A Monster for Every Season: Summer 2
You can get A Monster for Every Season: Summer 2 now at Gumroad
Page 6 of 23 FirstFirst 12345678910111213141516 ... LastLast
Results 151 to 180 of 678
  1. - Top - End - #151
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    GreatWyrmGold's Avatar

    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    In a castle under the sea
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The LA Assignment Thread XI: Better LA'd Than Never

    Quote Originally Posted by Remuko View Post
    yes i understand that. a lvl 4 fighter is also CR 4 (IIRC). That means #CR = #PC class levels. This thing has 6 monster class levels but is only rated as being as strong as 4 PC class levels. To me that makes it -0.
    I see why you'd think that, but you're wrong. The whole reason CR and ECL are separate numbers is that most abilities are more useful for a PC than a monster or vise versa. Incorporeality isn't useless for a monster in combat, for instance, but it's far more potent for a PC. Alter Appearance might let the lyrist get the drop on the party, but it's otherwise useless for monsters; however, a PC will find it quite useful if there's any kind of social or intrigue challenges in the campaign. The spectral lyrist's bardic music requires that it not do anything else and breaks if someone takes aggressive action towards the target—this makes it hard to use in combat, but clever PCs can find plenty of uses for it regardless.

    The Spectral Lyrist is practically built out of abilities that are more useful for PCs than monsters. If its ECL wasn't higher than its CR, something would be dreadfully wrong.
    Quote Originally Posted by The Blade Wolf View Post
    Ah, thank you very much GreatWyrmGold, you obviously live up to that name with your intelligence and wisdom with that post.
    Quotes, more

    The Tale of Demman, Second King of Ireland, a CKII AAR, won a WritAAR of the Week award. Winner of Villainous Competitions 8 and 40; silver for 32
    Fanfic

    Pixel avatar by me! Other avatar by Recaiden.

  2. - Top - End - #152
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
    danielxcutter's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jul 2016
    Location
    Seoul
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The LA Assignment Thread XI: Better LA'd Than Never

    I mean being a face isn't much help for a monster, but there isn't that much else this thing can pull besides incorporeality(which other monsters have cheaper) and a disguise. No the touch doesn't count, the DC's not worth the investment especially if the DM decides to randomly shut you down.
    Cool elan (no not that kind) Illithid Slayer by linkele.

    Editor/co-writer of Magicae Est Potestas, a crossover between Artemis Fowl and Undertale. Archive Of Our Own FanFiction.net DeviantArt
    We also have a TvTropes page!

    Currently playing: Red Hand of Doom(campaign journal)

    Extended signature here.

  3. - Top - End - #153
    Troll in the Playground
     
    Debatra's Avatar

    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Kaeda
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The LA Assignment Thread XI: Better LA'd Than Never

    Quote Originally Posted by danielxcutter View Post
    No the touch doesn't count, the DC's not worth the investment especially if the DM decides to randomly shut you down.
    As mentioned whenever someone brings up "Freedom of Movement exists" in response to a grapple-focused monster, this should not be considered relevant to a creature's LA. If the DM is constantly using things that no-sell you, it's an issue (and that kind of DM probably wouldn't let you use these threads' ratings anyway). If it's just an occasional thing, it should be fine.
    Kaedanis Pyran, tai faernae.

    The LA Assignment Threads: Attempting to Make Monsters Playable Since 2016

    My Homebrewer's Extended Signature
    Spoiler: Quotes
    Show
    Quote Originally Posted by Lycan 01 View Post
    Roland just endorsed a crack pairing?


    Did... did we break the universe?
    Quote Originally Posted by SassyQuatch View Post
    It is a major flaw in the game. Destroy a moon? Sure. Talk to somebody a hundred miles away, that's going to be difficult.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rizban View Post
    Realistically speaking... D&D style magic doesn't exist, so... let's ignore reality.

  4. - Top - End - #154
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Thurbane's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Terra Australis
    Gender
    Male

    Question Re: The LA Assignment Thread XI: Better LA'd Than Never

    On a side-note, the touch has an inherent drawback in that it is most effective at shutting down mooks with low Charisma, but those same mooks usually have a high Fort save.

