Possible combat applications for disguise self

[whateew]

What ways can one use the disguise self spell to their advantage in a combat situation? I'm a massive fan of the Hexblood lineage, and a free disguise self might as well be used - so how would you go about i?.

There is, of course, the jank of playing an incredibly thin character who disguises themself as a thicker fellow to fool an enemy about where they should be aiming, but (unless a DM makes a decision) Spells Do What They Say They Do, so I doubt that'd have much in game effect (reliably at least). I've seen some discussion that this would maybe initially provide a bonus, and then all enemies would see through the ruse, but again, SDWTSTD

However, there are still maybe some shenanigans to get up to. A rogue disguising themself as a cowering child might be initially made a lesser priority. A fighter disguised as an elderly grandmother or a frail spellcaster might be able to lure enemies closer, away from the rest of the party. A mage disguised as a beefy barbarian might not fool people for long, but may be able to avoid physical damage (or, better yet, attract mental saves that they can deal with easily.)

Can you think of other such uses? And, if you were DMing a game, how would you handle a PC who wanted to look at doing such a thing?

[Segev]

A frontline damage dealer diaguising himself as one of the enemies he's near could confuse them, provided he makes sure his party doesn't target him.

[whateew]

A frontline damage dealer diaguising himself as one of the enemies he's near could confuse them, provided he makes sure his party doesn't target him.

Oh, I hadn't thought of that! This would be a fun way to reward foreplanning too - scout out the enemies in advance, and confuse them (maybe with a tussle and grapple)

A fun interaction might be a druid with natures mantle casting a usual summoning spell or other such concentration madness, then bonus action hiding while disguised as the party rogue. If they work together, 50% chance that someone aiming for a caster gets uncanny dodged instead, as if both the rogue and the druid are taking turns hiding in a similar location, it might be difficult to differentiate the two!

[MaxWilson]

What ways can one use the disguise self spell to their advantage in a combat situation? I'm a massive fan of the Hexblood lineage, and a free disguise self might as well be used - so how would you go about i?.

There is, of course, the jank of playing an incredibly thin character who disguises themself as a thicker fellow to fool an enemy about where they should be aiming, but (unless a DM makes a decision) Spells Do What They Say They Do, so I doubt that'd have much in game effect (reliably at least). I've seen some discussion that this would maybe initially provide a bonus, and then all enemies would see through the ruse, but again, SDWTSTD

However, there are still maybe some shenanigans to get up to. A rogue disguising themself as a cowering child might be initially made a lesser priority. A fighter disguised as an elderly grandmother or a frail spellcaster might be able to lure enemies closer, away from the rest of the party. A mage disguised as a beefy barbarian might not fool people for long, but may be able to avoid physical damage (or, better yet, attract mental saves that they can deal with easily.)

Can you think of other such uses? And, if you were DMing a game, how would you handle a PC who wanted to look at doing such a thing?

A Medusa's gaze petrifies, but there is a clause which allows creatures to escape by averting their eyes:

"Unless surprised, a creature can avert its eyes to avoid the saving throw at the start of its turn. If the creature does so, it can't see the medusa until the start of its next turn, when it can avert its eyes again. If the creature looks at the medusa in the meantime, it must immediately make the save."

While there are technically no rules as written for "averting your gaze" under normal (non-monster-specific) circumstances, and a rules lawyer might therefore object that this can only happen if a genuine Medusa is present, still there's no reason in principle a creature viewing an apparent Medusa wouldn't be able to avert its gaze exactly the same way. Therefore, against enemies who are savvy enough to know how to fight Medusas, Disguise Self/Seeming could potentially trick them into looking away from you, "avoiding the saving throw" that you couldn't really impose on them in the first place.

[whateew]

A Medusa's gaze petrifies, but there is a clause which allows creatures to escape by averting their eyes:

"Unless surprised, a creature can avert its eyes to avoid the saving throw at the start of its turn. If the creature does so, it can't see the medusa until the start of its next turn, when it can avert its eyes again. If the creature looks at the medusa in the meantime, it must immediately make the save."

While there are technically no rules as written for "averting your gaze" under normal (non-monster-specific) circumstances, and a rules lawyer might therefore object that this can only happen if a genuine Medusa is present, still there's no reason in principle a creature viewing an apparent Medusa wouldn't be able to avert its gaze exactly the same way. Therefore, against enemies who are savvy enough to know how to fight Medusas, Disguise Self/Seeming could potentially trick them into looking away from you, "avoiding the saving throw" that you couldn't really impose on them in the first place.

This is a very flavourful option, especially for the Hexblood - your "crown" could be a nest of snakes, and you take the actor feat + disguise kit for Maximal Shenanigans. Have your bard even spread rumours of a mysterious sorcerer who walks in town vieled, paralysing creatures at a glance. Hell, as a sorcerer (subtly?) prepare hold person for the first creature to look you in the eyes. (Although smart NPC's could do that arcana reaction)

I wouldn't look!

[Altheus]

Disguise yourself as an enemy leader and give really bad orders.

[Sception]

Most relevant disguise self use will involve some amount of scouting so that you can cast it in advance, but yeah, disguising yourself as an enemy, disguising yourself as an enemy leader (particularly if you can combine it with strong deception and/or performance skills, especially with the actor feat).

Not a combat ability, but you can disguise self before going to talk to someone you mean to use the 'friends' cantrip on, then leave and let the disguise end before the spell effect turns them hostile to "you". Combine this trick with impersonating someone specific you don't like to turn the cantrip's drawback into a secondary bonus.

[J-H]

I had a player who used his Hat of Disguise to look like a skeleton. He successfully fooled some bone golems and other skeletons. It wouldn't have worked on zombies (smell/lifesense type stuff). I gave him advantage/sneak attack on his attack rolls against the mindless undead, since they didn't see him as a threat.

Same campaign (Castle Dracula), I had another who used Disguise Self to look like a vampire to get past some other golems. It worked until he blew his cover by not recognizing a name.

[Tanarii]

While there are technically no rules as written for "averting your gaze" under normal (non-monster-specific) circumstances, and a rules lawyer might therefore object that this can only happen if a genuine Medusa is present, still there's no reason in principle a creature viewing an apparent Medusa wouldn't be able to avert its gaze exactly the same way. Therefore, against enemies who are savvy enough to know how to fight Medusas, Disguise Self/Seeming could potentially trick them into looking away from you, "avoiding the saving throw" that you couldn't really impose on them in the first place.

As the premier rules lawyer on these boards who objects to that rule being written into any monster stat blocks in the first place ...

I think that's a fantastic tactic, as long as your DM rules that your PC can avert their gaze and inflict the Blind condition on themself at any time.

[Segev]

As the premier rules lawyer on these boards who objects to that rule being written into any monster stat blocks in the first place ...

I think that's a fantastic tactic, as long as your DM rules that your PC can avert their gaze and inflict the Blind condition on themself at any time.

Given 5e's "rulings, not rules" combined with the notion that the reason for this is because you're trying to match the rules/rulings with the fiction layer, it makes sense that you could avert your gaze because you THINK it's dangerous to look at something.

I am curious, though: why do you object to that rule being in a monster stat block in the first place? Is it just that you'd prefer to have a general set of gaze attack rules? (I can't think of any reason why you'd have a general "avert your gaze" rule without something specific covering why that would ever be desirable.)

[Tanarii]

Given 5e's "rulings, not rules" combined with the notion that the reason for this is because you're trying to match the rules/rulings with the fiction layer, it makes sense that you could avert your gaze because you THINK it's dangerous to look at something.

The idea that a combatant could keep their eyes averted sufficiently in a deadly situation breaks my suspension of disbelief. Especially the common table ruling that a PB closing their eyes to give yourself the blinded condition.

It's also a glaring contradiction in the face of the (also belief suspending) rule that exists as RAW that combatants are generally paying attention to everything around them.

If a PC wants to do that, they should have to blindfold themself.

-------

But if you are going to make a ruling in that direction, this becomes a great tactic!

[Unoriginal]

You can use Disguise Self to make enemies perceive incorrect information about you, causing them to use the wrong tactics.

Making the Githzerai Warlock look like a Tiefling likely means the enemy will avoid targetting them with fire spells, for example. And the nimble Arcane Trickster could make themselves look like a mighty but slow and clumsy knight to bait AoEs targetting DEX.

[MaxWilson]

As the premier rules lawyer on these boards who objects to that rule being written into any monster stat blocks in the first place ...

I think that's a fantastic tactic, as long as your DM rules that your PC can avert their gaze and inflict the Blind condition on themself at any time.

Note: I don't think your position is rules-lawyering, because IIRC you would eliminate the option across the board, including against Medusas, requiring actual blindfolds instead. It's only rules-lawyery to treat real and illusory Medusas differently.

In this case the hoped-for effect on savvy opponents under your rules would be the same: they blindfold themselves, and now you've got advantage.

You can use Disguise Self to make enemies perceive incorrect information about you, causing them to use the wrong tactics.

Making the Githzerai Warlock look like a Tiefling likely means the enemy will avoid targetting them with fire spells, for example. And the nimble Arcane Trickster could make themselves look like a mighty but slow and clumsy knight to bait AoEs targetting DEX.

Yeah, and the squishy wizard (who wants to avoid being in melee) should make himself look like a hulking barbarian with a greataxe (whom monsters want to avoid being in melee with) or a shambling zombie (who isn't worth getting into melee with until everyone more important is dead).

Even without Disguise Self, I advocate that wizards should openly carry rapiers even if they aren't proficient with them, just for deception purposes. Armored wizards (e.g. Life Cleric 1) should carry greatswords instead.

[cookieface]

My first thought in response to the original question (how to use Disguise Self) is after you successfully hide from your enemies, cast Disguise Self, then reappear and get into their back lines unopposed.

Could be a good option for your Arcane Trickster.

[da newt]

Disguise self as:

one of your foes
the BBEG
an innocent child/old lady
an escaped captive of the party / damsel in distress
a statue
a ghost
Medusa
a God
a guard
the King
the hostage you are there to rescue
a naked lady
unarmed/unarmored
a corpse
rakshasa
litch
the bartender (free drinks)


You are only limited by humanoid shape and within 1' of your true height - you can change everything else including clothes, weapons, very fat, super thin, age, sex, race, incorporeal, stone, gold, etc.

[Warlush]

Not a combat ability, but you can disguise self before going to talk to someone you mean to use the 'friends' cantrip on, then leave and let the disguise end before the spell effect turns them hostile to "you". Combine this trick with impersonating someone specific you don't like to turn the cantrip's drawback into a secondary bonus.

This is so abusable and so much fun one of my DMs started having every NPC arbitrarily, physically investigate my character so they would "see through my illusion". Try it and see if your DM is as petty and uncreative as mine.

[whateew]

This is so abusable and so much fun one of my DMs started having every NPC arbitrarily, physically investigate my character so they would "see through my illusion". Try it and see if your DM is as petty and uncreative as mine.

Heheheh, the classic. It's definitely abusable, and if I were a DM I would figure out some way to challenge a player doing that, but not by just outright ruining it like that. Maybe instead, once a few people had been fooled, the town's guards will begin spreading rumours of an impersonator who uses enchantment magic, making this risky IF caught.

[Damon_Tor]

I allow "social stealth" at my table, which is a charisma (stealth) check made to avoid notice because you appear to belong wherever you are. Disguises, including magical disguises, are an important tool for using this effectively.

[Rev666]

In the game I'm currently playing there's a group called The Kell Gang and they're a bunch of human/half elf thugs that 90% of the members wear studded leather while wielding scimitars and a pistol (guns are prevalent in this campaign).

My half elf hexblade with mask of many faces and actor has every intention of hiding out of site, changing into one of them and sneaking around back to be "support" for them.

As long as you're smart with it then its piss easy to use in combat effectively.