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Thread: Saying Goodbye to the PH+1 Rule
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2021-02-24, 04:31 PM (ISO 8601)
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Saying Goodbye to the PH+1 Rule
Some important news for anyone involved in Adventurer's League: The PH+1 rule is now gone. Players are permitted to use as many books as they like, though there is a restriction based on the specific campaign.
- PHB, Volo's, Xanathar's, Mordekainen's, and Tasha's are available for all campaigns.
- SCAG is available in anything in the Forgotten Realms.
- Eberron is only available in Oracle of War.
- Genasi, aarakocra, tortles, and locathah are available in Masters and Historic campaigns
- It appears that the MTG books, Ravnica and Theros, are not legal anywhere in AL.
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2021-02-24, 05:34 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Nov 2017
Re: Saying Goodbye to the PH+1 Rule
I suppose it was inevitable as more and more books were released. But I didn't expect them to just straight up abandon the rule. I would have thought that they would have just expanded the number of "free" books you get, e.g. PHB+XGtE+TCoE+1.
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2021-02-24, 05:53 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Saying Goodbye to the PH+1 Rule
To paraphrase an wise Jedi master:
"At an end, that rule is. And leave soon enough, it couldn't."
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2021-02-26, 04:15 AM (ISO 8601)
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2021-02-26, 09:47 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Saying Goodbye to the PH+1 Rule
*sigh* Why does WoTC hate DMs?
Avatar by linklele. How Teleport Worksa. Malifice (paraphrased):
Rulings are not 'House Rules.' Rulings are a DM doing what DMs are supposed to do.
b. greenstone (paraphrased):
Agency means that they {players} control their character's actions; you control the world's reactions to the character's actions.
Second known member of the Greyview Appreciation Society
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2021-02-26, 10:30 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Vacation in Nyalotha
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2021-02-26, 10:44 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Sep 2015
Re: Saying Goodbye to the PH+1 Rule
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2021-02-26, 10:52 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Saying Goodbye to the PH+1 Rule
What about this change, in particular, makes you think that current or new AL players will dislike AL more and become "jaded" enough to leave?
The first-order effect is that players get to use all of the books that are "appropriate" to the setting, so I would guess that players would be happier in the short-to-medium term.
Maybe there are second-order effects in which players get disgusted with others' unreasonable PCs or DMs' struggles to keep up with additional rules?
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2021-02-26, 10:56 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Saying Goodbye to the PH+1 Rule
I suspect that more DM's will decline the opportunity to DM. While COVID has really hampered my second chance to AL - the first one died back when Strahd came out thanks to a spousal veto - I am in touch with a few people locally who may want to get some AL games going this summer. I had offered to DM initially, now that I have had some mor games under my belt on roll20 with a few groups.
In my case, this development is extremely unwelcome.
I will most likely withdraw that offer.Avatar by linklele. How Teleport Worksa. Malifice (paraphrased):
Rulings are not 'House Rules.' Rulings are a DM doing what DMs are supposed to do.
b. greenstone (paraphrased):
Agency means that they {players} control their character's actions; you control the world's reactions to the character's actions.
Second known member of the Greyview Appreciation Society
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2021-02-26, 10:59 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Sep 2015
Re: Saying Goodbye to the PH+1 Rule
The two biggest factors I've found that drove players away from AL, or at least made them want to experience a different type of game at the same time, are:
- non-persistent world
- extreme focus on high levels of optimization
Official play attracts a lot of extreme optimizers, largely because it has such an open character building policy.
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2021-02-26, 11:05 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Oct 2006
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Re: Saying Goodbye to the PH+1 Rule
Even from an immediate player effect, this has problems. If the change is as described then characters who were legal yesterday, based on Ravnica and Theros, are illegal for all settings today.
Another thing is that characters are no longer portable from AL game to AL game, which I sort of thought was supposed to be a significant advantage to AL games.
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2021-02-26, 12:46 PM (ISO 8601)
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Avatar by linklele. How Teleport Worksa. Malifice (paraphrased):
Rulings are not 'House Rules.' Rulings are a DM doing what DMs are supposed to do.
b. greenstone (paraphrased):
Agency means that they {players} control their character's actions; you control the world's reactions to the character's actions.
Second known member of the Greyview Appreciation Society
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2021-02-26, 12:57 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jul 2019
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2021-02-26, 01:08 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Sep 2011
Re: Saying Goodbye to the PH+1 Rule
I once played a level 1 mod that one shots you for doing something you're suppose to do. It doesn't "attract" high levels of optimization, it demands it.