    It would be quite effective against Sorcerers, Warmages, Dread Necros and the like, that rely on Charisma for their highest level spells and spell save DCs, but also generally have a bad Fort save bonus.

    Remind me, does sneak attack damage get added to ability damage, or is it just converted to negative energy damage?

  5. - Top - End - #155
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
    danielxcutter's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jul 2016
    Location
    Seoul
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The LA Assignment Thread XI: Better LA'd Than Never

    Quote Originally Posted by Thurbane View Post
    On a side-note, the touch has an inherent drawback in that it is most effective at shutting down mooks with low Charisma, but those same mooks usually have a high Fort save.

    It would be quite effective against Sorcerers, Warmages, Dread Necros and the like, that rely on Charisma for their highest level spells and spell save DCs, but also generally have a bad Fort save bonus.

    Remind me, does sneak attack damage get added to ability damage, or is it just converted to negative energy damage?
    Yeah this is what I meant; it’s possible to use against Cha-based casters but you’re not dropping any bruisers any time soon.
    Cool elan (no not that kind) Illithid Slayer by linkele.

    Editor/co-writer of Magicae Est Potestas, a crossover between Artemis Fowl and Undertale. Archive Of Our Own FanFiction.net DeviantArt
    We also have a TvTropes page!

    Currently playing: Red Hand of Doom(campaign journal)

    Extended signature here.

  6. - Top - End - #156
    Troll in the Playground
     
    Debatra's Avatar

    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Kaeda
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The LA Assignment Thread XI: Better LA'd Than Never

    Quote Originally Posted by Thurbane View Post
    Remind me, does sneak attack damage get added to ability damage, or is it just converted to negative energy damage?
    Negative energy.
    Kaedanis Pyran, tai faernae.

    The LA Assignment Threads: Attempting to Make Monsters Playable Since 2016

    My Homebrewer's Extended Signature
    Spoiler: Quotes
    Show
    Quote Originally Posted by Lycan 01 View Post
    Roland just endorsed a crack pairing?


    Did... did we break the universe?
    Quote Originally Posted by SassyQuatch View Post
    It is a major flaw in the game. Destroy a moon? Sure. Talk to somebody a hundred miles away, that's going to be difficult.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rizban View Post
    Realistically speaking... D&D style magic doesn't exist, so... let's ignore reality.

  7. - Top - End - #157
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    NecromancerGuy

    Join Date
    Feb 2021
    Location
    France
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The LA Assignment Thread XI: Better LA'd Than Never

    Quote Originally Posted by Debatra View Post
    Negative energy.
    Of course. 6d6 damage isn't that much at level 11, but 6d6 Dex damage is just overwhelming.
    Trying to resurrect the Negative LA thread, any comment and discussion are very welcome!


    Quote Originally Posted by H_H_F_F View Post
    3.5 allows you to optimize into godhood, yes, but far more importantly, it lets you optimize weak, weird, and niche options into relevance.

  8. - Top - End - #158
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
    danielxcutter's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jul 2016
    Location
    Seoul
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The LA Assignment Thread XI: Better LA'd Than Never

    Also it's only 1/round(two with Haste) and that's assuming your target fails the save which is... not guaranteed. You might be better off just using a Necrotic Focus Ghost Touch weapon at that point, assuming you go with that.
    Cool elan (no not that kind) Illithid Slayer by linkele.

    Editor/co-writer of Magicae Est Potestas, a crossover between Artemis Fowl and Undertale. Archive Of Our Own FanFiction.net DeviantArt
    We also have a TvTropes page!

    Currently playing: Red Hand of Doom(campaign journal)

    Extended signature here.

  9. - Top - End - #159
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    GreatWyrmGold's Avatar

    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    In a castle under the sea
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The LA Assignment Thread XI: Better LA'd Than Never

    Quote Originally Posted by danielxcutter View Post
    I mean being a face isn't much help for a monster, but there isn't that much else this thing can pull besides incorporeality(which other monsters have cheaper) and a disguise.
    being a face isn't much help for a monster
    ...that's it? Asserting that "face" is not a valid role to consider when rating monsters? I gotta level with you, "Nuh-uh" is not a terribly compelling argument.
    Quote Originally Posted by The Blade Wolf View Post
    Ah, thank you very much GreatWyrmGold, you obviously live up to that name with your intelligence and wisdom with that post.
    Quotes, more

    The Tale of Demman, Second King of Ireland, a CKII AAR, won a WritAAR of the Week award. Winner of Villainous Competitions 8 and 40; silver for 32
    Fanfic

    Pixel avatar by me! Other avatar by Recaiden.

