Support the GITP forums on Patreon
Help support GITP's forums (and ongoing server maintenance) via Patreon
Results 1 to 8 of 8
  1. - Top - End - #1
    Dwarf in the Playground
     
    Devil

    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Location
    The Netherlands
    Gender
    Male

    Default Circle of the Full Moon

    Spoiler: Author's Notes and design decisions
    Show
    Let me start by describing some of the thoughts and designs concepts behind this sub-class. As the name probably indicates, it's based on the circle of the moon, and it takes some inspiration from lycanthropes on the side. The main reason I've decided to make this sub-class, is that the "circle of the moon" druid is a bit wonky at times. At low levels it's a massive tanker. It either has too many forms to pick from (making it hard for a DM to work with/a new player to pick it up), or too few (both at high CR and/or if the DM sticks with the "what you've seen" idea, and never gets you fun beasts to play with).

    To counter this, I grouped various beasts into groups (originally to just flesh out the CR's that were missing and then limit a druid to X groups) and then made a progression for a limited group of forms. In this (final, for now) version, those groups are: Pachyderm (based on Rhino/Elephant/Mammoth), Sea (based on the various sharks, with a quick glance at the killer whale), Feline (Panther/Lion/Various tigers) and Reptile (lizards and crocodiles)

    In general, I tried to make logical progressions (preferring 12, 13, 14, 15 over random jumps). Also, many of them will do less damage then the "natural" creatures they are based on, as that felt like a needed nerf.

    All 4 groups of forms have their own logic behind them. The Pachyderm = Tanking/solid defense. The Sea = good health, good attack (and well, the one you pick in the sea). The Feline = a good middle ground and all about maneuverability. The Reptile = The skill/movement/fragile one (the fragile part moving it far away from it's rather tanky Crocodile/Reptile inspirations).

    My main worries at this point are: Did I manage to balance the HP/AC/Damage correctly? And are those skill proficiencies suitable or not?

    Finally, the "Combat Wild Shape", "Primal Strike" and "Thousand Forms" features are identical to the moon druid features, so I'll not post them here. You can find them in the Player Handbook on page 69.


    Circle of the Full Moon
    Druids of the Circle of the Full Moon are adaptable creatures. They embrace change, even as they reject chaos. While many come from a background already steeped in magic, shape shifting or even lycanthropy, the circle will also accept and teach those merely drawn to the idea of embracing the wild.

    The methods used to achieve their shape shifting powers vary per individual circle. While some use their magic to temper the lycanthropic curse burning in their blood, others achieve their feats of metamorphosis with the help of animal spirits or even certain natural deities.

    Combat Wild Shape
    Unchanged from Circle of the Moon (PHB, page 69)

    Lunar Forms
    The rites of your circle grant you the ability to transform into pseudo lycanthropic Lunar Forms. Starting at 2nd level, you can transform into the four Lunar Forms described below.

    A druid who transforms into Lunar form has two shapes available to them. A hybrid form (reminiscent of the classic lycanthrope) and an animal form (similar to a natural creature). Shifting between the hybrid and animal form takes a bonus action and can be done at will. This transformation does not consume a wildshape charge and doesn’t count in any way as a new transformation. When in hybrid form you may substitute any attack with a weapon attack. You must declare this substitution prior to making the attack.

    The hybrid and animal form have identical stats, unless noted in the descriptions below. The differences between the two are in looks (natural animal vs lycanthropic monster), and the fact that a druid in hybrid form is able to speak (though not competently enough to provide the verbal component of a spell).

    The specific stats of the form you assume, are determined by the form you choose and your druid level, as show in this table:

    Druid Level Shape Level Special
    2 1 Cannot use the sea form, nor the reptile form's swim speed
    4 1 -
    6 2 -
    9 3 -
    12 4 -
    15 5 -
    18 6 -

    A Druid of the Full Moon can also assume other forms, as described in the "wildshape" feature.

    Spoiler: Pachyderm (Rhino/Elephant) Form
    Show

    Level Size AC HP Speed STR DEX CON Abilities Actions Charge DC Charge Dam
    1 Large 13 2d12+4 30 ft 19 8 15 Charge Gore (1d8+4) 14 1d8
    2 Large 14 4d12+12 30 ft 20 8 16 Charge Gore (1d8+5) 15 1d8
    3 Large 15 6d12+18 30 ft 21 8 17 Charge Gore (2d8+5) 16 2d8
    4 Huge 16 8d12+32 30 ft 22 8 18 Charge Gore (2d8+6) 17 2d8
    5 Huge 17 10d12+40 30 ft 23 8 19 Charge Gore (3d8+6) 18 3d8
    6 Huge 18 12d12+60 30 ft 24 8 20 Charge Gore (3d8+7) 19 3d8

    Size (Hybrid form): The Pachyderm hybrid form is always Large.
    Size (Animal form): The Pachyderm animal form is Large at levels 1 through 3. From level 4 onwards, the druid has a choice to be either Large or Huge in animal form instead.
    AC: Based on Natural armor.
    Skills: A druid in Pachyderm form gains proficiency in Athletics.
    Charge: If a druid in pachyderm form moves at least 15 feet straight toward a target and then hits it with a gore attack on the same turn, the target takes X bludgeoning damage (for amount, see table). If the target is a creature, it must succeed on a Strength saving throw (For DC, see table) or be knocked prone.
    Gore: Melee Weapon Attack: Prof+Str mod to hit, reach 5 ft., one target. Hit: X bludgeoning damage (See Table).


    Spoiler: Sea (Shark) Form
    Show

    Level Size AC HP Speed STR DEX CON Senses Abilities Actions
    1 Medium 12 2d10+4 15 ft, Swim 40 ft 14 14 13 Underwater Blindsight (30) Blood Frenzy, Amphibious Bite (1d8+2)
    2 Medium 12 4d10+8 15 ft, Swim 40 ft 16 14 15 Underwater Blindsight (30) Blood Frenzy, Amphibious Bite (1d10+3)
    3 Medium 12 6d10+18 15 ft, Swim 50 ft 18 14 17 Underwater Blindsight (30) Blood Frenzy, Amphibious Bite (2d8+4)
    4 Large 12 8d10+32 20 ft, Swim 50 ft 20 14 19 Underwater Blindsight (30) Blood Frenzy, Amphibious Bite (2d10+5)
    5 Large 12 10d10+50 20 ft, Swim 60 ft 22 14 21 Underwater Blindsight (30) Blood Frenzy, Amphibious Bite (3d8+6)
    6 Large 12 12d10+72 20 ft, Swim 60 ft 24 14 23 Underwater Blindsight (30) Blood Frenzy, Amphibious Bite (3d10+7)

    Size: The Sea Form is Medium at levels 1 through 3. From level 4 onwards, the druid has a choice to be either Medium or Large instead.
    AC: Unable to benefit from worn armor.
    Skills: A druid in Sea Form gains proficiency in Athletics and Perception.
    Underwater Blindsight: A druid in Sea Form gains blindsight with a range of 30 feet while underwater.
    Blood Frenzy: A druid in Sea Form has advantage on melee attack rolls against any creature (that can bleed) that doesn't have all its hit points.
    Amphibious: A druid in Sea Form can breathe air and water.
    Bite: Melee Weapon Attack: Prof+Str mod to hit, reach 5 ft., one target. Hit: X piercing damage. (See Table)


    Spoiler: Feline (Tiger/Panther) Form
    Show

    Level Size AC HP Speed STR DEX CON Abilities Actions DC
    1 Medium 12 2d10+2 40 ft 17 15 13 Keen Smell, Pounce, Running Leap Bite (1d8+3), Claw (1d6+3) 13
    2 Medium 12 4d10+8 40 ft 18 15 14 Keen Smell, Pounce, Running Leap Bite (1d8+4), Claw (1d8+4) 14
    3 Medium 12 5d10+10 50 ft 19 15 15 Keen Smell, Pounce, Running Leap, Multiattack Bite (1d10+4), Claw (1d8+4) 15
    4 Large 12 7d10+21 50 ft 20 15 16 Keen Smell, Pounce, Running Leap, Multiattack Bite (1d10+5), Claw (1d8+5) 16
    5 Large 12 8d10+24 60 ft 21 15 17 Keen Smell, Pounce, Running Leap, Multiattack Bite (1d12+5), Claw (1d10+5) 17
    6 Large 12 10d10+40 60 ft 22 15 18 Keen Smell, Pounce, Running Leap, Multiattack Bite (1d12+6), Claw (1d10+6) 18

    Size (Hybrid form): The Feline hybrid form is always Medium.
    Size (Animal form): The Feline animal form is Medium at levels 1 through 3. From level 4 onwards, the druid has a choice to be either Medium or Large in animal form instead.
    AC: Can wear armor.
    Skills: A druid in Feline Form gains proficiency in Acrobatics and Perception.
    Keen Smell: A druid in Feline Form has advantage on Wisdom (Perception) checks that rely on smell.
    Pounce: If a druid in Feline Form moves at least 20 feet straight toward a creature and then hits it with a claw attack on the same turn, that target must succeed on a Strength saving throw (For DC, see table) or be knocked prone. If the target is prone, the druid can make one bite attack against it as a bonus action.
    Running Leap: With a 10-foot running start, a druid in Feline Form can long jump up to 25 feet.
    Multiattack (Hybrid form): From level 3 onwards, a druid in Feline Form (hybrid), makes two weapon attacks, only one of which can be its bite.
    Multiattack (Animal form): From level 3 onwards, a druid in Feline Form (animal), can attack twice. Once with its claws, once with its bite.
    Bite: Melee Weapon Attack: Prof+Str mod to hit, reach 5 ft., one target. Hit: X piercing damage. (See Table)
    Claw: Melee Weapon Attack: Prof+Str mod to hit, reach 5 ft., one target. Hit: X slashing damage. (See Table)


    Spoiler: Reptile (Lizard/Crocodile) Form
    Show

    Level Size AC HP Speed STR DEX CON Abilities Actions Hold breath DC
    1 Medium 13 2d8+2 30 ft, climb 30ft, swim 30 ft 13 12 12 Hold Breath, Spider Climb Bite (1d6+1), Tail (1d4+1) 5 12
    2 Medium 13 4d8+4 30 ft, climb 30ft, swim 30 ft 14 13 12 Hold Breath, Spider Climb Bite (1d8+2), Tail (1d6+2) 10 13
    3 Medium 14 5d8+5 30 ft, climb 30ft, swim 30 ft 15 14 12 Hold Breath, Spider Climb, Multiattack Bite (1d10+2), Tail (1d8+2) 15 14
    4 Medium 14 7d8+7 30 ft, climb 30ft, swim 30 ft 16 15 12 Hold Breath, Spider Climb, Multiattack Bite (2d6+3 Tail (1d8+3) 20 15
    5 Medium 15 8d8+8 30 ft, climb 30ft, swim 30 ft 17 16 12 Hold Breath, Spider Climb, Multiattack Bite (2d8+3), Tail (2d6+3) 25 16
    6 Medium 15 10d8+10 30 ft, climb 30ft, swim 30 ft 18 17 12 Hold Breath, Spider Climb, Multiattack Bite (2d10+4), Tail (2d8+4) 30 17

    Size: The Reptile Form is always Medium.
    AC: Based on Natural armor.
    Skills: A druid in Reptile Form gains proficiency in Acrobatics and Stealth.
    Hold Breath: A druid in Reptile Form can hold its breath for a number of minutes, as shown in the table.
    Spider Climb: A druid in Reptile Form can climb difficult surfaces, without needing to make an ability check. This does not apply to ceilings and other near impossible surfaces.
    Multiattack: From level 3 onwards, a druid in Reptile Form, makes two weapon attacks, one with its bite and one with its tail.
    Bite: Melee Weapon Attack: Prof+Str mod to hit, reach 5 ft., one target. Hit: X piercing damage (See Table), and the target is grappled (escape DC, see table). Until this grapple ends, the target is restrained, and the crocodile can't bite another target.
    Tail: Melee Weapon Attack: Prof+Str mod to hit, reach 10 ft., one target not grappled by the crocodile. Hit: X bludgeoning damage (See Table). If the target is a creature, it must succeed on a Strength saving throw (For DC, see table) or be knocked prone.


    Primal Strike
    Unchanged from Circle of the Moon (PHB, page 69)

    Lycanthropic Wild Shape
    At 10th level, you can expend two uses of Wild Shape at the same time to transform into a more powerful version of your Lunar Forms. This provides both general improvements and improvements specific to each form.