That being said, they work as hard as they can to make convoluted and unfriendly rules towards the players. I couldn't keep all of it straight at the end, and all of the people I play with regularly gave up due to the limited opportunities to try the new content in AL.Avatar of Rudisplork Avatar of PC-dom and Slayer of the Internet. Extended sig
GitP Regulars as: Vestiges Spells Weapons Races Deities Feats Soulmelds/Veils
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2021-02-26, 02:18 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Sep 2015
Re: Saying Goodbye to the PH+1 Rule
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2021-02-26, 02:21 PM (ISO 8601)
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Avatar by linklele. How Teleport Worksa. Malifice (paraphrased):
Rulings are not 'House Rules.' Rulings are a DM doing what DMs are supposed to do.
b. greenstone (paraphrased):
Agency means that they {players} control their character's actions; you control the world's reactions to the character's actions.
Second known member of the Greyview Appreciation Society
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2021-02-26, 03:12 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Dec 2017
Re: Saying Goodbye to the PH+1 Rule
I'm just curious why you think simplifying the character creation process will drive DMs to refuse to run AL. Or why it indicates that WotC hates DMs?
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From a player perspective, I can see folks who like to optimize playing yuan-ti pureblood/other monstrous races or variant humans more. However, if they wanted to do that they could already.
DMs still had to be aware of the rules from SCAG, Volos, PHB. XGTE, TCE etc because you could get characters at one table using various combinations of content from any of them. Volos as +1, SCAG as +1, EEPC as +1, XGTE as +1 ... you wouldn't get Yuan-ti hexblades but you could get yuan-ti warlocks and half-elf hexblades without any trouble.
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From a DM perspective, there is less checking and validation needed when you sit down with a table and check to see if the character is AL legal. As long as they don't use Ravnica/Wildemount/Theros and stick to world relevant books, the DM no longer needs to check if the wizard accdidentally picked Toll the Dead as a cantrip without picking XGTE as their +1.
They also have three campaigns - Historical, Seasonal and "Masters". Seasonal slides into Historical at the end of the current year. Masters is Dreams of the Red Wizards, Candlekeep Mysteries and a limited collection of convention created content from some of the big conventions. Characters are associated with only one campaign though I don't understand why they need "Masters" distinct from Historical.Last edited by Keravath; 2021-02-26 at 03:13 PM.
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2021-02-26, 08:10 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Apr 2008
Re: Saying Goodbye to the PH+1 Rule
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2021-02-26, 10:03 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Saying Goodbye to the PH+1 Rule
Avatar by linklele. How Teleport Worksa. Malifice (paraphrased):
Rulings are not 'House Rules.' Rulings are a DM doing what DMs are supposed to do.
b. greenstone (paraphrased):
Agency means that they {players} control their character's actions; you control the world's reactions to the character's actions.
Second known member of the Greyview Appreciation Society
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2021-02-26, 10:32 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Apr 2008
Re: Saying Goodbye to the PH+1 Rule
Sounds great. Why should you have to (or, as we can now happily say, "have had to") specify "a home game"?
"I have a monk player, Dwarf, Drunken master."
"In a home game?"
"Irrelevant."
"I have a monk player, Tabaxi, Drunken master."
"In a home game?"
"Still irrelevant. Why did the race changing make you think that question would suddenly matter?"
Why would that be something she has to earn by you knowing her, trusting her, and thinking she's great when that EXACT same thing but with a different race would be allowed without these hoops? Unless you mean that a new AL player would ALSO not be allowed his Dwarf Drunken monk unless you knew and trusted him too?
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2021-02-27, 11:17 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Saying Goodbye to the PH+1 Rule
Last edited by KorvinStarmast; 2021-02-27 at 11:26 AM.
Avatar by linklele. How Teleport Worksa. Malifice (paraphrased):
Rulings are not 'House Rules.' Rulings are a DM doing what DMs are supposed to do.
b. greenstone (paraphrased):
Agency means that they {players} control their character's actions; you control the world's reactions to the character's actions.
Second known member of the Greyview Appreciation Society
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2021-02-27, 11:37 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Aug 2013
Re: Saying Goodbye to the PH+1 Rule
Hmm...this seems convoluted. It has been a while since I have done an AL game but even then there was a poor system of identifying what games were being done at a table, whether one shots or full campaigns. This just seems to make it worse. I mean a player gets put at a table with one source ready to go then to find out it is null & void for use as the table is running something else. But this also does conjure up the horror stories of live play events where players just show up with stacks of books and having to delay play time by searching through everything. Guess WOTC has yet to learn lessons of the past. The PHB +1 rule, love it or hate it, did prevent things like this. They should have just expanded the selections of the +1 sources to included everything, even the MTG books.
Last edited by GentlemanVoodoo; 2021-02-27 at 11:39 AM.
