Under Rated Peace Cleric combo...

[Nefariis]

Interesting combo that I haven't seen many posts about (at least not on here)

Peace Cleric 1 (Emboldening Bond/Bless) / Arcane Trickster X (Familiar/Sneak)

I've seen many posts on here recommending that rogues not use SCAG cantrips in fear that you might miss out on sneak attack (extra off-hand attacks) - but with an extra 2d4 to attack, I think that using SCAG cantrips are definitely worth it again.

Arcane Trickster gets a familiar, SCAG Cantrips, haste, three skills
Peace Cleric gets you Bless, Emboldening Bond, Guidance, one skill

Essentially you will always have a +2d4 to attack and advantage because arcane tricksters also have familiar

Option 1: Kobald
With a familiar (mouse on shoulder or owl flyby), pack tactics, bless, and emboldening bond
at level 12 with a +2 weapon rapier, and booming blade -

Attack: 2d4 + 11 with Advantage
Damage: 6d8 + 6d6 + 7 damage (you should regularly get your extra 3d8 damage booming blade as you still have a bonus action disengage)

According to Ludic's DPR Calculator you will hit 98.5% of the time at 17 AC for 59.4 damage for every single attack

(Have Sentinel or an Order Cleric teammate for 60 damage on other people's turns)

Option 2: Elf or half elf for another couple skills
Really Kobald with rat isn't even necessary - choose a elf for Elven Advantage and an owl with fly-by
Ludic's DPR Calculator now says you will hit 99.95% of the time at 17 AC for 61.8 damage

Option3: Grung (2d4 poison with Con Save) with an Owl
hit 98.5% of the time at 17 AC for 64.8 damage

Option4: Halfling with Halfling Luck (reroll 1's)
hit 99.87% of the time at 17 AC for 59.83 damage

The point is, you should always have advantage on a single attack on your turn regardless of race (thanks to familiar) and with a kobald you will always have advantage every time you attack regardless if it's on your turn or someone else's (pack tactics) - and either way you get +2d4 (Bless, emboldening bond) to attack - and you still have your bonus action!

And aside from the great damage you are doing every round, you are going to have a ton of skills (rogue/peace/half-elf), and you get Guidance/Emboldening Bond (they stack as well) - making you extremely versatile and self-sufficient out of combat.

Another interesting combo might be
kobald Peace Cleric 1 / Battle Master Fighter X

You now have advantage on 4 attacks at level 13 with SS/CBE (soonest to +5 dex) and +2d4 to attack
Ludic says it would be 97% chance to hit for 81 damage per round and that's not including any maneuver dice

Either way - more people need to be talking about a one level dip in Peace Cleric :)

[Silpharon]

It is really good, I agree. I like the rogue combo given that they will likely hit once in their turn anyway. This could further be combined with 1 level of Divine Soul Sorcerer for favored by the gods 2d4 attack roll bonus 1/SR for the rare times you roll a natural 1.

[stoutstien]

Go full buff bot. Artillerist 3-11/ peace cleric 6-X. Once you've handed out infusions like mind sharpener and start stacking warding bond with protective bond you can keep just about any party trucking.

[follacchioso]

It is a good combo, but you are going to spend a fortune on Material Components to conjure the Familiar, as it will get downed very often.

Your +2d4 come from Bless (1 action, 1 minute duration) and Emboldening Bond (1 action, 10 minutes duration). So you need two actions to prepare in advance of any combat, which you may not always have. If you intend on sending your familiar to the front line every time, that is also going to alert any enemy around. Overall my impression is that you would not be very sneaky as a rogue, and you would need some preparation in advance.

Even so, you will still be effective as a normal rogue, you can still attack normally and with the offhand attack when needed. However you need to consider how often you are going to be able to spend two actions in advance of a combat before entering the fight. You may get better leverage from two levels in War Cleric, which would grant you that extra +10 to hit when you really need it.

