What Are You Playing 5: New Thread+

[Eldan]

Got myself the electronic version of Gloomhaven. I played three or four sessions with friends before I had to move for my work, so I got back into it pretty quickly. It's still bloody hard though, if you don't know what you're doing. Lost the first mission like three times before I finally figured out how super conservative you have to be with your powers.

[Cespenar]

Got myself the electronic version of Gloomhaven. I played three or four sessions with friends before I had to move for my work, so I got back into it pretty quickly. It's still bloody hard though, if you don't know what you're doing. Lost the first mission like three times before I finally figured out how super conservative you have to be with your powers.

Yeah, played it too, as a newcomer, but I can't say that I'm a fan of the mechanics. From the looting to the exhaustion system and to everything else, it seems to always take the absolute most gamified route, which is a bit jarring for me. Maybe if I never played D&D, sure, but... eh.

[Taevyr]

It's a thing with some old games, Oblivion for one. It's not a Steam game, you can set it up to load from Steam, but if you do, you still need the Oblivion disc in the drive, so you're better off not bothering with Steam for Oblivion. There are other games that need discs (Dragon age Origins for one), I assume they work the same way.

That's odd: I bought an IRL elder scrolls collection quite a while ago that was partially Steam-connected (Morrowind-Oblivion-Skyrim with all expansions), and never had to bother with the actual disks for the Steam ones. Sure you're not missing anything?

Never had that trouble with Origins either, but I bought that one directly of steam, so there was never a disk in the first place.



EDIT: and yeah, the "unified" GoG library stll requires all the clients involved, but at least I can get a proper, single overview of all the games I own. And you can install all of'em from said overview, it just starts the client download.
Not perfect by any means, but certainly useful.

[Rynjin]

Yeah, played it too, as a newcomer, but I can't say that I'm a fan of the mechanics. From the looting to the exhaustion system and to everything else, it seems to always take the absolute most gamified route, which is a bit jarring for me. Maybe if I never played D&D, sure, but... eh.

Its...a board game. I'm not sure what you were expecting.

[Eldan]

The loot system is super annoying, though. Why can't your hardened mercs pick up the chest of magic items after killing the last monster? It's super artificial. "Don't kill that guard, we haven't picked up the money he's guarding yet!"

[Cespenar]

The loot system is super annoying, though. Why can't your hardened mercs pick up the chest of magic items after killing the last monster? It's super artificial. "Don't kill that guard, we haven't picked up the money he's guarding yet!"

Yep, that artificialness was what I was talking about. Similar stuff in the exhaustion mechanic. "We're in a safe room with closed doors right now, I'm at full health, but I misjudged my breath/stamina, so I peacefully die..."

Edit: I know that it's board game logic, but still. Maybe because of how close it is to D&D combat, it appears to be more jarring than it should be -- I don't know.

[NRSASD]

Yep, that artificialness was what I was talking about. Similar stuff in the exhaustion mechanic. "We're in a safe room with closed doors right now, I'm at full health, but I misjudged my breath/stamina, so I peacefully die..."

Edit: I know that it's board game logic, but still. Maybe because of how close it is to D&D combat, it appears to be more jarring than it should be -- I don't know.

I too experienced these problems when I first started playing Gloomhaven the Boardgame on Tabletop Simulator. It’s dumb and silly, but that’s how the game is balanced and so we must live with it. That said, once I got over that admittedly large hurdle I had a ton of fun with the game until about 40 missions in, where things got real gimmicky (escort quests where the escort has the life expectancy and attitude of a rooster in a room full of foxes).

My group’s head canon explanation was that adventuring is super hard work and really dangerous, so all our adventurers take super cocaine right before the quest starts. If they can’t finish the mission in 2 minutes they collapse of exhaustion.

[Spacewolf]

My group’s head canon explanation was that adventuring is super hard work and really dangerous, so all our adventurers take super cocaine right before the quest starts. If they can’t finish the mission in 2 minutes they collapse of exhaustion.

That'd make a pretty fun game to be honest, have to be similar to Hotline Miami or something along those lines.

You can take a bunch of drugs that give modifiers but reduce the amount of time you get for the mission.

[Anteros]

Anyone tried that new LoL rpg that's basically a reskinned Battle Chasers? I thought about buying it, but I never finished Battle Chasers. I got frustrated with how slow everything was. Sure, the animations look good...but if you're going to give me 30,000 random battles over the course of a game I need a way to speed them up.

[Cazero]

Anyone tried that new LoL rpg that's basically a reskinned Battle Chasers? I thought about buying it, but I never finished Battle Chasers. I got frustrated with how slow everything was. Sure, the animations look good...but if you're going to give me 30,000 random battles over the course of a game I need a way to speed them up.

I'm currently playing it.
It's pretty much like Battle Chasers. There are no repeatable randomized dungeons and no world map, but still plenty of wandering as fast travel options are limited. There's an increased battle speed option for you. The main quest progression counter makes me feel like the game will be shorter too.
The game still has some bugs popping up from time to time, but nothing a save/load couldn't fix so far.

[Cespenar]

My group’s head canon explanation was that adventuring is super hard work and really dangerous, so all our adventurers take super cocaine right before the quest starts. If they can’t finish the mission in 2 minutes they collapse of exhaustion.

Heh, that makes almost more sense than the base material, yeah.

[NRSASD]

That'd make a pretty fun game to be honest, have to be similar to Hotline Miami or something along those lines.

Play Streets of Rogue as an Investment Banker. That's literally the game hahaha

[Dire_Flumph]

Got myself the electronic version of Gloomhaven. I played three or four sessions with friends before I had to move for my work, so I got back into it pretty quickly. It's still bloody hard though, if you don't know what you're doing. Lost the first mission like three times before I finally figured out how super conservative you have to be with your powers.

I've been playing the boardgame for 2+ years and I couldn't wrap my head around the digital version. It was clearly a boardgame design and I wish they had adjusted how it plays for the digital adaption. The action card mechanic is great when I can go over cards in my hand. Less so thumbing through digital ones. I eventually just decided I'd rather play a turn based tactical game designed for PC and keep Gloomhaven on the gaming table. The biggest plus is not having to deal with setup and all the myriad status tokens, but playing the physical game with the Gloomhaven Helper app already simplifies that greatly anyway.

I realize it wasn't out yet when they started programming the campaign, but I wish they'd started with Jaws of the Lion, or at least eventually add it as an option. That has an actual tutorial and ramp up rather than the base game which tosses you in head first with no warning.

My group’s head canon explanation was that adventuring is super hard work and really dangerous, so all our adventurers take super cocaine right before the quest starts. If they can’t finish the mission in 2 minutes they collapse of exhaustion.

It's absolutely a balancing mechanic for the game that's a little head-scratching to find an actual justification for (Some classes are a bit more loot dependent and have more cards for obtaining loot easier. Sweeping leftover loot after mission negates that.), but I always figured it was the presence of Gloom/darkness or whatever that was physically draining the heroes the longer they stayed.

Two other coop tactical boardgames I've played, Deep Madness and Chronicles of Drunagor are more explicit about it. In the former Eldritch forces are literally devouring the underwater station the game takes place in, turning it into an otherworldly nightmare. If you're not out before the whole board is devoured it's game over. In the latter, darkness tiles that damage the heroes are constantly spawning and "chasing" heroes from spawning zones, forcing you to either fight in it or keep ahead of it.

[Rynjin]

My group’s head canon explanation was that adventuring is super hard work and really dangerous, so all our adventurers take super cocaine right before the quest starts. If they can’t finish the mission in 2 minutes they collapse of exhaustion.

Mindthief: "Kaikaikaikaikai! Ahoy there Cragheart me lad! I'm hopped up on ketamine and I'm going to die."

[Eldan]

Two other coop tactical boardgames I've played, Deep Madness and Chronicles of Drunagor are more explicit about it. In the former Eldritch forces are literally devouring the underwater station the game takes place in, turning it into an otherworldly nightmare. If you're not out before the whole board is devoured it's game over. In the latter, darkness tiles that damage the heroes are constantly spawning and "chasing" heroes from spawning zones, forcing you to either fight in it or keep ahead of it.

Mhm. It would be a lot more stomacheable (which is a word now), if there was some kind of box text explanation for why. Nothing in the game ever implies that dungeons fill up with gloom, or that you have to run away even on a successful mission, without even the time to pick up a few coins right next to you. I think my problem with Gloomhaven is not that it has those mechanics, as such. It's that it doesn't seem to want to justify any of them in-world.

I just like my games a bit more immersive. But maybe I'm spoiled.

It's still a good game, though? The tactical combat and the character options are still fun.

[Dire_Flumph]

It's still a good game, though? The tactical combat and the character options are still fun.

I think Gloomhaven is a fantastic game, but it often gets mis-labled as "D&D in a box" and it isn't that at all, so I've seen a lot of people come in with incorrect expectations. It's arguably not even a straight dungeon crawler. It's mostly a tactical puzzle, figuring out how to best manage your action abilities to complete the scenario before running out of cards. Because of that it runs into theming issues.

But I've found it a lot of fun, both with the tactical puzzle and the character building and how the game unlocks new content as you progress. Between the core box and Jaws of the Lion (which I'd recommend over the core box for people getting into the boardgame version), I've played 3 campaigns in the last 2 years and I'm eagerly awaiting Frosthaven to drop next year.

[Anteros]

I'm currently playing it.
It's pretty much like Battle Chasers. There are no repeatable randomized dungeons and no world map, but still plenty of wandering as fast travel options are limited. There's an increased battle speed option for you. The main quest progression counter makes me feel like the game will be shorter too.
The game still has some bugs popping up from time to time, but nothing a save/load couldn't fix so far.

I'm playing it now. It's still a little slow paced, but I used a mod to speed things up. Playing on the hardest difficulty and it's just hard enough to be interesting. Very similar to Battle Chasers, although I think Battle Chasers was more polished. There's lots of little nods to LoL in there, so I would probably enjoy it more if I was a LoL player.

[Anonymouswizard]

Picked Dark Souls 3 in the Steam Sale, rolled up a Mercenary and died twice to the first boss, rerolled as a Knight and beat the boss in one go. That 100% physical resist shield is a great safety net, although Ithink I do do it with the mercenary if I hadn't been playing at 11 in the evening.

The faster gameplay is a great plus compared to 1 and 2, but having either more health or more estus would be lovely (although seeing as how I'm not a spellcaster I can probably get rid of that ashen flask). Although honestly it still needs an easy mode for us disabled players.

[Spacewolf]

Picked Dark Souls 3 in the Steam Sale, rolled up a Mercenary and died twice to the first boss, rerolled as a Knight and beat the boss in one go. That 100% physical resist shield is a great safety net, although Ithink I do do it with the mercenary if I hadn't been playing at 11 in the evening.

The faster gameplay is a great plus compared to 1 and 2, but having either more health or more estus would be lovely (although seeing as how I'm not a spellcaster I can probably get rid of that ashen flask). Although honestly it still needs an easy mode for us disabled players.

If you're playing on PC maybe there's a mod for difficulty adjustment?

[Lord Raziere]

If you're playing on PC maybe there's a mod for difficulty adjustment?

I've checked, only mods for Dark Souls difficulty on Nexus are ones to make it harder. one of the problems of Dark souls online play is that there are cheaters ruining pvp, so any mod that adjusts difficulty has to account for someone using them to fight players as well. so while normal gameplay might not be fun for you, its a real jerk move to get a way to speed yourself up and go into pvp to kill people with an unfair advantage. at the very least if you go find those cheats to make them easier, please make sure you keep yourself out of online play.

[Anonymouswizard]

If you're playing on PC maybe there's a mod for difficulty adjustment?

The Dark Souls fandom is very adamant that difficulty is more important than accessibility, reaction-affecting disabilities or no.

That said I'm not against learning how to mod it myself. I plan to get Remastered and 2 on Steam for the same reason.

I've checked, only mods for Dark Souls difficulty on Nexus are ones to make it harder. one of the problems of Dark souls online play is that there are cheaters ruining pvp, so any mod that adjusts difficulty has to account for someone using them to fight players as well. so while normal gameplay might not be fun for you, its a real jerk move to get a way to speed yourself up and go into pvp to kill people with an unfair advantage. at the very least if you go find those cheats to make them easier, please make sure you keep yourself out of online play.

I want to be serious, this is 1) why I'm seriously considering switching to offline mode anyway (imagine everybody else having such a cheat due to genetics) and 2) why I think any potential easy mode should remove invading and possibly summoning at minimum. I honestly just don't find the idea of invading to be fun either.

But let's be honest, it's only cheating if doing it in online play. If you're just doing the PvE part of the game it's doing From Software's job for them.

[Rynjin]

You'll be happy to know that in Elden Ring PvP is purely opt-in, and can only happen when you're actively co-oping.

(I hope they change it so you can turn on PvP without co-op though,)

[Anteros]

The Dark Souls fandom is very adamant that difficulty is more important than accessibility, reaction-affecting disabilities or no.

That said I'm not against learning how to mod it myself. I plan to get Remastered and 2 on Steam for the same reason.



I want to be serious, this is 1) why I'm seriously considering switching to offline mode anyway (imagine everybody else having such a cheat due to genetics) and 2) why I think any potential easy mode should remove invading and possibly summoning at minimum. I honestly just don't find the idea of invading to be fun either.

But let's be honest, it's only cheating if doing it in online play. If you're just doing the PvE part of the game it's doing From Software's job for them.

It's not the first time I've seen you hint at having difficulty with reaction times. I'm curious what kind of reaction time you're talking about. I'm far from the fastest. I usually clock anywhere from 180 to 250ms and I've never had any difficulty with these games. I find them to be more about memorization than reaction based.

I'm not against the inclusion of an easy mode by any means, although I think the fear is that if such a mode is included that the devs will balance for it instead of trying to maintain the difficulty.

[Anonymouswizard]

It's not the first time I've seen you hint at having difficulty with reaction times. I'm curious what kind of reaction time you're talking about. I'm far from the fastest. I usually clock anywhere from 180 to 250ms and I've never had any difficulty with these games. I find them to be more about memorization than reaction based.

I'm not against the inclusion of an easy mode by any means, although I think the fear is that if such a mode is included that the devs will balance for it instead of trying to maintain the difficulty.

308ms last time I tested, I'm literally in the bottom ten percent. 200-250ms is apparently about average (it depends on stimulus), which likely explains the different experiences. Despite what people say reaction times are important, it doesn't matter if I read the attack if my dodge is a millisecond too late. They're just not as important as in Devil May... No actually they're just as important as in DMC, even if just because attacks take more of your healthbar away.

Plus that is a more legitimate argument than most I've seen against an easy mode (which includes 'but my prestige for beating it'). But I'm still not buying it, if 'artistic vision' is as important to them as people claim then surely the one that'll be halfhearted is the easy mode.

[Cespenar]

308ms last time I tested, I'm literally in the bottom ten percent. 200-250ms is apparently about average (it depends on stimulus), which likely explains the different experiences. Despite what people say reaction times are important, it doesn't matter if I read the attack if my dodge is a millisecond too late. They're just not as important as in Devil May... No actually they're just as important as in DMC, even if just because attacks take more of your healthbar away.

Plus that is a more legitimate argument than most I've seen against an easy mode (which includes 'but my prestige for beating it'). But I'm still not buying it, if 'artistic vision' is as important to them as people claim then surely the one that'll be halfhearted is the easy mode.

If on PC, theoretically you could run Cheat Engine and "speed hack" the game to run at 0.8 speed to make up for your reaction time.

Though that might have some other unforeseen effects, I wouldn't know.

[GloatingSwine]

2) why I think any potential easy mode should remove invading and possibly summoning at minimum. I honestly just don't find the idea of invading to be fun either.

Summoning kinda is the easy mode. It's also a good idea to put your own sign down at a boss door to let you fight it a few times on someone else's health bar and come away with a good number of souls (and sunbro medals).

Plus obvs. stacking vitality and stamina on your levels up, which will have more impact than your damage stats on how hard the game is.

[Anonymouswizard]

If on PC, theoretically you could run Cheat Engine and "speed hack" the game to run at 0.8 speed to make up for your reaction time.

Though that might have some other unforeseen effects, I wouldn't know.

I mean, it's a legitimate suggestion and one I might try. At the very least it's worth playing around with.

Summoning kinda is the easy mode. It's also a good idea to put your own sign down at a boss door to let you fight it a few times on someone else's health bar and come away with a good number of souls (and sunbro medals).

Plus obvs. stacking vitality and stamina on your levels up, which will have more impact than your damage stats on how hard the game is.

Summoning, just like grinding/standing on your head/letting somebody else play it for you*/watching a let's play are not an easy mode, and don't actually solve the core issue. Neither would decreasing enemy stats for that matter, beyond the 'more likely to have one more chance' aspects.

What I tend to find is that people who don't have these issues can be dismissive of them and the desire for accessibility. It's not a universal opinion, but there tends to be a tendency to list nonsolutions. This is far worse when a game is known to be hard.

It's part of the reason I switched from consoles to PC, because now when the developers don't do their bloody job I can find a way to do this

Although thankful for the level up advice, it'll certainly change the way I'm spending souls. It's not actually that obvious which way the balance tips.

* Actual suggestion I got from somebody when I mentioned struggling with Undertale.

[GloatingSwine]

The other thing that makes Dark Souls easier, especially 3, is exploring everywhere in the world. Poke your nose into every nook and cranny you can and you'll find more upgrades to your estus flasks and more weapon upgrade items.

Upgrading your weapons is the best way to add to your damage, especially in the early to mid game.

It's also useful to carry a secondary blessed weapon like a cestus because they add HP regen, and you can just switch to it when nothing's going on to recover health without using up estus flasks.

[Cespenar]

* Actual suggestion I got from somebody when I mentioned struggling with Undertale.

While that definitely sounds kinda condescending, it's ironically not a half bad advice. I did the same thing halfway through the game myself. It simply has too much bullet hell.

[Cygnia]

New observation with Bard's Tale 4 is it's giving me motion sickness in some places (Isle of Stronsea specifically). Trying to fiddle with the FoV hasn't helped.