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2021-02-27, 12:04 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Dec 2017
Re: Saying Goodbye to the PH+1 Rule
For me, the motivation is the ability to play a character I create and develop in an ongoing story of THEIR life without having to commit to showing up with a group of folks on a weekly basis. I don't have to feel bad when the kids or spouse have something that needs doing and I can't make it. Having several different AL games scheduled in the same week (my local store used to run games Monday/Thursday/Friday and occasional Sundays) meant if my schedule changed, I had deadlines at work, or something else came up - I could cancel my booked slot freeing it up for someone else and still get to play my characters another day or week.
Regular D&D groups work great when you can find them. AL gives you flexibility and portability of the characters, scheduling flexibility that fits with everyone's busy lives, and a set of common expectations around how it will be run. You also get to play in group events like conventions or epics if that appeals to you.
Is a good group of friends playing together better? Likely. Is it always possible or available? No. AL gives you a game that goes on when you can play no matter whether Ahmed and Sarah, or anyone else happens to be able to make it that night or not.
As for whether AL is an important part of the promotion of D&D, I have no idea. The problem getting into this hobby has always been finding a group of like minded folks and someone who wants to DM. AL run out of stores and online provides an on ramp for individuals who don't have a group or a large enough social circle of folks who want to play to get a chance to play.
AL plays with 7 or sometimes more folks, AL tends to foster a welcoming attitude to new folks ...
I was playing at the local game store about 2 years ago with a tier 3 scheduled and a first time player had signed up not knowing they needed to play a character to level 11 before they could play a tier 3 - so the other 6 of us and the DM decided to play a tier 1 module instead and helped the new person to create a level 1 character - we had a great time ... however, if it had been a "regularly scheduled game" and not AL, it might have been much more difficult to get everyone to swap to a tier 1 adventure.
AL also provides a standardized set of rules - no house rules - no critical misses - no DM customization - no custom classes or races - no UA - everything has been at least play tested and balanced. Rando campaign at a game store? Not so much. The local game store had to ask a DM to leave because they loved their critical miss tables and other homebrew and wouldn't drop it when playing AL.
So for flexibility, consistency, RAW based rulings, character portability and many other features ... AL can really make sense for a lot of people.
That said, it isn't for everyone, and if folks don't want to play AL, no one is making them.Last edited by Keravath; 2021-02-27 at 12:08 PM.
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2021-02-27, 12:20 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Saying Goodbye to the PH+1 Rule
I found AL a good framework for convention play; and a half-way reasonable venue for new players to see what DnD is broadly about if they don’t have their own playgroup yet
That being said, the book+1 rule always seems a bit like a solution searching for a problem; most of the really ‘breakable’ (by some standards) stuff is contained within the PHB to begin with
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2021-02-27, 12:23 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Oct 2018
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Re: Saying Goodbye to the PH+1 Rule
I was never big on the +1 rule to begin with. And was one of a few reasons that I stayed away from Adventure League. With this change (and a few others that solved my other issues), I might actually give it a try now.
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2021-02-27, 12:36 PM (ISO 8601)
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2021-02-27, 01:37 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Saying Goodbye to the PH+1 Rule
what is the point of living if you can't deadlift?
All credit to the amazing avatar goes to thoroughlyS
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2021-02-27, 02:43 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Saying Goodbye to the PH+1 Rule
I wonder if this change was due to Tasha's book listing spells that were not contained within it but rather were contained in other source books such as Xanathar's?
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2021-02-27, 03:02 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Saying Goodbye to the PH+1 Rule
I suspect so. When each of the supplements was more of a stove pipe, the +1 wasn't as messy. With the porting in of stuff from the other books, they may have just made it 'too hard' and decided to bin the idea. I'd have been a lot less grumpy about Tasha's had the Arcana Cleric and Genasi been included in that book.
Avatar by linklele. How Teleport Worksa. Malifice (paraphrased):
Rulings are not 'House Rules.' Rulings are a DM doing what DMs are supposed to do.
b. greenstone (paraphrased):
Agency means that they {players} control their character's actions; you control the world's reactions to the character's actions.
Second known member of the Greyview Appreciation Society
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2021-02-27, 03:22 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Saying Goodbye to the PH+1 Rule
Good riddance to bad rubbish, Not being able to use a race from Volo's and the Xanthar's spells was just restrictions for restrictions sake instead of reducing complexity or power. And It reduces the possibility of the one true book problem and the frustration of being able to use part of Tasha's but not the rest of the book.
Mtg is weird anyway and I think all the subclasses are in other books at this point. Les Miserables to all who want to want to play satyrs though.Last edited by Witty Username; 2021-02-27 at 04:11 PM.
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