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2021-03-17, 05:33 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Apr 2009
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- Somewhere...
Re: Girl Genius XXIX: A giant corkboard of continuity madness
Albia has been planning to split Gil, Tarvek, and Martellus off and send them on their way so she can add Agatha to her court. Her anger may be play acting to accomplish that. But however clever her plan, I don't think it's going to work. Tarvek seems to understand what she's up to, as does Martellus to a lesser degree. And if Mechanicsburg is threatened by events, as it might be, Agatha's not going to sit still, she's going to go for the Lantern with full might and main.
We'll see what happens.
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2021-03-17, 06:19 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- May 2015
- Location
- Germany
- Gender
Re: Girl Genius XXIX: A giant corkboard of continuity madness
Sure, Albia might be playing it up, but I don't think she is happy about this development. Probably not good for England's interests.
Might still be time to split up though.
Someone (read Gil*, probably Tweedle too**) has to take care of the new mess while Agatha continues the search for the Lantern.
*Maybe Tarvek as well, if Gil can drag him along.
**Not together obviously, but Martellus has vested interest in Europa not getting conquered (by someone else)."If it lives it can be killed.
If it is dead it can be eaten."
Ronkong Coma "the way of the bookhunter" III Catacombium
(Walter Moers "Die Stadt der träumenden Bücher")
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2021-03-17, 06:22 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Apr 2013
- Location
- Pacific NW
- Gender
Re: Girl Genius XXIX: A giant corkboard of continuity madness
The novels make it more explicit that the Polar Lords are based in Russia, rather than Scandinavia.
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2021-03-17, 07:04 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Dec 2010
- Location
- right behind you
Re: Girl Genius XXIX: A giant corkboard of continuity madness
Wulfenbach created his empire by utterly smashing everyone into submission and ruling with an iron fist under the "Dont Make Me Come Over There" doctrine. Gil just by not being the original baron has the entire empire revolting to test his limits AND is dealing with a far more subtle and skilled Other interfering as instead of shambling zombies we have normal people totally loyal to lucrezia. Its two very different scenarios and thus not an equal measurement of ruling ability. That doesnt even take into account how the baron literally mind controlled his own son this entire time, interfering whenever his programming felt it necessary.
"Interdum feror cupidine partium magnarum Europae vincendarum"
Translation: "Sometimes I get this urge to conquer large parts of Europe."
"If you don't get those cameras out of my face, I'm gonna go 8.6 on the Richter scale with gastric emissions that'll clear this room."
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2021-03-17, 07:32 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Mar 2007
Re: Girl Genius XXIX: A giant corkboard of continuity madness
According to the Girl Genius wiki, Mechanicsburg "appears to be tucked into a particularly advantageous spot in what appears to be the equivalent of the Eastern Carpathian Mountains, just north of the river Olt, possibly in the location of modern-day Sibiu." So, at least geographically it is probably close to the invasion's front line. While the Polar Lords themselves may not be up to the task of breaking through the time-field, Gil's whole research base there is probably at extreme risk, and I doubt Agatha will like having to bust through a blockade of the Polar Lords just to get back home when she has the lantern. So I can definitely see her wanting to go full-force for the lantern, and don't see a real reason for Tarvek to split off from her.
Gil and Martellus, though, I can see leaving. Gil has to go back, if he has any hope of retaining what little control the Empire has left. Honestly, given that the Empire had already been greatly weakened following Klaus's disappearance and Gil's takeover, this massive invasion while he's off with his friends on the other side of the continent could already have spelled the doom of whatever credibility Gil had as a ruler. If a similarly massive counterattack doesn't happen ASAP that credibility is certainly gone.
And for Tweedle, he couldn't have asked for better. Someone takes up the Lightning Crown, defends Paris and slays the revenant of Valios. Then, a huge outside invasion begins and the local ruling power is powerless to do anything. What better way for him to cement his claim to the throne than to be the one to rally the defenders of Europa and drive back the polar lords? The only real problem there is that he's still dependent on Agatha for the Queen's Touch, unless his cat is ready sooner than he implied.Last edited by Ailurus; 2021-03-17 at 07:32 AM.
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2021-03-17, 07:33 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Feb 2016
- Location
- Earth and/or not-Earth
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Re: Girl Genius XXIX: A giant corkboard of continuity madness
So the Polar Ice Lords are heading towards the Carpathian Mountains. Isn't Mechanicsburg in the Carpathians? Perhaps that's their goal...
I made a webcomic, featuring absurdity, terrible art, and alleged morals.
