Astral Grappling

[Man_Over_Game]

So I'm reading up on the Way of the Astral Self. It says that you can make Strength Checks (like grapples) using Wisdom as your modifier, but would you also allow grappling with Reach? I'm trying to decide if the RAW allows it (I don't think it does), and if DMs would allow it anyway (I would).

What do you think?

[quindraco]

RAW, it does not allow reach grapples, because it only grants reach on unarmed strikes, which grapples explicitly are not - this is nothing like the cluster**** that is the RAW on beast barbarians with claws out grappling. Note also that even if it did work, RAW, the grapple would end at the end of the monk's turn - the astral arms don't have reach off-turn (e.g. this is relevant for AoOs, base). If you did rule that it worked, the grapple would only exist during the monk's turn - potentially useful for a drag, but useless for a sustained grapple.

For your second question, RAF, you have to make a second ruling if you allow astral grapples, as there is no RAW on how many spectral arms you have, and a grapple occupies the hand in question, so you need to rule on how many targets the monk can now grapple simultaneously. Presumably, this will also impact how many objects their spectral hands can hold at once, since it makes no sense for them to be able to grapple animated objects but not pick up regular objects. I think the maximum number of grapple targets the monk could theoretically have from action economy is something like 8 (with 11 fighter levels and 3 gloom stalker levels).

I would not allow it, personally. It's not as bad as the ****y mechanics of Echo Knights grappling through their Echo, but it's still a massive headache. How the heck would I balance a ruling on how many vials of acid the monk could juggle at once?

[Man_Over_Game]

Makes me wonder what I'd do if someone asked how many arms they can reasonably "use".

Hmm...I think I'd just say it's your proficiency. That's the maximum number of "usable" arms you can have with the Astral Self. Seems reasonable.

[verbatim]

I think if you want to do a grapple monk you're probably best off going Open Hand (if you grapple someone and then knock them prone with Flurry of Blows they can't stand back up) and then multiclassing into either:
- Tasha's ranger for expertise in athletics at lvl 1 and then hunter's mark and a fighting style at level 2

- Barbarian for rage (advantage on Strength Checks), with the caveat that at this point you become very, very MAD (how appropriate).

[ImproperJustice]

I would.
It’s a cool niche / capability for Astral Monks.

It hardly breaks anything, and in my opinion meets the design space of the Astral Monk.