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  1. - Top - End - #31
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    Default Re: MCU Phase 4 Trailer

    Originally Posted by Dire_Flumph
    I see it more expanding the base they want to draw in rather than shutting out Carol.
    This exactly.

  2. - Top - End - #32
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    Default Re: MCU Phase 4 Trailer

    Quote Originally Posted by Palanan View Post
    So, they’ve been vacationing on the other side of the universe the past few years?
    In the comics, they started to back off after humans started to develop their own heroes and they don't like to get involved in every little thing.

    When told to pick a side in the Civil War, they said, to paraphrase, "if you see two children roughhousing in the sandbox, do you feel he need to choose a side?"

    Their most recent series opens with them being revived after they were all killed at the start of Jason Aaron's Avengers, and it seems that the current run is being written with movie synergy in mind, so I expect we might get a "they were dead or dormant" thing to explain why they werren't here for the Chiturri invasion or Infinity War.
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  3. - Top - End - #33
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    Default Re: MCU Phase 4 Trailer

    Quote Originally Posted by Cikomyr2 View Post
    I think we should start to take bet about which will smile the less in the trailer.
    Given Monica’s reaction in WandaVision, that could be a fun thing to track. Maybe Disney could make it a frown-off.

  4. - Top - End - #34
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    Default Re: MCU Phase 4 Trailer

    Quote Originally Posted by Rater202 View Post
    Millions of years ago, a race of beings called the Celestials, thousand foot tall cosmic super gods who look like giant robots, came to Earth and experimented on ancient Homo erectus.
    Wait, hold on, I just remembered something. Isn't 'Celestial' the name of the race that Ego belonged to in Guardians of the Galaxy 2?

  5. - Top - End - #35
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    Default Re: MCU Phase 4 Trailer

    Quote Originally Posted by JadedDM View Post
    Wait, hold on, I just remembered something. Isn't 'Celestial' the name of the race that Ego belonged to in Guardians of the Galaxy 2?
    In the movies yes. In the comics, he's something else.
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    Spoiler: Ode To Meteors, By zimmerwald
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    Quote Originally Posted by zimmerwald1915 View Post
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  6. - Top - End - #36
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    Default Re: MCU Phase 4 Trailer

    Quote Originally Posted by JadedDM View Post
    Wait, hold on, I just remembered something. Isn't 'Celestial' the name of the race that Ego belonged to in Guardians of the Galaxy 2?
    Yes.

    Remember in the first Guardians movie where the collector talked about the infinity stones in an exposition dump. We see a giant robot when he said a single stone can break a planet and something about wheat.

    That robot is a Celestial, and in the comics all Celestials look like that. (Skips a more detailed explanation, Rater can do it better than me.)

    In Guardians 2 we learn Ego in the MCU is a Celestial, and his son Peter is half-Celestial. Thus some differences but the MCU does that all the time with streamlining.
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  7. - Top - End - #37
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    Default Re: MCU Phase 4 Trailer

    Quote Originally Posted by Palanan View Post
    So, they’ve been vacationing on the other side of the universe the past few years?
    IIRC there was a run where the Eternals lost their memories of what they were, they might be using that. If not I would badly like to know why they didn’t show up to help with Thanos.

    Quote Originally Posted by Palanan View Post
    Well, they’re including her logo in the A of the title, so that seems like pretty deliberate continuity with the first movie. I don’t see this as distancing, more of an expansion.

    Logo.
    Eh? That’s Monica’s symbol in the A, not Carol’s. And the S is Kamala’s.

    Quote Originally Posted by JadedDM View Post
    Wait, hold on, I just remembered something. Isn't 'Celestial' the name of the race that Ego belonged to in Guardians of the Galaxy 2?
    Him, and the severed head of Knowwhere.
    Last edited by Kareeah_Indaga; 2021-05-03 at 07:29 PM.

  8. - Top - End - #38
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    Default Re: MCU Phase 4 Trailer

    Quote Originally Posted by Kareeah_Indaga View Post
    I don’t know, I’m speculating. But turn that around: because Captain Marvel made over a billion dollars, why wouldn’t they want to underscore that she’s in it to draw viewers? Yet they aren’t.
    Captain Marvel wasn't great, but it certainly wasn't worth ditching Carol or shuffling her off the stage considering the massive PR benefits they get just from her existing and it's hard to work out the signal from the noise on the whole "Movie between Infinity War and Endgame made bank" and "Captain Marvel was just that good". If nothing else she gets a second movie alongside all the other Marvels and if they can't manage to make her interesting after that then she might get moved to team player Avengers character like the Hulk, their movies were about the same quality even now that I think about it, and they move Kamala or Monica to a more prominent role depending on who connects best.
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  9. - Top - End - #39
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    Default Re: MCU Phase 4 Trailer

    Quote Originally Posted by Kareeah_Indaga View Post
    Him, and the severed head of Knowwhere.
    Please do not incorporate all the Knowwhere marvel comic lore that came out in the last 6 years after the movie. 🤞 🛢️

    ( It may happen if Thor Love and Thunder casting leaks are accurate. )
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  10. - Top - End - #40
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    Default Re: MCU Phase 4 Trailer

    I see this less as "Marvel self-congratulations" and more "we're coming out of a global pandemic and want to confidently reassert ourselves as the definitive blockbuster movie franchise for the last decade after months of ambiguity over how and when we'll continue theatrically" in as a straightforward means as possible without directly mentioning C-19 in any way.

    As to Eternals, I genuinely don't know what people expect from a five-second snippets of future productions. Deep character moments or incisive plot details?

    The Marvels is an existing title for a Marvel comic series, a relatively famous one with some stellar Alex Ross art. It's the one that tries to reframe the Marvel Universe into a singular historical timeline starting from WW2 onwards into just a few issues, in a quasi-documentary style. I assume they had the name from that and decided to use it here for cute wordplay purposes.

  11. - Top - End - #41
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    Default Re: MCU Phase 4 Trailer

    Quote Originally Posted by Kitten Champion View Post
    As to Eternals, I genuinely don't know what people expect from a five-second snippets of future productions. Deep character moments or incisive plot details?
    We got a cameo scene where "The Ishtar Gate" a 2500 year artifact which was one of the 8 gates into the city of Babylon (Chaldean Empire sometimes called Neo-Babylonian even though the cultures, language, people ethnicity, etc were nothing alike for these two different empires a 1000+ years apart.)

    Ishtar Gate is now located in Germany as a museum piece. On twitter we got more photos of the mockup, both head on as seen on the MCU trailer, but also orthogonally from a camera angle 90 degrees the other direction and further out, and the reconstructed Ishtar Gate is merely plywood with stuff on top of the plywood

    Yeah, yeah, cool nerdy stuff but you can use other words besides cool
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  12. - Top - End - #42
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    Default Re: MCU Phase 4 Trailer

    Quote Originally Posted by Kareeah_Indaga View Post
    IIRC there was a run where the Eternals lost their memories of what they were, they might be using that. If not I would badly like to know why they didn’t show up to help with Thanos.
    .
    Maybe they are trapped in the 10 Rings? 😅

  13. - Top - End - #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by LaZodiac View Post
    Oh I have no doubt I'll come out of Eternals loving them all like with Guardians, but at least with Guardians I did, slightly, know who these z-listers were. I don't even KNOW the Eternals
    You had one up on me with the Guardians then. I went into that one only knowing anything about Rocket Raccoon, and him only because they (inexplicably, at the time) put him in Ultimate Marvel vs Capcom 3.

    Quote Originally Posted by LaZodiac View Post
    The best thing they could do is have it be mentioned that... T'Challa has been suffering in silence from his injuries, and he died peacefully after the struggle. This would be sort of canonizing the reality of Boseman, honouring his struggle.
    Fair, that would probably be among the best ways they could handle it. Still, it's going to be tough to pull off "our main character from the first movie died off-screen" and have it feel completely narratively satisfying though, I think.

    Quote Originally Posted by LaZodiac View Post
    They should also donate like 80% of the film proceeds to cancer research and stuff.
    I doubt they would/will be that generous, but yeah, would be good of them.

    Quote Originally Posted by LaZodiac View Post
    Excited for super powered lesbian family drama.
    Uh, I don't think any of those characters are lesbians? Well, maybe Monica I guess, I don't know anything about her besides what we saw of her as a kid in the first movie. But from what I've seen of Kamala elsewhere she's definitely not unless they change that for her MCU version; and while I confess I wondered a bit during some of Carol's scenes with Maria in the first film, I don't at this point honestly think they were going for that, If only because I'd expect they'd have said so by now if they were, like they have for Valkyrie being bi.
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  14. - Top - End - #44
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    Default Re: MCU Phase 4 Trailer

    Originally Posted by Kareeah_Indaga
    *that logo does not mean what you think it means*
    Fair enough, although that’s a distinction probably lost on anyone not familiar with Spectrum.

    Originally Posted by Kitten Champion
    I see this less as "Marvel self-congratulations”….
    Well, half the trailer is a mini-victory lap for the MCU to date, and they definitely come across as very pleased with themselves.

    Originally Posted by Kitten Champion
    As to Eternals, I genuinely don't know what people expect from a five-second snippets of future productions. Deep character moments or incisive plot details?
    Maybe, I dunno, ten seconds about Eternals, showing us one (1) compelling and unique detail?

    Originally Posted by LaZodiac
    Excited for super powered….
    Where are you getting this from?

  15. - Top - End - #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zevox View Post

    Uh, I don't think any of those characters are lesbians? Well, maybe Monica I guess, I don't know anything about her besides what we saw of her as a kid in the first movie. But from what I've seen of Kamala elsewhere she's definitely not unless they change that for her MCU version; and while I confess I wondered a bit during some of Carol's scenes with Maria in the first film, I don't at this point honestly think they were going for that, If only because I'd expect they'd have said so by now if they were, like they have for Valkyrie being bi.
    They Queer-Baited with 2019 Captain Marvel, the MCU characters.

    1) Either Carol Danvers and Maria Rambeau (founder of SWORD) are two found family roommates who provided mutual aid and support, raising Monica. Carol who is estranged with her father.
    2) Or Carol Danvers and Maria are lesbians / bisexuals.

    Either romantic or platonic, those are the two choices with the actual text, and the subtext is Maria was heartbroken when she lost Carol and it really messed with her and now her “friend” has returned with no memories of her.

    —————

    In sum Queer Baiting. I have no problem with #1 if they just say it. Platonic love is love. But likewise romantic life partners of the same-sex is also love. The playing the ambiguous game is so late 90s and the Aughts TV stuff. It is also likewise 80s comics with Mystique and Destiny but at least in the 80s we had a marvel editor who said no gay characters, and also the comic code authority restraining certain type of stories if you want the CCA rating saying acceptable for kids.

    It does not matter. Monica sees herself as having two moms even though one mom’s title is Auntie and Monica has unresolved feelings with WandaVISION where she does not have any ram right now to process her mom dying, nor Darcy and Wu talking Endgame fights. No Monica has a personality where she tries to help what is right in front of her, for doing things is easier to emotionally process than internal stuff which she can not fix just change her internal emotional perspective of stuff that has already occurred. (This is not judgement, just saying everyone copes and grieves in their own ways, in fact I salute Monica for knowing her type and then doing a project to help her grieve.)
    Last edited by Ramza00; 2021-05-03 at 10:50 PM.
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  16. - Top - End - #46
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    Default Re: MCU Phase 4 Trailer

    Quote Originally Posted by Palanan View Post
    Well, half the trailer is a mini-victory lap for the MCU to date, and they definitely come across as very pleased with themselves.
    See, what I see there in direct-as-all-hell text is "this is what you went to movies for, to escape, to feel connected to others in sharing same experience, and have a collective cultural moment" all of which has been lost, at least to some degree, in the pandemic. Yes, it's Marvel saying it here, but it's what a lot of people want to hear about movies in general at this point.

    Quote Originally Posted by Palanan View Post
    Maybe, I dunno, ten seconds about Eternals, showing us one (1) compelling and unique detail?
    My god, ten whole seconds was it. I take back everything I said completely, this should have been a scintillating epic of a story that gets everyone's undivided attention and unswerving desire to pre-order tickets today. They have failed utterly.

    The Marvel Cinematic Universe is cancelled, everyone pack up your bags and go home.
    Last edited by Kitten Champion; 2021-05-03 at 11:11 PM.

  17. - Top - End - #47
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    Originally Posted by Kitten Champion
    The Marvel Cinematic Universe is cancelled, everyone pack up your bags and go home.
    Come on now.

  18. - Top - End - #48
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    Default Re: MCU Phase 4 Trailer

    Quote Originally Posted by Zevox View Post
    Uh, I don't think any of those characters are lesbians? Well, maybe Monica I guess, I don't know anything about her besides what we saw of her as a kid in the first movie. But from what I've seen of Kamala elsewhere she's definitely not unless they change that for her MCU version; and while I confess I wondered a bit during some of Carol's scenes with Maria in the first film, I don't at this point honestly think they were going for that, If only because I'd expect they'd have said so by now if they were, like they have for Valkyrie being bi.
    I'm sorry, I was under the impression that the Captain Marvel movie would have Carol Danvers and Monica's mom in it. I'm honestly kinda confused why people are just sort of assuming she's not in it? Regardless, we'll see; but also yeah no Carol and her "best friend" are gay as hell.

    Valkyrie also. And if rumours are true, Love and Thunder is going to be about Valkyrie looking to find a queen of asgard to match her being the king.

  19. - Top - End - #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by LaZodiac View Post
    I'm sorry, I was under the impression that the Captain Marvel movie would have Carol Danvers and Monica's mom in it. I'm honestly kinda confused why people are just sort of assuming she's not in it? Regardless, we'll see; but also yeah no Carol and her "best friend" are gay as hell.

    Valkyrie also. And if rumours are true, Love and Thunder is going to be about Valkyrie looking to find a queen of asgard to match her being the king.
    They killed Monica’s mom, offscreen in WandaVISION . Maria Rambeau was being treated for cancer the day of the snap, Monica was with her, Monica got snapped and Maria did not. Maria recovered from the cancer, but then it came back and she died alone without her daughter or life partner 🥺 😭

    I guess the alternative was Maria faking her death to do something with Skrulls?

    Edit: Bucky and Maria somehow need to form a support group even if the timelines do not match. Never date a superhero whose name is Cap.
    Last edited by Ramza00; 2021-05-04 at 12:20 AM.
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  20. - Top - End - #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by LaZodiac View Post
    I'm sorry, I was under the impression that the Captain Marvel movie would have Carol Danvers and Monica's mom in it. I'm honestly kinda confused why people are just sort of assuming she's not in it? Regardless, we'll see; but also yeah no Carol and her "best friend" are gay as hell.
    This video analysis should be interesting, then!

    Spoiler
    Show

    Unfortunately, Maria is not alive come The Marvels, but there's probably going to be a lot of flashbacks. Hopefully.

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    Default Re: MCU Phase 4 Trailer

    Quote Originally Posted by Ramza00 View Post
    They killed Monica’s mom, offscreen in WandaVISION . Maria Rambeau was being treated for cancer the day of the snap, Monica was with her, Monica got snapped and Maria did not. Maria recovered from the cancer, but then it came back and she died alone without her daughter or life partner 🥺 😭

    I guess the alternative was Maria faking her death to do something with Skrulls?

    Edit: Bucky and Maria somehow need to form a support group even if the timelines do not match. Never date a superhero whose name is Cap.
    Quote Originally Posted by understatement View Post
    This video analysis should be interesting, then!

    Spoiler
    Show

    Unfortunately, Maria is not alive come The Marvels, but there's probably going to be a lot of flashbacks. Hopefully.
    Very sad.

    Also yeah Captain Marvel was HELLA gay. This video is pretty great.
    Last edited by LaZodiac; 2021-05-04 at 12:29 AM.

  22. - Top - End - #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by LaZodiac View Post
    I'm sorry, I was under the impression that the Captain Marvel movie would have Carol Danvers and Monica's mom in it. I'm honestly kinda confused why people are just sort of assuming she's not in it? Regardless, we'll see; but also yeah no Carol and her "best friend" are gay as hell.
    Even without knowing about the WandaVision thing, I wasn't thinking much about Maria in that equation partly because of the big time skip between films meaning that her survival was not guaranteed (how often do parents get killed in stories like these to provide motivation to their kids?), and partly because of the same reason I gave for Carol.

    Quote Originally Posted by LaZodiac View Post
    Valkyrie also. And if rumours are true, Love and Thunder is going to be about Valkyrie looking to find a queen of asgard to match her being the king.
    Yes, that one's not a rumor, that's something they've come out and said. And by "they" I mean "Valkyrie's actress," if memory serves.
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  23. - Top - End - #53
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    Trivia: When Jessica "Spider-Woman" Drew was pregnant in the comics following the soft reboot post-Secret Wars, both comic fans and people in-universe speculated that Carol "Captain Marvel" Danvers was the father.

    ...Considering that Jessica shouldn't be genetically compatible with humans in the first place what with the whole "artificial hybrid of human and Spider-DNA subjected to further mutagenic processes meant to simulate millions of years of evolution aimed towards a specific goal" that honestly would have made more sense than what actually happened.

    Jess had casual sex with a man and then missed a period, she didn't turn out to be pregnant... But despite dreading it when she was waiting for the test results, she felt disappointed when it came back as negative, so after spending a few months thinking about it she scheduled an appointment for artificial insemination. Gerry Drew's biological father is just some random normal human.

    I would honestly find "Jess and Carol had casual lesbian sex and Jess asexually reproduced a baby as result" to be more realistic than someone who shouldn't even be in the same genus as modern Homo s sapiens having a child via a random perfectly normal human male.

    Speaking of homosexual reproduction in Marvel comics: Clairmont's original plans for Nightcrawler were that Mystique would be his biological father, not his biological mother.

    Instead of the son of Mystique and Azazel, he was intended to be the son of Mystique and Irene Adler.

    Oh, by the way, Mystique was probably Sherlock Holmes. The Movies depict her as being the same age as Xavier, but in the comics she's older than Wolverine. She was working as a consulting detective in London in the late 1800s and early 1900s when she met Irene. Irene, or Destiny to use her mutant name, claims that she was the inspiration for the same-named character in Doyel's works... Except that Sherlock Holmes was a real person in the marvel universe, in addition to being a work of fiction*, and at least one of Doyle's stories(The Hound of The Baskervilles) happened more or less s depicted in the story.

    The conclusion is obvious.

    *The same is true of Tarzan and Conan the Barbarian.
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    Meteor
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    Way down the air
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    Where my other
    Rocks
    Are.

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    Default Re: MCU Phase 4 Trailer

    Quote Originally Posted by Rater202 View Post
    Trivia: When Jessica "Spider-Woman" Drew was pregnant in the comics following the soft reboot post-Secret Wars, both comic fans and people in-universe speculated that Carol "Captain Marvel" Danvers was the father.

    ...Considering that Jessica shouldn't be genetically compatible with humans in the first place what with the whole "artificial hybrid of human and Spider-DNA subjected to further mutagenic processes meant to simulate millions of years of evolution aimed towards a specific goal" that honestly would have made more sense than what actually happened.

    Jess had casual sex with a man and then missed a period, she didn't turn out to be pregnant... But despite dreading it when she was waiting for the test results, she felt disappointed when it came back as negative, so after spending a few months thinking about it she scheduled an appointment for artificial insemination. Gerry Drew's biological father is just some random normal human.

    I would honestly find "Jess and Carol had casual lesbian sex and Jess asexually reproduced a baby as result" to be more realistic than someone who shouldn't even be in the same genus as modern Homo s sapiens having a child via a random perfectly normal human male.
    No.

    I mean, when you assert all this comic book nonsense into these character lives you eventually end up with unrelatable characters and magical saviour babies.

    Jessica Drew made a life decision that real people make for real human reasons, her life didn't need yet another essay-length entry on the Marvel wiki on the convoluted circumstances to explain such a development when something as simple and non-melodramatic as "because she wanted to and could" was entirely sufficient.

  25. - Top - End - #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kitten Champion View Post
    No.

    I mean, when you assert all this comic book nonsense into these character lives you eventually end up with unrelatable characters and magical saviour babies.

    Jessica Drew made a life decision that real people make for real human reasons, her life didn't need yet another essay-length entry on the Marvel wiki on the convoluted circumstances to explain such a development when something as simple and non-melodramatic as "because she wanted to and could" was entirely sufficient.
    We're talking about a biologically immortal hyper-evolved human-spider hybrid super spy who can fly, shoot lightning out of her fingertips, instantly becomes immune to any toxic substance she's exposed to, and used to be a Nazi.

    And that's just her origin story.

    Jessica Drew is already unrelatable and comic book nonsense is an inherent part of her being because she's a comic book character.

    Enough weird bullcrap happens in her life that her making a perfectly ordinary decision that plenty of real people do and it working is honestly weirder than more weird bullcrap happening.

    Jessica Drew was spliced with the DNA of multiple species of spider and then locked in one of the High Evolutionary's Genetic Accelerators.

    Jessica spent decades inside one of those machines.

    A genetic accelerator can simulate thousands of years of evolution in just a few seconds.

    After spending decades in that chamber, Jessica is further removed genetically from humans than humans are from Dracorex hogswartia.

    Jessica being able to be impregnated by a normal human being stretched disbelief. The resulting child being perfectly healthy despite being a hybrid of two radically differatn species(Jessica being a species of one)

    This is one of the absurdly rare situations where weird comic book bullcrap would have been more believable than something perfectly mundane.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rater202 View Post
    We're talking about a biologically immortal hyper-evolved human-spider hybrid super spy who can fly, shoot lightning out of her fingertips, instantly becomes immune to any toxic substance she's exposed to, and used to be a Nazi.

    And that's just her origin story.

    Jessica Drew is already unrelatable and comic book nonsense is an inherent part of her being because she's a comic book character.

    Enough weird bullcrap happens in her life that her making a perfectly ordinary decision that plenty of real people do and it working is honestly weirder than more weird bullcrap happening.
    Guess what?

    That's what Marvel Comics are about. Don't believe me? Let's hear it from Stan the Man himself:


  27. - Top - End - #57
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    LaZodiac's Avatar

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    Default Re: MCU Phase 4 Trailer

    I mean.

    That interview was incredibly tongue in cheek. I think there's evidence (and, importantly, necessity) for there to be both grounded things, and ridiculous things.

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    Ogre in the Playground
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    Default Re: MCU Phase 4 Trailer

    Quote Originally Posted by GloatingSwine View Post
    Guess what?

    That's what Marvel Comics are about. Don't believe me? Let's hear it from Stan the Man himself:

    And that's maybe why Marvel Comics are considered super dense obscured overcomplicated stupid stories?

    And also why when Marvel Studio went for something that appeal beyond a demographic obsessed with convoluted bull**** details, they actually worked really hard to make it as streamlined as possible?

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    Default Re: MCU Phase 4 Trailer

    Hey Guys,

    is there any movie about Morbius, isnt it? or am I confusing things. Or has morbius nothing to do with the MCU?? Sorry for that dumb question
    The best closed door is the one you can leave open.

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    Default Re: MCU Phase 4 Trailer

    Quote Originally Posted by Rater202 View Post
    Kinda.

    That was the original intent, but that was when they were their own thing separate from the rest of the universe.

    After they were integrated into Earth 616 however, they did some hasty retcons about being confused for such beings(in particular, there was a meeting between Zuras and Thena with Zeus and Athena to clear up the misunderstanding about the four being confused for each other) but.

    But, but, not all of them are the case. The Forgotten one is The Gilgamesh, and while he was only confused for Hercules he apparently did do the cleaning of the Augean stables on Herc's behalf.

    And Sersi is just... The Circe. She claims that the Greeks didn't know how to sell her name.
    The MCU have the freedom of making it so for real. It's more straightforward, like the classical antiquity version of the Asgardians from the Thor movies.
    Last edited by Clertar; 2021-05-04 at 08:20 AM.
    "Like the old proverb says, if one sees something not right, one must draw out his sword to intervene"

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