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2021-03-17, 08:06 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Nov 2012
- Location
- Colorado
- Gender
Re: Girl Genius XXIX: A giant corkboard of continuity madness
Gil should have headed home as soon as possible, but instead stayed around to play Lover Boy to Agatha and Spark for various projects. I don't think his help was essential to stabilizing Kjarl, for example.
So ... irresponsible. And now the Polar Lords (Zola) are on the move. Except ... the last time we saw Zola, Grandma Sturmvorous had taken control of her. Which means this is most likely a ploy to make Gil look bad and then Tarvek and / or Martellus can benefit by driving back the invasion.
Der Kestle is still operational inside the Time Warp. If the Polar Lords do manage to break in, they will regret it deeply. As we saw just prior to the Baron setting off the Time Warp, the Castle is over-the-top lethal in defense of Mechanicsburg. Add to that a whole lot of Jagers and monsters, and a million men plus snow demons is just not enough.This ... is my signature finishing move!
"It's never good when you make a fiend cringe" - MadGrady
According to some online quiz, I'm a 6th level TN Wizard. They didn't give me full XP for all the monsters I've defeated while daydreaming.
http://easydamus.com/character.html
I am a Ranger Archetype: Gleaming Warden (thx to Ninja Prawn)
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2021-03-17, 08:17 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Dec 2007
- Location
- In the mind.
Re: Girl Genius XXIX: A giant corkboard of continuity madness
Only problem with Martellus leaving to defend Europe? He's still bound to Agatha and the animal mascot isn't ready yet.
If you want a OotS style Touhou avatar, send me a request.
Steam name: memnarch. Same avatar.
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2021-03-17, 09:25 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jun 2007
- Location
- On Paper
- Gender
Re: Girl Genius XXIX: A giant corkboard of continuity madness
I don't know precisely where the "Polar Lords" territory was, but assuming it was at least Scandanavia, that's a massive territory gain for a single day.
Probably because most of the people in their path were Wasped, and so everywhere surrendered with no resistance, but still.
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2021-03-17, 12:08 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Dec 2010
- Location
- right behind you
Re: Girl Genius XXIX: A giant corkboard of continuity madness
Mechanicsburg is boned. The castle has no power, it was shutting down everything just to maintain its most critical functions and would take years to power up properly now that its generators are back on line. Unless the castles generators are deep enough to store power outside of the time bubble, mechanicsburg is no better now than when klaus was attacking. Not toothless, but hardly unbeatable, especially with YET ANOTHER army possibly heading for it. Also, gil has accomplished some very important things. He got daddy dearest out of his skull, and lucrezia out of agathas. Thats HUGE. And how long has it been since then? A day? Two? He hasnt spent a long vacation here in london, thats for sure.
"Interdum feror cupidine partium magnarum Europae vincendarum"
Translation: "Sometimes I get this urge to conquer large parts of Europe."
"If you don't get those cameras out of my face, I'm gonna go 8.6 on the Richter scale with gastric emissions that'll clear this room."
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2021-03-17, 12:52 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- May 2015
- Location
- Germany
- Gender
Re: Girl Genius XXIX: A giant corkboard of continuity madness
"If it lives it can be killed.
If it is dead it can be eaten."
Ronkong Coma "the way of the bookhunter" III Catacombium
(Walter Moers "Die Stadt der träumenden Bücher")
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2021-03-17, 01:27 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Mar 2007
Re: Girl Genius XXIX: A giant corkboard of continuity madness
Correct. After Agatha fixed the lightning collector and zapped it Der Kestle woke up quite a bit. At the end of the Mechanicsburg arc, it was deploying the Thorn Hedge, dropping hostiles into pits under the streets, slamming buildings into each other with enough force to make the guns embed in the walls, sending waves of flying critters at Wulfenbach's fleet, waking up massive golem/clank things, and probably more stuff I'm forgetting. On its own, could it break the entire million-man army? No idea (probably not IMO), but it would certainly be a very painful, expensive undertaking. And that assumes it hasn't been recharging some during the time stop - after all, Der Kestle itself is still awake in there so it is at least possible that the generators have kept running.
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2021-03-17, 01:54 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jun 2007
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2021-03-17, 03:17 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Aug 2017
- Location
- France
- Gender
Re: Girl Genius XXIX: A giant corkboard of continuity madness
Forum Wisdom
Mage avatar by smutmulch & linklele.
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2021-03-17, 05:22 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Dec 2010
- Location
- right behind you
Re: Girl Genius XXIX: A giant corkboard of continuity madness
"Interdum feror cupidine partium magnarum Europae vincendarum"
Translation: "Sometimes I get this urge to conquer large parts of Europe."
