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  1. - Top - End - #301
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    Default Re: Tarmor's Terribly Tantalizing Tarasque Terrrifying Random Banter #234

    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    You guys made Rock N Roll, though.
    Yes, but people prefer to listen to it in France.

    Also heavy metal, twixe.
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  2. - Top - End - #302
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    Default Re: Tarmor's Terribly Tantalizing Tarasque Terrrifying Random Banter #234

    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    You guys made Rock N Roll, though.
    Far be it from me to get in between an Englishman and a Frenchman in an argument, but...

    No. That is factually incorrect.

    Rock and Roll is widely acknowledged to be derived from Blues which is a subset of Jazz that was influenced by African American spirituals.

    I could go on a long detailed history of the origins of Rock and Roll, but the gist of it is that it was born in American and you'd have to go back several "generations" of music to find non-American influences, which would have primarily come from West African and Continental Europe.

    Now, the English certainly helped in the development of Rock and Roll and created several of Rock and Roll's "descendants," but the core "genre" was born in the New World.

    Though I admit that it's somewhat of a moot point: At this point, Roc and Roll is more of an umbrella category that includes hundreds of widely different styles of music. If Music were animals, Rock and Roll would be a taxonomic family(or at least a Family Level Clade) containing multiple genera, species, and breeds/subspecies and ther's certainly crosspolination between different styles of music influencing differing Rock and Roll subgenras.
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    Quote Originally Posted by zimmerwald1915 View Post
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  3. - Top - End - #303
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    Default Re: Tarmor's Terribly Tantalizing Tarasque Terrrifying Random Banter #234

    Quote Originally Posted by Rater202 View Post
    Okay, I'm just gonna say that I genuinely don't remember mentioning children in that post in that context.
    Oh, my bad. I know that feeling all too well, I just thought you were making some sort of semantic argument. Sorry!
    Quote Originally Posted by Mystic Muse View Post
    As in, make it so whatever time they spend at school is all the time they have to dedicate to it, no take home stuff?
    Ayep. IIRC I've heard/read several reports saying that, at least for grade school, homework tends to be more detrimental than helpful and also adversely affects the poorer to a greater degree. And the lengthy block of summer vacation also does more harm than good. I'm not averse to summer vacation, I loved it as a kid, but smaller chunks with some schooling in between would likely have a significantly better effect on retention and advancement, i think the argument goes.
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  4. - Top - End - #304
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    Default Re: Tarmor's Terribly Tantalizing Tarasque Terrrifying Random Banter #234

    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    IIRC I've heard/read several reports saying that, at least for grade school, homework tends to be more detrimental than helpful and also adversely affects the poorer to a greater degree. And the lengthy block of summer vacation also does more harm than good. I'm not averse to summer vacation, I loved it as a kid, but smaller chunks with some schooling in between would likely have a significantly better effect on retention and advancement, i think the argument goes.
    I can provide anecdotal evidence to the homework but I'd be hesitant about removing summer vacation.

    Compulsory schooling is education secondary. It's primarily about keeping kids busy. Public schools, in America in the wake of compulsory education, were created because child labor was outlawed and parents needed somewhere to drop their kids off while they went to risk being maimed in order to barely afford bread that week. And even then, it wasn't about education for education's sake but molding children into being good workers in the future.

    Public schools, once schooling became compulsory at least, are modeled on factory production: Raw material is brought in in big batches, subjected to cookie-cutter treatment, kept together. Anything that doesn't fit the "standard" is sent through a stage again or simply discarded... All in the hopes of producing a standardized product, interchangeable with any other product of the same make and model.

    And a hundred years later, despite putting some very good spin on it, it's still pretty much just that.

    That's the priority. Education is secondary to occupying children and modeling them into workers.

    So if summer vacation is altered, it won't be in the interest of improving education, it'll be in the interest of keeping children occupied.