  10. - Top - End - #160
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
    danielxcutter's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jul 2016
    Location
    Seoul
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The LA Assignment Thread XI: Better LA'd Than Never

    Quote Originally Posted by GreatWyrmGold View Post
    ...that's it? Asserting that "face" is not a valid role to consider when rating monsters? I gotta level with you, "Nuh-uh" is not a terribly compelling argument.
    I meant "monster" as "thing you're going to beat up for XP" rather than "monstrous race". I don't see Diplomacy being used often in a random encounter.
    Cool elan (no not that kind) Illithid Slayer by linkele.

    Editor/co-writer of Magicae Est Potestas, a crossover between Artemis Fowl and Undertale. Archive Of Our Own FanFiction.net DeviantArt
    We also have a TvTropes page!

    Currently playing: Red Hand of Doom(campaign journal)

    Extended signature here.

  11. - Top - End - #161
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    OrcBarbarianGuy

    Join Date
    May 2018
    Location
    Colorado
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The LA Assignment Thread XI: Better LA'd Than Never

    Quote Originally Posted by Morphic tide View Post
    Without LA, you have the ability scores to enter Sublime Chord by Wizard and keep the Wizard spells functioning just fine. Though you can only fit Sublime Chord 9, as you have to have 5 levels of Wizard to get 3rd level spells that way, it's going from a 6rhd monster with no innate spellcasting to 9th level spells. You can also go Sublime Chord 2/Stormsinger 7, still getting 9th level spells, but having 8 additional uses of Bardic Music instead of 4, and trade Song of Timelessness for all the Stormsong effects up to Winter's Ballad. With LA +2, you still end up reaching 8th level spells.
    This can get a single 9th level spell by 19 if it takes an accelerated casting PRC isn't much of an argument in favor of giving this thing positive LA.

    My main issue with spectral lyrist is that you really aren't getting much and what you are getting isn't very good. Charisma Drain once the asterisk is added isn't great, most monsters and mooks you encounter will have high fort saves or are straight up immune due to type and things like rogues and arcane casters which have lower fort saves are more rare as encounters and often have higher cha making them harder targets to take on. To be honest if the Charisma Drain had a Will Save instead I think this would be +1, however, it being a fort save and getting slammed with an asterisk really tanks it.

    Side note are we meaning asterisk to remove the entire ability, just remove the cha bonus, cap the cha/hp bonus, or remove both cha and hp bonus?

    It makes the spectral lyrist very hard to place for power level, in a heavy murder hobo focused game spectral lyrist is a very bad choice and would make for a -0 choice, in a more standard game that has a mix of combat and non combat encounters I think this would be low end +0, and in a game that is hyper focused on intrigue and noncombat this would be probably close to +1. Altogether, getting fascinate and suggestion out of a mock bardic music ability, incorporeality undead traits, Alter Appearance, a good skill list (hide, move silently, and UMD would make it great), and decent ability bonuses I think it skirts by at +0* LA.

    Quote Originally Posted by Thurbane
    There are a small handful:

    - Lyric Thaumaturge: "Bardic music 5/day" Requires Melodic Casting, which in turn requires Bardic music class feature.
    - Seeker of the Song: "Bardic music ability"
    - Sublime Chord "Bardic music ability"

    Also, Dawncaller: "Bardic music ability". But you need to be a Goliath, and undead can't qualify for Stoneblessed, so...

    [edit] partially ninja'd [/edit]
    There is also Warchanter which doesn't apply in this case since it requires inspire courage and Warrior Skald which only requires Power Attack, Cleave, Concentration, and Perform but gives you true bardic music +.

    I actually rather like both PRCs they are quite fun especially in Gestalt games I have used Warchanter in a low magic game with a spelless Harmonious Knight Paladin which was a lot of fun. Though Warrior Skald really should have better HD d6 is hard to swallow also both should have gotten umd...

  12. - Top - End - #162
    Troll in the Playground
     
    Debatra's Avatar

    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Kaeda
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The LA Assignment Thread XI: Better LA'd Than Never

    Quote Originally Posted by liquidformat View Post
    Side note are we meaning asterisk to remove the entire ability, just remove the cha bonus, cap the cha/hp bonus, or remove both cha and hp bonus?
    Just the charisma bonus.

    Quote Originally Posted by liquidformat View Post
    It makes the spectral lyrist very hard to place for power level, in a heavy murder hobo focused game spectral lyrist is a very bad choice and would make for a -0 choice, in a more standard game that has a mix of combat and non combat encounters I think this would be low end +0, and in a game that is hyper focused on intrigue and noncombat this would be probably close to +1. Altogether, getting fascinate and suggestion out of a mock bardic music ability, incorporeality undead traits, Alter Appearance, a good skill list (hide, move silently, and UMD would make it great), and decent ability bonuses I think it skirts by at +0* LA.
    We can't really assume any particular kind of game (and especially giving ratings like "+X if you're murderhobo-ing, +Y if your game has a lot of intrigue and low combat", etc are just right out. We try to give general ratings here. A monster that is combat-focused doesn't get a higher rating than something that is "just" really good at talking or sneaking.
    Kaedanis Pyran, tai faernae.

    The LA Assignment Threads: Attempting to Make Monsters Playable Since 2016

    My Homebrewer's Extended Signature
    Spoiler: Quotes
    Show
    Quote Originally Posted by Lycan 01 View Post
    Roland just endorsed a crack pairing?


    Did... did we break the universe?
    Quote Originally Posted by SassyQuatch View Post
    It is a major flaw in the game. Destroy a moon? Sure. Talk to somebody a hundred miles away, that's going to be difficult.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rizban View Post
    Realistically speaking... D&D style magic doesn't exist, so... let's ignore reality.

  13. - Top - End - #163
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
    danielxcutter's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jul 2016
    Location
    Seoul
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The LA Assignment Thread XI: Better LA'd Than Never

    Isn't the only Face-focused monster we've rated the Succubus? Which, y'know, still had Outsider HD as well as good stats?
    Cool elan (no not that kind) Illithid Slayer by linkele.

    Editor/co-writer of Magicae Est Potestas, a crossover between Artemis Fowl and Undertale. Archive Of Our Own FanFiction.net DeviantArt
    We also have a TvTropes page!

    Currently playing: Red Hand of Doom(campaign journal)

    Extended signature here.

  14. - Top - End - #164
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    OrcBarbarianGuy

    Join Date
    May 2018
    Location
    Colorado
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The LA Assignment Thread XI: Better LA'd Than Never

    Quote Originally Posted by Debatra View Post
    Just the charisma bonus.
    Ok that makes it a bit easier to swallow, I know with shambling mound we talked about capping its ability vs just straight outright removing it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Debatra View Post
    We can't really assume any particular kind of game (and especially giving ratings like "+X if you're murderhobo-ing, +Y if your game has a lot of intrigue and low combat", etc are just right out. We try to give general ratings here. A monster that is combat-focused doesn't get a higher rating than something that is "just" really good at talking or sneaking.
    Yep that is kind of my point, that things seem to balance out over all, in some games its abilities are a huge boon and in others it will flounder but over all I think it has enough going on to skirt by as a +0* LA. It is similar for a lot of the aquatic monsters, they often deserve a 'higher LA' in aquatic games or are down right unplayable in nonaquatic games until you have resources to overcome their issues.

    Quote Originally Posted by danielxcutter View Post
    Isn't the only Face-focused monster we've rated the Succubus? Which, y'know, still had Outsider HD as well as good stats?
    Technically the Erinyes too but it has more combat focused abilities. The Succubus having at will ethereal jaunt and 6 rhd actually makes it an interesting comparison point as ethereal jaunt does give similar benefits to Incorporeal without some of the downsides, also its range of at will spells in and of themselves make it a lot more useful than spectral lyrist. Comparing the two side by side the Succubus is dramatically more powerful so I can't see spectral lyrist getting +1 much less +2 LA. I think incorporeal, undead, and ability scores are enough for 3-4 RHD, so the question really is are Alter Appearance, Bardic Music, and charisma drain worth 2-3 rhd?

    I think the closest comparison point I can think of is a necropolitan changeling Dread Necromancer 5, necropolitan changeling Bard 5, maybe necropolitan changeling Dread Necromancer 4/Bard 1, or necropolitan changeling Dread Necromancer 1/Bard 4 all of these comparison points would be high tier 3 low tier 2. Honestly, I don't see spectral lyrist being as useful as any of these in or outside of combat and it is going to struggle being competitive with these builds. If it weren't for its bardic music ability allowing it to jump right into some decent prcs I would say it is -0. As is like I have said before it just barely hits that +0* mark, you aren't outcompeting anyone at a similar level and in fact you are often probably going to feel slightly useless, that sounds like it is in tier 4 or 5 which is just enough to be +0...
    Last edited by liquidformat; 2021-06-14 at 10:37 AM.

  15. - Top - End - #165
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
    danielxcutter's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jul 2016
    Location
    Seoul
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The LA Assignment Thread XI: Better LA'd Than Never

    I mean, I don't really agree with +0 but I can stomach it easier than the weird votes like +2. Because like no, this is not worth 8 levels' worth of progress and your Constitution score.

    Don't really feel qualified to vote for a lot of these things though. Haven't since we started this book.
    Cool elan (no not that kind) Illithid Slayer by linkele.

    Editor/co-writer of Magicae Est Potestas, a crossover between Artemis Fowl and Undertale. Archive Of Our Own FanFiction.net DeviantArt
    We also have a TvTropes page!

    Currently playing: Red Hand of Doom(campaign journal)

    Extended signature here.

  16. - Top - End - #166
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    GreatWyrmGold's Avatar

    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    In a castle under the sea
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The LA Assignment Thread XI: Better LA'd Than Never

    Quote Originally Posted by danielxcutter View Post
    I meant "monster" as "thing you're going to beat up for XP" rather than "monstrous race". I don't see Diplomacy being used often in a random encounter.
    Oh, I misread your post as saying that it wasn't worth considering face abilities when rating monsters as player characters, not as encounters.
    Quote Originally Posted by The Blade Wolf View Post
    Ah, thank you very much GreatWyrmGold, you obviously live up to that name with your intelligence and wisdom with that post.
    Quotes, more

    The Tale of Demman, Second King of Ireland, a CKII AAR, won a WritAAR of the Week award. Winner of Villainous Competitions 8 and 40; silver for 32
    Fanfic

    Pixel avatar by me! Other avatar by Recaiden.

  17. - Top - End - #167
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
    danielxcutter's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jul 2016
    Location
    Seoul
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The LA Assignment Thread XI: Better LA'd Than Never

    Quote Originally Posted by GreatWyrmGold View Post
    Oh, I misread your post as saying that it wasn't worth considering face abilities when rating monsters as player characters, not as encounters.
    Yeah being able to be a face is valid(whether I think the Spectral Lyrist's are worth it is another question, but it's still a plus), but when's the last random encounter where a monster used a social skill besides Bluff(for feinting) or Intimidate? Heck, how many people have had one at all?
    Cool elan (no not that kind) Illithid Slayer by linkele.

    Editor/co-writer of Magicae Est Potestas, a crossover between Artemis Fowl and Undertale. Archive Of Our Own FanFiction.net DeviantArt
    We also have a TvTropes page!

    Currently playing: Red Hand of Doom(campaign journal)

    Extended signature here.

  18. - Top - End - #168
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    OrcBarbarianGuy

    Join Date
    May 2018
    Location
    Colorado
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The LA Assignment Thread XI: Better LA'd Than Never

    Quote Originally Posted by danielxcutter View Post
    Yeah being able to be a face is valid(whether I think the Spectral Lyrist's are worth it is another question, but it's still a plus), but when's the last random encounter where a monster used a social skill besides Bluff(for feinting) or Intimidate? Heck, how many people have had one at all?
    I feel like I had this happen in a joke evil murderhobo game...