"If you don't get those cameras out of my face, I'm gonna go 8.6 on the Richter scale with gastric emissions that'll clear this room."
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2021-03-17, 06:12 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Sep 2015
- Location
- London, UK
- Gender
Re: Girl Genius XXIX: A giant corkboard of continuity madness
Ah, that new thread smell...
Incidentally, I think it may be time to update the opening post of the thread: Othar's Twitter is back from hiatus and the Wordpress and Livejournal pages no longer exist.
Speaking of Othar's twitter, new(?) Geister information: they were a subterranean civilisation. Unfortunately that fits well with every major theory of their origin.
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2021-03-18, 06:18 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Oct 2019
Re: Girl Genius XXIX: A giant corkboard of continuity madness
That raises an interesting question for me:
is there any way to read the othar twitter-thing without getting angry at twitters complete un-usability?
I mean, if i get a link to that account, i see the newest messages first (wich kind of makes sense for a short message service).
But if i want to read-, and follow a story, i might want to start with the *first* message, not the *last*.
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2021-03-18, 08:12 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Nov 2012
- Location
- Colorado
- Gender
Re: Girl Genius XXIX: A giant corkboard of continuity madness
The Castle seems to be operational and communicating. When the Baron activated the Time Stop the Castle was fully operational - Agatha had just called down lightning upon it and recharged all it's batteries, and Von Zinter plus others had gotten the main power drives up and running. It was fully charged with an ongoing source of fresh power. And as we saw, it unleashed hell upon the invaders and then channeled them out of the city right over the top of Higgs, just to show Zeetha a thing or two.
If the time stop precludes the generators from supplying power, then it also precludes the other mechanisms from using power.
That is a good question. If time is frozen in the city, the Dyne should not change, and therefore it should not flow.
We know from Vole's story that while the city may be Time Stopped, the minds of those inside are still working. And he grew while he was in there, although Gil did not. The implications for the Castle are hard to know, since it has a mind but not really a body.This ... is my signature finishing move!
"It's never good when you make a fiend cringe" - MadGrady
According to some online quiz, I'm a 6th level TN Wizard. They didn't give me full XP for all the monsters I've defeated while daydreaming.
http://easydamus.com/character.html
I am a Ranger Archetype: Gleaming Warden (thx to Ninja Prawn)
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2021-03-18, 09:03 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Nov 2005
- Location
- Sydney, Australia
- Gender
Re: Girl Genius XXIX: A giant corkboard of continuity madness
I actually don't know about that. I thought Vole's sense of time passing was a side-effect of the way he was withdrawn from the time field.
Remember, previous withdrawal candidates immediately aged to dust. That was the reason they chose Vole as the next removal candidate - he could age a thousand years and it wouldn't matter, as he was a Jager. Given the way his body was using up energy (such that they had to force-feed him nutrients to sustain him) it seems like that was the case during Vole's withdrawal. However they then refined the process, so that Tarvek and Othar were removed un-aged. I suspect that Vole is the only one whose mind has endured a large passing of time - during the removal process - while the minds of everyone else in the time stop (except Der Kestle) are working at the same rate as time passes in there i.e. exceedingly slowly.I'm pretty much the opposite of concise. If I fail to get to the point, please ask me and I'm happy to (attempt to) clarify.
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2021-03-18, 10:32 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Nov 2006
- Location
- England. Ish.
- Gender
Re: Girl Genius XXIX: A giant corkboard of continuity madness
No, it still flows out into the Dyne, but the properties that made it interesting stop in Mechanicsberg.
...Well, it still flows out unless the timestop affects the flow, of course.Warning: This posting may contain wit, wisdom, pathos, irony, satire, sarcasm and puns. And traces of nut.
"The main skill of a good ruler seems to be not preventing the conflagrations but rather keeping them contained enough they rate more as campfires." Rogar Demonblud
"Hold on just a d*** second. UK has spam callers that try to get you to buy conservatories?!? Even y'alls spammers are higher class than ours!" Peelee
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2021-03-18, 03:30 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Aug 2017
- Location
- France
- Gender
Re: Girl Genius XXIX: A giant corkboard of continuity madness
It should, the water is inside the bubble so the riverbank outside the city must be very dry right now while the water flowing to the city is... er... being blocked off at the edge of the bubble by the water allready there? Maybe it works out as the Dyne flowing along the edge of the time bubble now?
EDIT: Arrgh, liminal side-effects like this is why localized time manipualtion should not be analyzed, too closely.Last edited by Fyraltari; 2021-03-18 at 03:31 PM.
