New OOTS products from CafePress
New OOTS t-shirts, ornaments, mugs, bags, and more
Page 1 of 4 1234 LastLast
Results 1 to 30 of 112
  1. - Top - End - #1
    Titan in the Playground
    Join Date
    Feb 2011

    Default MCU: World of the Snap

    In the Falcon & Winter Soldier thread, there was some detailed discussion about the immediate effects of the Snap, and how that would shape the course of the subsequent five years.

    Have any of the writers or showrunners ever commented on whether there’s a treatment or series bible that goes into any detail on this period? It's clear there were some massive dislocations, at the very least, and I'd be interested to know if there's anything more in-depth about this period.

  2. - Top - End - #2
    Spamalot in the Playground
     
    Psyren's Avatar

    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: MCU: World of the Snap

    Both Hawkeye and Shang-Chi are expected to explore that period more - possibly the Eternals too? - so I imagine fleshing it out before those projects are finalized would be counterproductive.
    Quote Originally Posted by The Giant View Post
    But really, the important lesson here is this: Rather than making assumptions that don't fit with the text and then complaining about the text being wrong, why not just choose different assumptions that DO fit with the text?
    Plague Doctor by Crimmy
    Ext. Sig (Handbooks/Creations)

  3. - Top - End - #3
    Troll in the Playground
    Join Date
    Jul 2015

    Default Re: MCU: World of the Snap

    In some ways there's an inevitable sense of vagueness to this sort of thing simply because Marvel has always been kind of careful to keep the world of the MCU 'like ours, but not quite.' In particular, given the MCU's extremely heavy American focus up until this point it's distinctly unclear how the rest of the world works, something that has had a negative impact on projects set in foreign locales. For example we really have no understanding of what the MCU versions of China, India, or Russia (to pick a few rather important nations) actually looked like pre-Snap, making it impossible to speculate on what they would have looked like post-Snap.
    Now publishing a webnovel travelogue.

    Resvier: a P6 homebrew setting

  4. - Top - End - #4
    Ogre in the Playground
    Join Date
    Oct 2013

    Default Re: MCU: World of the Snap

    Very unlikely they'll go into it. It would take an enormous amount of work, and the fans would complain anyway that it was done wrong.

  5. - Top - End - #5
    Spamalot in the Playground
     
    Psyren's Avatar

    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: MCU: World of the Snap

    Quote Originally Posted by Mechalich View Post
    In some ways there's an inevitable sense of vagueness to this sort of thing simply because Marvel has always been kind of careful to keep the world of the MCU 'like ours, but not quite.' In particular, given the MCU's extremely heavy American focus up until this point it's distinctly unclear how the rest of the world works, something that has had a negative impact on projects set in foreign locales. For example we really have no understanding of what the MCU versions of China, India, or Russia (to pick a few rather important nations) actually looked like pre-Snap, making it impossible to speculate on what they would have looked like post-Snap.
    This goes back to my first point; it's likely that the Ten Rings (the real one) gained prominence during the Snap if Shang Chi is going to be partially set there, and that will give us a lens into what's going on in MCU China. Wakanda Forever will likely help us understand what was going on in Africa. Hawkeye will probably show us a bit of both Japan (due to Ronin running around there) and Russia (how Yelena met Val) etc.
    Quote Originally Posted by The Giant View Post
    But really, the important lesson here is this: Rather than making assumptions that don't fit with the text and then complaining about the text being wrong, why not just choose different assumptions that DO fit with the text?
    Plague Doctor by Crimmy
    Ext. Sig (Handbooks/Creations)

  6. - Top - End - #6
    Ogre in the Playground
    Join Date
    Jun 2014

    Default Re: MCU: World of the Snap

    Haven't heard anything about a series bible, just interviews.

    This one mentions that half of all life includes animals.

    I do need to confirm something about the outcome of Infinity War, and apologies if you’ve addressed this – the end of Ant-Man and the Wasp led to conversations. Are half the animals dead? Are half of the horses gone? Half of the ants?

    Yes! Yes. All life.
    This one has a bit more.

    Erik Sommers: You spend a lot of time in a room with the team just talking about all this stuff. There were some things we definitely talked about a lot. “Okay, let’s say you were in an airplane and you blipped and then you come back, but the airplane is not in the same place anymore, so do you just blip back in the sky? And then is it half of all life? Does that mean, like, cats and animals? And what happens to the bees? They’re already having so much trouble, the bees.” So we got bogged down in the nitty-gritty.

    What answer did Marvel give for the airplane question?

    McKenna: We were told that when Bruce [Banner] brings everyone back that he accounted for that, that was part of his wish. Everyone came back safe and sound. We don’t have to worry about people falling out of the skies.

    And the bees?

    McKenna: The bees were fine too. They all came right back to their hives.

    But animals did disappear during the blip.

    McKenna: All life forms. Even down to the bacteria in your digestive system. We were wondering if we could make a whole plot point about people’s digestive systems that were really screwed up.

  7. - Top - End - #7
    Titan in the Playground
    Join Date
    Feb 2011

    Default Re: MCU: World of the Snap

    Originally Posted by Kareeah_Indaga
    Haven't heard anything about a series bible, just interviews.
    These are exactly what I was looking for, thank you. Are you aware of anything else along these lines?

  8. - Top - End - #8
    Ogre in the Playground
    Join Date
    Jun 2014

    Default Re: MCU: World of the Snap

    Quote Originally Posted by Palanan View Post
    These are exactly what I was looking for, thank you. Are you aware of anything else along these lines?
    Not ATM, but I’ll keep an eye out.

  9. - Top - End - #9
    Spamalot in the Playground
     
    Psyren's Avatar

    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: MCU: World of the Snap

    When the Snap is undone, one of the first changes we notice - even before Hawkeye's family calling his phone - are a bunch more birds chirping. So yes, half of life includes animals.

    (However, that doesn't mean it affected livestock to the same degree that it affected inedible animals.)
    Quote Originally Posted by The Giant View Post
    But really, the important lesson here is this: Rather than making assumptions that don't fit with the text and then complaining about the text being wrong, why not just choose different assumptions that DO fit with the text?
    Plague Doctor by Crimmy
    Ext. Sig (Handbooks/Creations)

  10. - Top - End - #10
    Troll in the Playground
    Join Date
    Jul 2015

    Default Re: MCU: World of the Snap

    'Half of all life' including everything is ridiculous. If that includes half of all plant life, guess what happens to the Earth: everyone dies. And of course, even leaving that aside, generation times and reproductive potential varies massively across different types of organisms. Many insect groups reproduce their entire population every year, while long lived trees or whales might take centuries to recover (humans are in the middle, halving the human population only reduces the level to what it was in the mid 1970s). Significantly, saying half of all life vanishes doesn't match what we actually see in the concluding shots of Infinity War: we only see humans turning to ash, not the verdant landscape of Wakanda melting away.

    Of course it doesn't matter anyway. The Snap is stupid. It's a stupid idea for Thanos to have, it's a ludicrous thing to implement, and trying to somehow synchronize the 'five years later' reality with everyone destroyed by the Snap was madness from the start. It will never be possible to integrate it forever and it's just going to be an albatross around MCU worldbuilding until the multiverse renders it irrelevant.
    Now publishing a webnovel travelogue.

    Resvier: a P6 homebrew setting

  11. - Top - End - #11
    Spamalot in the Playground
     
    Psyren's Avatar

    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: MCU: World of the Snap

    Quote Originally Posted by Mechalich View Post
    It will never be possible to integrate it forever
    I have bad news for you, it's integrated most of their audience don't care about the specifics.

    I agree that it shouldn't go down to stomach bacteria but until Feige confirms what these Sony writers have to say I'm not too worried about taking it seriously.
    Quote Originally Posted by The Giant View Post
    But really, the important lesson here is this: Rather than making assumptions that don't fit with the text and then complaining about the text being wrong, why not just choose different assumptions that DO fit with the text?
    Plague Doctor by Crimmy
    Ext. Sig (Handbooks/Creations)

  12. - Top - End - #12
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Brother Oni's Avatar

    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Cippa's River Meadow
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: MCU: World of the Snap

    A musician pointed out to me that the half of all life disappearing went full meta, with the Avengers theme playing during post-Snap in the second movie sounding extremely somber and subdued, because half the instruments in the orchestra were missing.

  13. - Top - End - #13
    Titan in the Playground
    Join Date
    Feb 2011

    Default Re: MCU: World of the Snap

    Originally Posted by Brother Oni
    A musician pointed out to me that the half of all life disappearing went full meta, with the Avengers theme playing during post-Snap in the second movie sounding extremely somber and subdued, because half the instruments in the orchestra were missing.
    I never picked up on that, but very cool. It does seem a certain amount of thought was put into it.

    Originally Posted by Mechalich
    The Snap is stupid…. It will never be possible to integrate it forever and it's just going to be an albatross around MCU worldbuilding until the multiverse renders it irrelevant.
    At this point the Snap is pretty much baked into the heart of the MCU. The first ten years were leading up to it, and whether you consider that a bug or a feature is a matter of personal taste. I happen to think the Infinity Stones are completely ridiculous, and I wish the MCU had taken a different route, but here we are.

    And speaking of bugs….

    Originally Posted by Mechalich
    Many insect groups reproduce their entire population every year, while long lived trees or whales might take centuries to recover….
    Ecologists call this variation the difference between r- and K-selection, with larger and usually longer-lived organisms considered K-selected, and the small-bodied, fast-reproducing species considered r-selected.

    And in fact, humans aren’t in the middle; we’re relatively large for mammals, quite long-lived, and most importantly we typically only have one offspring per birth, so we are squarely K-selected.

    Originally Posted by Mechalich
    If that includes half of all plant life, guess what happens to the Earth: everyone dies.
    Not necessarily. As usual, ecological effects are far more complex than people (or demented alien warlords) often realize.

    In the vertebrate world, predator populations typically take longer to recover from catastrophes than prey, so most predator species would probably crash early on. This would lead to a quick bounceback from prey species, so five years later there may actually be a larger population of deer and elk, even allowing for hunting pressure from remaining humans.

    This would have major impacts on species composition of forests and fields. As just one example, in the US Mid-Atlantic I could see this driving understory species composition towards dominance by pawpaw, barberry and spicebush, since those are common species which deer won’t eat. This might actually make some local forests more productive for humans, since pawpaws are an excellent food resource.

    It should be obvious that I’m not saying the post-Snap human population will be living high on venison and pawpaw bread, but there will be countless unexpected local variations which might provide better-than-starvation options for some areas.

    But there would also be some massive unintended consequences. On a broader scale, the disappearance of half the trees from the Amazon basin would have two major effects. First, much more sunlight would be reaching the forest floor. Under ordinary circumstances, when a large tree falls, it creates an empty space in the canopy, called a light gap, which allows sunlight to stimulate the germination of seedlings from the seed bank under the light gap. This sets off a race for the canopy among fast-growing seedlings. In typical rainforest, light gaps account for maybe 2-3% of total surface area; but if that’s suddenly expanded to 50%, then there will be a tremendous pulse of new growth throughout the Amazon, with the surviving trees rising above a dense shaggy carpet of seedling thickets.

    Unfortunately, without the canopy to intercept tropical rainfall, and with half as many full-sized trees to absorb the water through their roots, there will be far greater rates of erosion and soil runoff, from already thin and nutrient-depleted soils. Rivers throughout the Amazon will run thick red from soil erosion, and whether or not the masses of fast-growing seedlings can blunt that erosion is a real question. Whatever soil is lost to the rivers will eventually roll downstream to the mouths of the Amazon, past Marajó and into the Atlantic, where it will settle on top of the existing sediment fan, and will be lost to the Amazon ecosystem forever. This may cause permanent soil depletion and, at the least, result in a severely species-poor Amazon biome.

    The only silver lining here is that the sudden intense pulse of growth from seedlings—assuming they can derive enough nutrients from the washed-out soil—will pull gigatons of CO2 from the atmosphere, not just in the Amazon but all around the world. Between this and the probable large-scale collapse of industrial emissions, global climate change may tip from warming to cooling, which will have its own raft of unintended consequences—although the sudden return of 3.5 billion humans may lead to a resumption of emissions.

    So it’s an immensely complex situation, and the post-Snap world makes a fascinating setting for just that reason.

  14. - Top - End - #14
    Ettin in the Playground
     
    GnomeWizardGuy

    Join Date
    Nov 2013

    Default Re: MCU: World of the Snap

    I just assume the Snap works the same way wishes do in DBZ - differently depending on what the plot needs at the exact moment it comes up.

    Goku gets wished back from the dead...and has to hoof it out of the afterlife on foot because the plot requires him to not be there when Vegeta arrives.

    Vegeta gets wished back from the deat...and instead of reviving in the afterlife he wakes up in his own grave. Hilariously, the sole purpose of this appears to be to confuse the hell out of Freeza.

    Krillin gets wished back from the afterlife...but doesn't resurrect either in the afterlife or in asteroid field that used to be the planet he died on. Instead, he resurrects where the wish was made.

    The point being that you shouldn't overthink this stuff. Both the Snap and the un-Snap are literally magic wishes. The effects of the Blip are meant to be largely contained to two movies, and the MCU will move on from them long before the Internet stops arguing about it.

    In a universe where the Earth almost got eaten by a god from the shadow dimension I'm prepared to accept "half of everybody went poof" without going into a deep supply-side economics analysis of how that would work. The MCU asks me to believe three more improbable things before breakfast.

  15. - Top - End - #15
    Spamalot in the Playground
     
    Psyren's Avatar

    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: MCU: World of the Snap

    Quote Originally Posted by Rodin View Post
    I just assume the Snap works the same way wishes do in DBZ - differently depending on what the plot needs at the exact moment it comes up.

    Goku gets wished back from the dead...and has to hoof it out of the afterlife on foot because the plot requires him to not be there when Vegeta arrives.

    Vegeta gets wished back from the deat...and instead of reviving in the afterlife he wakes up in his own grave. Hilariously, the sole purpose of this appears to be to confuse the hell out of Freeza.

    Krillin gets wished back from the afterlife...but doesn't resurrect either in the afterlife or in asteroid field that used to be the planet he died on. Instead, he resurrects where the wish was made.

    The point being that you shouldn't overthink this stuff. Both the Snap and the un-Snap are literally magic wishes. The effects of the Blip are meant to be largely contained to two movies, and the MCU will move on from them long before the Internet stops arguing about it.

    In a universe where the Earth almost got eaten by a god from the shadow dimension I'm prepared to accept "half of everybody went poof" without going into a deep supply-side economics analysis of how that would work. The MCU asks me to believe three more improbable things before breakfast.
    I definitely agree with your larger argument but point of order here, your DBZ examples are actually explained in-universe:

    - Goku did revive where his body was, it just so happens that Kami poofed his body into the afterlife shortly after Raditz killed him. This is what allowed him to train while dead unlike Vegeta (not that Vegeta would have been allowed to, or had a lot of time to do that anyway.) The downside of course being that he had to run back.

    - Vegeta revived where his body was too - in a shallow grave on Namek where Goku had buried him, because nobody poofed him anywhere.

    - As for Krillin/Tenshinhan/Chiaotzu, they were brought back by Porunga rather than the Earth dragon - as the wish was made in Namekian, the exact wording of Dende's request is unknown.
    Quote Originally Posted by The Giant View Post
    But really, the important lesson here is this: Rather than making assumptions that don't fit with the text and then complaining about the text being wrong, why not just choose different assumptions that DO fit with the text?
    Plague Doctor by Crimmy
    Ext. Sig (Handbooks/Creations)

  16. - Top - End - #16
    Titan in the Playground
    Join Date
    Feb 2011

    Default Re: MCU: World of the Snap

    Originally Posted by Rodin
    …I’m prepared to accept "half of everybody went poof" without going into a deep supply-side economics analysis of how that would work. The MCU asks me to believe three more improbable things before breakfast.
    I can believe improbable things and enjoy the detailed analysis.

    Not everyone wants to engage to the same extent, and that’s fine. So many questions occur to me that I want to explore the ramifications, which for me is a hallmark of an interesting setting.

    One of the questions the MCU has already raised is why some people, e.g. the Flag Smashers, preferred the post-Snap world when most of what we’ve seen of it looked fairly bleak. We have an ideological answer from Karli and her compatriots, but I’m interested in the broader context that contributed to that ideology, which means understanding the sequence of events after the first Snap.

    And the MCU isn’t done with the Snap, since the Hawkeye series will evidently be spending some additional time in that period. If it follows Hawkeye’s descent into Ronin after losing his family, we may see a fair amount more of what took place just after the Snap.

  17. - Top - End - #17
    Spamalot in the Playground
     
    Psyren's Avatar

    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: MCU: World of the Snap

    My theory is that Hawkeye will be mostly post-Endgame, but involve some Ronin flashbacks which take place during the Snap. Unlike FATWS and WandaVision, he was around for that time (and in a pretty dark place) so we're likely to get some POV from him.
    Quote Originally Posted by The Giant View Post
    But really, the important lesson here is this: Rather than making assumptions that don't fit with the text and then complaining about the text being wrong, why not just choose different assumptions that DO fit with the text?
    Plague Doctor by Crimmy
    Ext. Sig (Handbooks/Creations)

  18. - Top - End - #18
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Tyndmyr's Avatar

    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Maryland
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: MCU: World of the Snap

    Quote Originally Posted by Kareeah_Indaga View Post
    McKenna: All life forms. Even down to the bacteria in your digestive system. We were wondering if we could make a whole plot point about people’s digestive systems that were really screwed up.
    That'd probably not be that big of a deal, really. The numbers are large enough that no variety is likely to be wiped out, and reproductive periods are fast enough to replenish pretty quickly.

    That'd probably be the least relevant change.

    This gets really problematic when we talk about things like insects getting back up to carrying capacity vastly faster than predators. The entire ecosystem would be some vast, hard to predict mess. Probably better that they don't make this a plot point. I mean, it'd be really cool if they did in a well thought out way, but it doesn't make the kind of problems you can punch away. Falcon & Winter Soldier dabbled with it, but not in a way that really added a great deal to it. Sure, Hawkeye could play with this, but I expect this to play second fiddle to important questions such as why he got his haircut.

  19. - Top - End - #19
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    Lacuna Caster's Avatar

    Join Date
    Oct 2014

    Default Re: MCU: World of the Snap

    Quote Originally Posted by Mechalich View Post
    Of course it doesn't matter anyway. The Snap is stupid. It's a stupid idea for Thanos to have, it's a ludicrous thing to implement, and trying to somehow synchronize the 'five years later' reality with everyone destroyed by the Snap was madness from the start. It will never be possible to integrate it forever and it's just going to be an albatross around MCU worldbuilding until the multiverse renders it irrelevant.
    Could you explain why you consider the Snap to be stupid/ludicrous? I can think of some answers to that question, but I'm curious as to what yours are.
    Give directly to the extreme poor.

  20. - Top - End - #20
    Ogre in the Playground
    Join Date
    Jun 2014

    Default Re: MCU: World of the Snap

    Quote Originally Posted by Tyndmyr View Post
    Sure, Hawkeye could play with this, but I expect this to play second fiddle to important questions such as why he got his haircut.
    Sad but probably true.

    If this were an RPG they could have done dozens of quests that involved punching things and still tied in to the aftermath. I think this came up in a previous thread but there should be a huge crime wave shortly after the Snap, both as people realize a large number of cars, houses, etc. are now unoccupied and that things like food, medicine, gasoline etc. are going to be badly disrupted for a while.

    Unrelated, one thing I’m wondering about is the dust from all the Snapped. If it just gradually fades out of existence, that is a LOT of mass taken out of the biosphere, if it sticks around it should be screwing with the weather at least in the short term (haze, dust storms) even ignoring any effects it might have on, say, soil productivity.

  21. - Top - End - #21
    Spamalot in the Playground
     
    Psyren's Avatar

    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: MCU: World of the Snap

    Quote Originally Posted by Kareeah_Indaga View Post
    I think this came up in a previous thread but there should be a huge crime wave shortly after the Snap, both as people realize a large number of cars, houses, etc. are now unoccupied and that things like food, medicine, gasoline etc. are going to be badly disrupted for a while.
    How do we know there wasn't? I'm guessing he didn't become Ronin just because all the grief counselors were overbooked, he saw criminals taking advantage.
    Quote Originally Posted by The Giant View Post
    But really, the important lesson here is this: Rather than making assumptions that don't fit with the text and then complaining about the text being wrong, why not just choose different assumptions that DO fit with the text?
    Plague Doctor by Crimmy
    Ext. Sig (Handbooks/Creations)

  22. - Top - End - #22
    Titan in the Playground
    Join Date
    Feb 2011

    Default Re: MCU: World of the Snap

    Originally Posted by Kareeah_Indaga
    I think this came up in a previous thread but there should be a huge crime wave shortly after the Snap, both as people realize a large number of cars, houses, etc. are now unoccupied and that things like food, medicine, gasoline etc. are going to be badly disrupted for a while.
    Definitely so. There will be widespread looting and hoarding starting immediately afterward, together with panic buying from whatever stores are still open. With only half the number of police, most areas will be helpless to stop it for days or weeks, and this will merge with the broader wave of other crimes

    And there will be a whole spectrum of armed gangs, some of them criminals from the outset and others attempting to form neighborhood patrols. On a local level, I would expect a few of the better-prepared groups to take over warehouse stores like CostCo and Sam’s Club, since those have enough food on-site to keep a gang going for some time. And all the surviving disaster preppers will be hunkered down saying “I told you so.”

    At some point, the government will try to reassert itself with martial law, but that could take quite a while. Simply moving troops around will be a major challenge, since most highways and city streets will probably be cluttered with abandoned vehicles, and the military will have half the normal personnel for flying, fueling and repairing their aircraft. The first few weeks or months will be chaos writ large, and I wouldn’t expect anything near government control for at least a year—and I wouldn’t be surprised if there were still small-scale warlords and gang enclaves in pockets everywhere, especially in the larger cities, persisting for years. And of course there will be any number of lunatics, nutbars and fringe groups proclaiming their own republics and/or the end times.

    Originally Posted by Kareeah_Indaga
    Unrelated, one thing I’m wondering about is the dust from all the Snapped. If it just gradually fades out of existence, that is a LOT of mass taken out of the biosphere, if it sticks around it should be screwing with the weather at least in the short term (haze, dust storms) even ignoring any effects it might have on, say, soil productivity.
    That’s an extremely good point about the missing biomass. Vertebrate biomass is negligible on a global scale, but plant biomass is a different story.

    Losing 225 gigatons of carbon from global ecosystems is significant, but losing the transpiration from that much vegetation could have even greater effects on local weather and hydrology. Beyond that, plant leaves reflect most of the sunlight they intercept, so with 50% of vegetation cover removed, it would mean that much more sunlight absorbed by bare earth and reradiated as infrared, so we could see an immediate sharp rise in global temperatures. Among many other things, that means even more accelerated melting of glaciers, snow cover and permafrost, plus even greater fire risk, as well as increased spread of tropical diseases and a correspondingly greater chance of a pandemic—although in this context, the likely breakdown of international travel may slow its spread or even help contain it.

    And speaking of soil productivity, losing half of all earthworms, nematodes, thrips and other soil organisms might cross some threshold and cause a crash in whatever crops remain. To say nothing of the loss of half of all water-filtering organisms, right when soil erosion and runoff will be increasing tremendously.

  23. - Top - End - #23
    Ogre in the Playground
    Join Date
    Jun 2014

    Default Re: MCU: World of the Snap

    Quote Originally Posted by Palanan View Post
    Definitely so. There will be widespread looting and hoarding starting immediately afterward, together with panic buying from whatever stores are still open. With only half the number of police, most areas will be helpless to stop it for days or weeks, and this will merge with the broader wave of other crimes

    And there will be a whole spectrum of armed gangs, some of them criminals from the outset and others attempting to form neighborhood patrols. On a local level, I would expect a few of the better-prepared groups to take over warehouse stores like CostCo and Sam’s Club, since those have enough food on-site to keep a gang going for some time. And all the surviving disaster preppers will be hunkered down saying “I told you so.”

    At some point, the government will try to reassert itself with martial law, but that could take quite a while. Simply moving troops around will be a major challenge, since most highways and city streets will probably be cluttered with abandoned vehicles, and the military will have half the normal personnel for flying, fueling and repairing their aircraft. The first few weeks or months will be chaos writ large, and I wouldn’t expect anything near government control for at least a year—and I wouldn’t be surprised if there were still small-scale warlords and gang enclaves in pockets everywhere, especially in the larger cities, persisting for years. And of course there will be any number of lunatics, nutbars and fringe groups proclaiming their own republics and/or the end times.
    I'd expect the suicide rate to spike too. And lots of people to die because their medication got disrupted or their surgery got pushed out due to the original surgeon getting dusted.

    Animal shelters and orphanages would be busier but not sure if they'd be crowded since half their original charges would be gone. But they'd definitely be short staffed.

    How well would utilities fare do you think? I'm not sure how much human interaction occurs at, say, the local power plant.

  24. - Top - End - #24
    Titan in the Playground
    Join Date
    Feb 2011

    Default Re: MCU: World of the Snap

    Originally Posted by Kareeah_Indaga
    Animal shelters and orphanages would be busier but not sure if they'd be crowded since half their original charges would be gone.
    The staffing losses would leave them overwhelmed. Most animal rescue and rehab centers are flooded as it is, and losing half their staff would likely cause many of them to close.

    On a related note, many zoos and aquaria would probably close or fall apart, since they’re more reliant on specialists. If a zoo loses their great-ape specialist or their big-cats specialist, they may not be able to replace that person, and that would be compounded with broader issues of food supply and medicine scarcity.

    Most of them would close for the duration, but even if they tried to stay open, visitation would be close to zero and so would ticket sales. If the markets collapse, as I expect they would, then philanthropic donations would dry up, and without major donors or visitor dollars, most zoos and aquaria would be bankrupt in months if not sooner.

    Originally Posted by Kareeah_Indaga
    How well would utilities fare do you think? I'm not sure how much human interaction occurs at, say, the local power plant.
    Very good question. My guess is that utilities would be minimally affected to start with, since I would expect most power plants have a fair amount of redundancy in their staff.

    But issues would probably crop up fairly soon. There will only be half the number of trained repair personnel, so there will be the equivalent of twice the ordinary volume of service calls. I would expect the power plants themselves to remain more or less functional, but energy distribution will be another issue—to say nothing of all the fringe types who will want to take down local power for one reason or another.

    The real trouble will be with storms, and especially hurricanes. Normally a major hurricane draws in repair crews from a radius of several hundred miles, but with half the number of crews available, plus the danger and disrepair of most highways, it’s unlikely any crews will be traveling any distance, so the power outages from hurricanes will last for weeks or months.

    That means even more shortages, more fatalities from lack of medical care, and more violence from armed gangs and generalized crime. If more than one hurricane hits the same area in the same season, the power outages could be permanent if infrastructure can’t be replaced—and since most hurricane-prone areas have inadequate evacuation plans, residents will be at risk whether they stay or try to leave.

  25. - Top - End - #25
    Spamalot in the Playground
     
    Psyren's Avatar

    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: MCU: World of the Snap

    It was bad but not apocalyptically bad. 5 years later SHIELD has power, and there is even enough power to keep the security cameras going in the random warehouse where Lang's van was impounded. I don't think we can conclude it went full Walking Dead in the aftermath or anything.
    Quote Originally Posted by The Giant View Post
    But really, the important lesson here is this: Rather than making assumptions that don't fit with the text and then complaining about the text being wrong, why not just choose different assumptions that DO fit with the text?
    Plague Doctor by Crimmy
    Ext. Sig (Handbooks/Creations)

  26. - Top - End - #26
    Ogre in the Playground
    Join Date
    Jun 2014

    Default Re: MCU: World of the Snap

    Quote Originally Posted by Palanan View Post
    The real trouble will be with storms, and especially hurricanes. Normally a major hurricane draws in repair crews from a radius of several hundred miles, but with half the number of crews available, plus the danger and disrepair of most highways, it’s unlikely any crews will be traveling any distance, so the power outages from hurricanes will last for weeks or months.

    That means even more shortages, more fatalities from lack of medical care, and more violence from armed gangs and generalized crime. If more than one hurricane hits the same area in the same season, the power outages could be permanent if infrastructure can’t be replaced—and since most hurricane-prone areas have inadequate evacuation plans, residents will be at risk whether they stay or try to leave.
    That raises another question: when did the Snap take place, calendar-wise? Spider-man FFH mentions they had already taken midterms, there’s no snow on the ground, Peter’s apparently still in school, so spring?

    Assuming that’s the case, northern hemisphere planting is going to be impacted, but depending on when the Snap occurred either it hasn’t happened yet or is in progress (and would probably need to be re-seeded in the latter case, given that half the seedlings would have been snapped).

    Fruit trees are going to be impossible to replace in that time frame and some species may not end up getting back up to capacity until Dr. Banner snaps everything back, because of how long they take to grow them. (Google says 6 to 10 years for apple trees to produce fruit, 3 to 5 for orange.)

    Beef is going to be hard to come by, chicken meat the poultry farms might be able to cheat a little. Fish is a little fuzzier; apparently shrimp grow to edible size in 3-4 weeks (!) but salmon and such take longer. So, depends on the species.

    Tentatively, if I was a major government, I would buy, rent, or otherwise get ahold of as much farmland as possible to grow peas, beans, lettuce and anything else that grows fast, and pray for a long growing season to try and get two crops in for the first year. Farms for non-food substances (ex: tobacco) would be converted to food farms where possible.

  27. - Top - End - #27
    Spamalot in the Playground
     
    Psyren's Avatar

    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: MCU: World of the Snap

    Quote Originally Posted by Kareeah_Indaga View Post
    That raises another question: when did the Snap take place, calendar-wise? Spider-man FFH mentions they had already taken midterms, there’s no snow on the ground, Peter’s apparently still in school, so spring?
    Judging by their outfits, it doesn't appear to be winter or summer

    Spring seems likely...?
    Quote Originally Posted by The Giant View Post
    But really, the important lesson here is this: Rather than making assumptions that don't fit with the text and then complaining about the text being wrong, why not just choose different assumptions that DO fit with the text?
    Plague Doctor by Crimmy
    Ext. Sig (Handbooks/Creations)

  28. - Top - End - #28
    Troll in the Playground
     
    JadedDM's Avatar

    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Washington, USA
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: MCU: World of the Snap

    For whatever it's worth, the MCU wiki says Spring 2018.

  29. - Top - End - #29
    Ettin in the Playground
     
    GnomeWizardGuy

    Join Date
    Nov 2013

    Default Re: MCU: World of the Snap

    Quote Originally Posted by Psyren View Post
    It was bad but not apocalyptically bad. 5 years later SHIELD has power, and there is even enough power to keep the security cameras going in the random warehouse where Lang's van was impounded. I don't think we can conclude it went full Walking Dead in the aftermath or anything.
    I'd say it depends on where you were at the time. It's implied by F&WS that the global effects varied greatly. Highly stable nations like the US and Western Europe mostly weathered the storm, while more unstable regions like Eastern Europe were thrown into chaos by the sudden change in power balance.

    In somewhere like the US, the Snap wipes out the President and roughly half of Congress. That would cause things to screech to a halt for a while, but eventually the VP would take over and the states would elect new representatives and government would be restored. I'm not saying it would be easy, but the system is designed to replace fallen members.

    Now take a dictatorship or monarchy. The Snap wipes out His Supremeness and those he would have picked to succeed him, or in the case of a monarchy the King goes bye-bye along with his heirs. At best you have a succession crisis - more likely you have an outright civil war on your hands. Particularly if one side decides the Snap was a weapon turned on them by their rivals.

    In this theoretical country you now have half the people gone, the government collapsed, and a civil war. That's pretty apocalyptic, and the countries that might ordinarily step forward to render aid are dealing with their own problems. The weaker the original government, the more likely things are to go to hell when that government is magically decapitated.

  30. - Top - End - #30
    Titan in the Playground
    Join Date
    Feb 2011

    Default Re: MCU: World of the Snap

    Originally Posted by Kareeah_Indaga
    Beef is going to be hard to come by, chicken meat the poultry farms might be able to cheat a little. Fish is a little fuzzier; apparently shrimp grow to edible size in 3-4 weeks (!) but salmon and such take longer. So, depends on the species.
    All true, but transportation will be the real bottleneck here, especially when the armed gangs figure out they can use abandoned cars as roadblocks to force 18-wheelers to stop. Eating local will be a matter of necessity, at least until corporations can add armed personnel to their distribution networks.

    As for fish, people will be eating whatever they can catch, as well as fish they wouldn’t ordinarily eat, with menhaden at the top of that list. Coastal communities may end up relying primarily on local catches, which may have impacts on fish populations as well as the ecosystems trying to survive on the same target species.

    Originally Posted by Kareeah_Indaga
    Tentatively, if I was a major government, I would buy, rent, or otherwise get ahold of as much farmland as possible to grow peas, beans, lettuce and anything else that grows fast, and pray for a long growing season to try and get two crops in for the first year.
    Most governments will be preoccupied with reestablishing basic control, although it’s possible some agencies of larger and wealthier nations will try to get ahead of food issues. But the farmland is likely to be a long way from the capital, or wherever the government is operating from, and making sure that the correct seeds reach the designated farms could end up being a logistical near-impossibility.

    And the spike in temperatures from greater insolation of soils could make for some very difficult weather patterns. Local water wars might break out fairly quickly in areas that rely on irrigation for their food production, and pacifying these would be another drain on national militaries.

    Originally Posted by Kareeah_Indaga
    Farms for non-food substances (ex: tobacco) would be converted to food farms where possible.
    Tobacco farms would present another issue, which is that long-term tobacco cultivation depletes the soil of nutrients, in particular nitrogen, phosporus and potassium. Former tobacco farms would be more difficult to farm for food plants, and while there will certainly be those who try, the yields will probably be much poorer than non-tobacco farmland.

    Originally Posted by Rodin
    Now take a dictatorship or monarchy.…

    In this theoretical country you now have half the people gone, the government collapsed, and a civil war. That's pretty apocalyptic, and the countries that might ordinarily step forward to render aid are dealing with their own problems.
    Definitely this. And these civil wars will be creating floods of refugees trying to get somewhere else.

    Most countries will probably be struggling to maintain even basic control, and their depleted militaries will be concentrating on restoring civil order, so borders will be porous or effectively nonexistent in many places. And wherever the refugees perceive as safer will have to somehow absorb them as well as dealing with local needs.

    I don’t think any country will be completely immune to these issues—and if there are major hurricanes that take out power and water in coastal communities, those regions would see internally displaced as well.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •