bury it?
It is not an artifact right?
So you can just destroy it?

[Mastikator]

This would roughly be the equivalent of say, lobotomizing people in order to ensure compliance with the law. I suppose it's slightly better as there's no permanent damage, but even the most well-meaning laws would be an evil act to enforce in this way. The only real thing a Good ruler would do with this item would be to bury it deep underground in a sarcophagus of molten lead.

That being said, an evil group could get some use out of it by forcing an entire village to become their eternal servants by supplying laws like "any material wealth you accumulate that is not strictly necessary for your continued survival must be handed over to Adventuring Group #2060b on the first of every month." or something like that, with additional laws to ensure productivity or secrecy.

I can imagine one situation where a good ruler would use it, as a rehabilitation tool. Receive reduced sentence if you agree to read the quill of law. The quill of law then just says "don't attack people, no stealing". Combined with some means of survival for those who can't without stealing and it could actually do a lot of good.

[Naanomi]

I can imagine one situation where a good ruler would use it, as a rehabilitation tool. Receive reduced sentence if you agree to read the quill of law. The quill of law then just says "don't attack people, no stealing". Combined with some means of survival for those who can't without stealing and it could actually do a lot of good.

Yeah, anywhere where people are comfortable using forced compliance it would have a place... enforcing prison-yard safety rules for example

[OldTrees1]

Why bury it?
It is not an artifact right?
So you can just destroy it?

Wait. Is it an artifact or a normal magic item?

Artifact:
Pro - There is only 1 Quill
Con - It is hard to destroy

Not Artifact:
Pro - It is easy to destroy
Con - Another is being crafted

[IsaacsAlterEgo]

I can imagine one situation where a good ruler would use it, as a rehabilitation tool. Receive reduced sentence if you agree to read the quill of law. The quill of law then just says "don't attack people, no stealing". Combined with some means of survival for those who can't without stealing and it could actually do a lot of good.

This is basically the plot of A Clockwork Orange and I don't think it worked out very well there!

[Cikomyr2]

I would see it used in an enjoyable and interesting way as a heavily localized thing. Meant as a tool of special oppression "no citizen can leave the city" for a conquered setting, or special diplomatic towns.

A place where the laws are accepted by those who will enter, ahead of time. Using the laws as some forcibly imposed "Aura of Peace" to ensure the security of everyone involved would be interesting to play out. Or any variation of the concept.

In large scale worlds, maybe restrict these "super lawful zones" to strategic location. Like train stations, border crossings. Stargate locations.

Hell, maybe this is what keep Hell sealed. What if the hordes of hell couldn't get out because the doors are sealed shut with these Pens, making it illegal to leave? You could have the pens be a tool of Heavens.

[FabulousFizban]

1. Read the following law
2. Read the previous law
3. There is no 3.

[FabulousFizban]

1. Tuesday is hereby abolished.
2. Wednesday will now take place on Saturday, Saturday having been moved to a new week.
3. All animals must be clothed.

[Incorrect]

Why stop there? Get a crack team of scribes to write down portions of a killer joke equivalent in another language. Put it on the barbarian’s shield.
“All who read this must hold their breath until they die.” Is suboptimal to be sure, but it kills anyone who reads it.

I wanted to keep it non-lethal, so it can be used when in the middle of a crowd of bystanders, or in a kings court.

[Bundin]

As for the laws... three laws... if only we had an example for some sort of ethical-but-authoritarian Lg society to follow...

1) within the city limits, one must not willingly cause harm to another sentient being, or by willful inaction allow another sentient being to come to harm

2) within the city limits, one must not willfully engage in behavior that threatens its own existence; except in situations where that would violate the first law

3) within city limits, one must obey the lawfully given orders of law enforcement officers; except in situations where that would violate the first two laws; or immediately and peacefully leave the city limits

Without a corresponding Zeroth Law, issues would crop up sooner or later, when someone has to choose the needs of the many over the needs of the few. Three just doesn't completely cut it :) Great starting point though!

However, I would probably write:
1. You will buy your next mattress, bedroll or straw sack at Bundin's Beds Emporium!
2. You will not sell mattresses, bedrolls or straw sacks at a lower price than Bundin's Beds Emporium!
3. You will tell at least two friends about the excellent service at Bundin's Beds Emporium at least once in the two weeks following this moment!

That'll teach that other floating one-eyed @#$@! selling moldy mattresses over at Bedroll Bathtub and Beholders!

[Witty Username]

What would I write? Or what would I set up in a d&d game?
1) 1. You shall not cause harm though action or inaction to yourself or others.
2. You shall not cause another to believe a falsehood you believe is false.
3. All your actions shall adhere to the United States legal code, according to the state you are currently in unless doing so would cause harm though action or inaction to yourself or others or cause another to believe a falsehood you believe is false.

2)
1. You will not cause harm to the writer of this law or any under the protection of the writer of this law.
2. You will spend some amount of time each day performing prayer, silent contemplation or any rituals of this writer's designation
3. You will obey any spoken command of the writer of these laws, if the command is a set task the command is to last only until the completion of that task, if it reverences a pattern of behavior or conduct the command is to last 1 hour unless otherwise specified.