New OOTS products from CafePress
New OOTS t-shirts, ornaments, mugs, bags, and more
Results 1 to 8 of 8
  1. - Top - End - #1
    Dwarf in the Playground
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Gender
    Male

    Default Ice Knife and Witch Bolt as Cantrips?

    Would witch bolt and ice knife be better as cantrips?

    Ice knife would need to be reduced to 1d6/1d6 burst scaling.

    Witch bolt still requires concertation.

    Thoughts?
    Last edited by Zaile; 2021-01-15 at 08:17 PM.
    Signature verification required.

    Latest Homebrew: The Battledancer 5e Dragonfire Adept 5e

  2. - Top - End - #2
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    NecromancerGuy

    Join Date
    Oct 2017

    Default Re: Ice Knife and Witch Bolt as Cantrips?

    Quote Originally Posted by Zaile View Post
    Would witch bolt and ice knife be better as cantrips?

    Ice knife would need to be reduced to 1d6/1d6 burst scaling.

    Witch bolt still requires concertation.

    Thoughts?
    No and yes. Ice knife would be pretty busted, actually, for a cantrip. It's actually in an okay place, it's a first level blast that does mediocre damage and has a small AOE, putting it on par with other first level blasts. It's on some spell sheets that other blasts aren't.

    Witch bolt can't be saved unless you just remake the entire spell and abandon all the current trappings. Concentration for reactivated single target damage is a mediocre strategy to begin with, and any further limitations (can't switch target, can't move, damage is awful) makes it worthless.

  3. - Top - End - #3
    Dwarf in the Playground
    Join Date
    Mar 2019

    Default Re: Ice Knife and Witch Bolt as Cantrips?

    Quote Originally Posted by Zaile View Post
    Would witch bolt and ice knife be better as cantrips?

    Ice knife would need to be reduced to 1d6/1d6 burst scaling.

    Witch bolt still requires concertation.

    Thoughts?
    I wouldn't do ice knife because it is also area of effect. Witch bolt I think works ok if you drop the follow up damage.

    I allow:
    • Single target spells that spell (melee/ranged) attack may also be cast as cantrips (assuming they are known/prepared as a leveled spell) with the following base damage dice: chaos bolt d8 (loses leap, but can choose damage type from any of the d8s rolled), chromatic orb d8, guiding bolt d8, inflict wounds d10, melf's acid arrow d6 (still does 2d4 delayed hit and half miss damage), ray of sickness d4, witch bolt d12 (loses follow up damage/duration)


    So witch bolt does superior damage vs firebolt, but is limited by the 30' range.

  4. - Top - End - #4
    Dwarf in the Playground
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Ice Knife and Witch Bolt as Cantrips?

    I like the suggestions so far!

    My main reason for doing ice knife is it would be on par with Word of Radiance and useable at range. Word of radiance and sword burst are both terrible for any caster as their maximum benefit requires you to be surrounded. The absolute worst place for any caster.

    What about an Ice Knife that has a 5' burst targeting 4 squares/Dex save? There was a similar effect in 3.5 with a feat that gave a scaling damage 4-square fireball called "Fiery Burst." Super great feat.
    Signature verification required.

    Latest Homebrew: The Battledancer 5e Dragonfire Adept 5e

  5. - Top - End - #5
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    BlueWizardGirl

    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Ice Knife and Witch Bolt as Cantrips?

    Take acid splash, change damage to cold, ice knife as a cantrip.

    Witch bolt, change 1st level to cantrip. Clarify that the higher slots are the cantrip level upgrades. It probably wouldn't be overpowered.

    One last thing, if you use the witch bolt changes, up poison spray range to 15ft and allow it a second target within 5ft. That cantrip needs love.
    Last edited by Witty Username; 2021-01-17 at 12:48 PM.

  6. - Top - End - #6
    Dwarf in the Playground
     
    EvilClericGuy

    Join Date
    Jan 2021

    Default Re: Ice Knife and Witch Bolt as Cantrips?

    2000 views, 4 replies, oof mate
    I steal Signatures, and like General Grevious, add them to my collection. Or, I would, if there wasn't a forum limit to signature length.

  7. - Top - End - #7
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    ClericGuy

    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Location
    New Zealand
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Ice Knife and Witch Bolt as Cantrips?

    Ice knife is good where it is. For a 1st level spell it's got a lot going for it - single-target damage, AoE damage, some of which doesn't rely on an attack roll.

    Throw out witch bolt. Instead, take the create bonfire cantrip and have it do lightning damage.

  8. - Top - End - #8
    Dwarf in the Playground
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Ice Knife and Witch Bolt as Cantrips?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jon talks a lot View Post
    2000 views, 4 replies, oof mate
    You have good ratios, you have bad. I roll with it.
    Signature verification required.

    Latest Homebrew: The Battledancer 5e Dragonfire Adept 5e

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •