Are Archery Valor Bards any Good?

[Toadkiller]

To answer the original question- they are great if that’s what you want to play. Play what you want and don’t worry about the numbers.

[LudicSavant]

I assume it would look something like this:

Race: Half-Elf
Class: Hexblade 1, Valor Bard 19.
Ability Scores: 8 STR, 15+1 DEX, 13+1 CON, 8 INT, 11 WIS, 15+2 CHA.
ASI's (In no particular order): +2 CHA, Elven Accuracy (CHA), Sharpshooter, Crossbow expert, Medium Armor Master

Using spells like Quick Quiver, haste, or other combat spells.

Is this any good as a archer, or does the dpr of gloomstalker / fighter archers or hexbows outweigh the advantages of being a full caster in addition to archery?

Bard-chers are pretty good when done right. At minimum you're looking at a full spellcaster with a reliable 'cantrip.'

I guess my first question about your specific Bard-cher build plan would be "why pick Valor as the subclass if you're planning to dip Hexblade?"

[Jon talks a lot]

Bard-chers are pretty good when done right. At minimum you're looking at a full spellcaster with a reliable 'cantrip.'

I guess my first question about your specific Bard-cher build plan would be "why pick Valor as the subclass if you're planning to dip Hexblade?"

That's a good question that I didn't really think about. I suppose Swords would be better thanks to flourishes?

[Ganryu]

Simulacron.
Greater Steed (Magical secrets)
Haste (Magical Secrets)
Crossbow Mastery

14 attacks a turn at level 14. 7 if we want to go with the cheap DM. Yeah, I think we can do alright for damage.

[Dork_Forge]

Simulacron.
Greater Steed (Magical secrets)
Haste (Magical Secrets)
Crossbow Mastery

14 attacks a turn at level 14. 7 if we want to go with the cheap DM. Yeah, I think we can do alright for damage.

And how are you getting to 7 attacks a turn? Are you including mount attacks or something?

...You don't think the high cost (both investment and opportunity) and set up time of that claim is a problem?

[Ganryu]

And how are you getting to 7 attacks a turn? Are you including mount attacks or something?

...You don't think the high cost (both investment and opportunity) and set up time of that claim is a problem?

1 attack, lvl 1.
2 attacks, lvl 4 - Crossbow mastery
3 attacks, lvl 6 - extra attack
7 attacks, lvl 10. Greater Steed - peryton- 2 attacks & flyby ability. Haste gives you AND the steed an extra attack a turn. Also, speed boost, so getting the most out of fly by.

Cost of this build:
1 hand cross bow.
Haste has no gold components, neither does Greater Steed.

Your charisma can be lower, and your AC isn't too important. CON becomes super important though tbh. Might even grab Resilence- Con.

[Dork_Forge]

1 attack, lvl 1.
2 attacks, lvl 4 - Crossbow mastery
3 attacks, lvl 6 - extra attack
7 attacks, lvl 10. Greater Steed - peryton- 2 attacks & flyby ability. Haste gives you AND the steed an extra attack a turn. Also, speed boost, so getting the most out of fly by.

Cost of this build:
1 hand cross bow.
Haste has no gold components, neither does Greater Steed.

Your charisma can be lower, and your AC isn't too important. CON becomes super important though tbh. Might even grab Resilence- Con.

I wasn't strictly referring to gold cost, this build actually costs you:

-Two magical secrets

-An ASI, delaying your Dex when you don't have Archery to compensate

- A 3rd level slot and action to set up Haste, so that 7 attacks isn't happening on turn 1, you're actually losing breaking even on that turn if both the Peryton and Bard Haste attack.

-You're tied to a hand crossbow, smaller damage die, shorter ranges with no Sharpshooter in sight

-Lower Cha means worse casting and less inspiration dice, neither super important for your individual archery abilities, but if you're stiffing what you're meant to be good at, then why are you choosing a Bard at all?

And then... this isn't really about being an archer at all? 3 of the attacks are from a steed that requires you close to melee anyway, the whole gimmick supporting it would be useable by a PAM Valor Bard (that would have higher AC).

Otherwise... eh? Saying 7 attacks sounds impressive, but the Peryton attacks at +5 for subpar damage and the Bard is throwing out 1d6+5 at best. The VB just doesn't have any tools to capitalise on being a weapon damage dealer unless they spend magical secrets and slots to... sometimes kind of keep up with real martials?

[Ganryu]

I wasn't strictly referring to gold cost, this build actually costs you:

-Two magical secrets

-An ASI, delaying your Dex when you don't have Archery to compensate

- A 3rd level slot and action to set up Haste, so that 7 attacks isn't happening on turn 1, you're actually losing breaking even on that turn if both the Peryton and Bard Haste attack.

-You're tied to a hand crossbow, smaller damage die, shorter ranges with no Sharpshooter in sight

-Lower Cha means worse casting and less inspiration dice, neither super important for your individual archery abilities, but if you're stiffing what you're meant to be good at, then why are you choosing a Bard at all?

And then... this isn't really about being an archer at all? 3 of the attacks are from a steed that requires you close to melee anyway, the whole gimmick supporting it would be useable by a PAM Valor Bard (that would have higher AC).

Otherwise... eh? Saying 7 attacks sounds impressive, but the Peryton attacks at +5 for subpar damage and the Bard is throwing out 1d6+5 at best. The VB just doesn't have any tools to capitalise on being a weapon damage dealer unless they spend magical secrets and slots to... sometimes kind of keep up with real martials?

I mean, put it into math. At lvl 10, that's 7 attacks, which is still fairly impressive. And spells if you want it.



A PAM valor bard would be more MAD than this build. You only really need Dex/Cha maxed out (If that warlock level is taken, which honestly, I don't find neccessary) This means later, you can grab sharp shooter as well for 4 of your attacks. Heck, you even have room to grab at last level Fighting Initiate to get Archery, but would recomment 1 level of fighter instead.

Anyways, damage calculations.

7 attacks every turn:
1d6+4 * 4 = 46 damage per turn from you.
2d8+1d8+3+2d4+3 +1d8+3 = 31.5
77.5

Later on, Sharpshooter can get you to 86 damage.

Fighter at level 10.

Using polearm mastery + heavy weapon fighting + action surge.
9d10+50 + 20 + 2.5, all out nova.

122
Clear winner... except that is literally all your resources. After this awesome turn, it looks like
2d10+ 30 + 1d4 +12
55.

Bardcher is still doing 77.5, long as he doesn't get caught.

Now, not my favorite class in the world, but you can't say it's ineffective, it can more than give a fighter a run for his money in melee only damage output.

[Eldariel]

1 attack, lvl 1.
2 attacks, lvl 4 - Crossbow mastery
3 attacks, lvl 6 - extra attack
7 attacks, lvl 10. Greater Steed - peryton- 2 attacks & flyby ability. Haste gives you AND the steed an extra attack a turn. Also, speed boost, so getting the most out of fly by.

Cost of this build:
1 hand cross bow.
Haste has no gold components, neither does Greater Steed.

Your charisma can be lower, and your AC isn't too important. CON becomes super important though tbh. Might even grab Resilence- Con.

Haste? The number of attacks is a multiplier of damage. This build already has plenty of attacks - what you need is damage per hit. You 100% should pick up a damage boosting spell when going this route (Holy Weapon and Elemental Weapon are the two relevant options for your level 10 Magical Secrets). The Haste ability on our Steed doesn't really matter since it can't exactly use ranged weapons and if you're using ranged weapons, you won't be going to melee to hit things with it. As a bonus, both of the spells mentioned last an hour instead of minutes so they're something you can keep up between encounters conserving resources.

Magical Secrets and Elemental Weapon for a Bard to enhance himself is probably one of the most wasteful strategies I've heard of. That's not because they deal much less damage than a Fighter or something, but because a Bard's talents could be used for so much more than a +2-or-whatever attack bonus on themselves (as they proceed to actually attack maybe 2 rounds in what remains of that fight). Might as well go EK+Wizard by that point, at least you'll have some synergies for that playstyle.

I disagree. It's not an automatic choice but it's not a bad one. It's a 1 hour spell that casts off 3rd and 5th level slots that upcasts even to level 7 if needed and does damage at up to 600' range: if your party needs a ranged damage dealer, and the campaign makes ranged damage dealing good, they are what you should pick up (Elemental Weapon or Holy Weapon, of which Elemental Weapon makes Sharpshooter better). Obviously you pick up Greater Steed too.

Reasons why this is not a bad way to go:
- It lasts 1 hour making it very slot efficient (Summon Celestial is competitive though, but at ranges over 150' it can't get advantage, which is a significant damage handicap compared to a Sharpshooter)
- Few spells have an effective range of over 120' (this goes up to 600')
- There are times when you want to be effective at over 120' - kiting long range enemies, times when you want to kite long range enemies, etc. Basically every time you want to kill something dangerous up close without opening yourself up to it - your party will be much stronger if they can execute proper kiting strategies.
- Compared to EK, you are still a single full caster. Replacing every EK with a full caster is going to be a net power boost at least higher up.
- Compared to Wizard, well, you get access to non-Wizard buffs and Inspiration and skills and such. Wizard is still fine for the job, of course, and I'd never fault anyone for picking a Wizard but getting Greater Steed and such is nice (with all sources I'd definitely go Holy Weapon + FGS or Elemental Weapon + FGS as my MS on 10 if going this route, assuming others have the Walling covered already - again, this isn't something you do if you're the only caster in the party but something you do if you're the only long range damage dealer in the party that wants one).

Basically, archery is the one exception to "full caster with Extra Attack shouldn't build around it" because it does something casters generally have trouble doing - kills things at over 4 times their normal operational range. In other words, it expands the character's and the party's problem solving ability. This combined with casters' normal ability to kite or produce kiters (Haste, Longstrider, Phantom Steed, Find Greater Steed, etc.) makes this a brutal and efficient tactic that a well-rounded party should have access to. But it's more efficient to fill this role with a caster putting broadly a sixth of their resources into it than a warrior who puts all their resources into it and gets maybe slightly higher damage up until level 13-14.

Extra Attack alone isn't gonna win any damage contests but combined with damage buffs and a feat it's gonna get the job done compared to not having it (though there's of course Magic Jar but even up until Shapechange, putting resources into archery with EA actually pays off because the best Archer form for Shapechange, Planetar, doesn't bring its own ranged multiattack so to make full use of it, you do want Extra Attack on your chassis).


TL;DR: Party, not single character optimisation, and tactical versatility plus slot efficiency is why I'd argue picking up a damage buff from Magical Secrets isn't wrong and why I'd argue it's good for any of the full casters with Extra Attack to pick up Archery options when the case is such that the slot is open in the party.

[Dork_Forge]

I mean, put it into math. At lvl 10, that's 7 attacks, which is still fairly impressive. And spells if you want it.

Again, saying 7 attacks sounds impressive but that isn't happening on the first turn and a significant chunk of those attacks rely on a mount that has 33hp and a bad AC, that you have no way of protecting.

A PAM valor bard would be more MAD than this build. You only really need Dex/Cha maxed out (If that warlock level is taken, which honestly, I don't find neccessary) This means later, you can grab sharp shooter as well for 4 of your attacks. Heck, you even have room to grab at last level Fighting Initiate to get Archery, but would recomment 1 level of fighter instead.

Only one stat maxed huh? Assuming normal point buy progression (or just not assuming great rolls) that's maxing your primary stat at 12th level unless you lock yourself in to V.Human for the feat. Delaying your primary stat isn't the end of the world, but adds to the medicority in tiers 1 and 2.

Anyways, damage calculations.

7 attacks every turn:
1d6+4 * 4 = 46 damage per turn from you.
2d8+1d8+3+2d4+3 +1d8+3 = 31.5
77.5

Later on, Sharpshooter can get you to 86 damage.

So you're also assuming Dive Attack every time? Once the Peryton is hasted that isn't a bad assumption, but seems pretty environmentally reliant, no biggie either way.

Maybe I'm missing something, but 4d6+16 is an average of 30 damage, not 46.

Peryton is slightly better at 32, I'm not sure how you got a .5 with an even number of dice.

so round 2 onwards is 62, not 77.5, with a 3rd level slot and concentration used and assuming the Peryton is alive (being the softest target in a level 10 game that's actively attacking, I'd wager that isn't going to be the case for long).

Fighter at level 10.

Using polearm mastery + heavy weapon fighting + action surge.
9d10+50 + 20 + 2.5, all out nova.

122
Clear winner... except that is literally all your resources. After this awesome turn, it looks like
2d10+ 30 + 1d4 +12
55.

I assume that you meant to include Great Weapon Master in this? Though I'm not sure why you're comparing a PAM/GWM Fighter against an archer, is this because I mentioned PAM hitting the same number of attacks?

Fighter level 10: ASIs Dex +2, Dex +2, Sharpshooter, Archery

Standard turn: 2d8+30 for average 39

Nova round: 4d8+60 for average 78 damage with no set up required

Oh yeah, and this is at the worst comparison point for the Figher, immediately before they get 3 attacks as standard for their action and harder hitting novas.

This is also not accounting for accuracy, which the Valor Bard significantly falls behind in. I mean the Peryton has a +5 and the Valor Bard delayed Dex and no boosts to offset the Sharpshooter penalty, do you not think the lower accuracy has a pretty significant impact?

Bardcher is still doing 77.5, long as he doesn't get caught.

Now, not my favorite class in the world, but you can't say it's ineffective, it can more than give a fighter a run for his money in melee only damage output.

So, what is missing from this picture that so often happens in these discussions? This Fighter has no subclass.

Battlemaster? 5d10 to spend every short rest, most likely on directly adding damage dice (which can help capitalise on crits that would otherwise be lack lustre), but also the flexability of making Sharpshooter hit.

Eldritch Knight? At this level there's no reason why they couldn't be granting themselves a +1 weapon for increased Sharpshooter reliability/small damage bump, access to a familiar for occasional advantage depending on initiative and enemy proclivities.

Samurai? A reliable way to give yourself advantage for at least one turn every single combat.

Arcane Archer? Bonus damage and control effects, if multiple targets then greater hit reliability

Echo Knight? More attacks and superior placement

Rune Knight? Extra damage

Psi Warrior? Extra damage, control effects

So whilst the Valor Bard is behind the Fighter in effectiveness... pretty much all of the time out, when it can get competitive (literally at the least favourable level for martials) it's setting itself up for catastrophic failure.

Peryton gets shot out from under the Bard? Hello fall damage and a significant drop in damage

Concentration drops? This isn't really unlikely given a middling AC and Con save bonus, both the Bard and peryton can't do anything for a turn and... they both fall out of the sky (hello again fall damage) since the Peryton can't hover.

FGS here is in some ways a boon and in more ways a glaring weakness.

[dmhelp]

Holy weapon instead of elemental weapon?

[Waazraath]

Oh yeah, and this is at the worst comparison point for the Figher, immediately before they get 3 attacks as standard for their action and harder hitting novas.

Funny, same happened to me in this thread! Darn, what are the odds?!

Holy weapon instead of elemental weapon?

No, don't think so. 2d8 is better than 2d4, and there's the 'bonus action' thing which makes it much better in campaigns where players don't dictate the terms of combat. But losing +2 to hit is really painful for a build that utilizes Sharp Shooter. The lvl 10 bard in earlier examples would have a modifier of only +2 at level 10.

I don't think it's a bad choice though, if you skip SS altogether. If you use SS, you need better to hit (like elemental weapon, or magic weapon if that isn't available), or extra attacks (haste) or something to get advantage (improved invisibility).

[Oerlaf]

I’m pkaying Tasha’s winged tiefling (+2 dex, +1 cha) with 8 levels of bard and 2 in rogue.

1st action: greater invisibility and bonus action hide
next rounds: shoit twice with sharpshooter and bonus action hide

[Eldariel]

Funny, same happened to me in this thread! Darn, what are the odds?!

Obviously all levels should be considered. 14+ is gonna be caster-favoured; the key levels are 10, 11, 12, 13. 10 is as relevant a point as 11 - of course they should have equal weight. Still, even if the Fighter does deal more (as it probably will until 14), the question remains whether it's "more enough" compared to getting those 1-6 spell slots outside the buffing slots the Bard has. At the very least Bard doesn't fall very far behind at any point.

No, don't think so. 2d8 is better than 2d4, and there's the 'bonus action' thing which makes it much better in campaigns where players don't dictate the terms of combat. But losing +2 to hit is really painful for a build that utilizes Sharp Shooter. The lvl 10 bard in earlier examples would have a modifier of only +2 at level 10.

I don't think it's a bad choice though, if you skip SS altogether. If you use SS, you need better to hit (like elemental weapon, or magic weapon if that isn't available), or extra attacks (haste) or something to get advantage (improved invisibility).

It's worth noting that you can use SS situationally: it's worth it for the range and the cover ignoring alone. The -5/+10 is great but of course, it depends on target AC; e.g. against Tiamat I obviously didn't use it very often (only when double buffed and with Inspiration or advantage) since a 25 AC target is pretty rough to hit. OTOH firing some oozes or beasts or any such, you basically don't need any attack bonus for it to be worth it.

[Waazraath]

It's worth noting that you can use SS situationally: it's worth it for the range and the cover ignoring alone. The -5/+10 is great but of course, it depends on target AC;

This is true of course, and any player that wants to use it to full effect needs to estimate if using it will help DPR or reduce it. Also a fighter (with a higher 'to hit') might also face a foe with such a high AC that it is not worth it, and any character can face a foe with only a few hp left where using SS is just overkill (and thus needless risk), and rider effects may be involved which make it a better trade off not to have a higher miss chance (BM really wants to trip somebody, Battlesmith wanting to use a hit to heal a fallen ally for 2d6 hp, etc.).

In the context of the discussion though (maxing archer bard's DPR up to a level where it can almost compete with fighters) the bard really needs it. I don't think anything is wrong with a bard that just picks CBE (without other investments in dex or archery) and has the option to cast Holy Weapon with 3 ranged attacks for 1d6 + 2d8 + 3 with a decent chance to hit. It's versatile and often will have plenty of other options - tbh, I think it'll be in most parties a more useful addition than a bard that commits completely to archery. But it won't get near a fighter's damage, barring lvl 14+ simulacrum shenenigans, in a campaign which allows that.

[Eldariel]

I actually came to the conclusion that I rather wanted SS than CBE when picking one or the other (on both, Bladesinger and Valor Bard but not Swords Bard). The big advantage of archery is the range, and at long ranges you really want to both, be able to ignore all sorts of cover and the range disadvantage (admittedly you can easily get advantage to offset it but I definitely prefer trying to get advantage especially since it also goes so well with SS damage boost). Valor Bard isn't like Swords Bard in that he'd probably burn his Inspiration on free actions: you'll be using those as bonus actions. There are also some bonus action spells and other uses of bonus action. All this combined made me prefer Longbow and just not caring about CBE. This freed up a feat and let me use Archery for where it really matters: at ranges where I can't just solve an encounter with a spell.

EDIT: With Tasha's it's also possible to put that second feat into FI: Archery, which is fineish though of course pretty expensive. I'd generally just prefer an Elven Accuracy build of some sort.

[Stangler]

I actually came to the conclusion that I rather wanted SS than CBE when picking one or the other (on both, Bladesinger and Valor Bard but not Swords Bard). The big advantage of archery is the range, and at long ranges you really want to both, be able to ignore all sorts of cover and the range disadvantage (admittedly you can easily get advantage to offset it but I definitely prefer trying to get advantage especially since it also goes so well with SS damage boost). Valor Bard isn't like Swords Bard in that he'd probably burn his Inspiration on free actions: you'll be using those as bonus actions. There are also some bonus action spells and other uses of bonus action. All this combined made me prefer Longbow and just not caring about CBE. This freed up a feat and let me use Archery for where it really matters: at ranges where I can't just solve an encounter with a spell.

EDIT: With Tasha's it's also possible to put that second feat into FI: Archery, which is fineish though of course pretty expensive. I'd generally just prefer an Elven Accuracy build of some sort.

I have been considering building a Valor Bard and was thinking that Xbow expert didn't seem to make sense for the reasons you stated. i.e. you want range, you need ASIs, and you have other uses of your bonus action(inspiration/spells).

What do other players think?

[Eldariel]

I have been considering building a Valor Bard and was thinking that Xbow expert didn't seem to make sense for the reasons you stated. i.e. you want range, you need ASIs, and you have other uses of your bonus action(inspiration/spells).

What do other players think?

The question is really, how much of an archer you want to be. If you want to be an archer with spells, then you obviously want Xbow Expert. If you want to be a caster with a solid long range option, Xbow Expert is largely redundant. Of course, it comes down to a question of what you want to do at those mid range targets, which is again largely a party composition question. Does the party have e.g. a Druid, a Cleric or a Wizard with some summons or perhaps a Paladin or a Barbarian to clean up at low-mid range needing only someone to cover the long range? XBE is probably redundant. Does the party only have you as a damage dealer at all ranges? There's an argument to be made about doubling up on short range damage with XBE (it's really good on Tier 1 and slowly fades away into becoming only decent higher up).

Bard chassis innately adds a decent amount of damage to the party but it requires another damage dealer to dump Inspiration on (to hit boosting Inspiration on a GWM or SS user is pretty massive - every point of inspiration is often 20+ damage dealt), which generally means Valor Bard does want other significant damage dealers in the party to truly maximise their own damage output (though using Inspiration defensively and for utility has a lot of value too: but generally to make the most of it you want the offensive option on the table as well). Of course, this can be something like a big summon or a Polymorphed ally for most levels too - but small mass summons lend themselves poorly to hit since single hit non-resource damage is what really matters (non-resource, since resource damage like Smite and "first hit"-damage like Sneak Attack generally adds up to an almost fixed amount anyways since you are rarely smiting on every attack anyways so as long as one attack hits, you probably will do about as much anyways especially on Tier 2 where this matters the most).

[Stangler]

The question is really, how much of an archer you want to be. If you want to be an archer with spells, then you obviously want Xbow Expert. If you want to be a caster with a solid long range option, Xbow Expert is largely redundant. Of course, it comes down to a question of what you want to do at those mid range targets, which is again largely a party composition question. Does the party have e.g. a Druid, a Cleric or a Wizard with some summons or perhaps a Paladin or a Barbarian to clean up at low-mid range needing only someone to cover the long range? XBE is probably redundant. Does the party only have you as a damage dealer at all ranges? There's an argument to be made about doubling up on short range damage with XBE (it's really good on Tier 1 and slowly fades away into becoming only decent higher up).

Bard chassis innately adds a decent amount of damage to the party but it requires another damage dealer to dump Inspiration on (to hit boosting Inspiration on a GWM or SS user is pretty massive - every point of inspiration is often 20+ damage dealt), which generally means Valor Bard does want other significant damage dealers in the party to truly maximise their own damage output (though using Inspiration defensively and for utility has a lot of value too: but generally to make the most of it you want the offensive option on the table as well). Of course, this can be something like a big summon or a Polymorphed ally for most levels too - but small mass summons lend themselves poorly to hit since single hit non-resource damage is what really matters (non-resource, since resource damage like Smite and "first hit"-damage like Sneak Attack generally adds up to an almost fixed amount anyways since you are rarely smiting on every attack anyways so as long as one attack hits, you probably will do about as much anyways especially on Tier 2 where this matters the most).

Honestly looking at the bard spell list and there is really very few bonus action spells so the opportunity to mix spell casting and attacks seems limited for levels 1 to 9. This leaves Hand Xbow as a much more attractive option. It still eats an ASI/Feat so this makes the class dependent on DEX/CHA and two feats (SS/XBOW) which pushes builds toward V Human and maybe even a Hexblade dip to stop being MAD.

[Eldariel]

Honestly looking at the bard spell list and there is really very few bonus action spells so the opportunity to mix spell casting and attacks seems limited for levels 1 to 9. This leaves Hand Xbow as a much more attractive option. It still eats an ASI/Feat so this makes the class dependent on DEX/CHA and two feats (SS/XBOW) which pushes builds toward V Human and maybe even a Hexblade dip to stop being MAD.

True, but Inspiration is bonus action and on Tier 2, it's 3+ times per short rest which is a fairly significant amount; 3 rounds in every short rest is about 1/3rd of the rounds if using it for combat mostly. Bard list does indeed have very few bonus actions, but there's one extremely relevant low level spell basically every Bard will know and that's Healing Word. The other real option is if you went Fey-Touched (17 Cha or something): that would net you Misty Step and Hex, both of which are useful low level bonus actions.

[Thunderous Mojo]

An Orc's Aggressive trait in conjunction with Mobile Flourish can yield an extreme amount of movement....essentially 3x times movement.

Goblin could also add some Bonus Action options.

An Eberron, Mark of Making human would compliment Eladriel's build.
The dragonmark adds Continual Flame, Conjure Barrage, and Elemental Weapon to the spell list.

You would also get a Concentration free Magic Weapon once per day to enchant your backup weapon for when things go FUBAR.

Arrows with Continual Flame cast on them, Alleviate many difficulties that can arise.

[SpawnOfMorbo]

I assume it would look something like this:

Race: Half-Elf
Class: Hexblade 1, Valor Bard 19.
Ability Scores: 8 STR, 15+1 DEX, 13+1 CON, 8 INT, 11 WIS, 15+2 CHA.
ASI's (In no particular order): +2 CHA, Elven Accuracy (CHA), Sharpshooter, Crossbow expert, Medium Armor Master

Using spells like Quick Quiver, haste, or other combat spells.

Is this any good as a archer, or does the dpr of gloomstalker / fighter archers or hexbows outweigh the advantages of being a full caster in addition to archery?

Pretty much anything is good. Don't worry about it. You have team mates so your base DPR doesn't really matter so much as the collective team working together.