Twilight Clerics

[arnin77]

A professional Basketball Player dunking on an eight year old doesn't 'break Basketball' but it is a bit unseemly.🃏

Is it wrong that I want to see that on a poster?

https://i.imgflip.com/57muj9.jpg

[Aylowan]

For me, this just again raises the question what exactly is a cleric/god of twilight supposed to be? If it were Nighttime or Darkness or even the Moon I'd have some idea what to think on the matter, but as it stands it's just a great big question mark.

My take is that their theme was intended as "protectors against the scary things in the dark night" -- kinda like liminal dieties, protectors of cities or travelers, and similar. From the subclass description: "The darkness can also bring terrors, but the gods of twilight guard against the horrors of the night." To me, there's overlap with the theme of Oath of the Watchers paladins.

That's why they have heavy armor and martial weapons (though, on a cleric, I don't think those are all *that* powerful compared to default cleric armor/weapons.)
That's why they have the darkvision / initiative stuff. (Similar to the Watchers initiative boost.)
That's why they have spells like See Invisibility and Aura of Vitality.

That being said, having a coherent theme doesn't mean their Channel Divinity isn't overpowered. Obviously the class could have used more fine-tuning to be thematic without going too far.

[Thunderous Mojo]

I agree with every word in Ludic's Post, #60, of this thread.👍

We are using the term disrupt in different manners. By disrupt, I mean obviates the threat of a type of challenge or encounter.

So based off the above quote, would it be accurate to clarify that the word that best fits what you meant was the word "NEGATE" instead of "DISRUPT"?

My experience, has been that receiving just 10 THP, from round to round, from an Artillerist's Protector Canon is sufficient to boost the effectiveness of damage mitigating abilities.

A Fireball that has a damage roll of 40 points of damage can quickly be reduced to a glancing blow through the combination of THP, Absorb Elements, and making the saving throw for half damage.

A weapon attack that would do 30 points of damage is doing, substantially less once 20 points of harm are negated by Temporary Hit Points and the Interception Fighting Style.

The above are all examples of real events that happen in a Eberron campaign I play in where the Adventuring Party consists of a Psi Warrior, an Enchanter, an Artillerist, and a Storm Sorcerer.

When we successfully surprise our foes and have THP, we often take no damage from an encounter. An Artillerist might have to spend all of their 1st level spell slots to have the Protector Cannon up and running for encounters spread over a 5 hour time frame.

A Twilight Cleric just needs access to Short Rests to cover the same number of encounters with no expenditure of spell slots, and of course Twilight Sanctuary is more powerful than a Protector Cannon.

A regular supply of THP can easily disrupt the expected attrition rate of resources a party has to expend, compared to the resources expended by a PC Group that lacks regular access to THP.

Is it wrong that I want to see that on a poster?

From a perspective of Kantian Categorical Imperative Ethics....probably.....but it is a darn funny image...that I too would love to see on a poster. 🥸

[Willie the Duck]

So based off the above quote, would it be accurate to clarify that the word that best fits what you meant was the word "NEGATE" instead of "DISRUPT"?

Sure, if you prefer.

A regular supply of THP can easily disrupt the expected attrition rate of resources a party has to expend, compared to the resources expended by a PC Group that lacks regular access to THP.

Yes, Twilight Clerics wildly change the usage of HP depletion* as a significant limiter of how long a party can keep going. In a way, it is the 2.0 of the original-language Healing Spirit.
*or the mitigation of that depletion, barring that one front-liner who always gets hit for a lot (and mass healing/mitigating everyone for X doesn't change that they are hit for 2X every fight)

[Dork_Forge]

Twilight Clerics are a mess of features that are too much individually and OP altogether, especially since they break whatever conventions have come before.

The Channel Divinity

-The Temp HP calc is just insanely good, I don't understand what made them make it die+level, imo if they wanted it to do all of these things it should be just Wis mod.

-Removing Charmed and Frightened for free every round? That's crazy good against a lot of monsters

-Let's not forget that whilst the above are show stoppers, the CD is also facilitating later class features

Nerf the smurf out of the temp hp calculation, put a duration on the temp hp, and if the remove condition effect remains make it concentration. Even with all of those nerfs, it's still a good CD.

Eyes of Night

This is just nonesense, where on earth did they get 300ft from, who thought that would even be reasonable? And then allowing the Cleric to share this ridiculous distance with the party?!

