DataNinja's Scintillating Digital Random Banter #231

[Jasdoif]

Expecting a superhuman to solve our problems isn't a solution at all and pretty much all structures created (under the pretense of) to enable that are part of the various problems. Horizontal co-operation is where it's at.

More generally, someone who wants you to solve your own problems is more trustworthy than someone who wants you to give them your stuff so they can solve all your problems for you. If the intentions are sincere, it means they have no idea what all your problems actually are; and it's exceedingly rare for the intentions to be sincere....In either case, the story always changes after they have your stuff; there's no escrow here.

[Fyraltari]

There have been a large number of near misses in human history.

That is true. There also have been a lot of good things, as I said, focusing on the negative and taking the positive for granted.

Also, some scientists have said that if the problem of climate change isn't solved by 2050ish that human extinction will be inevitable.

These are the most pessimistic estimates, even taking only into account those who say that climate change is no longer reversible most estimates state that it will result in a horrible situation as social inequalities (and most things) are worsened but not in the guaranteed anihilation of the homo genus.

Weren't you just talking about survivorship bias?

Yes, and?

[Peelee]

That's not a success rate, a success rate would be "100% of the average people with an overinflated ego who try to establish a monarchy succeed." In reality, that number is much lower, being only a fraction of a percent.

Textbook case of survivor bias, right there.

I more meant that as an off-the-cuff remark on how many civilizations ended up with kings/emperors. But yeah, still survivor bias, you got me there.

Also, i agree with everything Fyraltari said in this thread between that quote and now.

[Rater202]

Anyway, I have my reasons to be pessimistic and leave it at that.

If anyone wonders why most of the fantasies I've shared here involve sleeping for centuries, putting my loved ones on a ship and leaving the earth behind, or transforming into something that only has to interact with society on its own terms, this is one of the reasons.

Other reasons include my dissatisfaction with the body I have, the body I'm most likely to ever have under the best of circumstances, and so on, being fed up with achy joints, bad vision, hypersensitivity, and so on, general transhumanist leanings, and a vague desire to show them, show them all! in regards to all the people who ever mistreated me.

[Form]

Wrong, the king can only interact with so many people every day. Power is ultimately a story that the nation agrees upon. Without symbols office be they trinkets, uniforms, palaces, flags or whatever decorum to tell everybody where they fit into the social hierarchy no-one could rule anybody. The king isn't better than anybody else, he's just the one that the apparel of state is most convinced can ensure their next paycheck and that apparelt of state only exists because the people agrees to the narrative that justifies its existence, that it is the best system ordained by god, the will of the nation, natural law, whatever to ensures both stability and an acceptable level of prosperity to the majority of them. Symbols of authority serve to reinforce that narrative, to reinforce the belief that the system is best and the one it has put in place as leader is in fact the best of them, imbued with special authority by the supreme authority that legitimates the state.

Ah, but surely that is the sign they are not a true monarch! /jest

But yeah, sure, if you want to be more realistic about then all the bells and whistles do very much serve a purpose. Though there's a difference between a little bit of such decorum and a lot of it and somewhere along that line between the two I'd find myself wondering how solid their political power base really is if they feel the need emphasize it so much. And I'm sure the various symbols of the office of the monarchy have a rich and storied history and that it's all laden with meaningful symbolism too....., most of which I know little about.

They weren't a battle harem. They were an army calling itself a harem.

You know, you're not doing a very good job of selling this harem of yours!

[Peelee]

Ah, but surely that is the sign they are not a true monarch! /jest

But yeah, sure, if you want to be more realistic about then all the bells and whistles do very much serve a purpose. Though there's a difference between a little bit of such decorum and a lot of it

My favorite crown is the laurel wreath of ancient times. I always saw it as a portrayal of status and simultaneously humility, as it was not an ostentatious display of previous metals and stones but a simple plant. Not sure that that's how it was meant, but that's how I like to see it. The "speak softly" part of rulership embodied in a crown, as it were.

[sktarq]

My favorite crown is the laurel wreath of ancient times. I always saw it as a portrayal of status and simultaneously humility, as it was not an ostentatious display of previous metals and stones but a simple plant. Not sure that that's how it was meant, but that's how I like to see it. The "speak softly" part of rulership embodied in a crown, as it were.

Well since the Grass Crown was even higher it does create an interesting dynamic where lower symbols had greater status.

[Rater202]

Me: Standing in kitchen heading to living room

Kitty: Sitting in living room next to coffee table, looking into kitchen.

Me and Kitty: Look at each other for 10-20 seconds.

Me: Walks into living room.

Kitty: Jump's on coffee table and presents self for pats and scratches.

They're learning.

[Anonymouswizard]

Loading screen: 150FPS
Gameplay: 15FPS

I hate games trying to claim I can run them with higher graphics than I can. At least I just blitzed through character creation to check it actually got to gameplay.

[Rater202]

I can't help but be perplexed by people who only listen to one kind of music or hate a genre of music out of hand.

There's good pop and bad pop. Good rock and bad rock. Good country and bad country. Good rap and bad rap.

And so on.

Honestly, the idea of classifying your tastes in music by genre seems odd to me.

[Tvtyrant]

I can't help but be perplexed by people who only listen to one kind of music or hate a genre of music out of hand.

There's good pop and bad pop. Good rock and bad rock. Good country and bad country. Good rap and bad rap.

And so on.

Honestly, the idea of classifying your tastes in music by genre seems odd to me.

I think there is a common scenario where genre music requires prepared listening to enjoy. Miles Davis is considered amazing by jazz fans, and most people much prefer the dance jazz those same fans dislike for its lack of intricacy. Metallica is barely considered metal by metal heads, but it is far and away more enjoyable than Burzum to most people.

There's some elitism there, but I also think the nuances of a genre tend to be lost on people who aren't into that genre and you desensitize yourself to genre conventions that seem spotty outside the genre. In addition music is very much generational; Old Susana was a bonafide hit once and Elvis really was edgy.

[Rater202]

I think there is a common scenario where genre music requires prepared listening to enjoy. Miles Davis is considered amazing by jazz fans, and most people much prefer the dance jazz those same fans dislike for its lack of intricacy. Metallica is barely considered metal by metal heads, but it is far and away more enjoyable than Burzum to most people.

There's some elitism there, but I also think the nuances of a genre tend to be lost on people who aren't into that genre and you desensitize yourself to genre conventions that seem spotty outside the genre. In addition music is very much generational; Old Susana was a bonafide hit once and Elvis really was edgy.

Yeah, I guess.

But like, my typical playlist would be some Eminem, some Charlie Daniels, some Nickleback, some Kiss, an original cast recording from a musical, something by Bach or Mozart, some Queen, an English language cover of an anime theme song, a J-pop song I first heard in a videogame, some Daft Punk, and an eighties cartoon theme played on Tesla coils.

And when I think about it it seems weird to me that such varied tastes aren't standard.

[Anonymouswizard]

Good rap and bad rap.

Shame it's mostly the latter that gets released.

Okay, I'm aware I'm supposed to be part of the rap and grime generation, but none of the major rap songs I've heard have sounded good to me, barring Stan (and a couple of other that I'm not sure if they count as rap, let me google... okay I also enjoy Gangster's Paradise). A lot of it has to do with missing the complexity that music needs.

Like, I complain in RL that modern pop music is only taking the bad parts of rap. I have a lot of dislike for the attributes of modern mainstream rap (but that doesn't mean I think all rap is bad).

What really annoys me is when rap songs use the chorus of other songs, because it can lead to me experiencing quality whiplash when the chorus comes on and I recognise a good if nit great song. I'd argue that your rap song has failed if I come away singing 'Baby, when I met you/There was peace unknown/I set out to get you/With a fine tooth comb'.

[Lord Raziere]

I mean I just have an eclectic assortment of songs in my playlist as well. maybe me and Rater are just a similar type of introvert in that regard? though most of my picks tend to be videogame music, remixes of videogame music, anime music, and such. most of it to get me pumped. I have recently been listening to Ace attorney music and there is good reason why they had an orchestral concert made out of it. Edgeworth's first pursuit theme is my favorite.

[Peelee]

Shame it's mostly the latter that gets released.

Okay, I'm aware I'm supposed to be part of the rap and grime generation, but none of the major rap songs I've heard have sounded good to me, barring Stan (and a couple of other that I'm not sure if they count as rap, let me google... okay I also enjoy Gangster's Paradise). A lot of it has to do with missing the complexity that music needs.

Like, I complain in RL that modern pop music is only taking the bad parts of rap. I have a lot of dislike for the attributes of modern mainstream rap (but that doesn't mean I think all rap is bad).