    General Lycanthropic benefits
    Because the druid lets the lycanthropic nature of their ability rise closer to the surface, all Lunar Forms gain the following benefits:
    Damage Resistances: bludgeoning, piercing, and slashing from nonmagical attacks that aren't silvered.
    Condition Immunities: exhaustion, poisoned.

    Spoiler: Specific Pachyderm Lycanthropic benefits
    Show

    The unmovable, resilient nature of their natural cousins gives the Pachyderm form the following additional benefits:
    Damage Immunities: bludgeoning, piercing, and slashing from nonmagical attacks that aren't silvered.
    Damage Resistances: bludgeoning, piercing, and slashing attacks.
    Advantage on: Saving throws against being knocked prone.


    Spoiler: Specific Sea Lycanthropic benefits
    Show

    As a creature of the deep, cold waters, the Sea Form gains the following additional benefits:
    Damage Resistances: Acid & Cold
    Condition Immunities: Prone while in the water
    You are acclimated to cold and frigid water, suffering no ill effect when exposed to it.


    Spoiler: Specific Feline Lycanthropic benefits
    Show

    As nimble and flexible creatures, the Feline Form gains the following additional benefits:
    Condition Immunities: Prone
    Advantage on: Saving throws against being grappled or restrained.
    When you make a melee attack against a creature, you don't provoke opportunity attacks from that creature for the rest of the turn, whether you hit or not.


    Spoiler: Specific Reptile Lycanthropic benefits
    Show

    Closely related to many a toxic or corrosive animal, the Reptile form gains the following additional benefits:
    Damage Immunities: Poison
    Damage Resistances: Acid
    Advantage on: Dexterity (Stealth) checks when holding completely still.


    Thousand Forms
    Unchanged from Circle of the Moon (PHB, page 69)


    Spoiler: Alternate rule 1: Less flight/Forms - for less hassle/lower magic settings
    Show

    In lower magic campaigns; or when the player/DM don't want to deal with quite so many different stats and movement options. Consider the following adaptations:

    Limited:
    A druid of the Full Moon has a limited repetoire of non-Lunar Forms. They have access to a number of forms equal to 2 + their INT modifier.
    Whenever you gain a level in this class, you can swap out two known forms for two new ones.
    These forms must meet all requirements as mentioned in the wildshape feature.

    None:
    Druids of the Circle of the Full Moon cannot use their wildshape feature to transform into other shapes than their lunar forms.

    Spoiler: Alternate rule 2: Focusing on a single Lunar Form - for an even simpler and more lycanthropic feel
    Show

    As requested by "Elves" here are my thoughts about making this a single form class instead.
    The major upside of this is playing closer to a normal lycanthrope (always cool), but it comes with a downside of even less adaptability.
    To compensate for this downside, I'd suggest making the following changes:


    Add to Lunar Forms:
    When you first gain access to this feature, pick one of the 4 possible Lunar Forms. You can only transform into this form, the other 3 are forever beyond your reach.

    From level 6 on, your chosen form gets a boost, based on the form chosen (An early present from their "Lycanthropic Wild Shape" benefits).

    Pachyderm Form gets:
    Damage Resistance: bludgeoning, piercing, and slashing from nonmagical attacks that aren't silvered.

    Sea Form gets:
    Condition Immunity: Exhaustion
    You are acclimated to cold and frigid water, suffering no ill effect when exposed to it.

    Feline Form gets:
    When you make a melee attack against a creature, you don't provoke opportunity attacks from that creature for the rest of the turn, whether you hit or not.

    Reptile Form gets:
    Damage Immunity: Poison
    Condition Immunity: Poisoned


    Change to Lycanthropic Wild Shape:
    A Druid of the Full Moon, only expends a single use of Wild shape when using their Lycanthropic Wild Shape.

    Spoiler: Alternate rule 3: Refluffing/Changing the Lunar Shapes - If you like Turtles more than sharks (or are more Rat than Reptile)
    Show

    While just re-skinning the Lunar Forms is as simple as picking another cosmetic pallet, actually making the forms fit to the new forms would be far more interesting. So below, you can find my idea for a number of changes with an initial idea of how to change the stats.
    Note that some changes (like changing the Sea shape to be Turtle base) require another change to keep the different roles overall (in case of Turtle, which can be rather tanky, the Pachyderm needs some changes as well).
    And to be honest, changing the Pachyderm to a more movement based form, means that the feline form needs to find a new role in its new Lupine form as well. Thus linking the first 3 together, Though only the Sea/Pachyderm change really SHOULD be done together at all times.

    Pachyderm to Bovine (Elk/Horse/Ox)
    Instead of the Pachyderm's stand there and take it - "I'm a living wall" - attitude. This one would be more about mobility. So we are going from "Immovable object" to "unstoppable object".
    We keep most of the stats and attacks from the main Pachyderm form, but we'll lower its hp, AC and Charge DC. And increase its speed. Plus give it a more "utilitarian" feature.

    Suggested change to Lunar form:
    • HP to use d10's instead of d12's
    • AC to use the following progression: 13/13/14/14/15/15 (Would have liked to go "wear armor" but with that Dex and no heavy armor, it just doesn't work)
    • Speed to use the following progression: 40/40/50/50/60/60
    • Charge DC to be reduced by 1
    • Add "Powerful build" at all levels - Increasing carrying capacity and otherwise helping with moving things around


    Suggested value for Lycanthropic Wild Shape:
    Resistant to: Force and Psychic
    Advantage on saves again: Grappled, Paralyzed, Petrified, Prone, Restrained, Unconscious


    Sea to Turtle (Snapping Turtle)
    A snapping turtle is almost as much about biting as a shark is. However, it takes a more defensive stand on the whole thing.
    Again we keep the basic stats, but we'll change speeds, hp, dex, ac, blindsight and bloodlust.

    Suggested change to Lunar form:
    • Lower the Dex to 10
    • Change the HD to d12's
    • Make the AC a progression of 13/14/15/16/17/18 (Natural armor)
    • Change walking speed to a progression of 20/20/25/25/30/30
    • Change swimming speed to a progression of 30/30/35/35/40/40
    • Remove "Underwater blindsight"
    • Remove "Blood Frenzy"
    • Give the Turtle Advantage against being knocked prone (I don't like the "Dex to get up" and the "less AC while prone" rules for snapping turtles/Tortles. But you could apply them)
    • On a succesful bite attack, allow the Turtle to start a grapple


    Suggested value for Lycanthropic Wild Shape:
    Immune to: bludgeoning, piercing, and slashing from nonmagical attacks that aren't silvered
    Resistant to: Acid and Cold
    You are acclimated to cold and frigid water, suffering no ill effect when exposed to it.


    Feline to Lupine (Wolf/Hyena)
    The wolf and the cat could theoretically be a literal re-skin and done. But as the Bovine form now takes up the mobility slot, let's tweak the Lupine Form as well.
    We'll lower the speed a little, remove the jumping bonus and up the senses slightly. And to give it its own feel, add the Hyena's rampage ability.

    Suggested change to Lunar form:
    • Change the walking speed progression to 30/30/35/35/40/40
    • Change "Keen Smell" into "Keen Hearing and Smell" expanding the advantage to hearing as well
    • Give the "Rampage" ability, granting a bonus movement and attack with its claws as a bonus action when it brings an enemy down (so for first rounds it has pounce, for later rounds it has rampage. Both require a bonus action, so they'll never stack)


    Suggested value for Lycanthropic Wild Shape:
    Increase Darkvision range to 120ft
    When a druid in Lupine Form takes damage, it can choose to respond offensively or defensively:
    Offensively: On the druid's next turn their first attack against the dealer of the damage has advantage to hit.
    Defensively: Until the end of their next turn, the druid has resistance to that type of damage from that source.


    Reptile to Rodent (Rat)
    The rat fills the same role as the Reptile. Namely being the more skill based form, with less hp/ac/size etc. However, we'll still tweak some things to make it more fitting flavor wise.
    We'll drop the natural armor, going instead with the ability to wear armor. And we'll replace spiderclimb with resistance to being poisoned/diseased. And the bite will no longer grapple, instead it will disease our enemies.

    Suggested change to Lunar form:
    • AC will be based on Dexterity and armor worn, instead of natural armor
    • Hold breath scales slower than before at 5/5/10/10/15/15
    • Remove Spiderclimb
    • Add advantage on saving throws to avoid being poisoned or diseased
    • Instead of allowing a grapple, the bite attack now has a chance to bestow a disease on our enemies (same DC - maybe lowered slightly) - vs CON. If they fail the safe, they get the downsides that normally come with being poisoned)


    Suggested value for Lycanthropic Wild Shape:
    Immunity to: Poison damage
    Condition immunity: Poisoned and Diseased
    Advantage on: Saving throws to escape grapples and restraints
    The ability to count as 1 size smaller when trying to squeeze through small openings


    Changelog:
    • 2021-02-02: Improved description of the Lunar form (and the distinction between animal and hybrid form), hopefully making it easier to understand. Also added more standardized descriptions in the specific Lunar Forms (also removed some unneeded differentiators between hybrid and animal form). Finally, added some spoiler tags to keep things condensed and improved visual looks of the tables.
    • 2021-02-04: Added additional boost to the Lycanthropic wild shape bonusses for the Sea, Feline and Reptile forms. Add wording about the use of weapons in hybrid form. Replaced the rule of "no non-Lunar Form" wildshapes with a rule giving them normal druid wildshape forms. Instead added "Alternate rule 1" about limiting/removing these forms for lower magic/lower hassle campaigns.
    • 2021-02-07: Added a second and third alternate rule. Adding the ability to play this class with a single lunar form (more lycanthropic) and some alternate looks/inspirations for the 4 Lunar Forms.
    Last edited by Loek; 2021-02-07 at 06:36 AM. Reason: Update
    Help improve my (favorite) 5e homebrews: The Circle of the Full Moon and Tweaking the Echo Knight.
    My old 3.5 homebrews: The Disciple of the gem, the Dragonhearted and my Warlock fix.

  2. - Top - End - #2
    Pixie in the Playground
    Join Date
    Sep 2018

    Default Re: Circle of the Full Moon

    Unfortunately, I do not feel like I have enough experience to address the balance issues for the various forms however there are a few points that I do so that should probably be addressed.

    Swapping between animal form and hybrid form feels like it is an important part of this subclass. But within a particular lunar form I am not clear what is the same between the two forms and what is different. Maybe it is clear if one reads the lycanthrope entry of the monster manual, but since it is an important part of the subclass you should probably put the general rules here and indicate that forms with additional differences are noted in the table and/or the description of the form.

    There are a couple of instances of language like "Medium, with an option to go Large from Level 4 onwards". I think this language should probably be rephrase. I think the intention is that at levels 1-3 that form must be Medium and at levels 4-6 that form can be Medium or Large at the player's choice, but I am not sure of that interpretation.

    As written, this is the only Druid subclass that can not assume a form that can fly. I think you should that can use form level 2 without restrictions, and create an Avian form chart that only has form levels 2-6. If you want to keep things a little simpler you could delay access to a flying form by 1 level by omitting the druid level 8 row from the chart and omitting the Lunar form level 2 row from the Avian form.

  3. - Top - End - #3
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    Elves's Avatar

    Join Date
    Feb 2019

    Default Re: Circle of the Full Moon

    Moon Circle based on lycanthropy is a much cooler idea than canon. But having these different forms is too complex. Focus it on being a werewolf.
    The Age of Warriors (revived 2019) - Huge fanmade TOB sequel. Content needs PEACH and input.

  4. - Top - End - #4
    Dwarf in the Playground
     
    Devil

    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Location
    The Netherlands
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Circle of the Full Moon

    Quote Originally Posted by kosh49 View Post
    Swapping between animal form and hybrid form feels like it is an important part of this subclass. But within a particular lunar form I am not clear what is the same between the two forms and what is different. Maybe it is clear if one reads the lycanthrope entry of the monster manual, but since it is an important part of the subclass you should probably put the general rules here and indicate that forms with additional differences are noted in the table and/or the description of the form.
    The lycanthope entry has nothing to do with this class other than some inspiration (like the use of hybrid/animal).

    And in general, the animal form and the hybrid form are identical, with the following exceptions:
    • In hybrid form, the druid can speak (but not provide verbal components to spells)
    • The druid will appear different (I'd image you'd get a different response to a tiger vs a weretiger - One = jikes, send out a hunter. The other = burn the witch, start the inquisition!)
    • Aspects noted specifically with (hybrid) or (animal) in the descriptions.

    All that said and done, you are right that this isn't always immediately clear. I'll go back and make this clear somehow.