Forum Wisdom
Mage avatar by smutmulch & linklele.
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2021-03-18, 03:42 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Nov 2006
- Location
- England. Ish.
- Gender
Re: Girl Genius XXIX: A giant corkboard of continuity madness
At the end of the day it depends on how deep the spring is, how big the time bubble is and the ground structure. The water could well find a new way out with sufficient pressure, and the chances are it would wind up flowing in the general direction of the Dyne and probably even form a tributary.
Warning: This posting may contain wit, wisdom, pathos, irony, satire, sarcasm and puns. And traces of nut.
"The main skill of a good ruler seems to be not preventing the conflagrations but rather keeping them contained enough they rate more as campfires." Rogar Demonblud
"Hold on just a d*** second. UK has spam callers that try to get you to buy conservatories?!? Even y'alls spammers are higher class than ours!" Peelee
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2021-03-18, 06:37 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Apr 2009
- Location
- ??Ph??
Re: Girl Genius XXIX: A giant corkboard of continuity madness
Maybe air, water and fine particles and/or maybe even most inanimate things aren taren't affected by the time stop for .. some reson.
(Or maybe the Folgios didn't put that much though into it. And probably neither should you. Remember, Girl genius 'science' runs on Pixie dust and Plot power and has much internal coherency as the plots demand.)
So, that's twice that the empire is almost overrun as soon as the figure in charge is out of commision for alittle while. (Except at least when it was Klauss if memory serves it was implied it was at least a few days and there was the rumours of the heterodyne to muddle things up). Admitedly the polar lord attack is too fortuitous with Gil absence/presence in england for one not to suspect that Zola/the Other hadn't had a hand in this.
That said, I feel Albia reaction is overblown here. It has been barely a day, even if Gil was there, I would imagine it'd take him more time to start organising a defense and counter attack. (Then again, maybe not...)
Although it may say a lot about the state of the empire if he actually need to be there in person for it to happen at all... If a state cannot organize itself against a threat without it's nominal leader to oversee every operation personally than maybe it wasn't that stable or well organised to begin with... Really feel like it might be an ademic problem with all those sspark controlled state really. Paris was entirely dependent on it being a master, The empire crumbles as soon as there's no more baron, Mechanisburg while still going has still been pining for a heterodyne to live again and of course the castle wich is it's main strength is entirely dependent on an Heterodyne being there and something tell me if something happened to Albia, England would just desintegrate in moments. Not saying Othar has a point but...Last edited by smuchmuch; 2021-03-18 at 06:49 PM.
I'm sig'ing in the rain, just sig'ing in the rain....
Somme old avatars, by meSpoiler
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2021-03-18, 11:23 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Feb 2013
- Location
- USA
- Gender
Re: Girl Genius XXIX: A giant corkboard of continuity madness
Yeah, I definitely agree on Albia's reaction being overblown. Even it's been a week (feels more like 3 days max). That's really nothing.
And the Empire is really that only in name and possibly territory. Definitely not structure. Klaus and seemingly Gil ran it exclusively on a 'don't make me come over there' basis. There's no territorial control, that's left to local sparks/lords. We've never seen an Imperial garrison anywhere other than the tiny one at Mechanisburg. There's not even unification of force structure and command. Instead, it's an ad hoc mish-mash of every deposed sparks forces the Baron absorbed around a small core of Wulfenbach clanks and airmen. It's possible there aren't even really border forts and concentrated army anywhere near the polar lords. Instead there's just the assumption that Gil would float Castle Wulfenbach over there if needed.
It's closer to a feudal kingdom than anything we commonly think of as an empire.
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2021-03-19, 12:25 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- May 2015
- Location
- Germany
- Gender
Re: Girl Genius XXIX: A giant corkboard of continuity madness
„We have no desire to conquer Europa.“
Sure. But that doesn't mean this isn't what this'll lead too.
That army's going to turn on Gil the moment it suits Albia's aims."If it lives it can be killed.
If it is dead it can be eaten."
Ronkong Coma "the way of the bookhunter" III Catacombium
(Walter Moers "Die Stadt der träumenden Bücher")
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2021-03-19, 12:34 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jun 2006
- Location
- Under Mt. Ebott
- Gender
Re: Girl Genius XXIX: A giant corkboard of continuity madness
I'm not sure you want to be making the scathing attack on absolute, personally administrated monarchy you're making, Albia.
Like, Gil has been gone for what, a week or two since he went out to chase Tarvek's kidnappers? If one dude taking two weeks for personal business is enough to completely shatter a system, the system does not work! And far s I can tell, the Empire is less dependent on a Baron than England is on its Queen - by this precedent, if anything happens to Albia, sounds like England would last a couple days before turning into Mad Max.
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2021-03-19, 01:36 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jan 2010
- Location
- Tor zur Welt
- Gender
Re: Girl Genius XXIX: A giant corkboard of continuity madness
* my emphasis
http://dmreference.com/SRD/
http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/
Things that don't kill me make me strong
Things that do kill me leave me dead
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2021-03-19, 03:02 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jul 2015
Re: Girl Genius XXIX: A giant corkboard of continuity madness
I'm pretty sure the Foglios simply haven't got a good idea of how long large-scale military operations, even mechanized ones (which would be a very, very generous interpretation of spark-led forces) take to unfold. The missive says both that the Polar Lords launched their attack 'yesterday' and that they have 'taken every major city in their path.'
These are fundamentally incompatible statements. Even if the Polar Lords are attacking in multiple columns along a wide front, major cities in northeastern Europe are spread out. No army is taking multiple cities in just one day. It'd be lucky to cover the distance between even two relatively close major cities (ex. Warsaw and Lodz, about 150 km apart) in a week.
Realistically the two weeks or so Gil might have been gone isn't enough time to even assemble an army of a million troops, much less lead it anywhere. And of course the same thing is true of any force sent from England. Even dispatched by ship, they'd have to travel from London to Gibraltar to Istanbul to some port on the Black Sea (Varna, perhaps) and then march north from there. That's weeks minimum, months more likely.
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2021-03-19, 05:38 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- May 2009
Re: Girl Genius XXIX: A giant corkboard of continuity madness
I quite agree.
Let's just say that it is quite obvious that they either haven't read Eisenhower's "Crusade in Europe" or other attempts at popularly explaining large scale military operations including air/sea/land components , or have ignored it.
Even assuming for the sake of argument that the Polar Lords territory is a lot less Polar than the name suggests and it extends to most of Russia and the unmarked lands north-east of Carpathia on the old Girl Genius maps, and even assuming that this million man army had been assembled in secret some time in advance, ready to take advantage of an opportunity should one arise (riight), and that they are advancing across a very broad front with an individual column assigned to take each city, such that the cities of north-eastern Europe that are falling so far are those that could be reached in one day, and further assuming that they are greatly helped in overcoming unsuspecting resistance by infiltrators (something that works far better in novels than real life), and that there's enough troops left over for a thrust towards the heart of the Empire and Mechanicsburg in particular, the distance is still too great for anything but airlifted forces to have reached a point within one day where they'd be marching on the Carpathian foothills. And any such forces would be at high risk of not being resupplied once the Empire reacted.
It reminds me of when the Order of The Stick performed a naval evacuation of Azure City and its environs, and somehow managed to save more than a small fraction of the 500k population on the fleet, which exile fleet then managed to supply itself while sailing around looking for allies/a new home.
There are times logistics just have to go cry in the corner, and this is one of them.Last edited by Deliverance; 2021-03-19 at 05:40 AM.
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2021-03-19, 06:51 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Dec 2010
- Location
- right behind you
Re: Girl Genius XXIX: A giant corkboard of continuity madness
I mean, for all we know, this has been setup for awhile now and wasnt looking for an opening, it was always planned to be launched as soon as it was ready. The fact that gil isnt there just helps the chaos spread. As for resupply, this is striking me as more of a large scale smash and grab. Enough troops and mechs and demons and such to overwhelm defenses and move on with a specific goal in mind, mechanicsburg. At the same time spreading out any response force because they are basically sweeping across the entire western border of europa like a wave, not moving on a single city at a time. They have a goal in mind and its not to expand polar lord territory, its to go after whatever their target is with the city. Its even possible the attack was planned to catch GIL since he spends all his time there. He has only been gone for a day or two really, so the idea of a quick crush burn kill invasion to decapitate the leadership of the empire, and possibly seize all territory between the old border and mechanicsburg isnt a terrible one. Germany showed how effective a lightning raid could be. It took a month to take all of poland and they actually WERE interested in holding the area. They werent just rolling through to reach the next nation over. So yes it is being done faster than it could work, but I dont think its too much of a stretch for anyone not majoring in the history of warfare to swallow.
"Interdum feror cupidine partium magnarum Europae vincendarum"
Translation: "Sometimes I get this urge to conquer large parts of Europe."
"If you don't get those cameras out of my face, I'm gonna go 8.6 on the Richter scale with gastric emissions that'll clear this room."