What really annoys me is when rap songs use the chorus of other songs, because it can lead to me experiencing quality whiplash when the chorus comes on and I recognise a good if nit great song. I'd argue that your rap song has failed if I come away singing 'Baby, when I met you/There was peace unknown/I set out to get you/With a fine tooth comb'.

As a non-fan of rap, I like a good amount of Eminem's stuff. Mostly the ones that are very pointed and have him delivering specific messages, like Till I Collapse or Without Me. Dude is a lyrical genius.

[Rater202]

I mean I just have an eclectic assortment of songs in my playlist as well. maybe me and Rater are just a similar type of introvert in that regard? though most of my picks tend to be videogame music, remixes of videogame music, anime music, and such. most of it to get me pumped. I have recently been listening to Ace attorney music and there is good reason why they had an orchestral concert made out of it. Edgeworth's first pursuit theme is my favorite.

I don't think it's an introvert thing.

I just think that music fandoms are too factionized, territorial, and elitist.

I don't get it.

Music is about freedom and expression and creativity and emotion and the best music either delivers a message or tells or story.

The idea that something is not "real music" or that certain genres of music are inherently bad is... Honestly, it goes against the spirit of music.

I mean, there are definitely genres of music I don't care for and performers I don't like... but...

Like, there are some genres of music that re more likely to have "soulless" music dominate the radio representation... Do you know what I'm talking about? The stuff that isn't nearly bad per se but was clearly written for the money instead of as an artistic statement?

Some genres are more like to have that dominate the market, but that doesn't make the genres inherently bad.

I don't know, I don't see how someone can claim to like music but want to narrowly define "good music" or even "real music." Or worse, insist that bad music is good becuase it's by their favorite artist or part of their genre of choice.

[factotum]

I'd have to agree with Rater202 there. I mean, I'll jokingly repeat the old George Harrison saying "Let's put the C back into rap" because it's not a genre I'm fond of, but I'm not going to criticise anyone for liking it.

[Tarmor]

I think a lot of people have a more varied music taste than they may think they do... and might realise it if they really looked at their music collection. I will say that if it came out in the 80's then I'm more likely to know and like it, than something in the last twenties years - so the time period is more relevant to me than a genre.

The music on my phone, on my computer or in my CD collection is as varied as Rater's list - in fact, its almost the same as Rater's list except that I'll have a few instrumentals (TV soundtracks for example) instead of the classical music, and probably a bit more K-pop and mando-pop than anime/game tracks.

[Rater202]

I desire the energy and to excessive more without becoming exhausted.

The only way to get the energy is to exercise more than I am currently capable of without suffering exhaustion regularly for an extended period of time.

This is a simple but most irritating paradox.

[LaZodiac]

As a non-fan of rap, I like a good amount of Eminem's stuff. Mostly the ones that are very pointed and have him delivering specific messages, like Till I Collapse or Without Me. Dude is a lyrical genius.

As someone who does like rap; if you're a non-fan of rap, but like all that stuff, the issue is you haven't heard any good rap beyond his.

This isn't an admonishment just a noting of a point. It'd be like if someone said they disliked chicken, but did enjoy a specific recipe of chicken. It isn't that the recipe is special, it's that you've only had ****ty chicken.

[Anonymouswizard]

As someone who does like rap; if you're a non-fan of rap, but like all that stuff, the issue is you haven't heard any good rap beyond his.

This isn't an admonishment just a noting of a point. It'd be like if someone said they disliked chicken, but did enjoy a specific recipe of chicken. It isn't that the recipe is special, it's that you've only had ****ty chicken.

Most of the time, occasionally it's because there's a distinct part of the food the recipe gets rid of (like some people dislike certain textures of food).

Like I agree on the general principle, although I'll note that I've also disliked most Eminem stuff I've heard, but sometimes it really is a case of ''other people like the texture of cooked onion, I don't'.

I'll also note that while in my opinion indie rap can be much better, there's still a lot I don't care about. Because the issue I have with rap has a lot to do with simplistic backing.

[Tvtyrant]

There is also a clique thing at least into college. Everyone listens to some of lots of things, but they also have that friend who bullies them for not conforming to the clique expectations (especially in high school.)

[Peelee]

As someone who does like rap; if you're a non-fan of rap, but like all that stuff, the issue is you haven't heard any good rap beyond his.

