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  1. - Top - End - #121
    Dwarf in the Playground
     
    ElfRogueGirl

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    Default Re: Pelor the Burning Hate

    Hey Aleph, wanna help me lynch Caoimhin and then we can mutually kill each other tonight?

    There is absolutely no good reason you should do this, I just think it would make for an amusing and unusual ending to the game if literally everyone died.
    I'm Chaotic Good! Ish!

  2. - Top - End - #122
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    BardGuy

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    Default Re: Pelor the Burning Hate

    Quote Originally Posted by Aleph Null View Post
    EDIT: Also it should be obvious that I killed the cult leader because I certainly didn't target myself. And I would not have done that if I had been converted.
    Yeah, there we go. That's the piece of logic I was missing. Vote Elenna FINAL

    - - - Updated - - -

    Since it doesn't matter at this point, I will mention that I healed you on Day 1 Elenna since I wanted my self heals on the even days. You were talkative enough that I figured you might have a power role. Which you did. In a way.

    ALSO I just realized that on Day 1 we had a real chance of lynching both the SK or the Cult Leader? Dang.

  3. - Top - End - #123
    Troll in the Playground
     
    BardGuy

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    Default Re: Pelor the Burning Hate

    Day 4 Ends (early) and Game Ends: Town Victory

    Conversation is tense and trust low as the survivors discuss who should die. But then one of them asks about a murder pact so that literally everyone dies, which seals the deal.

    Elenna, Serial Killer, was lynched.

    The healer and guard manage to shake the one other survivor out of her haze, and the three of them prepare, instead of a welcoming feast, a burial service for those slain for the pure faith of Pelor.

    TOWN WINS:
    Winners: Cao, Aleph Null, AV , Valmark, The Outsider, Apogeee1, Book Wombat, Xihirli, Captain Cap

    Cult: Requiliac, Grek
    Serial Killer: Elenna


    Deadchat: https://www.quicktopic.com/53/H/7fngWxUxh2xh
    My commentary as the game went on
    Spoiler
    Show

    General Thoughts
    -not sure if the 1/game survival for Cult Leader was too strong or not
    -probably should have had more players before including a Serial Killer, as originally noted. Maybe this game really needs 14 players to flow smoothly and not give cult too much of an edge.
    -it seems like it didn't cause problems, but sorry I wasn't able to have the Day/Night start consistently at the start
    -I should have stated in the opening rules that it is not explicitly stated if a faction is destroyed. E.g., if the Cult is eliminated, that is not public info if both Town and SK still exist.

    Day 1
    I found it funny that the Serial Killer (Elenna) almost got in the lead, and was curious if she'd claim SK. Cult might want her alive for now to kill townies, and townies to help kill the cult, so she might be left alive.

    Night 1
    Cao banes Elenna, thinking she's powered. Right, but SK.
    Elenna kills Captain Cap, who puts her in communication with Aleph Null (the other NKer).
    Aleph Null kills Apogee, because Apogee asked for the vig to kill.
    Seer finds out Apogee is Town.
    Cult converts the seer

    Day 2
    Interesting. Starts with a vig claim, and pressure on the cult leader. The game will become very interesting/unusual if Requiliac gets lynched and the cult becomes a 2-person kill-less mafia.
    But then it shifts to Valmark. I wonder if that vote-switch at the end will come to bite Elenna.

    Night 2
    Grek scrys Elenna, but is killed by Elenna, so the cult doesn't learn who Elenna is. Cao banes himself, blocking the conversion attempt on him. So the cult is down to 1.
    I really wonder if the Serial Killer might win, but I worry Elenna looks iffy with Valmark's death.

    Funny note: Elenna said she would have killed Book Wombat, but Aleph Null told her he planned to. But it worked well enough for Town since she took out a cultist.

    Also funny: Cao correctly guessed that the cult would assume Aleph was baned, so he baned himself. Actually they assumed he would be baned OR was bluffing (vanillager trying to draw heat), but same result.

    Day 3
    Interesting Day. It was hard to tell how it'd go at first.
    I also think any faction could win with Requiliac getting the lynch, even if only because Aleph Null maybe ghosted. I think it's still anyone's game, or possible literally everyone dies (Elenna kills convert-ghost Aleph, and gets retribution-killed), depending on who gets converted N3.

    Spoiler: how anybody could win, depending on night actions
    Show

    Assuming Elenna kills Requiliac this Night.
    Cao can't bane himself, and Requiliac knows this as he tried to convert Cao the last night.
    But will Cao bane Aleph Null or AV?

    Assuming AV and Aleph Null stay inactive.
    If Cao is converted, it's Elenna vs. Cao RNG.
    If AV is converted, it's Elenna and Cao vs nobody. Will wind up being RNG between Elenna and Cao.
    If Aleph Null is converted, it's Elenna and Cao vs. an inactive cult, but if they vote to lynch him, they die as he's now the Fanatic. So whoever doesn't vote wins. Game of chicken?

    I think I also saw a path where everyone is dead if it winds up Elenna vs. the fanatic.
    But I think that required Aleph Null killing Cao tonight. Not thinking he's cult, but that he's a likely convert target. Indeed, if the Town was active, I think they could eliminate the cult via
    Cult converts Cao, Aleph, or AV.
    Cao banes Aleph, making the only convert possibilities himself or an inactive.
    Aleph kills Cao.
    Elenna kills Requiliac.
    D4 starts with zero cult or a cult of AV, so RNG between Serial Killer and town.


    Night 3
    Cao banes Aleph Null. (Can't bane himself this night.)
    Aleph comes back and agrees to kill Requiliac. Elenna tries to kill Aleph, but he's baned.
    Requiliac goes for a long-shot gambit that Elenna is lying and tries to convert her.

    Cult is eliminated, not that any other faction knows that.

    Day 4
    Town controls the vote, but doesn't know there's no cultists hiding, so the game doesn't auto-end. Elenna knows she was the conversion target N3. Cao knows Aleph was not converted N3. Nobody alive knows the conversion failed N2.
    Aleph can probably assume Cao baned him, though, which means Aleph can assume Cao was not the N2 convert.
    I'm glad it looks unlikely it'll just be RNG determining the game.
    Last edited by JeenLeen; 2021-02-24 at 02:56 PM.

  4. - Top - End - #124
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Valmark's Avatar

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    Default Re: Pelor the Burning Hate

    Note to self: don't vote someone who claimed. Not even in a Cult game.

    Good game, though I would've loved to see it end with everybody dead.
    I won an argument with my GM -15/08/2017- (20:32 GMT +1)

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  5. - Top - End - #125
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    AvatarVecna's Avatar

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    Default Re: Pelor the Burning Hate

    Quote Originally Posted by Valmark View Post
    Good game, though I would've loved to see it end with everybody dead.
    I've been following along. If the game day had been allowed to play out with an actual deadline, and Elenna's plan had been accepted for ****s and giggles, I would've posted a tiny thing just to ruin it cuz I'm a stinker.


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  6. - Top - End - #126
    Dwarf in the Playground
     
    ElfRogueGirl

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    Default Re: Pelor the Burning Hate

    Oh well, good game. Serial Killer is a really hard role to win with so I'm pretty glad I got as far as I did.

    @Requilac, I'm still confused why you tried to convert me last night.

    Quote Originally Posted by CaoimhinTheCape View Post
    Since it doesn't matter at this point, I will mention that I healed you on Day 1 Elenna since I wanted my self heals on the even days. You were talkative enough that I figured you might have a power role. Which you did. In a way.
    Ah, yeah, makes sense! I did pick Aleph Null as my kill target last night because I was basing my thinking around the assumption that you'd bane yourself N1.

    Quote Originally Posted by Valmark View Post
    Note to self: don't vote someone who claimed. Not even in a Cult game.

    Good game, though I would've loved to see it end with everybody dead.
    Same

    - - - Updated - - -

    In retrospect, I could have tried to convince Aleph that Cao might have been converted the night before, I guess.

    But even if he was 100% convinced Cao was a cultist somehow, there was the risk that AV would auto, and then if we lynched Cao it would have ended in everyone dead. His safest move in that case would probably be to lynch me that day, Cao would self-bane that night, and then hope to win the next day's lynch, either via RNG or via AV coming back to vote. So it's not like that would have helped me anyways.

    All in all, it was easier and funnier for ne to propose a murder pact

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by AvatarVecna View Post
    I've been following along. If the game day had been allowed to play out with an actual deadline, and Elenna's plan had been accepted for ****s and giggles, I would've posted a tiny thing just to ruin it cuz I'm a stinker.
    ...you suck

    Although an almost completely inactive player being the only survivor would admittedly also be pretty funny.
    Last edited by Elenna; 2021-02-24 at 03:39 PM.
    I'm Chaotic Good! Ish!

  7. - Top - End - #127
    Dwarf in the Playground
     
    Planetar

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    Default Re: Pelor the Burning Hate

    Gg all.
    When I killed apogee on night 1 you all seemed to pick up on why really fast, as expected. I pretty much wanted to set myself up as being SK for the time being so the cult wouldnít try to convert me and the town would try to keep me alive until end game, but that didnít work so I just claimed my role and hoped the healer didnít get converted.
    Risky, yes. Dangerous, yes. But it worked out in the end XD
    There are 1d20 types of people in the world: people that always roll natural 1 when it matters.

  8. - Top - End - #128
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    Flumph

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    Default Re: Pelor the Burning Hate

    A few comments and questions about this game from my perspective as cult leader

    1) Here is the Cult Chat: https://www.quicktopic.com/53/H/GqEB3GnLWKb83. It's mostly me talking to myself, but it does explain many of my decisions.

    2) Coaimhin! What kind of madman healer doesn't bane the person who has an uncontested town claim on the night phase after they baned!?

    3) I am surprised that I got as far as I did, given how few other cultists were around. Two out of three of my conversions failed, and the one time I did have a successful conversion the target died immediately the night after (thanks a lot, Grek ).

    4) My strategy as Cult Leader was just to do exactly what I would do if I were a Vanilla Townie. I would have made the exact same lynch votes and comments if I were a townie. My role as Cult Leader didn't influence my day behavior significantly. I didn't even co-ordinate a lynch vote with Elenna on D2. The only time I let the Cult behavior in was that I intentionally took longer than I needed to to respond to Caoimhin's role-reveal proposal, but even then I would have said the exact same thing as a true townie, just sooner.

    5) On D3 I was considering secretly telling Caoimhin (who I was almost certain was SK at the time, due to a rules misunderstanding explained in Post 13 of the QT) that I was the Cult Leader and trying to come with some sort of complex alliance to lynch Elenna (who I thought was healer). I actually even started writing the PM and got several paragraphs in before I backed out. Good thing I didn't.

    5) I explain why I chose to try to convert Elenna on N3 on post 16 of the QT. Basically, I had reason to believe that Elenna and Caomhin were intentionally lying about their roles to throw the Cult Leader off. It was a massive gamble that didn't pay off.

    6) Successfuly converting Grek the Elder N1 was mostly luck. As I stated before, power roles tend to be quieter but still present, so I thought that Grek was more likely to be a power role than others.

    7) Aleph Null, if you where so suspicious of me as being Cult and voted for me on the first two days, why didn't you NK me earlier? Was Apogee and Book Wombat really more suspicious than myself?

    8) I still don't know who Pelor and Zarus are. I guess we shouldn't be surprised the faith didn't catch on to anyone except a likely senile old man then.
    -
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  9. - Top - End - #129
    Dwarf in the Playground
     
    Planetar

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    Default Re: Pelor the Burning Hate

    Quote Originally Posted by Requilac View Post
    A few comments and questions about this game from my perspective as cult leader

    1) Here is the Cult Chat: https://www.quicktopic.com/53/H/GqEB3GnLWKb83. It's mostly me talking to myself, but it does explain many of my decisions.

    2) Coaimhin! What kind of madman healer doesn't bane the person who has an uncontested town claim on the night phase after they baned!?

    3) I am surprised that I got as far as I did, given how few other cultists were around. Two out of three of my conversions failed, and the one time I did have a successful conversion the target died immediately the night after (thanks a lot, Grek ).

    4) My strategy as Cult Leader was just to do exactly what I would do if I were a Vanilla Townie. I would have made the exact same lynch votes and comments if I were a townie. My role as Cult Leader didn't influence my day behavior significantly. I didn't even co-ordinate a lynch vote with Elenna on D2. The only time I let the Cult behavior in was that I intentionally took longer than I needed to to respond to Caoimhin's role-reveal proposal, but even then I would have said the exact same thing as a true townie, just sooner.

    5) On D3 I was considering secretly telling Caoimhin (who I was almost certain was SK at the time, due to a rules misunderstanding explained in Post 13 of the QT) that I was the Cult Leader and trying to come with some sort of complex alliance to lynch Elenna (who I thought was healer). I actually even started writing the PM and got several paragraphs in before I backed out. Good thing I didn't.

    5) I explain why I chose to try to convert Elenna on N3 on post 16 of the QT. Basically, I had reason to believe that Elenna and Caomhin were intentionally lying about their roles to throw the Cult Leader off. It was a massive gamble that didn't pay off.

    6) Successfuly converting Grek the Elder N1 was mostly luck. As I stated before, power roles tend to be quieter but still present, so I thought that Grek was more likely to be a power role than others.

    7) Aleph Null, if you where so suspicious of me as being Cult and voted for me on the first two days, why didn't you NK me earlier? Was Apogee and Book Wombat really more suspicious than myself?

    8) I still don't know who Pelor and Zarus are. I guess we shouldn't be surprised the faith didn't catch on to anyone except a likely senile old man then.
    You were suspicious the whole time, but I was not sure yet. Apogee pissed me off by accusing me for defending myself so he got the knife. And also because I felt it would validate a claim of a kill role.
    The kill on book wombat was actually a bit of a ďIím not sure who to killĒ shot which was a mistake in a cult game.
    There are 1d20 types of people in the world: people that always roll natural 1 when it matters.

  10. - Top - End - #130
    Troll in the Playground
     
    BardGuy

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    Default Re: Pelor the Burning Hate

    Things I found most funny:
    -the vig and serial killer getting a QuickTopic together, on the night the serial killer killed the QT-creator
    -that the seer scried the serial killer, the night she was killed by the serial killer
    -how it looked truly possible the last action might be mutual NKs by Aleph and Elenna, or potentially even Elenna vs. a ghosted Aleph and still end with everyone dead

    Also really figured a lynch or NK would happen on Reqliuiac sooner.
    I would have found it truly... well, not funny, but interesting, if, say, Grek and Aleph got converted, then Requiliac killed, and it became like a more traditional mafia game. Especially if Grek cleared Aleph as still town and they "led" the town against the serial killer and 'cult'.

  11. - Top - End - #131
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    Flumph

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    Default Re: Pelor the Burning Hate

    Quote Originally Posted by Elenna View Post

    @Requilac, I'm still confused why you tried to convert me last night.
    Look at post 16 of the Cult QT I sent above. I tried to convert you because I had reason to believe that you and Caoimhin were lying about your roles in order to throw me off. Clearly, I misjudged.

    Quote Originally Posted by Elenna View Post
    Although an almost completely inactive player being the only survivor would admittedly also be pretty funny.
    I actually thought that Aleph was going to go through with the MAD pact as well. He already proved himself to be pretty impulsive (a trait which actually proved useful bizarelly) with killing Apogee N1 and revealing his role D2, so going through with the plan just for the fun of it would be in-character.

    Quote Originally Posted by Aleph Null View Post
    Gg all.
    When I killed apogee on night 1 you all seemed to pick up on why really fast, as expected. I pretty much wanted to set myself up as being SK for the time being so the cult wouldnít try to convert me and the town would try to keep me alive until end game, but that didnít work so I just claimed my role and hoped the healer didnít get converted.
    Risky, yes. Dangerous, yes. But it worked out in the end XD
    I am actually surprised by how well that role reveal worked out. It really gave the town quite an unexpected upper hand. In future WW games I need to be considering doing something like that as a town power role.

    Quote Originally Posted by AvatarVecna View Post
    I've been following along. If the game day had been allowed to play out with an actual deadline, and Elenna's plan had been accepted for ****s and giggles, I would've posted a tiny thing just to ruin it cuz I'm a stinker.
    Point I missed: I was terrified that you would suddenly jump into action and reveal yourself as the actual Vanilla Townie on D3 after I fake-claimed that role. I ended up getting lynched anyway, but if you would have said that it would have been almost impossible for me to squirm out of it.
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  12. - Top - End - #132
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    WhiteWizardGirl

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    Default Re: Pelor the Burning Hate

    Grek's ghost was just watching on from the afterlife going "NO. Requilac, please. STICK TO THE ORIGINAL PLAN. GAH."

  13. - Top - End - #133
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    Flumph

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    Default Re: Pelor the Burning Hate

    Quote Originally Posted by Grek View Post
    Grek's ghost was just watching on from the afterlife going "NO. Requilac, please. STICK TO THE ORIGINAL PLAN. GAH."
    Wait, what was the original plan? I did follow your suggestion of converting Caoimhin N2, which didn't work out. I was unaware we had thought further ahead than that.
    -
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  14. - Top - End - #134
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    ElfRogueGirl

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    Default Re: Pelor the Burning Hate

    Oh, yeah, here's my QT if anyone wants to see me talk to myself.

    Quote Originally Posted by Requilac View Post
    A few comments and questions about this game from my perspective as cult leader

    1) Here is the Cult Chat: https://www.quicktopic.com/53/H/GqEB3GnLWKb83. It's mostly me talking to myself, but it does explain many of my decisions.

    2) Coaimhin! What kind of madman healer doesn't bane the person who has an uncontested town claim on the night phase after they baned!?

    3) I am surprised that I got as far as I did, given how few other cultists were around. Two out of three of my conversions failed, and the one time I did have a successful conversion the target died immediately the night after (thanks a lot, Grek ).

    4) My strategy as Cult Leader was just to do exactly what I would do if I were a Vanilla Townie. I would have made the exact same lynch votes and comments if I were a townie. My role as Cult Leader didn't influence my day behavior significantly. I didn't even co-ordinate a lynch vote with Elenna on D2. The only time I let the Cult behavior in was that I intentionally took longer than I needed to to respond to Caoimhin's role-reveal proposal, but even then I would have said the exact same thing as a true townie, just sooner.

    5) On D3 I was considering secretly telling Caoimhin (who I was almost certain was SK at the time, due to a rules misunderstanding explained in Post 13 of the QT) that I was the Cult Leader and trying to come with some sort of complex alliance to lynch Elenna (who I thought was healer). I actually even started writing the PM and got several paragraphs in before I backed out. Good thing I didn't.

    5) I explain why I chose to try to convert Elenna on N3 on post 16 of the QT. Basically, I had reason to believe that Elenna and Caomhin were intentionally lying about their roles to throw the Cult Leader off. It was a massive gamble that didn't pay off.

    6) Successfuly converting Grek the Elder N1 was mostly luck. As I stated before, power roles tend to be quieter but still present, so I thought that Grek was more likely to be a power role than others.

    7) Aleph Null, if you where so suspicious of me as being Cult and voted for me on the first two days, why didn't you NK me earlier? Was Apogee and Book Wombat really more suspicious than myself?

    8) I still don't know who Pelor and Zarus are. I guess we shouldn't be surprised the faith didn't catch on to anyone except a likely senile old man then.
    2) I KNOW RIGHT coulda had a 50-50 shot at winning if I'd killed the right person last night... okay, maybe not, since AV would probably have come in and voted if that were the case.

    5) Um, PMs weren't allowed in this game...

    5) why do you have two point #5's? Anyways, I guess I can kinda see why you thought that way, if you were under the impression PMs were allowed, but why would the Serial Killer agree to a plan like that?

    Also I'm still confused by "at least part of Elenna's statement is a lie, because I know that the healer protected Caoimhin and not Aleph Null N2, already showing her willingness to show deceit. " Like, of course it was a lie, the whole claim was a lie, I was making stuff up! Anyways, not really a big deal, probably would have ended the same either way.

    8) Short version: Pelor is a good god, Zarus is an evil god. The cult is trying to convince people that they're actually the same evil god, who is Pelor just pretending to be good.
    I'm Chaotic Good! Ish!

  15. - Top - End - #135
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    BardGuy

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    Default Re: Pelor the Burning Hate

    Quote Originally Posted by Requilac View Post
    2) Coaimhin! What kind of madman healer doesn't bane the person who has an uncontested town claim on the night phase after they baned!?
    Haha, it definitely was a risk that I wasn't sure would pay off. But I figured my insistence that Aleph was safe meant that he would be, plus whoever I chose to protect. And it makes sense that you would assume I was SK after that.



    I liked the prisoners dilemma of someone between Vig and SK needing to kill the Cult Leader, but also needing to kill the other. Bonus points for the private chat for them.



    Valmark, to be fair the only Townie who voted you for voting the Vig was me - Grek and Elenna assumidly jumped on so they could get you out of the game.

  16. - Top - End - #136
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    ElfRogueGirl

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    Default Re: Pelor the Burning Hate

    Quote Originally Posted by CaoimhinTheCape View Post
    Valmark, to be fair the only Townie who voted you for voting the Vig was me - Grek and Elenna assumidly jumped on so they could get you out of the game.
    No, IDK about Grek but I did actually think Valmark might be a cultist. Like I said at the time, Aleph's claim seemed weird but not in a cultist sort of way, especially because there was no counterclaim.
    I'm Chaotic Good! Ish!

  17. - Top - End - #137
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    WhiteWizardGirl

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    Default Re: Pelor the Burning Hate

    Quote Originally Posted by Requilac View Post
    Wait, what was the original plan? I did follow your suggestion of converting Caoimhin N2, which didn't work out. I was unaware we had thought further ahead than that.
    Plan was still to convert Caoimhin, I had thought. The Healer can't target the same person twice, so the convert would have definitely gone through. Unless Caoimhin was the SK, but I was under the impression a conversion attempt on a baned SK returns "you can't convert them they're the SK" instead of "conversion failed, they were baned".

    Valmark, to be fair the only Townie who voted you for voting the Vig was me - Grek and Elenna assumidly jumped on so they could get you out of the game.
    At that point, I was already 90% sure that Elenna was the SK based on my cult + Elder knowledge, so I was pretty confident that Valmark was town. But I figured "protect the claimed Town Power Role" as a reasonable enough cover for voting someone, so I did that while also trying to see if we could get a side train going on SK!Elenna.

  18. - Top - End - #138
    Troll in the Playground
     
    BardGuy

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    Default Re: Pelor the Burning Hate

    Quote Originally Posted by Grek View Post
    Plan was still to convert Caoimhin, I had thought. The Healer can't target the same person twice, so the convert would have definitely gone through. Unless Caoimhin was the SK, but I was under the impression a conversion attempt on a baned SK returns "you can't convert them they're the SK" instead of "conversion failed, they were baned".


    At that point, I was already 90% sure that Elenna was the SK based on my cult + Elder knowledge, so I was pretty confident that Valmark was town. But I figured "protect the claimed Town Power Role" as a reasonable enough cover for voting someone, so I did that while also trying to see if we could get a side train going on SK!Elenna.
    If Cao had been converted the last Night (instead of a failed attempt on Elenna), I think it would have gone to RNG.
    Day would have likely gone the same: lynch Elenna by Aleph Null and Cao. AV lingers but doesn't post and autolynches. That the game doesn't end reveals one is cult.
    Night: Cao either banes himself or void Aleph, so Cao survives.
    Day: 1 vs 1 vote-off. RNG.

    OR, if AV did post to avoid autolynch, it'd be 2 town vs. 1 cult, so depends on how AV votes. E.g., if she believes Cao or Aleph is the cultist.

    EDIT: or, if Elenna killed Cao (whether he was converted or not), it'd be a Town win as it'd be Elenna vs. AV & Aleph Null. We know AV was lurking and it sounds like she would have posted in that scenario.
    Last edited by JeenLeen; 2021-02-25 at 09:50 AM.

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