    Quote Originally Posted by kosh49 View Post
    There are a couple of instances of language like "Medium, with an option to go Large from Level 4 onwards". I think this language should probably be rephrase. I think the intention is that at levels 1-3 that form must be Medium and at levels 4-6 that form can be Medium or Large at the player's choice, but I am not sure of that interpretation.
    Your interpretation is mostly correct. (I had originally intended some differences between the forms, but I think keeping things the same will probably be a good idea) I'll go with a "at level x to y, the form is... and level a to b, you have the option to be" phrasing.

    Quote Originally Posted by kosh49 View Post
    As written, this is the only Druid subclass that can not assume a form that can fly. I think you should that can use form level 2 without restrictions, and create an Avian form chart that only has form levels 2-6. If you want to keep things a little simpler you could delay access to a flying form by 1 level by omitting the druid level 8 row from the chart and omitting the Lunar form level 2 row from the Avian form.
    This was actually fully intentional. As I believe that flight is one of those "things". When used properly it's cool and awesome. But it quickly becomes something that DM's either actively work against and/or fail to account for. That said, a quick fix for this could be to allow the "Druid of the Full Moon" access to the normal druidic wildshaping. (aka, the slow CR progression table that all druids have), giving them some usability forms there...

    (The main reason why I don't like a wereavian type form, besides this moratorium on flying speed, is that you quickly end up with a (possibly better) Aarokocra/Raptoran)

    Quote Originally Posted by Elves View Post
    Moon Circle based on lycanthropy is a much cooler idea than canon. But having these different forms is too complex. Focus it on being a werewolf.
    Thank you. As for focusing on a single shape, that's indeed possible. Though the loss of flexibility would probably lead to some minor boosts to most forms... I'll go play with this idea for a little while.


    Moved the "To Do" list to the bottom of the first post
    Last edited by Loek; 2021-02-04 at 04:59 PM. Reason: Checking off elements that have been completed
    Help improve my (favorite) 5e homebrews: The Circle of the Full Moon and Tweaking the Echo Knight.
    My old 3.5 homebrews: The Disciple of the gem, the Dragonhearted and my Warlock fix.

  5. - Top - End - #5
    Pixie in the Playground
    Join Date
    Sep 2018

    Default Re: Circle of the Full Moon

    You are right. Allowing them to use the regular druid wild shape forms so they can still take the form of a flying scout is probably better than giving them a full combat flying form that scales the same way the other Lunar Forms do.

  6. - Top - End - #6
    Orc in the Playground
    Join Date
    Aug 2013

    Default Re: Circle of the Full Moon

    Like some have said already, this is a cool idea but is also a bit cumbersome for what you are after. One idea is to look at the build of lychanthrope monsters and incorporating the common elements of them. There is also the consideration much like the lychanthrope monsters are you going to allow the use of weapons a druid has access to while in their hybrid shape? More so how do you balance this?

    One idea/example may be something like this:

    Lunar Forms
    The rites of your circle grant you the ability to transform into pseudo lycanthropic forms. Starting at 2nd level, you can use your Wild Shape to transform into a beast with a challenge rating as high as 1. You ignore the Max. CR column of the Beast Shapes table, but must abide by the other limitations there. Alternatively you may shape yourself into a humanoid form of your animal of medium size or larger. While in humanoid form you still maintain all characteristics of the animal form but gain these additional benefits:

    - You are unable to speak though may use other means to communicate ideas requiring use of hands.
    - Your size becomes medium. Your land movement speed returns to your default land speed and your animal form attacks decrease to 1d8 damage if they were higher though still maintain any other effects of the attack.
    - You are able to manipulate and use simple objects including weapons.
    - If your animal form grants you a multi-attack you may substitute one attack with a weapon attack that is a melee weapon you are proficient in. You must declare this substitution prior to making the attack.

    While in either your animal or humanoid form, you may shift between these as a bonus action. Starting at 6th level, you can transform into a beast with a challenge rating as high as your druid level divided by 3, rounded down.


    In this write up, rather than having to come up with forms it goes by the animal itself and still allows a continual progression like the original moon druids. Though you are able to shift into the hybrid form. As to the hybrid form, there needs to be some balance points of disadvantages and advantages with respect to the full animal form. What I have placed was just some examples off the top of my head. But there needs to be trade offs of some kind so as to balance the forms.