Oh, I figured. It's also likely due to me not really seeking out rap that much to start with, of course. Not gonna find the good chicken dishes If I just don't really buy any chicken.

80s and early 90s hip hop is awesome, and I will actively seek that out though.

[Rogar Demonblud]

In that case you might want to start looking into recent country, since that's what they seem to be pulling from lately. It's amazing how much time they spend making themselves sound like some other genre from a generation ago.

I've noticed the only rap I really like is what I'm seeing live, so I think it's more about the performer/audience interaction for me.

[Peelee]

In that case you might want to start looking into recent country, since that's what they seem to be pulling from lately. It's amazing how much time they spend making themselves sound like some other genre from a generation ago.

I've noticed the only rap I really like is what I'm seeing live, so I think it's more about the performer/audience interaction for me.

I like good country (though, like with rap, I don't actively seek it out). I hate the "country" style that Bo Burnham nailed in Pandering.

[Rater202]

There is also a clique thing at least into college. Everyone listens to some of lots of things, but they also have that friend who bullies them for not conforming to the clique expectations (especially in high school.)

That attitude can die in a fire.

In that case you might want to start looking into recent country, since that's what they seem to be pulling from lately. It's amazing how much time they spend making themselves sound like some other genre from a generation ago.

I've noticed the only rap I really like is what I'm seeing live, so I think it's more about the performer/audience interaction for me.

It makes sense when you know the history of the music—they might not sound like it, but Rap and country are part of the same extended musical family.

[sktarq]

As someone who does like rap; if you're a non-fan of rap, but like all that stuff, the issue is you haven't heard any good rap beyond his.

This isn't an admonishment just a noting of a point. It'd be like if someone said they disliked chicken, but did enjoy a specific recipe of chicken. It isn't that the recipe is special, it's that you've only had ****ty chicken.

I'd have to say I totally disagree with this.

As someone who dislikes a lot of certain foods there are times when I dislike something about an ingredient that is then balanced out, chemically interacted away, or blocked by specific things in a recipe that make it tolerable in that case. That's not a matter of only liking that ingredient (in this case chicken) when it is "good".

Similarly for music. You can find specific songs that work around a common part of the genre...either being REALLY good at part of music you like in general so that outweighs the bad or something similar...Like I don't like rap, or most pop, or much music at all. Especially if it has people using words. Doesn't mean I can't see the skill that goes into it...it just either falls flat or is actively annoying (older country (this more recent Nashville-pop is less annoying on average) metal, rap, "Classical" classical music (I really don't like Mozart or Hayden), chamber music, and most non-precussive non-octave based stuff all tend to have dark effects on my mood...but I can see that Busta-Rhymes or Mozart were "good" even as I am getting annoyed at the sonic assault my ears and brain are under...I'd prefer Peacocks tbh... But occasionally I can flip it around and focus ONLY on the lyrics and like it (Weird Al has the highest hit rate on this)...at which point the music part doesn't mater at all and would I generally wish it would just go away...and just because that exception exists doesnn't for a moment mean that "good" music will help.

But as someone who generally decides if I like something by going for the quote-unquote "best" examples of the genre, cuisine, ingredient etc I can say that while there is some truth to your statement it is by no means universal, exceptions exists. And often have zip to do with "quality".

[Rater202]

That is sometimes the case, but when it comes to food there are often cases where someone says they don't like X but they've only ever had a couple of kinds of X.

Especially if they speak very generally "I don't like green vegetables" or "I don't like meatloaf" considering how many green vegetables there are and how many ways there are to cook them and the million freaking kinds of meatloaf... Those aren't really statements that anyone can say honestly.

I don't like lettuce or cabbage and the scent of boiled broccoli makes me nauseous. But I loves me some kale chips, some roasted Brussel sprouts, and some fresh spinach.

[Peelee]

That is sometimes the case, but when it comes to food there are often cases where someone says they don't like X but they've only ever had a couple of kinds of X.

Especially if they speak very generally "I don't like green vegetables" or "I don't like meatloaf" considering how many green vegetables there are and how many ways there are to cook them and the million freaking kinds of meatloaf... Those aren't really statements that anyone can say honestly.

Sure they are. Just because you think literally everyone who says this like that must be wrong doesn't mean you are absolutely right.

[Rater202]

Sure they are. Just because you think literally everyone who says this like that must be wrong doesn't mean you are absolutely right.

Please don't put words in my mouth.

I'm speaking about general trends here, not absolutes.