How to build a good Druid

[Frosty]

I'm looking to build a Druid who can definitely take care of himself but doesn't cheese out to the point where the other group members are redundant. I don't know who else will be in the group so I want to able to do a bit of everything (summoning, casting, crushing things in wildshape). I'm going straight Druid, so that's easy, but I need some help with Feats and spell selection. I'm starting off with a Fleshraker companion.

I have this stat array to mess around with [10] [14] [15] [16] [16] [18] and we're starting at level 7 so we have one point to spend on a stat. I'm not sure what race to go for.

I'm thinking of definitely getting Spell Focus (Conj) and Augment Summoning, Natural Spell (duh), and Leadership (getting a Druid Cohort who brings his own Fleshraker Companion).

Not sure what to get next. Either Wild Cohort for a Companion lite, Extend Spell for buff spells and over-time damage spells, Exalted Wildshape to be able to turn into a Blink Dog and DD all over the place, or maybe dragon wildshape to be able to fly above the battlefield and rain death from above while gaining dragon immunities.

[Nebo_]

Level 1: Spell Focus (Conjuration)
Level 3: Augment Summoning
Level 6: Natural Spell
Level 9: Nothing else
Level 12: matters, because
Level 15: you win
Level 18: at D&D.

Seriously...

Str 10
Dex 14
Con 16
Int 16
Wis 18
Cha 15

Natural Bond to give your companion that extra edge.
Greenbound Summoning if you really want to make your DM frustrated.
Extend spell is a great buff and summon augment.

[MCerberus]

Summing Dire Bears + Being a Dire Beard = profit.

[OneWinged4ngel]

As with a cleric, much of your optimization comes in at what spells you choose to prepare (or what broken form you're allowed to wildhshape into. *Cough*Fleshraker*Cough*)

[Temp]

Being a Dire Beard

Typo or not, that is awesome.

Also, Rashemi Elemental Summoning (UE) and Greenbound Summoning (Something of Faerun... I can't think of it now...) are nice boosts.

Summon Elemental (CC) is great; it's like a free disposable party member.

[MCerberus]

Yes I think it's a plant shape that makes you able to strangle people if they decide they'd look stylish wearing the beard.

[Frosty]

As with a cleric, much of your optimization comes in at what spells you choose to prepare (or what broken form you're allowed to wildhshape into. *Cough*Fleshraker*Cough*)

What spells are really good for Druid? I heard about a spell called Creeping Cold or something but I don't know what it does.

I don't have Unapproachable East and it won't fit my RP flavor to change my summons into plants. Will my summons be underpowered with just Augment Summoning?

And do I really want to shift into a Fleshraker? I've already got two under my command thanks to my Druid cohort.

[tyckspoon]

Wait, what? You plan to have a Fleshraker companion, use Leadership to gain another Druid as a Cohort, take feats that let you get even more impressive Wildshape options, and you don't want cheese? The cognitive dissonance, it is giving me a headache.

[Temp]

You always want to turn into a Fleshraker.


...Or some sort of Monkey with a Fell Drain-ed Flame Blade... that's a good 'un too.

[MCerberus]

Entangle
Abuse your spontaneous casting as much as possible (at level 7 you can have an incredibly large amount of creatures in the field with trip/grapple attacks)
Faerie Fire is great against certain types of opponents... oh and BAM
Obscuring Mist - combine with the above
Plus you have healing spells



... and that's just level 1.

[Frosty]

Wait, what? You plan to have a Fleshraker companion, use Leadership to gain another Druid as a Cohort, take feats that let you get even more impressive Wildshape options, and you don't want cheese? The cognitive dissonance, it is giving me a headache.

Well it's just that the some of the others say they'll be optimizing, and I want to be competent, but not quite overshadowing the others. The ones that will definitely try to optimize are the Favored Soul, Hexblade, and Fighter/Monk

[ocato]

I like to turn into a bear. It isn't super powerful or optimipwning or anything. I just feel like Dire Bear is classic druid. I'm thinking about submitting a halfling druid to a high level game on the pbp section who rides his dire lion, summons loads of animals, and only wild shapes when absolutely necessary. Is it t3h awesome? Meh. I'd enjoy it.

[tyckspoon]

Well it's just that the some of the others say they'll be optimizing, and I want to be competent, but not quite overshadowing the others. The ones that will definitely try to optimize are the Favored Soul, Hexblade, and Fighter/Monk

Unless they know some secret dark art of optimization that I haven't seen mentioned anywhere yet, you're probably already achieving your desired level of competency just by being a Druid.

[Temp]

Well it's just that the some of the others say they'll be optimizing, and I want to be competent, but not quite overshadowing the others. The ones that will definitely try to optimize are the Favored Soul, Hexblade, and Fighter/Monk

A Favored Soul, Hexblade and Fighter/Monk?

And you're:
1)playing a Druid
2)with a Fleshraker companion
3)and the Leadership feat
4)for a Druid cohort

...so-as not to be overshadowed?

That is what we call overkill.

[greenknight]

I'm looking to build a Druid who can definitely take care of himself but doesn't cheese out to the point where the other group members are redundant.

There's your problem. Nearly all full spellcasters (with only a few exceptions not including Druid) are made of cheese, so unless the rest of the party are also full spellcasters then at the mid to high levels it's going to be very hard not to completely outshine them.

So, if you don't want to outshine them and they aren't all spellcasters, I suggest you don't take Natural Spell, you don't have an Animal Companion of any kind, and you only use Wild Shape for combat. Also, do not take Leadership, unless you have something like a Fighter or Monk as your Cohort (and even that might be too much of a boost to your already awesome abilities).

I don't know who else will be in the group so I want to able to do a bit of everything (summoning, casting, crushing things in wildshape). I'm going straight Druid, so that's easy, but I need some help with Feats and spell selection. I'm starting off with a Fleshraker companion.

Do all that, and add the feats you mentioned, and you're almost certainly going to outshine the non-spellcasters. At your starting level, you'll probably even outshine the other spellcasters, at least for a little while.

I have this stat array to mess around with [10] [14] [15] [16] [16] [18] and we're starting at level 7 so we have one point to spend on a stat. I'm not sure what race to go for.

Go for Half-Orc, since of all the standard races that one gives the least benefit to a Druid. Do not be a Human, since that powers up the Druid class even more.

Not sure what to get next. Either Wild Cohort for a Companion lite, Extend Spell for buff spells and over-time damage spells, Exalted Wildshape to be able to turn into a Blink Dog and DD all over the place, or maybe dragon wildshape to be able to fly above the battlefield and rain death from above while gaining dragon immunities.

Exalted Wildshape might be the least powerful of those choices, so that's the one you should go for if you're trying to reduce the Druid's power - especially if you don't have Natural Spell.

[Gerrtt]

Is Spell Focus really beneficial to summon monster spells, or am I missing something? I know they are conjuration spells but I didn't think Spell Focus did anything except change DCs, which there aren't any for Monster Spells....right?

Edit:

Nevermind, missed that Augment Summoning was in there. My bad.

[ocato]

Don't castrate yourself, that won't help you or them. I understand toning it down, but certainly don't make obviously detrimental decisions either, like a race with a penalty to wisdom or only casting goodberry and shillelagh. Try taking an animal companion from the SRD suggested ones, like a wolf or something. They're effective and classic without being t3h pwnzor. Augment Summoning is a good feat for a middle of the road druid. If you have races of the wild, you might like the halfling substitution levels if halfling seems like a good race to take. You get some nice little additives to your pet in terms of riding him, you get a few spontaineous castings of good spells to share with your mount like protection from energy and jump, and your wildshape is minorly nerfed. Pretty much your base wild shape is small and tiny, then you get large and diminuitive later. Skip natural spell and take some light metamagic like extend spell. You'll be better than a few members of the party, but the sky won't spin on your whimsy.

[Frosty]

but the sky won't spin on your whimsy.

Isn't there a Druid spell that does that?

[Frosty]

A Favored Soul, Hexblade and Fighter/Monk?

I understand that the Monk needs work (the player wanted to be a martial artist), but what's wrong with the Favored Soul and Hexblade?

[MCerberus]

Isn't there a Druid spell that does that?

Storm of Vengeance isn't very whimsical.

[Frosty]

Maybe I can take non-optimal feats like Improved Toughness.

[AlterForm]

Maybe I can take non-optimal feats like Improved Toughness.

Fixed it for you.

[Jack_Simth]

Don't castrate yourself, that won't help you or them. I understand toning it down, but certainly don't make obviously detrimental decisions either, like a race with a penalty to wisdom or only casting goodberry and shillelagh. Try taking an animal companion from the SRD suggested ones, like a wolf or something. They're effective and classic without being t3h pwnzor. Augment Summoning is a good feat for a middle of the road druid. If you have races of the wild, you might like the halfling substitution levels if halfling seems like a good race to take. You get some nice little additives to your pet in terms of riding him, you get a few spontaineous castings of good spells to share with your mount like protection from energy and jump, and your wildshape is minorly nerfed. Pretty much your base wild shape is small and tiny, then you get large and diminuitive later. Skip natural spell and take some light metamagic like extend spell. You'll be better than a few members of the party, but the sky won't spin on your whimsy.

Broken is made by a large power differential between players, not a matter of a very powerful character. In a party with three core-only monks, the fourth player taking spells from thirty different books to play a druid is broken. In a party with a Wizard, a Cleric, and a Druid who all powergame up the ying-yang, the core-only Monk is broken.

This may sound odd, but you do want to gimp your character to the level of the party. Now, you may not know how strong your party is going in - so do this mostly by spell selection. First few times out, load up on nothing but buff, debuff, and utility spells that will help the rest at the table shine - Barkskin for everybody, Greater Magic Fang for the Monk, Dispel Magic, healing spells, bull's strength, and so on. Keep the hard-to-change portion of the build strong (your feats, skills, and stat selection - take, for instance, a Dwarf with Spell Focus(Conjouration), Augment Summoning, and Natural Spell) but don't use it much; leave the easily changed portions of your build (spell selection and animal companion) focused on helping out everyone else. If you find you're not doing as well as others at the table, pick a good Wildshape form and self-buff, or Summon something fight for you. The next day, you can just change your selection. It's one of the benefits of a primary caster - you can re-tool to fit the situation on fairly short notice... including the metagame situation.

Storm of Vengeance isn't very whimsical.

How about Control Weather?

[Fishy]

Friends Don't Let Friends Take Leadership.

My advice to you is to go and do whatever the heck you want, and forget *everything* you've ever read either here or on the CharOp boards. Just enjoy your game.

[Hawriel]

Isn't there a Druid spell that does that?

no its a potion of courage, aka bottle of wisky.

[Temp]

I understand that the Monk needs work (the player wanted to be a martial artist), but what's wrong with the Favored Soul and Hexblade?

The Favored Soul is inferior to the Cleric in nearly every way. It needs two statistics to cast spells (and it doesn't even get Turn Undead to fuel Charisma Synergy), it limits its spell list--removing one of the major strengths Divine Casters have, it has access to fewer spells and loses the few class abilities Clerics do get(no Domains for spells or abilities).

The Hexblade is a Full base attack class, which is nice, but its spell list is incredibly limited. It also has a nice case of MAD between Charisma (curses, spells, saves), Strength (damage, attacks), Dexterity (Light Armor only) and Constitution (Bad Fort saves and Light Armor). It's weak for a gish and its spell list doesn't synergize well with its melee role.

Neither are bad classes, but both have to work hard to meet the power of an unoptimized Druid. Using Leadership and Wild Shape cheese won't help them.

[DSCrankshaw]

Well, if you want to tone down the druid without totally gimping it, try taking the PHB2 alternate class features. You give up wild shape, natural spell, spontaneous summon, and animal companion. What you get is a more limited form of shapeshifting at will (which is not compatible with natural spell), and spontaneous rejuventation (fast healing for self and all allies in range). It actually works pretty nice, and the druid's no longer so overpowered.

You can also combine it with a couple of levels of swordsage.

[Turcano]

I don't have Unapproachable East and it won't fit my RP flavor to change my summons into plants. Will my summons be underpowered with just Augment Summoning?

RES pretty much puts a template on air elementals (giving them a 1/day use of cone of cold) and earth elementals (which gives them the Engulf ability).

And no, you probably won't be underpowered with just Augment Summoning; summon nature's ally is already slightly more powerful than summon monster (at least with elementals).

You don't have much to worry about; it's really hard to screw up a druid.

[Frosty]

I guess one way to Gimp myself would be to put 11 is Wisdom, but that just doesn't make sense thematically.

[TimeWizard]

Druid? I have one of those. I roll a D[impossibly large], and the result is the feat I take, from the alphabetical master list at Wizard's. Psionic Body and Agile were my first two choices... and I'm still better then everyone else, which shows you how obviously better I am at D&D than everyon else. Like Rogue, sorry "rouges" in World of Warcraft- which I have a level 70 night elf tier 6 on Stupidgamehammer Sever. Because I'm so incredibly awesomer then everyone.

*resists urge to kill himself out of hyberbolic sarcasm*