Help with character concept

[ChaosStar]

Alright. I have a concept for a character, but it's looking non-viable to me. Maybe you guys can help? The concept is someone that fights by throwing his enemies up into the air and causing them to slam down on the ground. I like the 2nd part of Graviturgy's Violent Attraction feature for this, but reliably causing fall damage doesn't seem to be a thing. Best I can find is spending 2 turns on Telekinesis, a 5th level spell, to move an enemy 60 feet in the air, then using Violent Attraction to up the fall damage to 6d6+2d10. Maybe you guys can help me find a better way to use this ability reliably.

[Catullus64]

Combine Levitate with forced-movement cantrips and spells like Thorn Whip and Eldritch Blast + Grasp of Hadar? Float up in the air, move yourself over people with a 10-foot pole like a gondolier, and then yank them upwards with cantrip so they fall? At most you'll get an extra 1d6 damage out of this trick, so... free Hex? Somehow I doubt this is the epic character you were imagining.

If you want this particular thing to be what your character does and does incredibly well, you're mostly out of luck. 5e isn't really meant for such hyper-specialized magic builds.

[sayaijin]

Grapple monk.

This requires a DM with an appreciation for anime or at least Kung Fu flicks, but a monk can move on vertical surfaces and liquids at 9th level. If you take a race with a normal 30ft movement, then with the extra 15ft from monk 9, if you have someone grappled then you can carry them up a vertical surface move+dash+BA dash for 135ft. This gets even crazier with feats and race selections like Tabaxi.

Bonus points if you fight in a rainstorm. Technically rain drops are liquid, so if your DM is willing to let you go full anime, you can run up the rain drops with the grappled creature.

[Man_Over_Game]

Combine Levitate with forced-movement cantrips and spells like Thorn Whip and Eldritch Blast + Grasp of Hadar? Float up in the air, move yourself over people with a 10-foot pole like a gondolier, and then yank them upwards with cantrip so they fall? At most you'll get an extra 1d6 damage out of this trick, so... free Hex? Somehow I doubt this is the epic character you were imagining.

If you want this particular thing to be what your character does and does incredibly well, you're mostly out of luck. 5e isn't really meant for such hyper-specialized magic builds.

Could pick a flying race, and Grasp of Hadar is 10 feet per Eldritch Bolt. It's about as good as it's gonna get without homebrew.

[holywhippet]

You could try using spells that push enemies away from yourself. Thunderwave is one possibility. Eldritch blast with repelling blast is another. Since the latter applies once per blast that hits you could could force someone up to 40 feet away at high levels. There is, of course, the small matter of being below them. If you take a small race like gnome or halfling and cast enlarge/reduce person on yourself then you will be tiny and able to move through the space of hostile creatures. However you will need to see if your DM will let you fire off a spell while moving since you can't actually end your movement in their space. If you could get access to a burrow speed then you could always tunnel below them of course.

Another option is to choose a race/class that gains the ability to fly and cast enlarge/reduce person on your enemy (use quicken spell to make it happen as a bonus action) then grapple your opponent and fly up in the air before dropping them.

[da newt]

Grapple + Dhampir's spider climb and drop = a little more damage and PRONE

Any Flying race and Thorn Whip or EB Grasp of Hadar = a little damage and PRONE - maybe add in Undead Warlock for a wis save vs afraid too or genie lock for spike growth to land in or ....

[Foolwise]

Grapple monk.

This requires a DM with an appreciation for anime or at least Kung Fu flicks, but a monk can move on vertical surfaces and liquids at 9th level. If you take a race with a normal 30ft movement, then with the extra 15ft from monk 9, if you have someone grappled then you can carry them up a vertical surface move+dash+BA dash for 135ft. This gets even crazier with feats and race selections like Tabaxi.

Bonus points if you fight in a rainstorm. Technically rain drops are liquid, so if your DM is willing to let you go full anime, you can run up the rain drops with the grappled creature.

Way of Ascendant Dragon (UA) gives flying speed at lvl 6. Add a cliff or castle keep to run up first and you can reach insane heights.

[Kuulvheysoon]

Alas, reverse gravity is a 7th level spell.

[Naanomi]

Halflings who can move into other people's squares; then either Repelling Blast or Open Hand push?

Moon Druid can give you a burrow speed, a few rideable beastmaster pets can burrow as well...

[sayaijin]

Way of Ascendant Dragon (UA) gives flying speed at lvl 6. Add a cliff or castle keep to run up first and you can reach insane heights.

Nice! Hadn't even thought which subclass would be best. So let's try this:

Tabaxi WoAD (UA) Monk 8
For one ASI we take Skill Expert for Athletics (for grappling)
The other ASI can be either stat increase or Mobile.
45ft flight speed with Action dash and Bonus Action dash using Tabaxi ability to double movement for the turn.
270ft of movement, but dragging a grappled creature divides that in half, so you take the creature 130ft up. You allow yourself to free fall while grappling the creature and then use the remaining 5ft of flying movent you have to release the creature and fly right before you hit the ground.

It takes 13d6 (45.5) damage when it lands, and as long as your DM is okay with your free fall, fly at the last second cheese...you don't take any damage.

You can't do it every turn because there's a cool down on the Tabaxi ability, and it costs 1 ki point. It's also worth mentioning that just hitting with 4 attacks as a level 8 monk by again spending 1 ki point to flurry of blows is (1d6+4)*4 or 30 damage. So if you're willing to spend a turn standing still and grappling in order to dragon drop from 130ft up on the next turn, then this is the build for you.

[holywhippet]

Do keep in mind with any climbing type builds that they may be very situational. You can only run up the side of a wall/cliff/object as far as it actually goes.

[Unoriginal]

The Beast Barbarian can jump very high vertically starting from lvl 6. You could grapple the enemy, jump, let both you and the enemy fall, then land on said enemy so that they take 1.5 time the fall damage while you take half (or 25% if you're raging).

[sayaijin]

The Beast Barbarian can jump very high vertically starting from lvl 6. You could grapple the enemy, jump, let both you and the enemy fall, then land on said enemy so that they take 1.5 time the fall damage while you take half (or 25% if you're raging).

I think you're referring to the level 14 totem warrior ability. I don't see flying speed on the beast barbarian, but they do gain climb speed.

The lowest level that a player can suplex an enemy for a significant amount of damage is either a flying race or the dragon UA monk at level 6.

[Sorinth]

I think you're referring to the level 14 totem warrior ability. I don't see flying speed on the beast barbarian, but they do gain climb speed.

The lowest level that a player can suplex an enemy for a significant amount of damage is either a flying race or the dragon UA monk at level 6.

Beast Barbarian can at level 6 make a strength athletics check to extend the jump equal to the check's total. With skill expertise they can consistently get quite high on their jumps.

[KorvinStarmast]

Could pick a flying race, and Grasp of Hadar is 10 feet per Eldritch Bolt. It's about as good as it's gonna get without homebrew.

Only repelling blast does one per bolt. If you look carefully at the words in Grasp, it only grabs one. My DM and I found this out in play when I picked up the invocation.

Once on each of your turns when you hit a creature with your Eldritch blast, you can move that creature in a straight line 10 feet closer to you.

Repelling blast is once per bolt.

Alas, reverse gravity is a 7th level spell.

It's awesome when it works.

[sayaijin]

Beast Barbarian can at level 6 make a strength athletics check to extend the jump equal to the check's total. With skill expertise they can consistently get quite high on their jumps.

So you have to use 10ft movement before jumping or your vertical jump height gets halved. Since you're grappling, that uses 20ft of your movement. Then you jump straight up which doesn't use any of your movent because you're not covering any squares (I think). This high jump is 3+Str+Athletics with Beast barbarian ability. Assuming we got expertise for Athletics, then at level 6 (assuming 18 Str) that's 3+4+4+6+1d20. At max that's 37ft up, and your enemy takes 3d6 damage which is not as much as just attacking as a barbarian. If you rolled godly stats then even with a 20 in Str that goes up to 39ft up, and still 3d6 fall damage. I think you need flying speed or a way to run up vertically to do this.

[sayaijin]

Okay there is one other option depending on how your DM feels about RAW vs Rule of Cool: enemy as an improvised thrown weapon.

https://forums.giantitp.com/showthre...hrowing-weapon

[Sorinth]

So you have to use 10ft movement before jumping or your vertical jump height gets halved. Since you're grappling, that uses 20ft of your movement. Then you jump straight up which doesn't use any of your movent because you're not covering any squares (I think). This high jump is 3+Str+Athletics with Beast barbarian ability. Assuming we got expertise for Athletics, then at level 6 (assuming 18 Str) that's 3+4+4+6+1d20. At max that's 37ft up, and your enemy takes 3d6 damage which is not as much as just attacking as a barbarian. If you rolled godly stats then even with a 20 in Str that goes up to 39ft up, and still 3d6 fall damage. I think you need flying speed or a way to run up vertically to do this.

I'm not saying it's a great strategy, just correcting that it was in fact the level 6 Beast ability and not a level 14 Totem.

That said it's worth noting this doesn't cost an action, it's just your movement, so the 3d6 is in addition to any attacks from your action (Beyond the very first used to grapple).

[Saelethil]

1) Pick a race with a fly speed
2) Find a way to get expertise in athletics
3) Grab an enemy and fly straight up
4) Drop them
5) Profit

Depending on your class you might even be able to do this more than once per turn since grappling only takes one of your attacks.

[Person_Man]

+1 to Monk for this build - maybe with one level of Rogue for Expertise in Athletics.

Also, the rules basically make it very hard to move enemies vertically, because most miniatures combat is two dimensional and its a hassle for the DM. But if you’re playing in the theatre of the mind, I see no reason why you couldn’t just describe your hits as knocking them into the air. In other words, play whatever melee build you prefer, and just layer anime like fight scenes as fluff on top if it.

[sayaijin]

I'm not saying it's a great strategy, just correcting that it was in fact the level 6 Beast ability and not a level 14 Totem.

That said it's worth noting this doesn't cost an action, it's just your movement, so the 3d6 is in addition to any attacks from your action (Beyond the very first used to grapple).

Good call. I had forgotten that this only uses a grapple attack, so you're free to make your other attack. If they don't escape your grapple then you can do it again the following turn. I'd still prefer a character who doesn't take damage in this process, but for non-UA and non-DM handwaving, Beast barbarian is the lowest level you can do this.

I mentioned in my other comment that if your DM let's you bend the rules, then you can use your opponent as an improvised weapon. That lets you throw them 60ft up on the air.


EDIT: Although... there is the Echo Knight [stares at can of worms]

[Cryptwright]

Maybe you can squeeze in mold earth to help make a hole to assure they fall further.

[Foolwise]

Make it a full team effort. Beast Barb launches the poor goblin into the flying Aarakocra Drunken Master who redirects it to the even higher Ascendant Dragon Half-Orc who pummels it toward the ground exactly where the Druid conveniently opened it up either further with Mold Earth. Monks use their slow fall reactions, the goblin's gravestone can be found in China.