The LA Assignment Thread XI: Better LA'd Than Never

[danielxcutter]

Eh... actually going to vote MM6. We need a break from reviewing weird undead, and no DMGII wasn't enough for that.

[Emberlily]

Miniature's Handbook I'm voting for if it's leaning towards a variety of low HD stuff.

[Bavarian itP]

Miniatures Handbook is it for me, too.

[TiaC]

Put me down for MM6, lot of interesting critters there and enough variation that it shouldn't get stale.

[Debatra]

MM6 is starting to pull away, and I kind of want to do that anyway. Also, a good chunk of these don't have their own pictures, so the floodgates are basically open for whatever jokes we can come up with.

Eh... actually going to vote MM6. We need a break from reviewing weird undead, and no DMGII wasn't enough for that.

Unfortunately, MM6 starts with exactly that. But then it's a good (or possibly bad) thirteen entries until the next one.

[Debatra]

Acheri

Another undead, but just a variant Ghost. Simple enough that I'm not even bothering with the table.

The spirits of girls who died to murder, accident, or plague. I imagine that would be the vast majority of deaths for NPCs that don't make it to old age. They don't get any of the standard Ghost Abilities aside from Manifestation and a variant Corrupting Touch. Their touch deals 1d4 damage and infects the victim with a disease with no incubation period. DCs are Charisma-based.

Each Archerai has a different disease, chosen from Blinding Sickness, Cackle Fever, Filth Fever, Mindfire, Red Ache, Shakes, or Slimy Doom.

The standard Ghost got +3/+4, depending mainly on Frostburn. Diseases are usually negligible, but instant incubation basically means it's some non-stacking ability damage attached to their natural weapon. And of course Blinding Sickness has a 3/4 chance of causing another save vs permanent blindness.

WotC LA: -
Our LA: +3

[Tzardok]

Does anybody have a link to the MM6?

[loky1109]

Archeri

Founds here: https://archive.wizards.com/dnd/files/mahasarpa.zip. Link in Thurbane's compilation post is broken.

Does anybody have a link to the MM6?

https://forums.giantitp.com/showthread.php?567712


Thurbane, I looked in your MM6 list and there are broken several more links. All these links have no archive in beginning and lead to zip downloads.

[Beni-Kujaku]

The girl on this picture seems to be a pleasure to live with.

It is much weaker than a ghost, with no Malevolence and Horrific Appearance, but I don't think the defenses and incorporeality plus the disease is worth only +2. I vote a weak LA +3 for the Acheri.

[Thurbane]

I'm happy to give this critter same as standard Ghost, LA +3/+4.

I wonder what the mythological origins of Acheri are? I remember an episode of Supernatural where the Acheri got very briefly mentioned. Brief search shows it's from Indian mythology. Interesting. I wonder if Achaierai came from the same route word, but the devs just decided to make it a completely different monster?

Thurbane, I looked in your MM6 list and there are broken several more links. All these links have no archive in beginning and lead to zip downloads.

Yeah, a lot of the links have gone down since I first posted it.

The zips are (or should be) to the web enhancements or adventures where the monsters can be found.

For the ones that are completely broken, we may have to use Wayback Machine, or other sources.

The free adventures, in particular, can be difficult to track down, and I didn't want to link to any questionable sites on my list. I have them all downloaded from back in the day, luckily.

[Efrate]

I will go +3. It's weaker than a standard ghost, but depending on how the disease touch is it might be quite good. Instant disease that saves based on stats is good, kind of a super poison, but can it reapply and reforce saves each round? If no I think this might drop to +2, if yes +3.

[Debatra]

but can it reapply and reforce saves each round?

There's no 24-hour immunity clause, so you can definitely force healthy people to make a new save for each hit, but... Actually, now that I check, the disease rules don't actually say you can't be infected with a disease you already have. We can probably just file that one under "RAW is Silly" though.

[Blue Jay]

Side Note: If we want to be extremely thorough, DMG2 also has the Mob template, so we should probably also give that template an LA (certainly -0, yeah?). Of course, if there was one template in all the books that we can justifiably skip, it's probably the Mob template.

---

I'm voting LA +3 for the Acheri. I think the standard ghost template got a variable +3/+4 LA because of the variety of special attacks (and the ambiguity about how many of them the ghost gets); but the Acheri is restricted to just one of those special attacks, and it's on the weaker end of the spectrum. So, I think the lower LA is sufficient.

Also, that picture is going to give me nightmares.

[liquidformat]

I will get on the +3 band wagon, I think this is enough worse than standard ghost that even the frostburn addon doesn't bump it up to +4.

[H_H_F_F]

Yeah, LA +3 seems reasonable.

[Beni-Kujaku]

Side Note: If we want to be extremely thorough, DMG2 also has the Mob template, so we should probably also give that template an LA (certainly -0, yeah?). Of course, if there was one template in all the books that we can justifiably skip, it's probably the Mob
template

Are you kidding me? The mob template is probably the single most powerful template for players in the whole game! It sets your number of HD to 30! Now‚ that may be a detriment most of the time‚ but not for epic creatures! An atropal‚ as strong as it is‚ isn't worth 66 HD‚ and would probably get LA-0. But imagine what would happen for an atropal mob. All the SLAs‚ at ECL 30? With Abomination and Undead immunities‚ with the pretty good grappling abilities of a mob combined with the terrifying negative level aura of the atropal? That would be broken. Plus‚ it's an acquired template‚ so you can take it after taking NI class levels‚ like barbarian or Black Blood Cultist. No‚ I suggest we give the mob template at least LA+10‚ just in case.

(More seriously‚ please don't make us review that. This is an obscure template absolutely not meant for PCs‚ let it remain this way)

[H_H_F_F]

I mean, playing a swarm is strerching it, but you'd play as a hive mind. A mob? That's simply a mechanical tool to simplify certain types of combat and adjust them to the system. I get that the point of this thread is "everything is playable", but, come on.

[Blue Jay]

I mean, playing a swarm is strerching it, but you'd play as a hive mind. A mob? That's simply a mechanical tool to simplify certain types of combat and adjust them to the system. I get that the point of this thread is "everything is playable", but, come on.

Eh... WotC gets blasted all the time on these forums for making assumptions about what kind of games people want to play, so I didn't want to do that here. I'm not invested, either way: I just wanted to be thorough.

[Debatra]

If we ever do it, I am not touching any of the potential jokes I can make with the image.

Looks like we agree on +3 here. Airjelly coming up.

[danielxcutter]

What're these things, aerogel?

[Debatra]

Airjelly

Thundercloud Oozes.

Size & Type: Small Ooze
Space/Reach: 5'/5', 10' reach with tendril.
HD: 2
Speed: Fly 80' (Perfect)
Ability Scores: Str -4, Dex +12, Con +18, Int -, Wis -10, Cha -10 - Net +6, three penalties
Natural Armor: 0
Natural Weapons: One Primary Tendril (1d3 plus 1d6 Electric)
Skill List: N/A
Body Shape: Ooze
Speech (Languages): N/A
CR: 2
WotC LA: -
Our LA: +2

On top of an interesting chasis, they get Weapon Finesse as a bonus feat. They're naturally translucent, giving them concealment that Blindsense and Blind-Fight are called out as ineffective against. Once per hour, they can focus their electrical charge to explode in a 10' burst of electricity. Creatures in the area must make a DC20 Reflex save or take 1d6 electricity damage per two HD the Airjelly has and be dazed for one round. This is presumably Con-based, but not mentioned as such.

[danielxcutter]

...We still haven't done Sentry Ooze yet, right?

[emulord]

Mobs only last 1d4+1 hours so its one of those cases that should actually be LA - even in a thread like this.

[Beni-Kujaku]

Ooh, a cloud pimple!

No, but seriously, what's with these stats? +18 Con with 2 RHD? With 80ft perfect flying? And you get automatic 20% concealment? This is madness! Then again, it's still an ooze, with all the problems that entails, from wielding items and weapons to near-object levels of stupidity.

You have extremely high levels of defense but won't do that much in offense. A precision-based rogue will not appreciate only having one attack. A strength-based fighter will just not use the incredible Dex and Weapon Finesse, and all spellcasting is out with these mental stats. This probably means some mixture of totemist to get natural attacks and rogue to get more damage on them (shame about the skill points). Probably three levels of Umbral Disciple to get Hide in Plain Sight. And with that, you're good for a long time. I hesitate between +2 and +3. This chassis is absolutely fantastic. Let's go for LA+3 for the airjelly.

Mobs only last 1d4+1 hours so its one of those cases that should actually be LA - even in a thread like this.

You know, that's why we have asterisks.

[danielxcutter]

Dragon Shaman maybe?

[Beni-Kujaku]

Dragon Shaman maybe?

Dragonfire adept, you mean? Because dragon shaman is more of a support/skill based character, and has next to no synergy with the airjelly

[danielxcutter]

Which one has the Con-based DC breath weapon?

[H_H_F_F]

These guys are brural, damn. You never see attributes like these on low hd monsters. Such an increase to Con also helps mitigate a big downside of high LA - early vulberability.

I'm pondering the actual LA. Is there any way for these guys to use weapons?

[danielxcutter]

Well, Improved Unarmed Strike should at least give them iteratives. Shame they presumably have like... no slots.

[H_H_F_F]

Well, Improved Unarmed Strike should at least give them iteratives. Shame they presumably have like... no slots.

VoP?

By the way, the one with the con-based breath weapon is indeed DFA, not dragon shaman.