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  1. - Top - End - #151
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    AssassinGuy

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    Default Re: Does This Mutation Make Me Look Fat? Let's Play Starcraft 2: Heart of the Swarm

    Personally i have never found a good reason to use aberrations in the campaign. Zerg simply doesnt need a frontline tank.
    “Evil is evil. Lesser, greater, middling, it's all the same. Proportions are negotiated, boundaries blurred. I'm not a pious hermit, I haven't done only good in my life. But if I'm to choose between one evil and another, then I prefer not to choose at all.”

  2. - Top - End - #152
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    Default Re: Does This Mutation Make Me Look Fat? Let's Play Starcraft 2: Heart of the Swarm

    They're not bad units, but I think there's a reason they got left out of the primary Zerg roster (by which I mean the standard stuff available in multiplayer), and that reason is that they're kind of extraneous.

    Also, I vote for Hunters. My experience with the splitter strain (via co-op with Zagara) is that it doesn't actually add much, whereas getting banelings to their targets faster is huge. It's also less micromanagement, since you don't have to worry about zerglings and other units getting in their way if you issue orders to a mixed group.
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    Default Re: Does This Mutation Make Me Look Fat? Let's Play Starcraft 2: Heart of the Swarm

    Eh it's not that much micromanagement to select all the banelings in a mixed group and roll them to the front of the army I'd say. I do it all the time as Zagara/Stetmann in co-op.
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  4. - Top - End - #154
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    Default Re: Does This Mutation Make Me Look Fat? Let's Play Starcraft 2: Heart of the Swarm

    Quote Originally Posted by The_Snark View Post
    Also, I vote for Hunters. My experience with the splitter strain (via co-op with Zagara) is that it doesn't actually add much, whereas getting banelings to their targets faster is huge
    While hunters and splitters are both valid (I personally really dislike Hunter Banes because I think their "leap" is the most unwieldy variation of the baneling, especially compared to some other powered up iterations of the concept like Stetmann's Mecha Banelings in co-op), Zagara is absolutely miserable to powerlevel on Brutal before she gets the many upgrades that make her resources more efficient. Splitter strain is pretty much free banelings.
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  5. - Top - End - #155
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    Default Re: Does This Mutation Make Me Look Fat? Let's Play Starcraft 2: Heart of the Swarm

    Quote Originally Posted by Winthur View Post
    ... Zagara is absolutely miserable to powerlevel on Brutal before she gets the many upgrades that make her resources more efficient. Splitter strain is pretty much free banelings.
    Having fully leveled Zagara's prestiges, I agree with you there, but the splitter upgrade is pretty low-key compared to the rest of her baneling upgrades. The mini-banelings do much less damage in a tiny radius.
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  6. - Top - End - #156
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    Default Re: Does This Mutation Make Me Look Fat? Let's Play Starcraft 2: Heart of the Swarm

    Quote Originally Posted by The_Snark View Post
    Having fully leveled Zagara's prestiges, I agree with you there, but the splitter upgrade is pretty low-key compared to the rest of her baneling upgrades. The mini-banelings do much less damage in a tiny radius.
    Obnoxiously, mini banes also take up supply that could be used for full sized banelings.
    “Evil is evil. Lesser, greater, middling, it's all the same. Proportions are negotiated, boundaries blurred. I'm not a pious hermit, I haven't done only good in my life. But if I'm to choose between one evil and another, then I prefer not to choose at all.”

  7. - Top - End - #157
    Eldritch Horror in the Playground Moderator
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    Default Re: Does This Mutation Make Me Look Fat? Let's Play Starcraft 2: Heart of the Swarm

    So, because this weekend is 50% longer than normal, you guys get 50% more bonus updates!

    The Baneling morph was tied at 2-2 explicit votes, so I flipped a coin.

    Spoiler: Update 8.5: In Which Banelings Become Evolved
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    February 5, 2506:

    Kerrigan had disappeared after the Dominion ships did, back to brood somewhere on the Leviathan. Since the surface was secure, I was able to fly the shuttle down to what was left of the base and go scrounging in the less-demolished buildings. The main barracks yielded a few pairs of women's fatigues in a size reasonably close to mine, and I raided their lockers for some other essential supplies. Hopefully they were on those surviving transports and wouldn't mind sharing. The canteen had been trashed by a pack of Roaches eating up all the exposed food, but they hadn't gotten into the vending machines aside from breaking the fronts open. Score one for me!