    On your Lycanthropic Wild Shape I would just make it a support ability granting immunity the resistance to the weapon damages but with the caveaut of being non-magical and non-silver. This falls in line design with like with the resistance abilities the paladin gets.

  7. - Top - End - #7
    Dwarf in the Playground
     
    Devil

    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Location
    The Netherlands
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Circle of the Full Moon

    Quote Originally Posted by GentlemanVoodoo View Post
    Like some have said already, this is a cool idea but is also a bit cumbersome for what you are after. One idea is to look at the build of lychanthrope monsters and incorporating the common elements of them. There is also the consideration much like the lychanthrope monsters are you going to allow the use of weapons a druid has access to while in their hybrid shape? More so how do you balance this?
    The main problem with straight up looking at the lycanthropes, is the fact that they true transformations (Think brackets around that true bit there). If a lycanthrope hits 0 HP, it dies, while a druid merely shifts back to their normal form. As such, looking at the beasts (that a druid's wildshape is supposedly balanced for) makes more sense (and later the elementals for the level 10 feature).

    As for weapon use, I'd consider letting them use weapons, but only by replacing one of their attacks. Which in almost all cases (levels/weapons) would lead to a strictly weaker attack as the shape's damages quickly outstrip the druid's limited weapons (not to mention the specials attached to quite a few beast attacks). The main win would be if you go ranged weapon, which will need an outside source of proficiencies (No (cross)bows for the druids) to truly shine. And even then, a shifted druid can't use their magic. So they are already giving up a massive source of ranged options.

    Quote Originally Posted by GentlemanVoodoo View Post
    One idea/example may be something like this:
    ...
    I really like the simplicity of this write up. A simple few rules instead of reinventing the wheel. Very nicely done.
    However, let's take one of the more advanced forms. Like the Giant shark. In hybrid form, they'd be sacrificing their swim speed (but still need to breathe underwater) and their 3d10 attack for a very basic normal attack.

    Realistically, it would result in a normal Moon druid, but with an additional hybrid "utility" trick.

    And as I stated in my design goals, the goal was to temper some of the Moon druid's complexity and strengths. Not add to them.

    Quote Originally Posted by GentlemanVoodoo View Post
    On your Lycanthropic Wild Shape I would just make it a support ability granting immunity the resistance to the weapon damages but with the caveaut of being non-magical and non-silver. This falls in line design with like with the resistance abilities the paladin gets.
    Like I said above, I'm comparing this ability to the "elemental wildshape" ability. But even if you compare it to the paladin (I'm guessing the oathbreaker's 15th level one?):
    • The paladin's ability is always active and has one less "way around it".
    • The druid one reduces one of their core features from a twice a rest to a single use per rest.

    So no, I wouldn't limit it to just that resistance.

    All that said, this sentence looks near perfect, and I'll be borrowing that one (though I'll let them substitute regardless of multi attack):
    • If your animal form grants you a multi-attack you may substitute one attack with a weapon attack that is a melee weapon you are proficient in. You must declare this substitution prior to making the attack.
    Help improve my (favorite) 5e homebrews: The Circle of the Full Moon and Tweaking the Echo Knight.
    My old 3.5 homebrews: The Disciple of the gem, the Dragonhearted and my Warlock fix.

  8. - Top - End - #8
    Dwarf in the Playground
     
    Devil

    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Location
    The Netherlands
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Circle of the Full Moon

    Alright, I just made the final update (barring more comments/feedback/help of course).

    The class now has 3 alternate rules:
    1. A limit to the smaller forms it can assume (for less overhead/burrowing/flying)
    2. A quick idea of how to make a less adaptive single form version work
    3. 4 different versions of the Lunar shapes (Bovine, Turtle, Lupine and Rodent) instead of the original 4


    What I'm mostly still looking for is feedback on:
    • The stats/attacks/details of the Lunar forms
    • How rough/usable the alternate rules are (especially 2 and 3)


    Thanks for all the feedback so far and a thank you in advance for all future feedback.
    Help improve my (favorite) 5e homebrews: The Circle of the Full Moon and Tweaking the Echo Knight.
    My old 3.5 homebrews: The Disciple of the gem, the Dragonhearted and my Warlock fix.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •