A Monster for Every Season: Summer 2
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  1. - Top - End - #181
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    Default Re: Werewolf/Mafia: Percy Jackson

    Huh. This kind of backfired, didn't it? (Well, I was pretty screwed before, so I guess the net result in relation to my death is pretty much zero).

    The funny thing is I'm not actually a wolf (though I'm sure they're loving me at the moment), I just tried to come up with a defense where I didn't have to admit I was netural and have people screw up my win-condition. But I realize my credibility right now is literally in the negatives so I won't push the issue. I'll just hang back, make some snarky comments until my death and then hope a Child of Hades gets lonely, I guess.

  2. - Top - End - #182
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    Default Re: Werewolf/Mafia: Percy Jackson

    Quote Originally Posted by JeenLeen View Post
    This could be a technicality in that the Neutrals are, in a sense, unlisted, but the sample ones are in play. So this is a way to sorta say what is meant, but not explicitly confirm or deny that the named Neutrals are active.
    gac3, care to confirm?
    Also, can we get confirmation that no named Roles are duplicated? E.g., it's impossible that Batcathat and Libro are both telling the truth?
    Confirm. A neutral may come from the list of hypothetical neutrals I provided but do not have to.
    No named roles were duplicated. This is explicitly why the child of Demeter role was doubled in the OP.

    Quote Originally Posted by Valmark View Post

    That's actually a good question. @gac3, do neutrals count for winning regarding wolves reaching the maiority? (Sorry if this was already said).
    This was not already said. Wolves need the majority but the neutrals will be a special case. If counting them doesn't seem like it will change the results, then they won't be counted. If however they are fighting to extend the game to try to achieve their win or something, then they will likely be counted until the wolves/wolf sided neutrals outnumber the town/town sided neutrals. Does that make sense? At this point they won't explicitly count or not count. It's more a play it by ear kinda thing.

  3. - Top - End - #183
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    Default Re: Werewolf/Mafia: Percy Jackson

    Quote Originally Posted by Batcathat View Post
    Huh. This kind of backfired, didn't it? (Well, I was pretty screwed before, so I guess the net result in relation to my death is pretty much zero).

    The funny thing is I'm not actually a wolf (though I'm sure they're loving me at the moment), I just tried to come up with a defense where I didn't have to admit I was netural and have people screw up my win-condition. But I realize my credibility right now is literally in the negatives so I won't push the issue. I'll just hang back, make some snarky comments until my death and then hope a Child of Hades gets lonely, I guess.
    I wanna see if I understand you correctly. You not only claimed to be a power that honest-to-god looks like the typical Devil power...

    ...you were fakeclaiming it?



    EDIT: Well, that makes 3 neutral claims...
    Last edited by AvatarVecna; 2021-06-02 at 12:47 PM.


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  4. - Top - End - #184
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    Default Re: Werewolf/Mafia: Percy Jackson

    Quote Originally Posted by Valmark View Post
    Gotcha, thanks ^^ what about neutrals regarding wolf win?

    Meaning if there are 5 Town, 3 Neutrals and 6 Wolves (completely made-up numbers, 7 wolves sound way too many) would the wolves win or would the game keep going?
    So in this specific example, the wolves wouldn't win if the neutrals were actively helping town. But wolves would win if the neutrals were either staying neutral or helping the wolves.

  5. - Top - End - #185
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    NecromancerGirl

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    Default Re: Werewolf/Mafia: Percy Jackson

    I'm changing my vote, Batcathat seems to have a potentially useful ability.
    Even though I am a necromancer, I am not a member of the Coven. In fact, my entire coven disbanded, so my alignment changed to Chaotic Good.

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    Last Updated: September 27th, 2021 @1:49 PM

  6. - Top - End - #186
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    Default Re: Werewolf/Mafia: Percy Jackson

    Quote Originally Posted by AvatarVecna View Post
    I wanna see if I understand you correctly. You not only claimed to be a power that honest-to-god looks like the typical Devil power...

    ...you were fakeclaiming it?
    That would be a correct description of, and reaction, to the events, yes. I had some reasons, but it was admittedly a desperate, hail-mary type plan, since I was drowning in votes at the time.

    Quote Originally Posted by EmmyNecromancer View Post
    I'm changing my vote, Batcathat seems to have a potentially useful ability.
    Is it my amazing ability to make people vote for me?

  7. - Top - End - #187
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    Default Re: Werewolf/Mafia: Percy Jackson

    I've been pondering why Batcathat would fakeclaim.
    But if wolf!Batcathat really thought he was going to get lynched, I can see him fakeclaiming in order to at least gain intel for the wolves. By fakeclaiming, he gets a counterclaim and the wolves now know who the real Child of Athena is.

    Of course, other possibilities exist, but I can see this as a smart way to maximize a death.
    Still think Libro did the right thing in counterclaiming. Just noting this to try to think of why Batcathat might make fakeclaim, when Batcathat presumably has a safe Role he could claim (since no Roles are definitely wolf or town.)

    On the other hand, wolf!Libro fakeclaiming to get Batcathat killed seems very odd and little value. It's not like he reveals alignment.
    Unless he's a Neutral who wants to kill the specific Role that Batcathat has... but that seems unlikely. Possible, but unlikely he's lucky enough the person he wants dead happened to claim D1.

    EDIT: massively ninja'd. Will rethink later
    Last edited by JeenLeen; 2021-06-02 at 12:49 PM.

  8. - Top - End - #188
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    Default Re: Werewolf/Mafia: Percy Jackson

    Quote Originally Posted by Batcathat View Post
    Huh. This kind of backfired, didn't it? (Well, I was pretty screwed before, so I guess the net result in relation to my death is pretty much zero).

    The funny thing is I'm not actually a wolf (though I'm sure they're loving me at the moment), I just tried to come up with a defense where I didn't have to admit I was netural and have people screw up my win-condition. But I realize my credibility right now is literally in the negatives so I won't push the issue. I'll just hang back, make some snarky comments until my death and then hope a Child of Hades gets lonely, I guess.
    But why challenge the counterclaimer afterwards?
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  9. - Top - End - #189
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    Default Re: Werewolf/Mafia: Percy Jackson

    Actually, after a touch more thought, I'm inclined to think Batcathat really is a wolf and this is a last-ditch effort to let him live as a neutral.
    Eh, I don't have much dog in this fight, I guess... I'd still like us to try to do a tie in hopes that we confirm EmmyNecromancer. I guess it's not as bad if Apollo's kid screws up the votecount now.

    On that note, gac3: would we see the vote-counts with the modification, and thus know if a Child of Apollo voted because the total number of votes on someone would be 1 more than the number of voters?

  10. - Top - End - #190
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    Default Re: Werewolf/Mafia: Percy Jackson

    Quote Originally Posted by gac3 View Post
    This was not already said. Wolves need the majority but the neutrals will be a special case. If counting them doesn't seem like it will change the results, then they won't be counted. If however they are fighting to extend the game to try to achieve their win or something, then they will likely be counted until the wolves/wolf sided neutrals outnumber the town/town sided neutrals. Does that make sense? At this point they won't explicitly count or not count. It's more a play it by ear kinda thing.
    The way I'm interpreting this (and the way I've seen people do it in the past) is that wolves win if it's guaranteed they'll be able to kill all townies. Normally if wolves outnumber town then they control both the lynch and the NK, so they win because town can't stop them. But if neutrals can prevent wolves from killing all the townies, then wolves don't win even if they outnumber town.
    gac, does that sound right to you?

    Quote Originally Posted by Batcathat View Post
    Huh. This kind of backfired, didn't it? (Well, I was pretty screwed before, so I guess the net result in relation to my death is pretty much zero).

    The funny thing is I'm not actually a wolf (though I'm sure they're loving me at the moment), I just tried to come up with a defense where I didn't have to admit I was netural and have people screw up my win-condition. But I realize my credibility right now is literally in the negatives so I won't push the issue. I'll just hang back, make some snarky comments until my death and then hope a Child of Hades gets lonely, I guess.
    Yeah, I'm keeping my vote on you. Mind telling us your actual power/wincon, though? Mostly for my own curiosity, I'm having trouble imagining an answer that would cause me to move my vote.

    Also, there's more than 24 hours left in the day, it's pretty early to panic and claim, especially with a fakeclaim, and especially given the amount of vote movement that's been happening...
    I'm Chaotic Good! Ish!

  11. - Top - End - #191
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    Default Re: Werewolf/Mafia: Percy Jackson

    Xihirli, somebody stole your schtick and fakeclaimed devil.


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  12. - Top - End - #192
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    Default Re: Werewolf/Mafia: Percy Jackson

    Quote Originally Posted by EmmyNecromancer View Post
    I'm changing my vote, Batcathat seems to have a potentially useful ability.
    I... don't think they claimed any ability for their supposed neutral role? They claimed Child of Athena, yeah, but it's pretty clear that's not their real ability.
    I'm Chaotic Good! Ish!

  13. - Top - End - #193
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    Default Re: Werewolf/Mafia: Percy Jackson

    Quote Originally Posted by Elenna View Post
    The way I'm interpreting this (and the way I've seen people do it in the past) is that wolves win if it's guaranteed they'll be able to kill all townies. Normally if wolves outnumber town then they control both the lynch and the NK, so they win because town can't stop them. But if neutrals can prevent wolves from killing all the townies, then wolves don't win even if they outnumber town.
    gac, does that sound right to you?.
    Basically yeah. Put way better than I did. It's a concept I understand in my head and don't always know how to translate it to application.

  14. - Top - End - #194
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    Default Re: Werewolf/Mafia: Percy Jackson

    Quote Originally Posted by Valmark View Post
    But why challenge the counterclaimer afterwards?
    Some slim hope that I could talk myself out of it, I guess? But then people piled on with some pretty logical arguments (if there's an upside to this, it's that I'm learning so much for future games) that I couldn't really counter.

    Quote Originally Posted by Elenna View Post
    Yeah, I'm keeping my vote on you. Mind telling us your actual power/wincon, though? Mostly for my own curiosity, I'm having trouble imagining an answer that would cause me to move my vote.
    Sure, why not?

    Child of Iris: Your mother is in charge of the main means of communication for the gods and their children.You have the ability to listen to the Iris network.
    Each night you gain access to two random player-made QTs. They will not be informed of this unless you choose to inform them.

    You are Neutral. You win when you can correctly identify each player as belonging to Town, Wolf or Neutral factions. You can only guess once and if you are incorrect you will automatically die the following night.

    Quote Originally Posted by Elenna View Post
    Also, there's more than 24 hours left in the day, it's pretty early to panic and claim, especially with a fakeclaim, and especially given the amount of vote movement that's been happening...
    Yes, that's probably true. I was actually planning on waiting a little but... well, I kind of did panic and claim, I guess.

  15. - Top - End - #195
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    Default Re: Werewolf/Mafia: Percy Jackson

    Quote Originally Posted by Batcathat View Post
    Child of Iris: Your mother is in charge of the main means of communication for the gods and their children.You have the ability to listen to the Iris network.
    Each night you gain access to two random player-made QTs. They will not be informed of this unless you choose to inform them.

    You are Neutral. You win when you can correctly identify each player as belonging to Town, Wolf or Neutral factions. You can only guess once and if you are incorrect you will automatically die the following night.
    If you are a wolf and made that up, brilliant move. It's weird enough that it's hard to believe it's made-up. But also almost completely untestable. Or, well, I guess we could let you live and you post something in the two QTs to let us know you are who you say. If you're a lying wolf, your wolf-buddies have to out themselves to cover for your lies. If you're not a lying wolf... well, no harm in letting you live.
    I reckon the best win strategy for you is to wait until the game is nearly over to guess. You can guess 100% accuracy the alignment of the dead players, and, near the end, it should be clear enough. Er, maybe.
    Though I guess the lie could just be your win-con (and maybe your parent/sponsor), and you're a serial killer with a QT-infiltration power. But that seems odd.

    I'd feel better if we knew if you or EmmyNecromancer were lying. Both of your win-cons (assuming we guessed hers correctly) don't really give any incentive for folk to kill you. There's no reason not to claim, since no risk involved. While it's possible Neutrals were made with no risk of claiming, it's... poor design, as, well, a Neutral needs some reason to not claim to just not become a third party (beyond the reason that being known as Neutral might make folk kill you in case you lie about your power/win-con.)
    For me... well, Apogee knows the details of my Role and how it could potentially give incentive for somebody to kill me. That's also the reason I'm not publicly stating the details of my role.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Also, EmmyNecromancer, want to share the exact text of your neutral "Child of X" text?
    Because Batcathat's is rather different format than mine. It could be that I'm a Champion, not a Child... but it seems oddly different, especially the formatting around the Win Condition.

  16. - Top - End - #196
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    Default Re: Werewolf/Mafia: Percy Jackson

    Batcathat this massively simplified the amount of thought I had to put into this game. Batcathat definitely deserves to be lynched today.
    Last edited by totadileplayz; 2021-06-02 at 05:57 PM.

  17. - Top - End - #197
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    Default Re: Werewolf/Mafia: Percy Jackson

    I finaly got home from work, trying to catch up to the things that happened.

  18. - Top - End - #198
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    Default Re: Werewolf/Mafia: Percy Jackson

    Quote Originally Posted by totadileplayz View Post
    Batcathat this massively simplified the amount of thought I had to put into this game. Batcathat definitely deserves to be lynched today.
    This feels like when someone reads the first few sentences of an article and reacts in the comment section, but their comment was exactly addressed later on. The vote is solid and I'm NOT getting scum reads on totadileplayz from this, just feels off.

  19. - Top - End - #199
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    Default Re: Werewolf/Mafia: Percy Jackson

    Much as I'd love to drink a Valmark's Throat Smoothie, it seems as though we've got at best a coin flip here. So either BatCatHat is a wolf or Libro is.

    EDIT: Oh, I see BatCatHat has actually confessed to faking their claim. So that... Libro gets pretty big town points in my eyes for doing their town duties whether or not BatCatHat ends up being a wolf.
    Last edited by Xihirli; 2021-06-02 at 01:54 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zar Peter View Post
    Supagoof took the most blows and incidentally took exactly the same damage Xihirli inflicted.
    Quote Originally Posted by Silent_Interim View Post
    Xihirli: Being a better target since 2015.
    Quote Originally Posted by Elenna View Post
    Xihirli, bastion of murder and betrayal.
    Quote Originally Posted by BasketOfPuppies View Post
    Wow I missed a lot today. So, kill Xihirli?
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    Nobody else is gonna be right behind me, right now. Only Xihirli.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rogan View Post
    If Xi and I agree some more, I will start to doubt my own alignment!
    Quote Originally Posted by flat_footed View Post
    I still prefer to see you as the dagger hanging over us all, Xi.

  20. - Top - End - #200
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    Default Re: Werewolf/Mafia: Percy Jackson

    Quote Originally Posted by rogue_alchemist View Post
    This feels like when someone reads the first few sentences of an article and reacts in the comment section, but their comment was exactly addressed later on. The vote is solid and I'm NOT getting scum reads on totadileplayz from this, just feels off.
    The fact they admitted to fake claiming doesn't exactly help their case, as I believe it is far more reasonable for a neutral to claim neutral then to get in this mess In the first place. As such I felt that the best choice was batcathat.

  21. - Top - End - #201
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    Default Re: Werewolf/Mafia: Percy Jackson

    Quote Originally Posted by Xihirli View Post
    EDIT: Oh, I see BatCatHat has actually confessed to faking their claim. So that... Libro gets pretty big town points in my eyes for doing their town duties whether or not BatCatHat ends up being a wolf.
    I won't try to convince anyone, but when I die and flip neutral, you should probably at least consider the possibility of Libro being a wolfy Athena child and my stupid ass giving a great opportunity to build town cred with little or no risk.

    Not saying it must be like that, but at least keep it in mind.

    EDIT:

    Quote Originally Posted by totadileplayz View Post
    The fact they admitted to fake claiming doesn't exactly help their case, as I believe it is far more reasonable for a neutral to claim neutral then to get in this mess In the first place. As such I felt that the best choice was batcathat.
    Yeah, I can see that now. Lesson learned, at least.
    Last edited by Batcathat; 2021-06-02 at 02:01 PM.

  22. - Top - End - #202
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    SwashbucklerGuy

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    Default Re: Werewolf/Mafia: Percy Jackson

    Batcathatís re-claim is a lie. Iíve received an earlier neutral claim from a different child of Iris.

  23. - Top - End - #203
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    Default Re: Werewolf/Mafia: Percy Jackson

    Quote Originally Posted by Batcathat View Post
    I won't try to convince anyone, but when I die and flip neutral, you should probably at least consider the possibility of Libro being a wolfy Athena child and my stupid ass giving a great opportunity to build town cred with little or no risk.

    Not saying it must be like that, but at least keep it in mind.
    Fair point. Counterclaiming is a safe and towncred-y move, while not necessarily logically yielding towncred.
    Libro.
    Last edited by JeenLeen; 2021-06-02 at 02:32 PM.

  24. - Top - End - #204
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    Default Re: Werewolf/Mafia: Percy Jackson

    This also means we donít test Emmy today, because itís more important to get the guaranteed wolf role out with a high degree of confidence.

  25. - Top - End - #205
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    Default Re: Werewolf/Mafia: Percy Jackson

    Quote Originally Posted by Apogee1 View Post
    Batcathatís re-claim is a lie. Iíve received an earlier neutral claim from a different child of Iris.
    I mean, it looked strongly like a lie before this anyway.

    Also there could be more children of Iris.
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  26. - Top - End - #206
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    Default Re: Werewolf/Mafia: Percy Jackson

    After all this, I am no longer backing BatCatHat.

    If we want to use this Day for something more, we can set up a tie between Emmy and BatCat. Emmy can hopefully prove her power (though I think we're still waiting on some info from her) and BatCat will get lynched anyway. Or Emmy is lying about her power and we get a wolf that way.




    Vote Count:

    Rogue_Alchemist (2): Flat_Footed, BookWombat
    Valmark (1): Zelphas
    Batcathat (9): EmmyNecromancer, Murska, Apogee1, AvatarVecna, Valmark, Elenna, Rogue_Alchemist, Totadileplayz, Xihirli, CaoimhinTheCape
    Totadileplayz (1): Batcathat
    BookWombat (2): Libro,
    Xirili (2): Rogan, Mornshine
    CaoimhinTheCape (2): Snowblaze, Bladescape
    EmmyNecromancer (2): Jeenleen, Shal06
    Last edited by CaoimhinTheCape; 2021-06-02 at 05:18 PM.

  27. - Top - End - #207
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    Default Re: Werewolf/Mafia: Percy Jackson

    Quote Originally Posted by Valmark View Post
    I mean, it looked strongly like a lie before this anyway.

    Also there could be more children of Iris.
    Right but something something Occamís razor. Also we have like 4 other neutrals claimed to exist in some way, and I doubt these exactly overlap. And, the other child of Iris has a different claimed win condition. So yeah, pretty confident calling it fake.

  28. - Top - End - #208
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    Default Re: Werewolf/Mafia: Percy Jackson

    Ninja'd a lot, but I still think we can test Emmy if Apogee (the most trusted townie right now) organizes the vote.




    Vote Count:

    Rogue_Alchemist (2): Flat_Footed, BookWombat
    Valmark (1): Zelphas
    Batcathat (9): EmmyNecromancer, Murska, Apogee1, AvatarVecna, Valmark, Elenna, Rogue_Alchemist, Totadileplayz, Xihirli, CaoimhinTheCape
    Totadileplayz (1): Batcathat
    BookWombat (1): Libro
    Xirili (2): Rogan, Mornshine
    CaoimhinTheCape (2): Snowblaze, Bladescape
    EmmyNecromancer (1): Shal06
    Libro (1): Jeenleen
    Last edited by CaoimhinTheCape; 2021-06-02 at 02:24 PM. Reason: typos

  29. - Top - End - #209
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    Default Re: Werewolf/Mafia: Percy Jackson

    Fun idea, but probably not feasible.

    There's 21 players. 1 of which is probably the vote-manip Child of Apollo. Let's hope they claimed to Apogee.
    10 of us vote Batcathat.
    10 of us vote someone else. I would lean Libro, but I guess he's basically town-vetted since batcathat suggested he's lying... so... Valmark had some heat and Xi asked to be lynched, so maybe one of them? Or we vote on whoever the most inactive (flat_footed or BookWombat) voted, since they might not be able to change their vote. Oh, and those both voted for rogue_alchemist, so that's easy.
    Child of Apollo votes a third party.

    If all goes as planned:
    -EmmyNecromancer fixes the tie to lynch Batcathat. She maybe exits the game. We presumably get a wolf.
    -Child of Apollo gets verified as his Role. Not sure if this is a good or bad thing.
    Even if Batcathat is a wolf and a scumbuddy wants to not play ball to save him, they really can't because doing so would get them lynched D2. If we agree to this, everyone has to play ball.

    I loathe changing my vote so many times, but rogue_alchemistto try to make this feasible.
    But I really doubt we'll get enough agreement to go this route. I understand folk want to get the wolf dead and not risk it to a possible-Neutral or (if she's lying) a coinflip.
    Last edited by JeenLeen; 2021-06-02 at 10:52 PM.

  30. - Top - End - #210
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    Default Re: Werewolf/Mafia: Percy Jackson

    Quote Originally Posted by JeenLeen View Post
    Fun idea, but probably not feasible.

    There's 21 players. 1 of which is probably the vote-manip Child of Apollo. Let's hope they claimed to Apogee.
    10 of us vote Batcathat.
    10 of us vote someone else. I would lean Libro, but I guess he's basically town-vetted since batcathat suggested he's lying... so... Valmark had some heat and Xi asked to be lynched, so maybe one of them? Or we vote on whoever the most inactive (flat_footed or BookWombat) voted, since they might not be able to change their vote. Oh, and those both voted for rogue_alchemist, so that's easy.
    Child of Apollo votes a third party.

    If all goes as planned:
    -EmmyNecromancer fixes the tie to lynch Batcathat. She maybe exits the game. We presumably get a wolf.
    -Child of Apollo gets verified as his Role. Not sure if this is a good or bad thing.
    Even if Batcathat is a wolf and a scumbuddy wants to not play ball to save him, they really can't because doing so would get them lynched D2. If we agree to this, everyone has to play ball.

    I loathe changing my vote so many times, but rogue_alchemistto try to make this feasible.
    But I really doubt we'll get enough agreement to go this route. I understand folk want to get the wolf dead and not risk it to a possible-Neutral or (if she's lying) a coinflip.
    That is not at all what I'm suggesting.

    11 of us vote BatCat
    10 of us vote Emmy

    Apogee makes sure that the person who claims being doublevoter is on Emmy.

    If Emmy has the ability as her Neutral to decide ties, she will pick for BatCat to die.
    Everyone knows that the doublevoter was on Emmy.

    If Emmy is lying, then it goes to a coinflip between two claimed Neutrals including an Emmy who lied.

    If the doublevoter lies and is voting Emmy anyway, same scenario as above. If doublevoter lies and is voting BatCat then BatCat dies.

    I don't see how there's a downside?

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