Just give them Darkvision/Improve existing Darkvision a la Gloom Stalker and be done with it, if this even needs to be here at all (it doesn't)

Vigilant Blessing

Not sure why this is here, only one creature isn't bad, would rather see a duration or number of uses=Wis mod like other Clerics...

Heavy Armor and Martial Weapons

No, just no. It doesn't make thematic sense why, it just seemed like they threw the last buff on top they thought they could get away with

Steps of the Night

Also too much in my opinion and is just an odd choice

Twilight Shroud

It's like someone looked at the Artillerist's turret and thought, this... but we need to make it even more powerful.


On the topic of the CD being once per rest at early levels, that doesn't even really matter. It's going to trivialise HP depletion to the point where it will have a huge knock on effect on other encounters.

[Segev]

I agree overall with Dork_Forge, here, but I want to state that the reason for the heavy armor/martial weapons proficiency is almost certainly because EVERY domain gets either that, or bonus cantrips. So remove that, and we'd be saying the same thing about the bonus cantrips, most likely.

[PhantomSoul]

I agree overall with Dork_Forge, here, but I want to state that the reason for the heavy armor/martial weapons proficiency is almost certainly because EVERY domain gets either that, or bonus cantrips. So remove that, and we'd be saying the same thing about the bonus cantrips, most likely.

Not quite, Trickster and Knowledge get neither, and Life gets heavy armour but not martial weapons. (There may be more; I only checked the PHB Domains.)

That said, they apparently wanted this thing to be OP while in melee range, so of course they gave it martial weapons and heavy armour.

[LudicSavant]

Putting "martial weapon proficiency" or "heavy armor proficiency" on a Cleric has more psychological influence than actual influence.

They're not what makes a Twilight Cleric strong.

[Dork_Forge]

I agree overall with Dork_Forge, here, but I want to state that the reason for the heavy armor/martial weapons proficiency is almost certainly because EVERY domain gets either that, or bonus cantrips. So remove that, and we'd be saying the same thing about the bonus cantrips, most likely.

If that was the case I don't think it'd really be that contentious to get a cantrip, since it's use would be situational at best rather than a straight upgrade in armor and weapon options.

That said, this subclass already gets a lot at 1st level and there's already precedence for getting neither cantrips or HA/MW at 1st level (Like the Knowledge domain). You'd just cut out the profs and flip 8th level to potent casting, though the other features would still need to be addressed.

The fluff is what makes all of this more confusing, it doesn't really match the abilities at all. It's meant to be about providing comfort during rest and venturing into the dark to protect from threats, yet not one ability has jack to do with resting and granting an initiative bonus isn't venturing into the dark, it's preparing you for when things come out of it.

I'm not sure who wrote this domain but it makes no real sense mechanically or thematically.

[Segev]

If that was the case I don't think it'd really be that contentious to get a cantrip, since it's use would be situational at best rather than a straight upgrade in armor and weapon options.

That said, this subclass already gets a lot at 1st level and there's already precedence for getting neither cantrips or HA/MW at 1st level (Like the Knowledge domain). You'd just cut out the profs and flip 8th level to potent casting, though the other features would still need to be addressed.

The fluff is what makes all of this more confusing, it doesn't really match the abilities at all. It's meant to be about providing comfort during rest and venturing into the dark to protect from threats, yet not one ability has jack to do with resting and granting an initiative bonus isn't venturing into the dark, it's preparing you for when things come out of it.

I'm not sure who wrote this domain but it makes no real sense mechanically or thematically.

Agreed. I think it bears repeating: it seems like this was a bundle of "I want to have a bunch of powers that make fights easier," and then they decided that "Twilight" as as good a domain as any to try to justify a connection between them.

[RogueJK]

and it's not paying for it somewhere in the rest of its kit. All of its abilities are strong, including its spell list.

Yep. The fact that they get 3 of the best non-Cleric spells in the game (Faerie Fire, Greater Invisibility, and Circle of Power) is solid by itself.


Circle of Power in particular is really underappreciated, likely because it's only otherwise available to Paladins who are Level 17+, or Bards who happened to know to look for it with one of their Magical Secrets picks. So I'm guessing it doesn't get much love mostly because a lot of people have never seen it in play, or paid much attention to its spell description since it's just a Tier 4 Paladin spell. (I've only ever seen it used by Tier 3 Bards myself, in fact.)

A lot of people seem to go gaga over the Ancients Paladin aura at first read, thinking it gives nearby allies Magic Resistance, which it doesn't... Circle of Power, on the other hand, does exactly that. Plus grants Evasion.

And a Twilight Cleric gets it at 9th(!) level. Basically twice as early as the Paladins it was originally intended for.

[stoutstien]

Yep. The fact that they get 3 of the best non-Cleric spells in the game (Faerie Fire, Greater Invisibility, and Circle of Power) is solid by itself.


Circle of Power in particular is really underappreciated, likely because it's only otherwise available to Paladins who are Level 17+, or Bards who happened to know to look for it with one of their Magical Secrets picks. So I'm guessing it doesn't get much love mostly because a lot of people have never seen it in play, or paid much attention to its spell description since it's just a Tier 4 Paladin spell. (I've only ever seen it used by Tier 3 Bards myself, in fact.)

A lot of people seem to go gaga over the Ancients Paladin aura at first read, thinking it gives nearby allies Magic Resistance, which it doesn't... Circle of Power, on the other hand, does exactly that. Plus grants Evasion.

And a Twilight Cleric gets it at 9th(!) level. Basically twice as early as the Paladins it was originally intended for.

Aye. The twilight cleric looks like some of the homebrew material floating around. Not completely game shattering but it does have strong Mary Sue vibes with a side of unnecessary creep.
It's bad because it's too good in the same way shepherd druids can be.

[Segev]

Aye. The twilight cleric looks like some of the homebrew material floating around. Not completely game shattering but it does have strong Mary Sue vibes with a side of unnecessary creep.
It's bad because it's too good in the same way shepherd druids can be.

I think it's a little worse if only because it's so obviously potent. Shepherd druids... keep slipping under my radar, and require a somewhat specific play style to be as powerful as they can be. Twilight Cleric is just "open up the box and win" in design.

[stoutstien]

I think it's a little worse if only because it's so obviously potent. Shepherd druids... keep slipping under my radar, and require a somewhat specific play style to be as powerful as they can be. Twilight Cleric is just "open up the box and win" in design.

Eh. Clerics are turn key to begin with as far as full casters go. Does it make it a better caster because they have simple to apply combos compared to something like a mark of healing evoker or the summoning focused DS sorcerer?

I try to avoid making judgement on material based on sticker value. I want to see one in play in various pacing and game focus to see if needs a warning label. If anything I'm happy to see some clerics that have strong reasons to stay cleric. Easy to jump out after a certain point just because nothing really scales with more cleric.

[PhantomSoul]

Eh. Clerics are turn key to begin with as far as full casters go. Does it make it a better caster because they have simple to apply combos compared to something like a mark of healing evoker or the summoning focused DS sorcerer?

It makes it worse for what it tells us about the complete lack of care, effort or interest in quality control in the book... but at least it's easier to see it should probably just not be included in player options from the start!

[da newt]

In my last session we encountered a combat where the perfect storm of factors allowed Twilight Sanctuary to be ridiculously beneficial.

Party of lvl 3 PCs, cleric, barbarian, monk, wizard vs ~ 3 vine blights, 20 needle blights, and 5 twig blights in a building (5' passages, stairs, doors). My cleric Blessed the group as the hoards approached, and we retreated to a 2nd floor hallway to limit how many could approach at once, then once combat started, popped TS. Combat went 11 rounds, the monk went down once early (vine blight), but healing word + TS kept them up the rest of the fight, the barbarian face tanked like a boss. It was a slog, they just kept coming like a zombie movie, but we prevailed almost entirely due to the TS temp hp recharge. It was silly.

Against a mob of weak hitters, this ability really shines. Without it, I think we would have been TPKed by a hundred paper-cuts.

[Snowbluff]

Man, it feels good that there's a cleric that people can say are overpowered. Honestly, most of the PHB cleric are pretty bad for one reason or another, basically trapping new players with a "playstyle" option while not at all doing a good job supporting that one. Someone made a case for the trickster earlier, and I have to say the duplicate is awful and its good spell list doesn't work if you've the duplicate out, and if you wanted those spells you really should have played a bard or a wizard. Tempest tends to be my favorite out of those subclasses because it doesn't necessarily conflict with the normal kind of action and concentration economy the base cleric has.

Cleric also just has inherent problems are a list of spells that doesn't actually have a lot of broadly applicable spells. You have to collect a list of ones that are very situational, and lot of those spells are going to be concentration and therefore mutually exclusive with each other. Some days you just aren't going to have the foresight or information to know to have Deathward or Freedom of Movement applied to your party going into a fight. Channel Divinities tend to be the load instead of build defining, unlike some of the Paladin ones, and this meant to be equivalent to the potentially extra spell casts a day wizard or sorcerer get. Healing spells are just awful outside of a few choice ones for reasons I am sure everyone is very well aware off. Some people complain about Clerics often devolving into Bless, Spiritual Weapon, Spirit Guardians, Summon X bots, but these really tend to be the best option when all of your other spell prep plans just didn't line up.

So when I see Twilight Cleric, I see what is basically a life cleric that won't get laughed at at my table. That being said the die roll from the THP should be removed for being slow and as a slight nerf for lower levels. Comparing it to Healing Spirit 1.0 isn't really an apt comparison. First, it takes an action, and secondly, doesn't actually heal anyone. Healing spirit wouldn't compete with whacking or cantripping on your turn (which has varied usefulness), and you could use it to entirely remove the damage taken between fights by doing the famous merry go round after each fight for cheap. I'm not sure if THP can bring a creature back up from unconsciousness, like Healing Spirit can. On the other hand, Twilight Sanctuary is a short rest resource and reaches your team arm more easily, but I think your mileage may vary, as not every DM affords players short rests while others may give a glut of them.

[Segev]

Man, it feels good that there's a cleric that people can say are overpowered. Honestly, most of the PHB cleric are pretty bad for one reason or another, basically trapping new players with a "playstyle" option while not at all doing a good job supporting that one. Someone made a case for the trickster earlier, and I have to say the duplicate is awful and its good spell list doesn't work if you've the duplicate out, and if you wanted those spells you really should have played a bard or a wizard. Tempest tends to be my favorite out of those subclasses because it doesn't necessarily conflict with the normal kind of action and concentration economy the base cleric has.

Cleric also just has inherent problems are a list of spells that doesn't actually have a lot of broadly applicable spells. You have to collect a list of ones that are very situational, and lot of those spells are going to be concentration and therefore mutually exclusive with each other. Some days you just aren't going to have the foresight or information to know to have Deathward or Freedom of Movement applied to your party going into a fight. Channel Divinities tend to be the load instead of build defining, unlike some of the Paladin ones, and this meant to be equivalent to the potentially extra spell casts a day wizard or sorcerer get. Healing spells are just awful outside of a few choice ones for reasons I am sure everyone is very well aware off. Some people complain about Clerics often devolving into Bless, Spiritual Weapon, Spirit Guardians, Summon X bots, but these really tend to be the best option when all of your other spell prep plans just didn't line up.

So when I see Twilight Cleric, I see what is basically a life cleric that won't get laughed at at my table. That being said the die roll from the THP should be removed for being slow and as a slight nerf for lower levels. Comparing it to Healing Spirit 1.0 isn't really an apt comparison. First, it takes an action, and secondly, doesn't actually heal anyone. Healing spirit wouldn't compete with whacking or cantripping on your turn (which has varied usefulness), and you could use it to entirely remove the damage taken between fights by doing the famous merry go round after each fight for cheap. I'm not sure if THP can bring a creature back up from unconsciousness, like Healing Spirit can. On the other hand, Twilight Sanctuary is a short rest resource and reaches your team arm more easily, but I think your mileage may vary, as not every DM affords players short rests while others may give a glut of them.

You're the first person with demonstrated system experience and mastery that I've ever seen allege that the Cleric is underpowered. Most people with any system mastery experience seem to agree that the class as a whole is quite solid, possibly a bit overtuned. Yes, the spells you list (e.g. bless, spirit guardians) are often named as go-to choices, but that's because, as you note, they are really good.

The Twilight Cleric certainly won't get laughed away from a table, but the idea that ANY Domain would is odd to me. The Twilight Cleric sins on two fronts: it's just too many Quite Good abilities in a very front-loaded package, and its theme feels like it's actually the "Win Fights" Domain with a thin "twilight" skin applied over the top of it. Even the share-able 300 ft. darkvision, while not a problem in my mind in and of itself, is a game-changer when the cleric can share it with his archer buddy in a dark cave and let the archer buddy have a round or few of free shots with advantage against even drow. And again, most of these abilities are not, by themselves, beyond the pale. They're VERY GOOD, but not overly so. (I do think the freebie removal of conditions every round is probably pushing it to "broken" on its own, but on another chassis without other advantages this has, maybe that could still work.) The trouble is that it has all of them.

As an analogy, there's nothing overpowered about sneak attack, or flurry of blows, or ambusher (the gloomstalker extra attack), or action surge. But if you gave all of those in the first three levels to one class, that would be overpowered.

There's nothing wrong with most (if not all) of the individual things the Twilight Cleric gets in the first two levels. But all of them together is a bit much.

[Theodoxus]

Re: Cleric spells. The fact that there are so very few actually good, usable spells doesn't make the Cleric either an overly poor or good class, just boring. Outside of a few domain spells, nearly every spell kit is going to look 80-90% identical, and that's boring.

Domain spells and domain abilities help differentiate a bit, but much like Wizard, Cleric tends to suffer from sameness across most tables.

Twilight has the advantage of bringing a couple of unique mechanics to the table, and as noted, those mechanics on the same chassis is quite powerful. But their spell kit will still be 90% of a Life or War Cleric, because again, there are so few decent spells.

I'll let others decide if that's good or bad in general, but it's one reason I've not seen many times where two Clerics are appreciated (despite the fact that being able to concentrate on two different spells would actually be gonzo). Most of the time when two people come to the table with Clerics, one will switch out, thinking they don't "need that much healing". Which is really sad and short sighted.

[Snowbluff]

You're the first person with demonstrated system experience and mastery that I've ever seen allege that the Cleric is underpowered. Most people with any system mastery experience seem to agree that the class as a whole is quite solid, possibly a bit overtuned. Yes, the spells you list (e.g. bless, spirit guardians) are often named as go-to choices, but that's because, as you note, they are really good.

I wouldn't go that far, and I apologize if I was being unclear. I don't mean to say that cleric is underpowered, but rather the domains tend to not be as helpful for fulfilling their "purpose" as one would expect or otherwise have gripes I think drag them down a bit, especially in the case of Life Cleric. I also think that due to the limitation of the Domain lists not going all 9 levels of spells, when combined with the sometimes lackluster efficacy of the domains, means that over time a lot of clerics feel less like their domain and are just riding on their base class's chassis.

I'm going to have to agree along the line of what Theodoxus has said as well, I guess. I think I might've ended up just saying kind of the same thing.

[Kuulvheysoon]

...

So when I see Twilight Cleric, I see what is basically a life cleric that won't get laughed at at my table. That being said the die roll from the THP should be removed for being slow and as a slight nerf for lower levels. Comparing it to Healing Spirit 1.0 isn't really an apt comparison. First, it takes an action, and secondly, doesn't actually heal anyone. Healing spirit wouldn't compete with whacking or cantripping on your turn (which has varied usefulness), and you could use it to entirely remove the damage taken between fights by doing the famous merry go round after each fight for cheap. I'm not sure if THP can bring a creature back up from unconsciousness, like Healing Spirit can. On the other hand, Twilight Sanctuary is a short rest resource and reaches your team arm more easily, but I think your mileage may vary, as not every DM affords players short rests while others may give a glut of them.

It cannot. From the PHB:

TEMPORARY HIT POINTS

Some spells and special abilities confer temporary hit points to a creature. Temporary hit points aren't actual hit points; they are a buffer against damage, a pool of hit points that protect you from injury.

When you have temporary hit points and take damage, the temporary hit points are lost first, and any leftover damage carries over to your normal hit points. For example, if you have 5 temporary hit points and take 7 damage, you lose the temporary hit points and then take 2 damage.

Because temporary hit points are separate from your actual hit points, they can exceed your hit point maximum. A character can, therefore, be at full hit points and receive temporary hit points.

Healing can't restore temporary hit points, and they can't be added together. If you have temporary hit points and receive more of them, you decide whether to keep the ones you have or to gain the new ones. For example, if a spell grants you 12 temporary hit points when you already have 10, you can have 12 or 10, not 22.

If you have 0 hit points, receiving temporary hit points doesn't restore you to consciousness or stabilize you. They can still absorb damage directed at you while you're in that state, but only true healing can save you.

Unless a feature that grants you temporary hit points has a duration, they last until they're depleted or you finish a long rest.

[LudicSavant]

I don't mean to say that cleric is underpowered, but rather the domains tend to not be as helpful for fulfilling their "purpose" as one would expect or otherwise have gripes I think drag them down a bit, especially in the case of Life Cleric.

What do you have against Life Clerics?

[Snowbluff]

What do you have against Life Clerics?

It's a combination of things. For starters, Cleric doesn't really get a lot of the synergistic healing spells like Healing Spirit or Good Berry, and healing isn't really a good use of your time, and this isn't mention the banality of their spell list. Life Cleric tends to reinforce the "Clerics are the healing class" mentality, which also creates the trap of "the best cleric is the life cleric because they're the best at healing!"

It cannot. From the PHB:

Thanks for the rules check!

[quindraco]

What do you have against Life Clerics?

I have absolutely nothing against Life Clerics personally, but I will point out that a Shepherd Druid is quite often better at healer support than the Life Cleric, who's supposed to be the ideal healer support. The healing output of Unicorn Spirit is insane. Depending on what assumptions you make, Shepherd Druids are arguably the best healers overall, with Life Clerics in second place.

[Thunderous Mojo]

Someone made a case for the trickster earlier, and I have to say the duplicate is awful and its good spell list doesn't work if you've the duplicate out, and if you wanted those spells you really should have played a bard or a wizard.

I'm afraid this isn't accurate...of the 10 Domain spells granted by Trickery Domain, only 4 spells require Concentration, (Polymorph, Modify Memory, Dominate Person, and PWoT).

I also want to state the Harness Divine Power feature introduced by TCoE, is a nice, weaker version of Arcane Recovery, that can be used more frequently.

Effectively having five 2nd level spell slots as a 6th level cleric, enhances the spell casting facet of the class.

Re: Cleric spells. The fact that there are so very few actually good, usable spells doesn't make the Cleric either an overly poor or good class, just boring. Outside of a few domain spells, nearly every spell kit is going to look 80-90% identical, and that's boring.

This has been true, since 1e. I do think Theodoxus, that when it comes to "Generally, good Adventuring Spells that work in many different situations"..most classes have a 'common loadout'...not just the cleric class.

The cleric spell list is substantial....I rarely had the exact same spells Prepared from day to day, and the Augury and Divination spells can aid you in narrowing down your selections.

A cleric is typically one Long Rest away from having a solution to the problems that arise.

[Snowbluff]

I'm afraid this isn't accurate...of the 10 Domain spells granted by Trickery Domain, only 4 spells require Concentration, (Polymorph, Modify Memory, Dominate Person, and PWoT).

Yes, you listed the good spells on the list. That was my point, that the good additions to the list were overlapping with their class feature. I apologize if that wasn't more clear.

I did forget about the little divine arcane recovery, but that does mean that you're offloading your channel divinity into casting more spells which will probably be from the cleric base list. It's nice to have to deal with a bad Channel Divinity, but I do worry it would lead to more clerics feeling too similiar because another domain feature has been supplanted by the chassis.

I have absolutely nothing against Life Clerics personally, but I will point out that a Shepherd Druid is quite often better at healer support than the Life Cleric, who's supposed to be the ideal healer support. The healing output of Unicorn Spirit is insane. Depending on what assumptions you make, Shepherd Druids are arguably the best healers overall, with Life Clerics in second place.

I agree. Combine this with the preferable druid list for healing and I would rate that a better healing option.

[Thunderous Mojo]

Yes, you listed the good spells on the list. That was my point

Aesthetic preferences are individualized. Out of curiosity, do you not consider Charm Person, Disguise Self, Dispel Magic, and Dimension Door to be "good spells"?

Even spells that are more situational such as Mirror Image and Blink, are nice to have on a Domain List; if the situation arises, you know you are prepared.

it would lead to more clerics feeling too similiar because another domain feature has been supplanted by the chassis.

To my aesthetic sensibilities, the 5e cleric has more differentiation between the various Domains, than any version of cleric presented in other D&D editions, with the exception of 2E's Specialty priest.

I have been an "Always DM" for many years now, and in general do not play clerics when I am a player, (A custom 2E Specialty Priest was the only other cleric I played); I've been surprised at how much fun the class is to play.

Each 5e cleric PC that I have had the pleasure to referee has seemed very different from each other.