OOTS #1227 - The Discussion Thread

[Locnil]

Epic Level Casters outpace other Epic Characters by +lots. It's possible he caught her flat footed so she couldn't evade.

Then again, it's not like Xykon has a particularly optimal build...

[knag]

Well there goes my "half of Redcloak's niece" theory...

[NobleCuriosity]

I’m so confused, isn’t Serini an epic-level rogue? Why couldn’t she just Evasion past whatever Xykon did?

Or maybe she did Evasion and instead of being totally disintegrated she was only half disintegrated?

Evasion is only applicable to reflex saves (Dexterity for 5e players). Presumably Xykon used a spell that offers a different save instead, one she wasn’t as strong at.

It is rather odd that it only wrecked half her body if it wasn’t a reflex save though.

[Robots]

WOOO! New comic. Just when I'm working, too... curses.

I know it's presented in a simplistic stick figure style, but the image of Serini missing half of her flesh is... disturbing.

Can't wait for the next comic!! I love Serini so far, also.

[danielxcutter]

Maybe that just wasn't a spell that allowed a Reflex save.

...Hmm, is it just me, or has Rich left out the dialogue box in that panel?

[Doug Lampert]

I’m so confused, isn’t Serini an epic-level rogue? Why couldn’t she just Evasion past whatever Xykon did?

Or maybe she did Evasion and instead of being totally disintegrated she was only half disintegrated?

3.5 disintegrate is a ranged touch and fortitude save, rogues have no significant advantages with those.

Plenty of other spells don't attack reflex.

Also, casters >> non casters by those levels in 3.5.

[Throknor]

No idea what spell he used but I doubt it was a standard Disintegrate if he wanted her diary.

[Metastachydium]

Yeah, but it should also be something quite large, given how it was able to carry so much so far apart... I think dragon was high on the list, any other larger creatures with orange skin/fur?

It's a dragon or half-dragon. I'm basically sure now. See, there is a consistency on how dark-colour-on-light-colour speech bubbles are handled, after all. It indeed is specific to two creature types: dragons and giants. Serini got those speech bubbles because she's part giant and I'd put money on Orange gaining them due to being a chromatic metallic (half-)dragon (probably bronze or copper).

[ebarde]

I’m so confused, isn’t Serini an epic-level rogue? Why couldn’t she just Evasion past whatever Xykon did?

Or maybe she did Evasion and instead of being totally disintegrated she was only half disintegrated?

I definetly feel the implication is she took half damage

[Yanisa]

probably not another troll (as those are green)

Not all trolls are green. (Also bonus points for being a half-dragon.)

Could this be our mysterious ally?

[danielxcutter]

Disintegrate has always been a green laser in OotS(as well as the official description), and it actually wouldn't affect any of her items anyways.

[Sam K]

It's a dragon or half-dragon. I'm basically sure now. See, there is a consistency on how dark-colour-on-light-colour speech bubbles are handled, after all. It indeed is specific to two creature types: dragons and giants. Serini got those speech bubbles because she's part giant and I'd put money on Orange gaining them due to being a chromatic (half-)dragon (probably bronze or copper).

Wouldn't that be metallic dragons, rather than chromatic? The helper being a dragon does open up for some kind of relationship to the Draketooths - the signamancy... I mean, the color scheme, fit, at least!

[SlashDash]

I assumed the fact that half her face is gone is she took half damage...
More wondering why didn't Xykon finish the job? I think another flashback would arrive later.


What's more interesting to me, is that she is half "regular pc race" and half "monster race" which might make her the exact person needed to help bridge the gap between Durkon and Red Cloak.

[Doug Lampert]

No idea what spell he used but I doubt it was a standard Disintegrate if he wanted her diary.

That's a possible 3.0 problem and could apply, although 3.0 SRD does not specify what happens to equipment when a creature is disintegrated so the ruling in OotS world may be that "the creature" is just the creature, not the gear, but in 3.5:

Any creature reduced to 0 or fewer hit points by this spell is entirely disintegrated, leaving behind only a trace of fine dust. A disintegrated creature’s equipment is unaffected.

[danielxcutter]

That's a possible 3.0 problem and could apply, although 3.0 SRD does not specify what happens to equipment when a creature is disintegrated so the ruling in OotS world may be that "the creature" is just the creature, not the gear, but in 3.5:

When V zapped Kubota, it left a bunch of dust and his armor. Then they used Gust of Wind to blow it overboard.

[Quebbster]

3.5 disintegrate is a ranged touch and fortitude save, rogues have no significant advantages with those.

Plenty of other spells don't attack reflex.

Also, casters >> non casters by those levels in 3.5.

What about under 3.0 rules? Since the attack happened before the Order got to Dorukan's Dungeon the world should still be running on 3.0 rules at that point.
Yes, I am aware the real answer is "It doesn't really matter".

[Metastachydium]

Wouldn't that be metallic dragons, rather than chromatic?

As the reference to bronze and copper shows, that's exactly what I meant. Thanks for spotting the mistake!

The helper being a dragon does open up for some kind of relationship to the Draketooths - the signamancy... I mean, the color scheme, fit, at least!

Anyone related to the Draketooths would have (this time actually) chromatic blood. Also, they would be long dead at this point.

[Shining Wrath]

OK, so we now know that Serini is not Lawful. This is my completely shocked face.
Troll blood is an interesting explanation. And it may mean that Serini is in some sense immortal - even if the halfling part dies, the troll part survives. I'm not sure how that would work in practice.
She needs to lose the cloak. It's a tripping hazard up there on the ledge.
Also, we have sort-of confirmation that this hideout is at Kragor's Tomb. Although Serini could be lying about that.

[danielxcutter]

OK, so we now know that Serini is not Lawful. This is my completely shocked face.
Troll blood is an interesting explanation. And it may mean that Serini is in some sense immortal - even if the halfling part dies, the troll part survives. I'm not sure how that would work in practice.
She needs to lose the cloak. It's a tripping hazard up there on the ledge.
Also, we have sort-of confirmation that this hideout is at Kragor's Tomb. Although Serini could be lying about that.

Nitpick: Tarquin's LE and his team's been playing the entire continent like a friggin' kazoo. Redcloak's been doing much the same with Xykon, although maybe not as successfully.

[Dire_Flumph]

Not all trolls are green. (Also bonus points for being a half-dragon.)

Could this be our mysterious ally?

Or...a half-dragon-half-troll blood infused Tenrin?

....Probably not

[Hekko]

Wouldn't that be metallic dragons, rather than chromatic? The helper being a dragon does open up for some kind of relationship to the Draketooths - the signamancy... I mean, the color scheme, fit, at least!

I think it's safe to say all dragon relatives of Draketooths are dead because of the Familicide.

Also, we have sort-of confirmation that this hideout is at Kragor's Tomb. Although Serini could be lying about that.

Serini may also consider the room(s) being part of Kraagor's Tomb even if they are located elsewhere, especially if the access is through a stable portal/trap.

[Shining Wrath]

Math, people, do your math.
When Xykon says "I made a 3/8ths-ling" he implies he destroyed 1/4 of a halfling.
The cloud of black is not how disintegrate is usually depicted. I'm going with something more along the lines of Horrid Wilting. Fort save for half, would have done around 70 points of damage unless Xykon souped it up with some epic level trick. As a high-level rogue Serini probably has around 3.5 points per level, plus her constitution bonus - so Horrid Wilting would be very close to a one-shot, depending on dice rolls.

Or something else - there's thousands of spells. There may even be one that explicitly destroys 1/4 of someone's body.

[Lapak]

Math, people, do your math.
When Xykon says "I made a 3/8ths-ling" he implies he destroyed 1/4 of a halfling.
The cloud of black is not how disintegrate is usually depicted. I'm going with something more along the lines of Horrid Wilting. Fort save for half, would have done around 70 points of damage unless Xykon souped it up with some epic level trick. As a high-level rogue Serini probably has around 3.5 points per level, plus her constitution bonus - so Horrid Wilting would be very close to a one-shot, depending on dice rolls.

Or something else - there's thousands of spells. There may even be one that explicitly destroys 1/4 of someone's body.

Horrid Wilting was what I was coming here to suggest.

[Shining Wrath]

Nitpick: Tarquin's LE and his team's been playing the entire continent like a friggin' kazoo. Redcloak's been doing much the same with Xykon, although maybe not as successfully.

None the less, I opine that the rogue is not Lawful. YMMV.

[One Skunk Todd]

Well the transfusion doesn't seem to have affected her reflexes much. She was pretty sprightly off the stool and up the ladder.

[Ninja Dragon]

Ok so now I want to see the paladins outplay Serini. Just so she has to endure the humulliation to be fooled by paladins.

Not that this is going to be easy, but those two are the kind who could pull it off.

[danielxcutter]

Ok so now I want to see the paladins outplay Serini. Just so she has to endure the humulliation to be fooled by paladins.

Not that this is going to be easy, but those two are the kind who could pull it off.

I think O-Chul's just going to convince her, but my evidence is all in Good Deeds Gone Unpunished(which is bonus material).

Also Horrid Wilting works better than most, but she looked charred or corroded, not shriveled into jerky.

[Stone of Light]

I kindof wonder if Serini might be evil.
Hitting defenceless prisoners and providing them with false hope of freedom doesn't exactly scream 'good' at any rate.

Eh, I'm going to argue Chaotic Neutral at most.

In regards to the hit:

1. The arc of the swing was rather short.
2. There's no battle damage on Lien in the last panel.

So, it seems like a more playful gesture than anything. Lien's OW was probably more out of shock than actual pain.

In regards to the lie, I'll admit that one's a bit more tricky, but I would imagine she's trying to crack a joke (albeit a rather in poor taste joke) at a Paladin's expense ("Haha, Paladin's are so gullible!"). Probably something she use to do with Soon all the time, given her line in the last panel. If anything, I'd argue bad judgement over evil at this point.

[danielxcutter]

Yeah, the "BONK" doesn't really imply it was really supposed to do damage.

[MoonCat]

I'm not saying it's uncharacteristic of Xykon, but it does seem incredibly careless to pull a scry-and-die on an epic level adventurer whose entire life mission is to thwart your goals of capturing a gate, and not even make sure you've killed her.