    I was all set to sit down and pig out on snack cakes and candy – my first real food in a month, can you believe it's been that long? Out of nowhere, it seemed like every Zerg in earshot screeched in unison. The handful of Mutalisks in the sky took off skyward, and Overlords were swooping down to collect smaller creatures everywhere.

    We are leaving this world, Little One. Return to your transport, and hurry.

    Fortune Cookie's warning caught me already halfway to the ship, arms full of munchies, and I double-timed it the rest of the way. Who knew what had Kerrigan in such a rush, or why the entire Swarm had flipped out like that, but I figure she'd tell me if I needed to know. In the meantime, I had a feast to continue...so of course, one of Abathur's stupid changelings shows up and asks me to visit the evolution pit.



    “What do you want this time, Abathur? I'm too chocolate-deprived for interruptions right now, let alone to participate in your stupid experiments.”



    “Noracolby input requested on Baneling strain improvements. Unique perspective has value. No participation necessary, only use of parasitic link reversal.”



    “How did you know about that?”



    “Did not know. Suspected outside presence intruding upon Swarm collective consciousness. Now confirmed. Observe testing on remote worlds. Analyze results. Offer suggestions.”



    “Fine, but you have to do something for me. I figure you must have created those ration bars I've been eating since I came onboard, because they taste like boots and butt. Take a few of these candy bars and figure out how to replicate the flavors in my food.”



    “Terran physiology primitive. Biomass bars calibrated to perfectly deliver all required nutrients. Taste irrelevant. Will examine new biomass samples, incorporate chemical sequences. Simple task.”

    With a bit of help from Fortune Cookie, I figure out which of the million windows to be peeking through, over some boring rock called Nelyth. There were Protoss here.





    The local “mitoscarabs” had developed an ability to...divide, I guess. They had multiple brains and redundant organs, so if you killed one the chunks would split up and turn into miniature mitoscarabs. Abathur wanted that.









    A nearby Prime mitoscarab was the easiest source of essence, so Abathur dropped a pack of Banelings in and ran them into it one by one until it and the miniature babies it made were puddles of goo.



    The new strain didn't look any different to me, but Abathur seemed pleased.





    A Protoss giant robot wandering around nearby got to be his testing dummy. Its lasers melted most of the banelings, but then the little mini-banelings...Baby-lings? Popped out and ran the rest of the way. It took most of the pack to destroy the thing, though.





    A fresh load of banelings blasted their way through a guard post. He just threw the entire pack in at once this time instead of micro-managing them, and a cluster of babylings were the only thing left standing.





    More banelings, more babylings, more dead Protoss.

    Next, we went looking in on a lava world called Scoria. Abathur had just abandoned a couple thousand banelings here and was checking back on the results to see what extreme conditions had created.





    Most of the banelings were trapped in the low ground, and melting whenever a lava surge happened.



    Some had grown powerful back legs though, and learned how to jump up cliffs to escape the deadly lava. These were what Abathur had hoped to find, and now he needed to collect the scattered broods.







    Lava flowed really quickly here, which made the new strain – I decided to call them Bouncelings – hide on the clifftops until it was safe.





    The Dominion had set up a mining camp here, and had the misfortune of running one of their patrols right into Abathur's marauding pack of bouncelings.



    The camp itself was heavily fortified along the main entrance. No attack force was getting through that.



    So instead, Abathur ran his pack along the cliffs until they were overlooking the camp from the rear, entirely undefended.





    One tidal wave of walking purple landmines later, the camp was in ruins.



    “Both are good at getting banelings into attack range, but the baby-lings arent nearly as powerful as the big ones. It took a lot of those to kill a single robot. The bouncelings can jump at stuff and explode before they get shot. Plus, wouldn't it be easier for you since the Zerglings already have that jumping ability?



    “Raptor strain sequences will make hunter strain modifications more stable. Less work needed to produce functional upgrade. Efficient. Appreciation expressed for contributions. Will devise modified ration bars soon.”


    Spoiler: Update 9: In Which Zerus Is Not A Primal Number
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    February 19, 2506:

    After what felt like the longest warp trip I'd ever taken, we came out in orbit of a strange, vibrantly green jungle world. The whole planet just felt really...alive...in a way I can't describe.



    “Hey Fortune Cookie, where are we? It seemed like we left in a tearing hurry and I don't know why.”



    This...is Zerus. Ancient homeworld of the Zerg, where We first became Us. We never expected to see it again, never bursting with life as it does. We are here because the Kerrigan willed it. She was attacked, but not harmed.”

    I was extremely confused. Wasn't Char the Zerg homeworld? Based on how long it had taken to get here, we had to be like a zillion light years away from Korhal or any other human planet. I wanted to ask more questions; even the Dominion's best scientists had never actually known where the Zerg came from in the first place. But Kerrigan broke in first, doing her telepathy thing across the entire Leviathan at once.



    Welcome to Zerus, everyone. There is an ancient primal Zerg here, and we're going to wake it up by feeding it. Fall in on the surface and set up a hive cluster.





    It wasn't hard to spot the creature she was talking about, because it was huge. Just its head looked big enough to swallow a siege tank or Ultralisk whole, and by the looks of it the rest was buried underground.



    Some sort of giant wild porcupine-pig was just chilling out nearby, and with a squeal it become dinner. But the giant buried Zerg didn't even stir after swallowing the meat. Clearly, it was going to take a lot of food to wake it up out of hibernation.







    Kerrigan didn't waste any time, leading a pack of Zerglings out to attack another quillboar and butcher it. A drone immediately headed in to carve up the carcass into movable chunks, but it seemed like we'd already drawn attention from the locals.



    “I am Brakk, slayer of Grazz, slayer of Noktor, slayer of Dalgon. You are corrupt Zerg and do not belong here!”



    “Fine. I'll play your little game, primal Zerg. I am Kerrigan, slayer of Fenix, slayer of DuGalle, slayer of Warfield. I act as I wish and nothing you can do will stop me.”

    “I do not know these primals that you speak of, but I shall slay you and take your essence, then purge your poison from this world.”



    With the ritual insults exchanged, I guess, Kerrigan went back to gathering quillboar meat. This one was camped out near a mineral deposit, so I figured she was planning on expanding the hive as well.



    Some flying primals, I guess troops of this Brakk jerk, came in to try and stop her this time, but they weren't prepared for anything as tough as her.



    Back at base, a flock of mutalisks was growing, all clumped together in a big ugly ball of wings and acid spit. Kerrigan wasn't even bothering to spawn anything else, so it seemed like she was planning a mobile attack this time around.



    A smart move, as it turned out. Brakk's forces had learned they couldn't attack her hive directly, so they tried doing an end run and destroying the quillboar meat before she could harvest it. Luckily, those mutalisks could fly pretty fast and wouldn't get lost in the jungle below, easily getting there in time to stop the primal raid.



    Just to prevent it from happening again, Kerrigan had the muta-ball camp out on top of the next quillboar body until the drones could dismantle it.



    An odd bubbling pool full of green slime sent Abathur absolutely bananas, insisting Kerrigan gather the primal essence inside it.



    Meanwhile, Kerrigan was spreading creep everywhere she could, as fast as possible. The primal zerg ignored it entirely, so they must not have realized it was spreading her field of vision and warning her when they tried to launch an attack.



    Pushing the perimeter out meant going on the attack again. The small clusters of primal zerg lurking around the area didn't stand a chance against the steadily growing mutalisk ball, and every group that died meant the creep could grow out a bit further.



    They also found and killed something that was apparently a primal hive, or close enough to one. Regular zerg hives couldn't shoot back when you attacked them, but that wasn't enough to save it.



    A strange creature appeared at one point, some sort of primal that was content to just sit and watch the fun. Kerrigan sent the mutaball its way just in case, but it ran away before anything could get close.





    With most of the local quillboar turned into delicious zerg kabobs, Kerrigan turned her attention to scooping up more of that primal essence from the slime pools.





    Brakk's forces tried to split up and eat two quillboar corpses at once next. They must have been getting desperate, but Kerrigan had more mutalisks than Brakk had primals and could split her troops as well.





    Finally, the last hunk of meat was thrown steaming into the sleeping ancient's gaping maw – and for the first time, it moved. The earth trembled under the hive cluster, and I thought I saw its eyes blink slowly.



    “Enough of this! I challenge you, corrupted Zerg Kerrigan. Pack leader to pack leader, no more tricks and feeble minions.”



    Brakk had taken the field in person, and he was gigantic. Like, Brutalisk-sized. The bodyguard of primals following him were tiny in comparison.



    Kerrigan obliged, throwing her mutaball at him. That was a pretty costly attack, as it happened, when Brakk showed he could spit explosive acid bombs. The poor dumb mutalisks that had mauled their way through everything else in the jungle died in droves.



    It softened him up enough that Kerrigan and her banelings could get the kill though. And sure enough, the ground-shaking laughter that followed could only be coming from one place.



    The giant primal zerg pulled itself partway out of the ground, every bit as big as it had looked originally. Kerrigan traded some barbed comments and bragging with it – something about being children of Amon, a fallen Xel'Naga, and how Kerrigan meant to claim the power of Zerus. It said she needed to become pure and primal to absorb that power, and she was willing to do anything to get what she wanted. She was scary enough as a human, what would she be afterwards?



    Voting:

    We get a Mutalisk mutation now:
    1) Vicious Glaive: Mutalisk attacks now bounce six times instead of three, doing more damage on the bounce.
    2) Rapid Regeneration: Mutalisks heal at 10 HP/second after leaving combat.
    3) Sundering Glaive: Mutalisks deal 100% bonus damage versus Armored enemies, but no longer bounce to additional targets.

  8. - Top - End - #158
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    SamuraiGuy

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    Default Re: Does This Mutation Make Me Look Fat? Let's Play Starcraft 2: Heart of the Swarm

    Quote Originally Posted by The Glyphstone View Post
    Voting:

    We get a Mutalisk mutation now:
    1) Vicious Glaive: Mutalisk attacks now bounce six times instead of three, doing more damage on the bounce.
    2) Rapid Regeneration: Mutalisks heal at 10 HP/second after leaving combat.
    3) Sundering Glaive: Mutalisks deal 100% bonus damage versus Armored enemies, but no longer bounce to additional targets.
    1) Vicious Glaive: Mutalisk attacks now bounce six times instead of three, doing more damage on the bounce.

    This is the best of these, I think. The health only is useful if you are not always attacking with your mutalisks (which should be rarely happening) and getting bonus against Armored enemies but no bounce just means your mutalisks just damage one target at a time. That is not very helpful sounding.
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    Default Re: Does This Mutation Make Me Look Fat? Let's Play Starcraft 2: Heart of the Swarm

    I'm going to vote for the 6-bounce upgrade as well.
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    Eldritch Horror in the Playground Moderator
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    Default Re: Does This Mutation Make Me Look Fat? Let's Play Starcraft 2: Heart of the Swarm

    If it helps anyone, I found this page where it breaks down the math behind Vicious Glaive.

    https://gaming.stackexchange.com/que...-glave-upgrade

    A regular glaive hits for 9, bounce 5, bounce 3 in campaign. A vicious glaive hits for 9/5/3/3/1/1.

  11. - Top - End - #161
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    Default Re: Does This Mutation Make Me Look Fat? Let's Play Starcraft 2: Heart of the Swarm

    Extra bounces for sure. Im not a huge muta user in general, but I love them for their multi attack, so more multi attack is always good. Especially since they dont weaken the earlier hits any.

    As for the baneling thing, meh, I guess thats a reasonable bit of logic for the choice. I still say the fact that they divide when killed may reduce their damage per baneling but ensures more banelings reach the target is worth it, but jumpers can do that as well with a bit more effort in guiding them so its a bit of a wash.
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    Default Re: Does This Mutation Make Me Look Fat? Let's Play Starcraft 2: Heart of the Swarm

    Given that intro I thought for sure she was going to have to feed her own army to it to wake it up.

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    Default Re: Does This Mutation Make Me Look Fat? Let's Play Starcraft 2: Heart of the Swarm

    Adding my vote for the 6 bounce upgrade, but the regeneration upgrade is a close contender. Stupid regen mutalisks will basically never die to anything short of a group of Thors.

    Also, betting 10 minerals on the update title 2 updates from now being

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    In which sudden yet inevitable betrayals are cursed
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    Default Re: Does This Mutation Make Me Look Fat? Let's Play Starcraft 2: Heart of the Swarm

    I'm going against the grain here and vote for Sundering Glaives It makes mutalisks much better at sniping high priority targets (Siege Tanks, Battle Cruisers, Immortals, Colossi) and buildings. I always felt like this was more important for the missions after Zerus than additional area damage.
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    Default Re: Does This Mutation Make Me Look Fat? Let's Play Starcraft 2: Heart of the Swarm

    Eh, Kerrigan herself is your sniper imo. I vote bounce - more dps overall, and you get a lot more bang for your buck microing her than mutas.
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    Default Re: Does This Mutation Make Me Look Fat? Let's Play Starcraft 2: Heart of the Swarm

    I'm going to vote Sundering Glaives here as well. Zerg doesn't need the extra AoE the majority of the time, and mutalisks can snipe things that Kerrigan can't get access to. Realistically this gives mutas a niche that you actually didn't have access to before.
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    Default Re: Does This Mutation Make Me Look Fat? Let's Play Starcraft 2: Heart of the Swarm

    Spoiler: Update 10: In Which Chekov Fires, Then Reloads
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    February 22, 2506:

    Things were quiet for a few days afterwards. The surviving primals from Brakk's pack had slunk off into the bushes, and Kerrigan was spending lots of time talking with that titanic primal we had woken up. Its name sounded something like Zerg-man, so that's what I started calling him in my head. Abathur threw a fit when he discovered a entirely new breed of primal Zerg spreading across the planet with features from a Hydralisk, then hid inside his evolution pits. He'd come through on his end of the deal first, so I had food that actually tasted good again even if the textures didn't feel right for the flavor.

    Eventually, Kerrigan came back up, long enough to tell Zagara she would be in temporary command of the Swarm. If there had been another planning session, I'd been left out of it, but this seemed important enough to pay attention to.



    She headed down to the planet again, along with a pack of bizarre new creatures that looked like walking four-legged mushrooms. Abathur's latest creation, it seemed, that he'd built with primal zerg genes in retaliation for them copying the Hydralisk.



    What they did wasn't clear until a pack of primals decided to get in Kerrigan's way. The “Swarm Hosts” dug themselves into the ground, then started flinging little acid-splitting bugs out of their backs that mobbed the primals.



    With the primals dead, she kept going until coming to a...pool. It was huge, shallow, and green, bubbling slightly and pulsing with so much power even my dumb brain could feel it. It almost felt alive in a weird way.



    “This is it, then. The First Spawning Pool. Where the Zerg began, developing the power to consume essence from each other. Where I need to go if I'm going to become strong enough to defeat Mengsk.”



    “Correct. The power of Zerus against your hate. One will survive. Consume the other's essence. That is the way of the true Zerg. Lose yourself. Evolve. Transform. Transcend. Or die.”



    “We'll see. Zagara, defend my crysalis until it is finished, one way or the other.”





    With that, she was gone, sealed away inside the armored cocoon. She'd always had a corner of her attention on me since finding out I could spy on the Zerg through my parasite, and the sudden absence felt odd. But the die was cast. She'd either be eaten by Zerus, or steal its power and become the most powerful person in the galaxy. And if I wasn't down there when she came out, something unspeakably terrible was going to happen.

    Wait, what? I couldn't explain the feeling – like deja vu, but in reverse. Somehow, I just knew that Kerrigan coming out of that chrysalis alone would be bad. So I crossed my fingers and flew the shuttle down to where Zagara had set up a cluster around the pool, hoping none of the spore crawlers had an itchy trigger...mouth?



    Zagara was already showing her difference in tactical habits compared to Kerrigan. One of the first things she started growing was a second Hatchery, simply to increase the rate that she could spawn more larva. Definitely an old-school Swarm attitude, burying the enemy in bodies.





    Kerrigan stepping into that pool looked to have stirred the primals into a frenzy. It seemed like every last one of Brakk's pack had come back looking for revenge. The first wave got thrown back easily enough, but these were still Zerg – it would only get worse.



    Sure enough, an entirely new pack showed up, drawn by the power of the pool. But instead of going straight for us, they started laying into the remnants of Brakk's forces. I guess predators are universal across the galaxy, they go for weakened prey first.



    Not that they didn't have the numbers to take a swing at Zagara's defenses anyways. Luckily, they took enough time to build up that Zagara simple moved her swarm hosts over to cover the gap, fairing as badly as Brakk's minions had.



    It seemed like everyone was ignoring me, so I took a walk down to the other side of the pool. There was a big pile of rocks that had falled off a cliffside, sealing away the passage there, but they looked kind of fragile. I knew Zerg could dig through almost anything, would Primal Zerg be the same way?



    “Zagara? Zagara? Hey, ZAGARA!”

    She either couldn't hear me, or was ignoring me. Turns out throwing a rock at a broodmother is an excellent way to both get their attention and piss them off.



    “Explain yourself quickly, Terran pet, or I will kill you now and risk the wrath of my queen later!”

    “Pile of rocks! South side! Primals could burrow through and attack her!”

    In case you were wondering, Zerg broodmothers have terrible breath. Literally the worst. But she paused, apparently thinking it over.

    “Vision...this must be vision. Perhaps you are not as useless as I believed, terran.”

    Happily not dead, I returned to watching the battle unfolding around us.





    Both packs were launching independent attacks against us, pushing our defenses from both sides at once.



    At first I was worried that they might break through, but then the primal spawning pool spewed out a huge cloud of flying, acid-spewing bugs like the ones from swarm hosts. They devoured the attacking primals like...well, like a swarm of locusts, really.



    “Very large primal zerg organism detected. Harvest essence. Will improve Swarm. Strengthen queen.”



    I didn't think it looked so tough myself, and either Zagara agreed or she just wanted Abathur to stop pestering her.



    A flock of mutalisks made short work of the critter either way. They flew right over where the main fight between the two packs was raging and tore it apart.



    Meanwhile, stuff was definitely happening in that pool. The cocoon had shed its shell and looked very sac-like now, twitching and pulsing.





    And sure enough, the primals started chewing their way through that collapsed rockfall, right where they would have had an undefended entrance into the pool's area. Except Zagara had listened to me and built up a huge mess of spine crawlers just in case. I'd helped save Kerrigan, but that weird feeling of impending doom wouldn't go away.







    They didn't let up, though. The last of Brakk's pack became lunch for Yggdra's pack, and now all of them were free to mob us from every entrance at once. Spine crawlers were thrashing, and the mutalisk flock was wearing itself to exhaustion flying from one side to the next.



    In the pond, though, the chrysalis was practically bulging now. It was glowing too, bright light leaking through from the inside. As another wave of locusts erupted, and Zagara began to order her drones off the mineral line to form a last-ditch wall of bodies around the chrysalis...it hatched. It felt like I was in the middle of a tornado, only with psychic power shoving me around instead of winds, and I swear I saw a Zergling go flying through the air. Blinding light flashed, and the entire battle just...stopped as she stepped out.

    A human had gone into that cocoon, and what came out was different. She'd sprouted bony wing-looking spikes from her back, and her skin was a dark veiny purple like raw muscle. The ghost suit she'd been wearing ever since we left Umoja was gone, but she had body plates of armor on her body that sorta resembled a swimsuit if you didn't look too closely. Glowing purple eyes and spidery glowing lines on her face like tattoos. But it took me a moment to realize what was missing – the pain that had been chewing her up since Raynor died. Now she just looked...sad.

    Every Zerg, primal or normal, had fallen to its knees or belly or whatever when she had emerged. Zagara was already scuttling towards us, ready to greet her and return command, but she looked at me instead.



    “It's done, Nora. I'm Zerg again, and Jim died for nothing. A monster, remade to hunt a monster.”

    I didn't know what to say...then a memory jumped into my head, from way back on Kaldir.

    “Know what we learned, that must be remembered – you can become something new, without losing sight of who you are.”

    “That'd be great to put in a fortune cookie, but I'm not sure how it helps me?”

    “Then perhaps it is not you who needs to remember it. “


    It all fell together and I knew what to do, even as General Warfield's ruined body flashed in my eyes again.



    “Do you still miss him?”

    Instead of psychic-crunchy-blasting me into a gooey pulp, Kerrigan closed her eyes. Zagara loomed behind me, but a minute that felt like hours passed before she whispered back. “Yes.”

    “Then you're still human enough to matter. Only a monster forgets how to love.”

    Sarah's eyes opened again and she smiled for the first time in months.



    Voting Time!

    Only one thing to pick now, but after Supreme we're going to have a giant pile of things to pick from. For now, though, we've got a Swarm Host mutation to choose – assuming I ever use them again, they're kind unwieldy, defensively awkward, and way inferior to Brood Lords as an offensive siege unit.

    1) Burrowing: Swarm hosts can now burrow instead of root, launching locusts while buried and hidden.
    2) Rapid Incubation: Locusts spawn 20% faster.
    3) Pressurized Glands: Locusts can attack both ground and air targets.

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    Default Re: Does This Mutation Make Me Look Fat? Let's Play Starcraft 2: Heart of the Swarm

    Im always torn on this, Only being able to be attacked by stealth popping units is nice, faster spawn timer is great to avoid that gap where they are defenseless before the next wave pops, but you can stagger them in ranks so they dont all launch at once to cover for that. And attacking ground and air is a REALLY nice option. All things being equal, im going attack air and ground, as I said, if you really want to use them, swarm hosts can be placed strategically so they produce in waves instead of all at once, which stops the vulnerability from between waves being serious. But being helpless against air units sucks. Being able to burrow is less useful overall as if you intend to siege a base, they probably have missile turrets anyways so you wont be invisible.
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    Default Re: Does This Mutation Make Me Look Fat? Let's Play Starcraft 2: Heart of the Swarm

    Quote Originally Posted by The Glyphstone View Post
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    “Do you still miss him?”

    Instead of psychic-crunchy-blasting me into a gooey pulp, Kerrigan closed her eyes. Zagara loomed behind me, but a minute that felt like hours passed before she whispered back. “Yes.”

    “Then you're still human enough to matter. Only a monster forgets how to love.”

    Sarah's eyes opened again and she smiled for the first time in months.

    D’awww.

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    Default Re: Does This Mutation Make Me Look Fat? Let's Play Starcraft 2: Heart of the Swarm

    I'm voting burrow because it's their iconic thing. Swarm Hosts are otherwise useless, and all the big campaign players I play with can't make them good.
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    Default Re: Does This Mutation Make Me Look Fat? Let's Play Starcraft 2: Heart of the Swarm

    Quote Originally Posted by Keltest View Post
    I'm voting burrow because it's their iconic thing. Swarm Hosts are otherwise useless, and all the big campaign players I play with can't make them good.
    I believe ive seen them used in some cheese builds, primarily nydus cheese, but yeah, I cant recall ever seeing them used by the big names as anything other than a "nobody would think im crazy enough to do this so it might actually work!" best of 3/5 series type games.
    "Interdum feror cupidine partium magnarum Europae vincendarum"
    Translation: "Sometimes I get this urge to conquer large parts of Europe."

    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd-o-rama View Post
    Traab is yelling everything that I'm thinking already.
    "If you don't get those cameras out of my face, I'm gonna go 8.6 on the Richter scale with gastric emissions that'll clear this room."

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    Eldritch Horror in the Playground Moderator
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    Default Re: Does This Mutation Make Me Look Fat? Let's Play Starcraft 2: Heart of the Swarm

    You guys might decide to be mean to me and take Vipers over Brood Lords later, so I'll have to fall back on Hosts for sieges.

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    Default Re: Does This Mutation Make Me Look Fat? Let's Play Starcraft 2: Heart of the Swarm

    Swarm Hosts used to be quite good as a style in ~late heart of the swarm. It was just super unpopular because you had to purposely play a ~45 minute game to win with them because the style was to just split the map in half and drain the opponent out of resources with spells and free units.
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    Default Re: Does This Mutation Make Me Look Fat? Let's Play Starcraft 2: Heart of the Swarm

    God imagine how powerful and dangerous they could be if the campaign upgrade deep dive or whatever its called was in the pvp? Basically, able to tunnel to wherever there is creep and hop skip and jump all over the map, sniping targets then fleeing before they can be pinned down? Sneak attacking with a swarm of locusts from odd angles then running before the counter attack can reach them. Who needs nydus worms?
    "Interdum feror cupidine partium magnarum Europae vincendarum"
    Translation: "Sometimes I get this urge to conquer large parts of Europe."

    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd-o-rama View Post
    Traab is yelling everything that I'm thinking already.
    "If you don't get those cameras out of my face, I'm gonna go 8.6 on the Richter scale with gastric emissions that'll clear this room."

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    Default Re: Does This Mutation Make Me Look Fat? Let's Play Starcraft 2: Heart of the Swarm

    The zerg pool with it's inward-curving 'teeth' reminds me of nothing so much as a Dune Trapper.

    My vote for the Swarm Hosts mutation is the pressurized glands, allowing it to target air units.
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    Default Re: Does This Mutation Make Me Look Fat? Let's Play Starcraft 2: Heart of the Swarm

    Quote Originally Posted by Traab View Post
    I believe ive seen them used in some cheese builds, primarily nydus cheese, but yeah, I cant recall ever seeing them used by the big names as anything other than a "nobody would think im crazy enough to do this so it might actually work!" best of 3/5 series type games.
    During the peak of HOTS multi-player, the swarm host was the go to zerg unit. But the campaign version is totally different from any multi-player version.
    “Evil is evil. Lesser, greater, middling, it's all the same. Proportions are negotiated, boundaries blurred. I'm not a pious hermit, I haven't done only good in my life. But if I'm to choose between one evil and another, then I prefer not to choose at all.”

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    Default Re: Does This Mutation Make Me Look Fat? Let's Play Starcraft 2: Heart of the Swarm

    Quote Originally Posted by Keltest View Post
    I'm voting burrow because it's their iconic thing. Swarm Hosts are otherwise useless, and all the big campaign players I play with can't make them good.
    I don't know that I'd say useless. Yes, having units that can attack while stealthed are pretty nice for Zerg, but a wall of summoned bugs that can stymie ground and flying units is also pretty nice - in both cases, the swarm host itself is usually not in much danger if you have a critical mass of hosts positioned well.
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    Eldritch Horror in the Playground Moderator
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    Default Re: Does This Mutation Make Me Look Fat? Let's Play Starcraft 2: Heart of the Swarm

    Looking ahead at future missions, at least, it seems like we've finished most of the defensive/siege-line scenarios? Army comp from here on out is going to value speed in moving between objective points, except for the very last one.

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    Default Re: Does This Mutation Make Me Look Fat? Let's Play Starcraft 2: Heart of the Swarm

    I vote pressurised glands. Being able to shoot at flying enemies makes Swarm Hosts more generally useful and also keeps them from being sitting ducks if they get caught without an escort.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Glyphstone View Post
    You guys might decide to be mean to me and take Vipers over Brood Lords later, so I'll have to fall back on Hosts for sieges.
    I consider Vipers far more useful than Brood Lords, so guess what I'll be voting for...
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    Default Re: Does This Mutation Make Me Look Fat? Let's Play Starcraft 2: Heart of the Swarm

    Since we are talking about all the random iterations of the Swarm Host over the ages, they are quite strong for both Abathur (especially p2) and Dehaka in co-op.

    I think Vipers are quite crazy strong with their Cloud but the Brood Lord option is also fine if you like a siege-based approach.
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