[Dalinar]

It would make the build more more MAD, but BB/GFB can also be gotten with a Warlock dip, which would enable you to go Pact of the Chain and Investment of the Chain Master for a much more resilient familiar. Also frees up your Rogue subclass to be something else if you want. You can go Hexblade (sigh) and get access to CHA-based attacks to help with that as well as Shield and Blur for defensive options. Also a good excuse to take the one-level Divine Soul dip discussed above.

At this point you have to ask yourself how much you're willing to delay your Rogue progression for the sake of having ridiculously accurate BB/GFB Sneak Attacks, though. Don't wanna lose too many d6s.

[Silpharon]

There are really nice aspects about emboldening bond:
- requires no concentration
- 10 minute duration is plenty for a pre-fight buff if you scout the enemy
- the extra d4 is per turn, so you can use it on an attack on your turn, and then a saving throw on the enemy's turn
- requires no spell slots, but uses scales with PB
- nothing is wisdom based, so it works well with 13 wis.

I'm thinking about how this would look on an Armorer. At 15 they have an Infiltrator skill where each attack provides advantage for the next attack. This would be a good way to ensure the first attack hits, so subsequent attacks have advantage.

It's fun to RP as well, I'm picturing Aragorn's speech at the black gate of Mordor: "there may come a day when the strength of men will fail, but it is not this day!!"

[RogueJK]

Essentially you will always have a +2d4 to attack

Keep in mind that casting Bless every combat will run through your limited spell slots quickly, and also requires Concentration. Similarly, Emboldening Bond is only usable Proficiency Bonus times per day. So it's not an "every fight" thing, unless your DM is only sticking you in a few combats per long rest, as opposed to the game designers' assumed 6-8 per long rest.

Plus, as mentioned above by follacchioso, unless you have time before a fight to prep, this combo takes 2 full rounds to come online since either one requires an Action to activate. So you wouldn't be able to make any attacks yourself until Round 3 at the earliest. That's two full rounds that you could have been attempting Sneak Attacks instead, so even with the higher chance to hit in Rounds 3+, it will take several more rounds for the statistical damage benefit to even out. Most useful for long fights, with bigger enemies with high HP and/or high AC.

Therefore, having both up for the +2d4 attack bonus is still a good option for some fights, especially if you have time to prep, but understand that you will not always have it running in every fight as claimed.

[Delnatha]

"Either way - more people need to be talking about a one level dip in Peace Cleric :)"

I have a paladin with a one level dip as a peace domain cleric who would makes an awesome teammate for rogues such as yourself. Your build is actually better if you have somebody else doing the bless and emboldening bond so you can focus on doing what you do best and not spending two rounds setting up the buffs.

But you're right. If somebody in the party is at least one level of peace domain cleric, the party is a lot more powerful. Honestly the benefit from the saving throw bonus is worth even more than the to hit bonus.

[Greywander]

Cleric dips are also popular for wizards, as it's an easy way to get medium armor and shields while maintaining full caster progression and getting a couple extra spells (which aren't on the wizard list). Knowledge was previously my favorite domain to dip as a wizard, though Arcana was always tempting. Peace dips are probably the new "optimal" dip.

[Keravath]

Interesting combo that I haven't seen many posts about (at least not on here)

Peace Cleric 1 (Emboldening Bond/Bless) / Arcane Trickster X (Familiar/Sneak)

I've seen many posts on here recommending that rogues not use SCAG cantrips in fear that you might miss out on sneak attack (extra off-hand attacks) - but with an extra 2d4 to attack, I think that using SCAG cantrips are definitely worth it again.

Arcane Trickster gets a familiar, SCAG Cantrips, haste, three skills
Peace Cleric gets you Bless, Emboldening Bond, Guidance, one skill

Essentially you will always have a +2d4 to attack and advantage because arcane tricksters also have familiar

...

Honestly, I think I have to disagree.

Most combats last 1-3 rounds, occasionally as many as 5 depending on opponents and DM (though I have run combats that have lasted as long as 20 rounds).

However, most combats are over quite quickly.

The +2d4 comes from bless and emboldening bond.

- bond takes an action and is available proficiency bonus times/day (so likely limited to 2 combats through level 4 and 3 through level 8)
- bless takes an action and a spell slot - an X arcane trickster/1 peace cleric will only have 3 first level slots at level 4.

On the third round of combat - the rogue finally gets a chance to attack but by then a lot of combats are over.

I think this is one of those combinations that sounds so much better on paper than it does in practice.

I ran into the same issue playing an arcana cleric with the Magic Intiate: Druid feat. Shillelagh is a bonus action and if used then you can only cast a cantrip - so you can't use it on the same turn as spirit guardians. Spiritual weapon is a bonus action that can't be cast at the same time as spirit guardians or shillelagh. Attacking using booming blade as a cleric needs an attack stat that is high or shillelagh to use wisdom. The net result is that it took 3 combat rounds or more to get most of this working and by that time a lot of combats were over. Booming blade+shillelagh + spirit guardians sounds great! But it takes time to get it running. I think this peace cleric dip +2d4 to hit is in the same boat and really won't be as cool in practice as it seems on paper.

[da newt]

"The balm of peace thrives at the heart of healthy communities, between friendly nations, and in the souls of the kindhearted. The gods of peace inspire people of all sorts to resolve conflict and to stand up against those forces that try to prevent peace from flourishing. See the Peace Deities table for a list of some of the gods associated with this domain.

Clerics of the Peace Domain preside over the signing of treaties, and they are often asked to arbitrate in disputes. These clerics' blessings draw people together and help them shoulder one another's burdens, and the clerics' magic aids those who are driven to the way of peace."

While the mechanics are nice, I don't think that there is anything in the PEACE CLERIC that doesn't conflict with Rogues. There is a good chance that any self respecting PEACE Deity will quickly pull their favor from roughly 99.99% of the rogues I have encountered.

Archery FS could be a nice accuracy boost for this too.

[Dalinar]

While the mechanics are nice, I don't think that there is anything in the PEACE CLERIC that doesn't conflict with Rogues. There is a good chance that any self respecting PEACE Deity will quickly pull their favor from roughly 99.99% of the rogues I have encountered.

TBF, you're measuring "stereotypical rogue interested in taking a level in peace cleric for the combat benefits," and understandably you find that explanation wanting.

Rather, consider the kind of person that Peace 1/Rogue X likely describes, which might be something like "I fight against anything that threatens the greater peace for others, and I've decided that emulating a rogue's tactics is the most effective way for me to do so given my circumstances," or perhaps you'd prefer a darker interpretation like "death is a form of peace, which I will grant as a gift to those I see fit, as efficiently as possible."

Honestly, you can RP-justify almost any class combination. That might be a fun thread idea, actually, although I think a lot of answers might come down to "I'm an X/Y because I discovered learning to do Y will also make me better at X which is my real calling." e.g. it's easy to see why a Druid and an Artificer might conflict thematically, but in the real world a lot of technological development is aimed at reducing environmental impact per human, so they can be squared up that way.

[5eNeedsDarksun]

Emboldening Bond is probably the single strongest 1st level ability, so I'm having a tough time seeing how anything with a 1 level dip in it is underrated. It's strong enough that if one of my players came to me with it as a 1 level dip I'd probably have a similar (but stronger) reaction I have with the Hexblade dip; "Why don't you think about 3-4 levels if you really want to play a cleric/ warlock?"
Perhaps the better question is: is it any better on AT than on most other classes/ subclasses? I take your point that the single attack needs to hit and EB is a decent way to do it. ATs are definitely taylor made to use blade cantrips as they don't need feats, etc to make it work, whereas in order to attack with 2 weapons they do really need Warcaster, and XE is a need to attack at range. The AT in our campaign usually uses Booming Blade and has been able to bump Dex as a result of not needing feats; he seldom misses as-is.
On the other hand ATs are already a bit MAD, so likely Con and/ or Int are going to take a hit. I also think you oversell the Bless Bonus as 1) you have limited slots 2) it takes con 3) it takes an action to cast. That said the single 1-4 is already insanely good.
My conclusion would be that I agree: a Peace Cleric dip is probably better on ATs than most other classes, and definitely ATs than other rogues.

[Nefariis]

On the third round of combat - the rogue finally gets a chance to attack but by then a lot of combats are over.

Like most people have said before this - ideally you would take the 12 seconds before combat to set this up.

Your build is actually better if you have somebody else doing the bless and emboldening bond so you can focus on doing what you do best and not spending two rounds setting up the buffs.

I kind of put this guy together because I like the idea that he doesn't ~really~ need anyone - he has tons of skills, has expertise sneak, Guidance, Bless, Cure Wounds, high DPR, Reliable Talent, a familiar for scouting, +2d4 to just about everything, and could easily be a party's face with expertise persuasion.

While the mechanics are nice, I don't think that there is anything in the PEACE CLERIC that doesn't conflict with Rogues. There is a good chance that any self respecting PEACE Deity will quickly pull their favor from roughly 99.99% of the rogues I have encountered.

There is also the pseudo robin hood story line you are missing (only you started off working for the church instead of the military) - then you noticed the state has gone corrupt and now you steal from the rich and give to the poor trying to create a more peaceful/balanced society.

On the other hand ATs are already a bit MAD, so likely Con and/ or Int are going to take a hit. I also think you oversell the Bless Bonus as 1) you have limited slots 2) it takes con 3) it takes an action to cast. That said the single 1-4 is already insanely good.

I don't think it's going to end up that MAD, your primary spells are things like BB/GFB and bless (no need for attack/save or needs a save), which means really forgo Int to favor Dex/CON - and concentration shouldn't be that big of an issue because if you do get hit, you have a +2d4 to your CON save to maintain bless.

My conclusion would be that I agree: a Peace Cleric dip is probably better on ATs than most other classes, and definitely ATs than other rogues.

Yeah this is kind of where I landed - I think the SCAG cantrips are kinda broken and really the only thing that was keeping them off the rogue was the thought that you might need your second attack to process sneak. Well, this character finds a way to regularly get advantage through pack tactics/familiar and then adds +2d4 on top of that to attack.

The only other mechanic I can think of that might benefit more from this is a fighter with XE/SS and 4 attacks - but what I like about the rogue is that he is an absolute skill monkey and the face of the party which makes him useful out of combat, which the fighter is not.

[quindraco]

I'm playing this build right now. The nerfed spell slot progression is annoying, but so far it's been pretty fun.

[Nefariis]

I'm playing this build right now. The nerfed spell slot progression is annoying, but so far it's been pretty fun.

What race/level are you? and do you find that you can setup both bless and bond before combat?

[quindraco]

What race/level are you? and do you find that you can setup both bless and bond before combat?

Eladrin, level 9 (so AT 8).

So far, no, because of the campaign - our combats have been too urgent for me to take two rounds before combat, so I've been throwing Emboldening Bond up beforehand (as its improved duration means I can screw up the timing with fewer repercussions) and then throwing up Bless on my first turn, like a traditional cleric. I like including my owl as a Bond target so a real Bond member can do a solo op (especially me, since I always Bond myself) and the owl can hustle over to make sure the Bond stays up. The bonus to the little guy's saves doesn't hurt, even though he definitely doesn't get Bless from me.

[RogueJK]

I like including my owl as a Bond target so a real Bond member can do a solo op (especially me, since I always Bond myself) and the owl can hustle over to make sure the Bond stays up.

That's actually a really good idea. Free auto-Guidance for 10 minutes while your Familiar rides on their shoulder or in their pocket, or circles 30' above. Useful not only for stuff like Stealth checks while solo scouting, but also for situations like the party Face heading into a solo social situation and getting +1d4 to their Persuasion/Deception/Insight checks while talking to that magistrate behind closed doors.

[Man_Over_Game]

I've seen many posts on here recommending that rogues not use SCAG cantrips in fear that you might miss out on sneak attack (extra off-hand attacks)

Whoever said that probably didn't know what they were talking about. Having two weapons means you don't get your Cunning Action, so no Disengage. SCAG cantrips are how you maintain that same level of damage without compromise.

[Nefariis]

Here is an interesting find, Emboldening Bond specifically says -

While any bonded creature is within 30 feet of another, the creature can roll a d4 and add the number rolled to an attack roll, an ability check, or a saving throw it makes. Each creature can add the d4 no more than once per turn.

but it does not specifically say you have to choose to add it before you make/see the attack roll - only that you can roll a d4 on your turn <pause> and add it to another roll if you wish.

Sage Advice (Dan Dillon) has already clarified it as such

This make's the ability much much much more powerful.

Think of the instance with a CE/SS scenario with multiple attacks - you can see the attack roll, and if you miss, then add the +d4 to your attack.

This is essentially a free/once per round, (slightly weaker) precision attack - but you get it as a first level ability, for 10 minutes.

[quindraco]

That's actually a really good idea. Free auto-Guidance for 10 minutes while your Familiar rides on their shoulder or in their pocket, or circles 30' above. Useful not only for stuff like Stealth checks while solo scouting, but also for situations like the party Face heading into a solo social situation and getting +1d4 to their Persuasion/Deception/Insight checks while talking to that magistrate behind closed doors.

I also know Guidance, so if the party face is having a chat like that and the Bond is up, it's +2d4, since I'll sit somewhere within 120 feet and spam Guidance.

[Nefariis]

I also know Guidance, so if the party face is having a chat like that and the Bond is up, it's +2d4, since I'll sit somewhere within 120 feet and spam Guidance.

This character seems like it would be sooo fun to play both in and out of combat - IMO up there as one of the better solo builds in the game.

Is there anything that you don't like about him/in what situations is he the weakest (besides spell progression)?

[x3n0n]

I also know Guidance, so if the party face is having a chat like that and the Bond is up, it's +2d4, since I'll sit somewhere within 120 feet and spam Guidance.

For anyone else who missed it (I did at first), the familiar allows delivery of spells with range Touch.

[quindraco]

This character seems like it would be sooo fun to play both in and out of combat - IMO up there as one of the better solo builds in the game.

Is there anything that you don't like about him/in what situations is he the weakest (besides spell progression)?

Well, right now he's doubly weak - his spell slot progression and sneak attack damage are both down from his cleric level causing him to be at AT8, not AT 9. But at AT9 all of his benefits are purely numerical - he'll gain... 1 spell slot, I think? And 1 sneak attack die. And then, the moment I'm dreading, which answers your question nicely:

Literally the only spell he has which causes a save is Light (for having the owl drop Light rocks wherever the party needs it). I have absolutely no use for the L9 AT ability of disadvantage on target saves while I'm unobserved, as I leaned hard into wizard illusions and cleric buffs. I'm trying to come up with a good homebrew to pitch to my GM to replace it, but I haven't thought of anything fun for me but also balanced yet.

As to how he's weakest right now, I have the struggles you'd expect from being an AT: the rulebook has no rules for stealthy casting, so it's usually pure nightmare fuel getting my mage hand to pick pockets. It's also pretty painful when the owl eats it, but my GM buffed the owl so instead of disappearing at 0 hp, the little guy gets death saves, which means I can Healing Word him back up.

My GM has showered me with mobility magic items - I have a Broom of Flying and a Carpet of Flying, and of course, I have a bunch of Misty Steps for teleporting to a spot my owl or I can see within 30 feet of me (using owl vision costs an action, naturally, on top of the bonus action). I have no idea if I'd feel much weaker if I didn't have such incredible mobility. Right now I literally carry my entire party. :-P