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  1. - Top - End - #1
    Barbarian in the Playground
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    Default Fast Paced/Simple Gun combat Rules?

    So I would like to set up a game around a few more modern settings. Y’all have convinced me 5e sucks for that. But I’d like to find some options so I can plan out a game. So here is what I’d like in the game rules and let’s see if anyone knows some games to help.

    1) Simplicity: I am NOT very good with the combat side still. Like I’d be ok with even as simple as percentage dice rolled and adjusted based on circumstance.
    2) Story is important. RP and planning are the major part. I’d like to incentivize smart plays over getting into combat BECAUSE
    3) Combat should be risky. It should also be LESS risky the more you plan. Your characters plan an ambush on an unarmored vehicle with 3 Nazi SS officers who are maybe have pistols and are just heading into a bar? THAT combat is going to be over in about 3-5 seconds. But if you try to engage the 6 squads in the town head on with 4 guys after? You are going to get fired and maneuvered on by hard combat experienced enemies.
    4) Faster paced. I don’t want to get bogged down in 30min of combat for a firefight that lasts 60 seconds in game world time.

    I have a few spy stories and other westerns I’d love to adjust to an RPG. But I just haven’t found a simple/fast system. Certainly not something that is easy to pick up and grasp for my non mathematical brain.

  2. - Top - End - #2
    Bugbear in the Playground
    Join Date
    Oct 2016

    Default Re: Fast Paced/Simple Gun combat Rules?

    How much detail do you want?

    Are all pistols the same?
    Do you split them into heavy/light?
    Do you split them into several categories (light revolver, light automatic, heavy revolver, target pistol, superior pistol etc.)
    Does each pistol have individual stats?

  3. - Top - End - #3
    Barbarian in the Playground
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    Default Re: Fast Paced/Simple Gun combat Rules?

    Quote Originally Posted by Pauly View Post
    How much detail do you want?

    Are all pistols the same?
    Do you split them into heavy/light?
    Do you split them into several categories (light revolver, light automatic, heavy revolver, target pistol, superior pistol etc.)
    Does each pistol have individual stats?
    For the most part? No division. There isn’t much difference in reality. Pistols put holes IN people, rifles through people, and shotguns knock hunks out of people. There would be machine guns, smgs, and such most likely. The key is I’d like to be able set up a spy thriller, western, or maybe a behind the lines WW2 game.
    Last edited by blackjack50; 2021-05-01 at 06:56 PM.

  4. - Top - End - #4
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    WolfInSheepsClothing

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    Default Re: Fast Paced/Simple Gun combat Rules?

    You could use Friday night firefight, or a variation there on

  5. - Top - End - #5
    Troll in the Playground
     
    BarbarianGuy

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    Default Re: Fast Paced/Simple Gun combat Rules?

    I could suggest the D6 Adventure system. It's free, not complex, has support for a lot of generic role play scenarios outside of combat. It's a fast moving game that is more cinematic in style, not really intended for tactical play (though it could easily use minis if you wanted to, they give ranges and speeds in meters/round). It's a generic system, so can be adopted to almost any action oriented genre you want- there's also supplements for sci-fi/space adventures (serial numbers filed off from the original Star Wars RPG), and fantasy.

    Combat is three steps, after initiative is determined-
    1 the attacker makes a roll, they need to hit 10. you modify difficulty according to range and whether the target has cover or took an active defense action.
    2. if they hit, roll damage
    3. defender rolls damage resistance (if any), and apply the damage.
    Characters can take multiple actions each round, at a penalty for each of the rolls. There are optional combat rules so they can use different types of fire specific to the different gun types, like bursts or full auto or spraying an area with bonuses to hit and penalties to damage.

    There are two options for dealing with injuries - a D&D style "body point" system that is more forgiving or a wound system that is more deadly. Using the more deadly system will have faster combats, especially if there generally isn't much armor/protective gear being worn.

    The main mechanic for everything is super simple, pick a difficulty for a task and have the player roll a relevant skill or ability. That's it - there's guidance on how to decide what difficulty you should give things, factors that should apply bonuses or penalties to different situations for all the different skills, but when it comes down to it you can run as fast and loose as you want. You can run most of the game with a two page reference sheet in the back of the book, once you're familiar enough with the rules there shouldn't be too much flipping through the book looking for stuff after the early sessions.

    There's many optional rules you can use to make characters as simple or complex as you want - lots of advantages and flaws that can be purchased with character build points. You have the option of having players choose pre-built templates provided in the book (or that you create yourself) that they just need to modify slightly, or give them a pool of points and assign anywhere they like to create a character from the ground up.

  6. - Top - End - #6
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Grod_The_Giant's Avatar

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    Default Re: Fast Paced/Simple Gun combat Rules?

    STaRS should work well for you. Combat is fast and can be incredibly lethal if you include more Weapon traits than Armor ones, and the system is built around finding ways to stack environmental and circumstantial bonuses in your favor.

    EDIT: To expound on that a little more, STaRS is a generic rules-light system. Characters have ten ability scores, each between 3 and 8; to accomplish something, you roll 1d10 with the relevant ability score as your target number. Skills and circumstances and provide bonuses (each of which makes your roll two points better), while circumstances and more powerful enemies can impose penalties (each of which makes your roll two points worse). Players do all the rolling, and enemy stat blocks consist of little more than scribbling "5 health, imposes a penalty on melee combat checks, can do a little shadow magic." It's easy to play, but arguably even easier to run.

    There's not exactly a combat engine; instead, the system is built around a more abstract "conflict engine" that can be used for any sort of challenge that you want to extend and make dramatic. Fighting a squad of Nazis would use the conflict rules, but so might an infiltration mission or a heated argument. Whatever way you go, there are only four actions: attack the problem directly, help an ally, hinder a foe, or move a long distance/past a barrier. You generally have plot-armor-health equal to the relevant ability score, refreshing every scene, and lose one or two points with a failed defense roll. That means in a normal fight, a character can take maybe 4-6 shots before going down--but if you declare that small arms are Weapon 1 (each application of which is a +2 bonus to damage), that gets cut in half. It's very easy to knock a character out of a conflict...but if the player doesn't want to accept the consequences, they can accept a long-term injury and regenerate their health. The combination makes it very easy to leave a party with broken limbs and gunshot wounds that will takes weeks of downtime (or sessions of play) to heal,0 but considerably harder to instantly turn them into chunky salsa.

    The longest STaRS game I ran was in a setting with 1920s era technology, where Weapon 1 guns were common but Armor 1 bulletproof vests were virtually unknown. Fights were every bit as fast and bloody as you'd hope.
    Last edited by Grod_The_Giant; 2021-05-03 at 01:09 PM.
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    STaRS: A non-narrativeist, generic rules-light system.
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  7. - Top - End - #7
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    Anonymouswizard's Avatar

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    Default Re: Fast Paced/Simple Gun combat Rules?

    I'm going to go off the beaten track and outside the time period you have in mind, [https://www.amazon.co.uk/Those-Dark-...9&sr=8-1]Those Dark Places[/url] by Osprey Publishing. It's a very simple system, you rate 4 stats 1-4, pick a primary and secondary skillset ('crew positions') that are rated at 2 and 1 respectively, and then every test is 1d6+Stat+Crew position against 6 for easy tasks, 7 for average tasks, and 8 for hard tasks. Except for opposed rolls, which are exactly the same as in [insert common system here] just using 1d6+stat+position.

    But it is intended for science fiction. It's very very nice, the hardback is high quality, relatively small, quite cheap, and the rules are incredibly simple. On the downside it is about 90% atmosphere and some of the rules are specifically to do with being along in an enclosed environment near considerable danger (particularly the rules about breaking down due to stress). I mainly mention it because:
    • It's incredibly simple and narrative focused. While it does have a combat system it's really just 'switch into rounds, this is how hurting people works'.
    • Combat is deadly, the most damage you can soak before going down is 4, and that's only if you put Strength at the maximum. That's four successful bunches, two pistol shots, or one somewhat lucky (50%) rifle shot. However you don't die until -2Strength, so there's a bit of give.
    • Unless I'm misremembering no advancement rules and no solid rules for equipment. Getting into fights just because only wears you down. (While adding in advancement rules would be easy I think the game runs just fine without mechanical advancement).
    • Being better equipped is really powerful. Weapon damage scales up fast, you roll a d6 for damage and have a ceiling based on your weapon (1 for unarmed damage, 4 for rifles and explosives). But hey, there's six other skillsets for a reason.


    So yeah, it's very much grungy science fiction rather than a modern game, but system-wise seems to hit most of your requirements.
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  8. - Top - End - #8
    Dwarf in the Playground
     
    Griffon

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    Default Re: Fast Paced/Simple Gun combat Rules?

    Quote Originally Posted by blackjack50 View Post
    So I would like to set up a game around a few more modern settings. Y’all have convinced me 5e sucks for that. But I’d like to find some options so I can plan out a game. So here is what I’d like in the game rules and let’s see if anyone knows some games to help.

    1) Simplicity: I am NOT very good with the combat side still. Like I’d be ok with even as simple as percentage dice rolled and adjusted based on circumstance.
    2) Story is important. RP and planning are the major part. I’d like to incentivize smart plays over getting into combat BECAUSE
    3) Combat should be risky. It should also be LESS risky the more you plan. Your characters plan an ambush on an unarmored vehicle with 3 Nazi SS officers who are maybe have pistols and are just heading into a bar? THAT combat is going to be over in about 3-5 seconds. But if you try to engage the 6 squads in the town head on with 4 guys after? You are going to get fired and maneuvered on by hard combat experienced enemies.
    4) Faster paced. I don’t want to get bogged down in 30min of combat for a firefight that lasts 60 seconds in game world time.

    I have a few spy stories and other westerns I’d love to adjust to an RPG. But I just haven’t found a simple/fast system. Certainly not something that is easy to pick up and grasp for my non mathematical brain.
    Try Chaosium's BRP which is a generic system. SAVAGE WORLDS does combat pretty well IF you don't mind the lethality in that system.
    I use GDW's Twilight2000 V2.2 rules for my modern games. FAR FUTURE ENTERPRISES still puts out PDFs and CD-ROMs of the game.

  9. - Top - End - #9
    Pixie in the Playground
     
    Leonard Robel's Avatar

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    Default Re: Fast Paced/Simple Gun combat Rules?

    Yes, it does.

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