    So they wouldn't reschedule the year so there's a couple of short breaks in the summer. They wouldn't make fall, winter, spring, and summer vacation equally long "breaks"in the middle of the year.

    Most likely, they'd just shave days off of summer vacation with some logic like "there's no summer vacation in 'real world' " and act like making children work more with less rest will make grades better.

    But, you know, I'm a cynical jackass who has experienced almost everything that can possibly be bad coming from the American Public School system. Take my reading with a grain of salt.
    Last edited by Rater202; 2021-08-02 at 02:06 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by zimmerwald1915 View Post
    Meteor
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    Way down the air
    To the floor
    Where my other
    Rocks
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  5. - Top - End - #305
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    Default Re: Tarmor's Terribly Tantalizing Tarasque Terrrifying Random Banter #234

    Quote Originally Posted by Rater202 View Post
    I can provide anecdotal evidence to the homework but I'd be hesitant about removing summer vacation.

    Compulsory schooling is education secondary. It's primarily about keeping kids busy. Public schools, in America in the wake of compulsory education, were created because child labor was outlawed and parents needed somewhere to drop their kids off while they went to risk being maimed in order to barely afford bread that week. And even then, it wasn't about education for education's sake but molding children into being good workers in the future.

    Public schools, once schooling became compulsory at least, are modeled on factory production: Raw material is brought in in big batches, subjected to cookie-cutter treatment, kept together. Anything that doesn't fit the "standard" is sent through a stage again or simply discarded... All in the hopes of producing a standardized product, interchangeable with any other product of the same make and model.

    And a hundred years later, despite putting some very good spin on it, it's still pretty much just that.

    That's the priority. Education is secondary to occupying children and modeling them into workers.

    So if summer vacation is altered, it won't be in the interest of improving education, it'll be in the interest of keeping children occupied.

    So they wouldn't reschedule the year so there's a couple of short breaks in the summer. They wouldn't make fall, winter, spring, and summer vacation equally long "breaks"in the middle of the year.

    Most likely, they'd just shave days off of summer vacation with some logic like "there's no summer vacation in 'real world' " and act like making children work more with less rest will make grades better.

    But, you know, I'm a cynical jackass who has experienced almost everything that can possibly be bad coming from the American Public School system. Take my reading with a grain of salt.
    For the educational side.

    For the busywork/historical/economic side.

    Those are just quick and dirty Googling, short version is every report from a reputable source I've heard in the past decade or so advocates against lengthy summer vacation for a wide variety of reasons (and it would similarly work out better for the teachers, who would no longer need to take 9 months of pay and divide it into 12 months of paying bills.

    Same for homework, almost every report I remember hearing or reading in the past many years advocates for getting rid of it to better the system overall.
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  6. - Top - End - #306
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    Default Re: Tarmor's Terribly Tantalizing Tarasque Terrrifying Random Banter #234

    I’m sorry to hear you had such a bad experience in the American educational system, that kind of sucks, makes me feel lucky that most of the teachers I had at the very least gave a crap about the students.

    I think there is some logic behind changing how vacation is. Kids do forget a lot of their stuff during summer and retention would probably be better if that time off was spread out more, but I don’t know, just doesn’t feel right getting rid of it.

  7. - Top - End - #307
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    Default Re: Tarmor's Terribly Tantalizing Tarasque Terrrifying Random Banter #234

    Quote Originally Posted by Rater202 View Post
    I can provide anecdotal evidence to the homework but I'd be hesitant about removing summer vacation.

    Compulsory schooling is education secondary. It's primarily about keeping kids busy. Public schools, in America in the wake of compulsory education, were created because child labor was outlawed and parents needed somewhere to drop their kids off while they went to risk being maimed in order to barely afford bread that week. And even then, it wasn't about education for education's sake but molding children into being good workers in the future.

    Public schools, once schooling became compulsory at least, are modeled on factory production: Raw material is brought in in big batches, subjected to cookie-cutter treatment, kept together. Anything that doesn't fit the "standard" is sent through a stage again or simply discarded... All in the hopes of producing a standardized product, interchangeable with any other product of the same make and model.

    And a hundred years later, despite putting some very good spin on it, it's still pretty much just that.

    That's the priority. Education is secondary to occupying children and modeling them into workers.

    So if summer vacation is altered, it won't be in the interest of improving education, it'll be in the interest of keeping children occupied.

    So they wouldn't reschedule the year so there's a couple of short breaks in the summer. They wouldn't make fall, winter, spring, and summer vacation equally long "breaks"in the middle of the year.

    Most likely, they'd just shave days off of summer vacation with some logic like "there's no summer vacation in 'real world' " and act like making children work more with less rest will make grades better.

    But, you know, I'm a cynical jackass who has experienced almost everything that can possibly be bad coming from the American Public School system. Take my reading with a grain of salt.
    For the educational side.

    For the busywork/historical/economic side.

    Those are just quick and dirty Googling, short version is every report from a reputable source I've heard in the past decade or so advocates against lengthy summer vacation for a wide variety of reasons (and it would similarly work out better for the teachers, who would no longer need to take 9 months of pay and divide it into 12 months of paying bills.

    Same for homework, almost every report I remember hearing or reading in the past many years advocates for getting rid of it to better the results of the system overall.

    Also seconding everything Beeftank said. It's terrible that you experienced the system at its worst. But a rising tide raises all boats, and ideally everything else improving could make the worst not nearly as bad. Ideally. I'm my hopeful world of optimism and rainbows.
    Last edited by Peelee; 2021-08-02 at 02:48 PM.
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    Seconded.

  8. - Top - End - #308
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    Default Re: Tarmor's Terribly Tantalizing Tarasque Terrrifying Random Banter #234

    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    For the educational side.

    For the busywork/historical/economic side.

    Those are just quick and dirty Googling, short version is every report from a reputable source I've heard in the past decade or so advocates against lengthy summer vacation for a wide variety of reasons (and it would similarly work out better for the teachers, who would no longer need to take 9 months of pay and divide it into 12 months of paying bills.

    Same for homework, almost every report I remember hearing or reading in the past many year's advocates for getting rid of it to better the system overall.
    I'm not saying you're wrong. There is most certainly a better system.

    I'm saying that if Summer vacation is changed, however, it won't be to a better system. It will most likely be something half-assed that causes more harm than help.

    At least, that's what my experiences lead me to believe: The people doing this kind of research aren't the ones in charge of these kinds of decisions. The people in charge of these kinds of decisions don't want to make any major changes, so if convinced that "shorter summer vacation" is the answer, instead of being at all thinking about it, they'd probably just cut Summer Vacation short without wondering if they're doing it right.

    Most likely, they'd cut too much without any other schedule changes to compensate. Children would go from having too much time to properly retain certain information between grades to not having enough of a break to properly de-stress.

    OR just get rid of Summer vacation entirely and then when kids inevitably start to crack from too much pressure they'd blame it on something else.
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    Quote Originally Posted by zimmerwald1915 View Post
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    Way down the air
    To the floor
    Where my other
    Rocks
    Are.

  9. - Top - End - #309
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    Default Re: Tarmor's Terribly Tantalizing Tarasque Terrrifying Random Banter #234

    Quote Originally Posted by Rater202 View Post
    I'm not saying you're wrong. There is most certainly a better system.

    I'm saying that if Summer vacation is changed, however, it won't be to a better system. It will most likely be something half-assed that causes more harm than help.
    Depends on who does it and why. In Peelee Super Happy Rainbow Land, it would absolutely be for the better. But hey, I'm an optimist.
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    Quote Originally Posted by pearl jam View Post
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    Seconded.

  10. - Top - End - #310
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    Default Re: Tarmor's Terribly Tantalizing Tarasque Terrrifying Random Banter #234

    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    Depends on who does it and why. In Peelee Super Happy Rainbow Land, it would absolutely be for the better. But hey, I'm an optimist.
    Well, the truth is probably somewhere in the middle: Something well-meaning but inept that helps some people but hurts others.

    I've just been burned too many times to trust that competent, well-meaning people will end up in positions of authority by default. It's probably something I should work on, but...

    Let's just say that there are some days where I don't completely disagree with Big Boss. "Let's make our own country where we won't get screwed over and to hell with the rest of the world" sounds pretty good some days. Could go without the "causing a world war to keep fighting forever" part though.
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    Quote Originally Posted by zimmerwald1915 View Post
    Meteor
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    You soar your
    Way down the air
    To the floor
    Where my other
    Rocks
    Are.

  11. - Top - End - #311
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    Default Re: Tarmor's Terribly Tantalizing Tarasque Terrrifying Random Banter #234

    Quote Originally Posted by Rater202 View Post

    Let's just say that there are some days where I don't completely disagree with Big Boss. "Let's make our own country where we won't get screwed over and to hell with the rest of the world" sounds pretty good some days. Could go without the "causing a world war to keep fighting forever" part though.
    In the Omale series, a vast group of humans got stranded on the titular dyson sphere and, faced with that uncomprehensibly large settleable empty space, that was basically their reaction every time their communities faced a disagreement: one group would just pack their things and go build anither independent town somewhere else where they'd do things their way. Cut to a few centries later, humanity is extremely spread out, communication is sparse and difficult and technology is seriosuly backwards (although that one has also to do with the relative lack of ore).
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    the Vector Legion [is the IFCC's new pawns], mark my words. Way too much unfinished business there and they already know about the Gates.
    I'll take that bet.

  12. - Top - End - #312
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    Default Re: Tarmor's Terribly Tantalizing Tarasque Terrrifying Random Banter #234

    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    In the Omale series, a vast group of humans got stranded on the titular dyson sphere and, faced with that uncomprehensibly large settleable empty space, that was basically their reaction every time their communities faced a disagreement: one group would just pack their things and go build anither independent town somewhere else where they'd do things their way. Cut to a few centries later, humanity is extremely spread out, communication is sparse and difficult and technology is seriosuly backwards (although that one has also to do with the relative lack of ore).
    Look, you people have already poked holes in my fantasy of showing up to my high school reunion in superhumanly perfect health and condition while looking to be in my mid-20s instead of my actual age, proving that it's real and not just cosmetic surgery, letting it sink in to all the asshats who used and abused me that while they will grow old and die I will remain young and healthy forever, then turn into a dragon and fly off to go fight crime or something while skywriting a huge middle finger on my way out.

    Let me have the one of me and an army of like-minded individuals using cardboard box tanks to defend our private fortress from people who want to harm or exploit us.
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    Quote Originally Posted by zimmerwald1915 View Post
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  13. - Top - End - #313
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    Default Re: Tarmor's Terribly Tantalizing Tarasque Terrrifying Random Banter #234

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Raziere View Post
    The problem with that is, my ideas are so scattershot that none of it really coalesces into an AU or a one-shot in the first place. My mind goes through a bunch of things and is like "maybe this, maybe that" and whenever I try to get out the ideas like you say, I only end up writing one sentence or so.
    Hm. If you're really only ending up with one sentence or so, you might be second-guessing what you're writing too hard to focus on the writing. You might try something like timed writing....In my experience getting started with the writing is the hardest part; once I get in the mode it's a lot easier to keep going, and I can always second-guess second-guessing myself later.
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    Default Re: Tarmor's Terribly Tantalizing Tarasque Terrrifying Random Banter #234

    I am watching TeamFourStar's lawyer play an ace attorney game—specifically the prequel about Phoenix's ancestor from the turn of the century.

    One of the witnesses in the tutorial trail very clearly has tuberculosis or a similar respiratory infection and he's just coughing up blood and wiping it on his garments in the middle of conversation.

    This man is a waiter.

    I just can't even. That is just fricking uncomfortable to watch. Like, in general, but especially right now.
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    Quote Originally Posted by zimmerwald1915 View Post
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    Way down the air
    To the floor
    Where my other
    Rocks
    Are.

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    Default Re: Tarmor's Terribly Tantalizing Tarasque Terrrifying Random Banter #234

    Quote Originally Posted by Rater202 View Post
    I am watching TeamFourStar's lawyer play an ace attorney game—specifically the prequel about Phoenix's ancestor from the turn of the century.

    One of the witnesses in the tutorial trail very clearly has tuberculosis or a similar respiratory infection and he's just coughing up blood and wiping it on his garments in the middle of conversation.

    This man is a waiter.

    I just can't even. That is just fricking uncomfortable to watch. Like, in general, but especially right now.
    Don't ever watch The Increasingly Poor Decisions of Todd Margaret. I don't think you would enjoy it.
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    Seconded.

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    Default Re: Tarmor's Terribly Tantalizing Tarasque Terrrifying Random Banter #234

    Perhaps the first proper grilled cheese I've made.

    Sharp chedder, shredded by hand, with dijon mustard, on artisen white, using olive oil as the cooking medium.

    I believe I have managed to perfect my flipping technique as I manged to flip the sanwhich without any spillage.

    Managed to get a very even toast and properly melt the cheese...

    And the sharp cheddar and the dijon complement each other without overpowering each other.

    Mayhaps the simplest, most basic combinations are the best in this scenario. I could see myself eating this with a deli pickle and a bowl of soup in a quiet restaurant.
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    Quote Originally Posted by zimmerwald1915 View Post
    Meteor
    You are a meteor
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    You soar your
    Way down the air
    To the floor
    Where my other
    Rocks
    Are.

  17. - Top - End - #317
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    Default Re: Tarmor's Terribly Tantalizing Tarasque Terrrifying Random Banter #234

    Quote Originally Posted by Rater202 View Post
    Perhaps the first proper grilled cheese I've made.

    Sharp chedder, shredded by hand, with dijon mustard, on artisen white, using olive oil as the cooking medium.

    I believe I have managed to perfect my flipping technique as I manged to flip the sanwhich without any spillage.

    Managed to get a very even toast and properly melt the cheese...

    And the sharp cheddar and the dijon complement each other without overpowering each other.

    Mayhaps the simplest, most basic combinations are the best in this scenario. I could see myself eating this with a deli pickle and a bowl of soup in a quiet restaurant.
    IIRC a famous chef once said, "if you have very good bread and very good butter, then not much beats bread and butter." A great many things can be elegant in their simplicity.

    I'm glad your sandwich was that good.
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    Default Re: Tarmor's Terribly Tantalizing Tarasque Terrrifying Random Banter #234

    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    IIRC a famous chef once said, "if you have very good bread and very good butter, then not much beats bread and butter." A great many things can be elegant in their simplicity.

    I'm glad your sandwich was that good.
    And now I crave kouign aman. Thanks.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    the Vector Legion [is the IFCC's new pawns], mark my words. Way too much unfinished business there and they already know about the Gates.
    I'll take that bet.

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    Default Re: Tarmor's Terribly Tantalizing Tarasque Terrrifying Random Banter #234

    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    And now I crave kouign aman. Thanks.
    It's doubly funny because I'm like 90% sure the chef that said that was French.
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    Default Re: Tarmor's Terribly Tantalizing Tarasque Terrrifying Random Banter #234

    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    It's doubly funny because I'm like 90% sure the chef that said that was French.
    How unexpected.
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    Default Re: Tarmor's Terribly Tantalizing Tarasque Terrrifying Random Banter #234

    anecdote: I took a food chemistry class as an elective in college.

    One of the lessons involved sampling two pizzas that were cooked from nearly identical recipes, except that one pizza was made using a glutton-free crust. Exact details of how it was rendered glutton-free were not given, just that it was.

    This was not a blind test, we knew going in which was which.

    Most of the class said that the glutton-free pizza was worse, but I legitimately could not taste a difference. The crust was a little chewy, but that's not really a bad thing in my book.
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    Default Re: Tarmor's Terribly Tantalizing Tarasque Terrrifying Random Banter #234

    Quote Originally Posted by Rater202 View Post
    anecdote: I took a food chemistry class as an elective in college.

    One of the lessons involved sampling two pizzas that were cooked from nearly identical recipes, except that one pizza was made using a glutton-free crust. Exact details of how it was rendered glutton-free were not given, just that it was.

    This was not a blind test, we knew going in which was which.

    Most of the class said that the glutton-free pizza was worse, but I legitimately could not taste a difference. The crust was a little chewy, but that's not really a bad thing in my book.
    Taste is funny that way.

    Also, Jacques Pépin, that's who it was. American, but French-born, so I was kind of right. I also got the exact wording off, but close enough for government work.
    Last edited by Peelee; 2021-08-03 at 12:36 PM.
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    Default Re: Tarmor's Terribly Tantalizing Tarasque Terrrifying Random Banter #234

    And now I notice that I repeatedly typed "glutton" instead of "gluten." Or my autocorrect is screwed up again. Either way.

    I am now imagining someone making pizza that it is literally impossible to hedonistically overindulge on.
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    Default Re: Tarmor's Terribly Tantalizing Tarasque Terrrifying Random Banter #234

    Quote Originally Posted by Rater202 View Post
    anecdote: I took a food chemistry class as an elective in college.

    One of the lessons involved sampling two pizzas that were cooked from nearly identical recipes, except that one pizza was made using a glutton-free crust. Exact details of how it was rendered glutton-free were not given, just that it was.

    This was not a blind test, we knew going in which was which.

    Most of the class said that the glutton-free pizza was worse, but I legitimately could not taste a difference. The crust was a little chewy, but that's not really a bad thing in my book.
    Well a bad-tasting pizza would maybe be glutton-free, but that does not help with knowing whether it is gluten-free.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    the Vector Legion [is the IFCC's new pawns], mark my words. Way too much unfinished business there and they already know about the Gates.
    I'll take that bet.

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    Default Re: Tarmor's Terribly Tantalizing Tarasque Terrrifying Random Banter #234

    Quote Originally Posted by Rater202 View Post
    I am now imagining someone making pizza that it is literally impossible to hedonistically overindulge on.
    Topped with ipecac slaw or something?
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    Default Re: Tarmor's Terribly Tantalizing Tarasque Terrrifying Random Banter #234

    Quote Originally Posted by Jasdoif View Post
    Topped with ipecac slaw or something?
    Hedonismbot would still love it.
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    Seconded.

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    Default Re: Tarmor's Terribly Tantalizing Tarasque Terrrifying Random Banter #234

    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    How unexpected.
    You were maybe thinking they would be British?
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    Default Re: Tarmor's Terribly Tantalizing Tarasque Terrrifying Random Banter #234

    Quote Originally Posted by Keltest View Post
    You were maybe thinking they would be British?
    There's a difference?

    Where can I run and hide to?
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    Seconded.

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    Default Re: Tarmor's Terribly Tantalizing Tarasque Terrrifying Random Banter #234

    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    There's a difference?

    Where can I run and hide to?
    Scandinavia has historically been good with telling the French and British what to do. I mean, you know, over a thousand years ago.
    “Evil is evil. Lesser, greater, middling, it's all the same. Proportions are negotiated, boundaries blurred. I'm not a pious hermit, I haven't done only good in my life. But if I'm to choose between one evil and another, then I prefer not to choose at all.”

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    Default Re: Tarmor's Terribly Tantalizing Tarasque Terrrifying Random Banter #234

    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    Hedonismbot would still love it.
    Is Hedonismbot capable of overindulging, though?
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