  19. - Top - End - #169
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Thurbane's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Terra Australis
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The LA Assignment Thread XI: Better LA'd Than Never

    The Visilight had a similar Cha draining/boost issues, although it's triggered on a grapple, from memory.

  20. - Top - End - #170
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    GnomePirate

    Join Date
    Apr 2020
    Location
    Jerusalem
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The LA Assignment Thread XI: Better LA'd Than Never

    Quote Originally Posted by danielxcutter View Post
    Yeah being able to be a face is valid(whether I think the Spectral Lyrist's are worth it is another question, but it's still a plus), but when's the last random encounter where a monster used a social skill besides Bluff(for feinting) or Intimidate? Heck, how many people have had one at all?
    Isn't the whole point of this thread to make these monsters playable?

  21. - Top - End - #171
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Thurbane's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Terra Australis
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The LA Assignment Thread XI: Better LA'd Than Never

    Quote Originally Posted by H_H_F_F View Post
    Isn't the whole point of this thread to make these monsters playable?
    I think what danielxcutter was trying to say was that being a face is not very useful for non-PC monsters (i.e. random encounters).

  22. - Top - End - #172
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    OrcBarbarianGuy

    Join Date
    May 2018
    Location
    Colorado
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The LA Assignment Thread XI: Better LA'd Than Never

    Quote Originally Posted by Thurbane View Post
    I think what danielxcutter was trying to say was that being a face is not very useful for non-PC monsters (i.e. random encounters).
    Yeah that is my understanding too, I could see it being an ok reoccurring NPC that is either not explicitly a bad guy or part of the ongoing bad guy's group but as random encounter it is pretty worthless

  23. - Top - End - #173
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
    danielxcutter's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jul 2016
    Location
    Seoul
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The LA Assignment Thread XI: Better LA'd Than Never

    Quote Originally Posted by Thurbane View Post
    I think what danielxcutter was trying to say was that being a face is not very useful for non-PC monsters (i.e. random encounters).
    Yes, thank you. This isn’t even the first time someone’s had to clarify that.
    Cool elan (no not that kind) Illithid Slayer by linkele.

    Editor/co-writer of Magicae Est Potestas, a crossover between Artemis Fowl and Undertale. Archive Of Our Own FanFiction.net DeviantArt
    We also have a TvTropes page!

    Currently playing: Red Hand of Doom(campaign journal)

    Extended signature here.

  24. - Top - End - #174
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    GnomePirate

    Join Date
    Apr 2020
    Location
    Jerusalem
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The LA Assignment Thread XI: Better LA'd Than Never

    Quote Originally Posted by danielxcutter View Post
    Yes, thank you. This isn’t even the first time someone’s had to clarify that.
    My bad. Apologies.

  25. - Top - End - #175
    Troll in the Playground
     
    Debatra's Avatar

    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Kaeda
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The LA Assignment Thread XI: Better LA'd Than Never

    +2* - Troacctid, Morphic tide
    +1* - Efrate
    +0* - Thurbane, Temotei, Beni-Kujaku, liquidformat
    -0* - Remuko

    I'm not gonna call it quite yet, but probably by this evening.
    Kaedanis Pyran, tai faernae.

    The LA Assignment Threads: Attempting to Make Monsters Playable Since 2016

    My Homebrewer's Extended Signature
    Spoiler: Quotes
    Show
    Quote Originally Posted by Lycan 01 View Post
    Roland just endorsed a crack pairing?


    Did... did we break the universe?
    Quote Originally Posted by SassyQuatch View Post
    It is a major flaw in the game. Destroy a moon? Sure. Talk to somebody a hundred miles away, that's going to be difficult.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rizban View Post
    Realistically speaking... D&D style magic doesn't exist, so... let's ignore reality.

  26. - Top - End - #176
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
    danielxcutter's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jul 2016
    Location
    Seoul
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The LA Assignment Thread XI: Better LA'd Than Never

    Uh... how do we weigh votes again? By average it looks like it'd come out as a +1 but that doesn't really seem representative...

    Oh, I guess +0* would work, since incorporeality is that strong and there are some bard PrCs that this thing can use.
    Last edited by danielxcutter; 2021-06-16 at 10:19 AM.
    Cool elan (no not that kind) Illithid Slayer by linkele.

    Editor/co-writer of Magicae Est Potestas, a crossover between Artemis Fowl and Undertale. Archive Of Our Own FanFiction.net DeviantArt
    We also have a TvTropes page!

    Currently playing: Red Hand of Doom(campaign journal)

    Extended signature here.

  27. - Top - End - #177
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    Caelestion's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    Baator (aka Britain)
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The LA Assignment Thread XI: Better LA'd Than Never

    I think I'd play that as is. LA +0*.

  28. - Top - End - #178
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    NecromancerGuy

    Join Date
    Feb 2021
    Location
    France
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The LA Assignment Thread XI: Better LA'd Than Never

    Quote Originally Posted by Caelestion View Post
    I think I'd play that as is. LA +0*.
    And that makes (+5-1)/9 (if we count -0 as at least -1‚ hence an average of +0.44‚ rounded to 0
    Trying to resurrect the Negative LA thread, any comment and discussion are very welcome!


    Quote Originally Posted by H_H_F_F View Post
    3.5 allows you to optimize into godhood, yes, but far more importantly, it lets you optimize weak, weird, and niche options into relevance.

  29. - Top - End - #179
    Troll in the Playground
     
    Debatra's Avatar

    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Kaeda
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The LA Assignment Thread XI: Better LA'd Than Never

    Well, the averages usually only matter if there's no clear winner in the votes, and +0* has just pulled far enough away for that to not be an issue. Next on the docket is the somewhat-complex Swarm Shifter template.
    Kaedanis Pyran, tai faernae.

    The LA Assignment Threads: Attempting to Make Monsters Playable Since 2016

    My Homebrewer's Extended Signature
    Spoiler: Quotes
    Show
    Quote Originally Posted by Lycan 01 View Post
    Roland just endorsed a crack pairing?


    Did... did we break the universe?
    Quote Originally Posted by SassyQuatch View Post
    It is a major flaw in the game. Destroy a moon? Sure. Talk to somebody a hundred miles away, that's going to be difficult.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rizban View Post
    Realistically speaking... D&D style magic doesn't exist, so... let's ignore reality.

  30. - Top - End - #180
    Troll in the Playground
     
    Debatra's Avatar

    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Kaeda
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The LA Assignment Thread XI: Better LA'd Than Never

    Swarm-Shifter

    A Swarm-Shifter Mummy

    Acquired or Inherited: Acquired
    Applied To: Any corporeal Undead with an Intelligence score
    Size & Type: Gains the Shapechanger subtype, and the Swarm subtype (and possible size change) when in Swarm form.
    Space/Reach: Unchanged in normal form, 10'/0' in Swarm form
    Hit Dice: Unchanged
    Speed: Unchanged in normal form
    Ability Scores: Unchanged in normal form, Swarm form changes Str and Dex based on size (see table 4-2, MMI, pg 291), with a minimum Str of 1.
    Armor Class: Unchanged in normal form, Swarm form changes Natural Armor based on size (see table 4-2, MMI, pg 291).
    Skills: Unchanged in normal form, +10 to Disguise in various circumstances based on form. (In general, assume the bonus applies to attempts to look normal or inanimate.)
    CR: +1, or +2 if applied multiple times (regardless of how many).
    WotC LA: -
    Our LA: +1, or +2 if applied multiple times (regardless of how many).

    You read that right, we have another template that can be acquired multiple times on the same creature. And this one gives eleven different alternate forms that will likely need to be rated individually. Or maybe we'll get lucky and they'll all be worth the same LA.

    So what do all the forms have in common? Well, it can Shift at will. Shifting forms heals it for 1 HP per HD, just like most alternate forms do. If it has multiple forms, it can shift straight from one to another. While shifting is a Supernatural ability, maintaining the forms actually isn't. An AMF won't change a Swarm-Shifter back to normal, and True Seeing reveals all of the creature's forms. If the swarm would take enough damage to disperse it, the Shifter returns to its normal form and is destroyed (unless it's an Undead with specific destruction rules, like a Vampire or Lich).

    While in a Swarm form, the Shifter gains the Hive Mind special quality, giving it immunity to anything that targets a specific number of creatures (including single-target spells) except things that "command, control, turn, rebuke, bolster, or destroy undead specifically". The ability to speak is lost in Swarm form.

    Swarm damage is given in a table on page 125 of Libris Mortis, and is based on the base creature's HD. Their Distraction ability is the same as other swarms. I'm not going to copy/paste normal swarm things like immunity to weapon damage eleven times, so just know your swarm rules. Unless otherwise noted, Distraction DCs are Constitution-based and other DCs are Charisma-based. Poisons and Diseases are of course delivered via the Swarm attack.

    Spoiler: Swarm Forms
    Show

    Bat Swarm

    Size: Diminutive
    Speed: 5', Fly 40' (Good)
    Special Attacks: Wounding - Living creatures damaged by the swarm bleed for one damage per round until they receive a DC10 Heal check or any form of magical healing.
    Special Qualities: Blindsense 20', based on sound.

    Beetle Swarm

    Size: Diminutive
    Speed: 30', Burrow 20', Fly 10' (Poor)
    Special Attacks: N/A
    Special Qualities: Tremorsense 60'

    Centipede Swarm

    Size: Diminutive
    Speed: 20', Climb 20'
    Special Attacks: Poison, 1d4 Dex/1d4 Dex
    Special Qualities: N/A

    Fly Swarm

    Size: Fine
    Speed: Fly 40' (Perfect)
    Special Attacks: Disease, Red Ache, 1d3 Days Inc, 1d8 Dex
    Special Qualities: N/A

    Leech Swarm

    Size: Diminutive (also gains Aquatic subtype)
    Speed: 5', Swim 30'
    Special Attacks: Wounding (same as bats above)
    Special Qualities: Tremorsense 30', also works in water

    Maggot (or Worm) Swarm

    Size: Fine
    Speed: 20'
    Special Attacks: Extended Nausea - Nausea from Distraction lasts 2d4 rounds
    Special Qualities: N/A

    Body Part Swarm

    ...No, really. A swarm of misc body parts. Bones, organs, flesh, etc.

    Size: Tiny
    Speed: 20', Fly 20' (Poor)
    Special Attacks: Fear - creatures damaged by the Swarm must make a will save or be Frightened for 1d4 rounds. This does not have the usual 24-hour immunity clause. Parts - Swarm attack does an additional 1d6 damage.
    Special Qualities: N/A

    Rat Swarm

    Size: Tiny
    Speed: 15', Climb 15'
    Special Attacks: Disease - Filth Fever, 1d3 day Inc, 1d3 Dex and Con
    Special Qualities: Scent

    Sand (or Tomb Dust or Grave Dirt) Swarm

    Size: Fine
    Speed: Fly 60' (Perfect)
    Special Attacks: N/A
    Special Qualities: N/A

    Scorpion Swarm

    Size: Diminutive
    Speed: 20'
    Special Attacks: Poison - 1d2 Con/1d2 Con
    Special Qualities: Tremorsense 60'

    Spider Swarm

    Size: Diminutive
    Speed: 20', Climb 20'
    Special Attacks: Poison - 1d3 Str/1d3 Str
    Special Qualities: Tremorsense 60'
    Last edited by Debatra; 2021-06-24 at 01:04 AM.
    Kaedanis Pyran, tai faernae.

    The LA Assignment Threads: Attempting to Make Monsters Playable Since 2016

    My Homebrewer's Extended Signature
    Spoiler: Quotes
    Show
    Quote Originally Posted by Lycan 01 View Post
    Roland just endorsed a crack pairing?


    Did... did we break the universe?
    Quote Originally Posted by SassyQuatch View Post
    It is a major flaw in the game. Destroy a moon? Sure. Talk to somebody a hundred miles away, that's going to be difficult.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rizban View Post
    Realistically speaking... D&D style magic doesn't exist, so... let's ignore reality.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •