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    BarbarianGuy

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    Default Tech support compared with 40k

    Working in IT I've noticed something about tech support people.

    Windows support people are like Adeptus Mechanicus, they follow the rites and produce the result but the junior ones get stuck if the rite doesn't work and they have to go and get someone more senior who knows more advanced rites.

    Linux support people are like Ork Mekboyz, they make things work with orky know-wotz, if the junior mekboy doesn't know something then the boss-mek gives him a thump around the head and tells him to use a different orky know-wot and stick them together in a different way.

    Devops people are like Eldar Bonesingers, you can see them doing things, you can see the results but how things go from one state to the other is a mystery.

    Am I right, or am I disparaging my professional bretheren and sisteren?

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    ElfPirate

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    Default Re: Tech support compared with 40k

    Nope. That checks out.

    And Apple are ofc the Tau.

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    Default Re: Tech support compared with 40k

    Forget the power of technology and science, for so much has been forgotten, never to be re-learned.

    Forget the promise of progress and understanding, for in the grim darkness of the far future there is only war.

    There is no peace amongst the stars, only an eternity of carnage and slaughter, and the laughter of thirsting gods.
    Yup. That sounds like Technical Support.
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    Default Re: Tech support compared with 40k

    So.... all that's left is finding a good match for Hereteks

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    Default Re: Tech support compared with 40k

    It's hard to be more disparaging than the normal view of IT, which is basically "every job at IT is simply knowing how to Google things better than the people below you".
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    Default Re: Tech support compared with 40k

    Quote Originally Posted by Altheus View Post
    Am I right, or am I disparaging my professional bretheren and sisteren?
    Downplaying DevOps as "tech support" falls in the disparagement category, yes
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    PaladinGuy

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    Default Re: Tech support compared with 40k

    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    It's hard to be more disparaging than the normal view of IT, which is basically "every job at IT is simply knowing how to Google things better than the people below you".
    That's just not true. Once one gets into IT management then one is less good at using Google than the staff working for you - that's their job, yours is to manage.

    I have what sounds like one of the best jobs in IT - I'm a tester, my job is to break things...

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    Default Re: Tech support compared with 40k

    As for forgetting tech, absolutely true. NASA has to occasionally get some programmer from the 70s or something out of retirement because they are the only ones who can make sense of old code.

    Personal anecdote, I worked in a pharmaceutical company and we were obligated to keep all measurement data from quality assurance for lifetime of our products and, I think 25 years. (It's been a while.) Meanign that we also had to keep an old IBM server from the 80s in working condition, and a stack of magnetic tapes. We had exactly one guy in the company who knew how to fire up that old server, in case we ever got any auditors. It looked a lot like an AM ritual.
    "In dark times, should the stars also go out?"

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    Default Re: Tech support compared with 40k

    We must keep the spirits of these machines appeased, that they may bless us with the inner workings of DOS.

    As college dorm tech support from the early 2000s, this does indeed check out and verify.

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    Default Re: Tech support compared with 40k

    Quote Originally Posted by Taevyr View Post
    So.... all that's left is finding a good match for Hereteks
    I mean its probably people who make their own computers from parts they order and assemble themselves, DIY people or something else to that effect.

    but adding mods to games like Skyrim and New Vegas certainly feels like modding tech myself, as I have to learn a bunch of arcane things to keep them functioning rather than crashing or glitching out, and its all largely self-maintained as it my personal mod set up, not really applicable to anyone elses problems, and nowhere near the tech knowledge of anyone with actual programming.
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    Default Re: Tech support compared with 40k

    Hereteks are people who invent their own programming languages. Alternatively, that kid who built a working nuclear reactor in his shed.
    "In dark times, should the stars also go out?"

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    Default Re: Tech support compared with 40k

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Raziere View Post
    I mean its probably people who make their own computers from parts they order and assemble themselves, DIY people or something else to that effect.
    There is a group of users who go one step beyond, for fun or necessity. They build their computer out of non-standard, modified or in other ways very much compromised parts. Resoldering cpu chips onto different circuitboards so the fit on a newer or older motherboard. Frankenstein parts that combined Intel and AMD stuff. Taking a cryptomining graphics card (that has no actual drivers or even even gfx output ports) and using that as their gpu. In many cases they also have to write the software for it.


    There is even a project that is reverse engineering and I think opensourcing a Windows ME or XP build or some such. Doesn't get more heretical than that.

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    Default Re: Tech support compared with 40k

    Quote Originally Posted by Taevyr View Post
    So.... all that's left is finding a good match for Hereteks
    That would probably be the on-site organization techs.

    "Oh, this thing is out of warranty but it's broken and needs to work for another month until it can be replaced? Well, if we can't do this the official way...."

    At least I know in my time in tech support you never see more heresy then when something had to be fixed right away but they didn't think it would need to last.
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    I like the "hobo" in there.
    "Hey, you just got 10000gp! You going to buy a fully staffed mansion or something?"
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    Default Re: Tech support compared with 40k

    Quote Originally Posted by druid91 View Post
    That would probably be the on-site organization techs.

    "Oh, this thing is out of warranty but it's broken and needs to work for another month until it can be replaced? Well, if we can't do this the official way...."

    At least I know in my time in tech support you never see more heresy then when something had to be fixed right away but they didn't think it would need to last.
    We have an HPLC on site that is 10 years out of warranty. The Post Doc who has been servicing that thing for the last five years (including her entire PhD) scares me. And yes, she's a full on Admech, too. Apparently, once the sampling-arm (an arrangement of pistons and a syringe, total about 20 cm or a bit less than a foot long, I don't know the official English name), went out of alignment and couldn't callibrate its position, so it started flailing around wildly enough that it broke the glass on the sample unit and started poking outside. She just cursed at it for about ten minutes solid while taking it apart and ad-hoc-ing it. She's not even a tech, officially, she's a biochemist.

    And yeah, some of the "manuals" get scary. "So, we get salt deposition in this pump valve if we get use this solvent. Manufacturer wanted to sell us a new pump. Isntead, what we do is that once a month, we pull out this tube, then pull out the degasser unit, plus this solvent bottle here right into the pump head, disable this safety, , unsscrew these bolts, then we use this hot plate, heat ultrapure water to 55°C (with a thermometer duct-taped to it), unplug the FLD, and use this capillary that's below standard diameter to create some back pressure..."
    "In dark times, should the stars also go out?"

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    Flumph

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    Default Re: Tech support compared with 40k

    Quote Originally Posted by Taevyr View Post
    So.... all that's left is finding a good match for Hereteks
    People whose first instinct on buying literally any piece of technology is to install Linux on it.

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    Default Re: Tech support compared with 40k

    Quote Originally Posted by GloatingSwine View Post
    People whose first instinct on buying literally any piece of technology is to install Linux on it.
    Surely: People whose first instinct on buying literally any piece of technology is to run Doom on it.
    Warning: This posting may contain wit, wisdom, pathos, irony, satire, sarcasm and puns. And traces of nut.

    "The main skill of a good ruler seems to be not preventing the conflagrations but rather keeping them contained enough they rate more as campfires." Rogar Demonblud

    "Hold on just a d*** second. UK has spam callers that try to get you to buy conservatories?!? Even y'alls spammers are higher class than ours!" Peelee

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    Default Re: Tech support compared with 40k

    Quote Originally Posted by Manga Shoggoth View Post
    Surely: People whose first instinct on buying literally any piece of technology is to run Doom on it.
    Then make a mod of a mod of Doom and play that as its own game?
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    Default Re: Tech support compared with 40k

    Now I'm kinda tempted to model some hereteks or admech who use the doom title screen as their banner. It's an old invocation of the machine spirit, used to test new cogitators.
    "In dark times, should the stars also go out?"

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    Default Re: Tech support compared with 40k

    Quote Originally Posted by Eldan View Post
    We have an HPLC on site that is 10 years out of warranty. The Post Doc who has been servicing that thing for the last five years (including her entire PhD) scares me. And yes, she's a full on Admech, too. Apparently, once the sampling-arm (an arrangement of pistons and a syringe, total about 20 cm or a bit less than a foot long, I don't know the official English name), went out of alignment and couldn't callibrate its position, so it started flailing around wildly enough that it broke the glass on the sample unit and started poking outside. She just cursed at it for about ten minutes solid while taking it apart and ad-hoc-ing it. She's not even a tech, officially, she's a biochemist.
    Hmmm, sounds a lot like my company...

    Quote Originally Posted by Eldan View Post
    And yeah, some of the "manuals" get scary. "So, we get salt deposition in this pump valve if we get use this solvent. Manufacturer wanted to sell us a new pump. Isntead, what we do is that once a month, we pull out this tube, then pull out the degasser unit, plus this solvent bottle here right into the pump head, disable this safety, , unsscrew these bolts, then we use this hot plate, heat ultrapure water to 55°C (with a thermometer duct-taped to it), unplug the FLD, and use this capillary that's below standard diameter to create some back pressure..."
    Wait, you have a safety on your pump system?
    I'd recommend fitting a dead column and running that straight to waste as swapping the tubing around for narrower ID stuff is just asking for trouble as someone is going to forget to replace it back after cleaning. I also find FLD modules a bit temperamental when reconnecting them, so I'd rather not mess about with connecting/disconnecting them.

    I also hope you don't have any important stainless steel parts in the flow path as that hot deionised water is gonna do a number on it.

    Can I ask what your piston shaft's made of? If you're getting leaking and salt deposition, I'd check for scoring and/or your pump seals aren't degraded.
    Last edited by Brother Oni; 2021-06-02 at 12:27 PM.

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    Default Re: Tech support compared with 40k

    Geez, we connect and disconnect our FLD before and after every series.
    "In dark times, should the stars also go out?"

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    Default Re: Tech support compared with 40k

    5 years ago I quit a job that instead of emailing a file to a customer to check product specs, would put it all on a floppy disc.
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    So where would the tyranids fit into all of this?
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    Default Re: Tech support compared with 40k

    Quote Originally Posted by Vizzerdrix View Post
    So where would the tyranids fit into all of this?
    The Tyranids fit into this as locusts. or kudzu. things like that. very different hardware.
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    Default Re: Tech support compared with 40k

    Quote Originally Posted by druid91 View Post
    At least I know in my time in tech support you never see more heresy then when something had to be fixed right away but they didn't think it would need to last.
    The worst thing about "temporary" fixes is how rarely the fix is actually temporary.
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    Default Re: Tech support compared with 40k

    Quote Originally Posted by Amidus Drexel View Post
    The worst thing about "temporary" fixes is how rarely the fix is actually temporary.
    And vice versa.
    Warning: This posting may contain wit, wisdom, pathos, irony, satire, sarcasm and puns. And traces of nut.

    "The main skill of a good ruler seems to be not preventing the conflagrations but rather keeping them contained enough they rate more as campfires." Rogar Demonblud

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    Default Re: Tech support compared with 40k

    Quote Originally Posted by Eldan View Post
    As for forgetting tech, absolutely true. NASA has to occasionally get some programmer from the 70s or something out of retirement because they are the only ones who can make sense of old code.

    Personal anecdote, I worked in a pharmaceutical company and we were obligated to keep all measurement data from quality assurance for lifetime of our products and, I think 25 years. (It's been a while.) Meanign that we also had to keep an old IBM server from the 80s in working condition, and a stack of magnetic tapes. We had exactly one guy in the company who knew how to fire up that old server, in case we ever got any auditors. It looked a lot like an AM ritual.
    Wouldn't magnetic tapes be hopelessly degraded by now regardless? I'm puzzled by why the data couldn't be transferred to a more modern format.
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    Default Re: Tech support compared with 40k

    Quote Originally Posted by Lacuna Caster View Post
    Wouldn't magnetic tapes be hopelessly degraded by now regardless? I'm puzzled by why the data couldn't be transferred to a more modern format.
    Because its a lot of work and people are lazy/cheap/foolish/all of the above.
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    Default Re: Tech support compared with 40k

    Quote Originally Posted by Lacuna Caster View Post
    Wouldn't magnetic tapes be hopelessly degraded by now regardless? I'm puzzled by why the data couldn't be transferred to a more modern format.
    Often the problem is converting the data is completely manual as there is no way to connect the source and destination formats/devices.
    The cost of and effort of converting is orders of a magnitude larger than just keeping some old stuff around for the few times it's needed.
    The problem lies in just that, it might be needed, or not, and you don't want to spend loads keeping data that you never end up needing.
    Especially in such cases where you don't continually and regularly move data into new systems.

    Quote Originally Posted by Keltest View Post
    Because its a lot of work and people are lazy/cheap/foolish/all of the above.
    I've seen similar things, I worked at place where they had to keep some old PCs as the only ones capable of running the old Paradox database system. Basically most of the old data wasn't particularly needed. There was little point in keeping up to date system clogged with the employment details of people who only worked 1 day in 1985. And then one day some insane person comes in and wants their employment history from the 1970s and you are digging in the archive because legally you have to provide it.

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    Default Re: Tech support compared with 40k

    Quote Originally Posted by snowblizz View Post
    Often the problem is converting the data is completely manual as there is no way to connect the source and destination formats/devices.
    The cost of and effort of converting is orders of a magnitude larger than just keeping some old stuff around for the few times it's needed.
    The problem lies in just that, it might be needed, or not, and you don't want to spend loads keeping data that you never end up needing.
    Especially in such cases where you don't continually and regularly move data into new systems.
    I'm fairly sure modern OCR could literally read stuff off a screen and convert it to a text file for further processing, so if you're capable of looking at the data at all it should be convertible in some sense. I mean, if you're legally obliged to provide the data and old formats are unstable and old machinery is going to break down sooner or later, what's the cost of a lawsuit?
    Give directly to the extreme poor.

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    ElfPirate

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    Default Re: Tech support compared with 40k

    Quote Originally Posted by Lacuna Caster View Post
    I'm fairly sure modern OCR could literally read stuff off a screen and convert it to a text file for further processing, so if you're capable of looking at the data at all it should be convertible in some sense. I mean, if you're legally obliged to provide the data and old formats are unstable and old machinery is going to break down sooner or later, what's the cost of a lawsuit?
    The problem is that "further processing". Someone has to interpret that data. And yes, that's the question, what's the cost of the lawsuit. In a lot of cases the answer is no where near as costly as spending time and effort translating the data. Often it's a calculated risk you take.

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