New OOTS products from CafePress
New OOTS t-shirts, ornaments, mugs, bags, and more
Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 30 of 85
  1. - Top - End - #1
    Titan in the Playground
     
    DrowGuy

    Join Date
    Dec 2015

    Default Shang-Chi And The Legend Of The Ten Rings (2021)

    Ok. Today I'm going to review Shang-Chi And The Legend Of The Ten Rings in my own words without copying our work.

    Spoiler: My Thoughts Of Shang-Chi And The Legend Of The Ten Rings (2021)
    Show
    Early this morning I saw Shang-Chi with my friends in IMAX. This movie is about a martial artist who wants to fight an evil organization known as the Ten Rings. What I love about this movie is it has so much action and comedy as well. Plus Abomination made his cinematic debut in this movie. There wasn't anything that I disliked about this movie. It was an action-pack movie and
    I enjoy it. I'll give this movie 10 out of 10 stars.
    It's time to get my Magikarp on!

  2. - Top - End - #2
    Titan in the Playground
    Join Date
    Sep 2014

    Default Re: Shang-Chi And The Legend Of The Ten Rings (2021)

    Abomination was in the Norton Hulk movie and that is canon in the MCU. Tim Roth has had the role throughout and he's going to be in She-Hulk.

  3. - Top - End - #3
    Titan in the Playground
     
    DrowGuy

    Join Date
    Dec 2015

    Default Re: Shang-Chi And The Legend Of The Ten Rings (2021)

    Quote Originally Posted by Razade View Post
    Abomination was in the Norton Hulk movie and that is canon in the MCU. Tim Roth has had the role throughout and he's going to be in She-Hulk.
    Oh really? I didn't know that.
    It's time to get my Magikarp on!

  4. - Top - End - #4
    Troll in the Playground
     
    DaOldeWolf's Avatar

    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    Mexico
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Shang-Chi And The Legend Of The Ten Rings (2021)

    Quote Originally Posted by Bartmanhomer View Post
    Ok. Today I'm going to review Shang-Chi And The Legend Of The Ten Rings in my own words without copying our work.

    Spoiler: My Thoughts Of Shang-Chi And The Legend Of The Ten Rings (2021)
    Show
    Early this morning I saw Shang-Chi with my friends in IMAX. This movie is about a martial artist who wants to fight an evil organization known as the Ten Rings. What I love about this movie is it has so much action and comedy as well. Plus Abomination made his cinematic debut in this movie. There wasn't anything that I disliked about this movie. It was an action-pack movie and
    I enjoy it. I'll give this movie 10 out of 10 stars.
    Really?! That good. IŽll check it out on Disney+ when it finally drops.
    Thanks to linklele for the amazing avvy.
    Quote Originally Posted by jidasfire View Post
    On a long enough scale, every OOTS forum discussion turns into a debate about alignment, Miko, or Familicide.
    or Star Wars.
    Spoiler: Easydamus result
    Show

    Neutral Good Human Paladin/Cleric (3rd/2nd Level)
    Ability Scores:
    Strength-15 Dexterity-13 Constitution-14
    Intelligence-16 Wisdom-17 Charisma-14
    Alignment: Neutral Good

  5. - Top - End - #5
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    Mordar's Avatar

    Join Date
    Mar 2008

    Default Re: Shang-Chi And The Legend Of The Ten Rings (2021)

    Quote Originally Posted by DaOldeWolf View Post
    Really?! That good. IŽll check it out on Disney+ when it finally drops.
    I thought it was solid - Simu Liu is good, action sequences are good, Tony Leung was very good. Awkwafina played, of course, Awkwafina and was give too much to do in the movie. One other odd/detrimental casting choice, IMO, and the usual variable power level mooks problem, but all in all, fun and enjoyable.

    Will have to consider more, but certainly in the top 50% of the MCU films for me.

    Spoiler: Post-credit scene
    Show
    Both post-credit scenes annoyed me, but the mid was far worse. Ragged looking hologram Bruce Banner asking if the Rings were Chitauri? WTF would a slave race that seems focused on organic-interfaced weapons/vehicles be doing making the Rings? And does Captain Marvel really bring any value to this conversation? I mean if you need a warship destroyed, sure, call her...but I don't see a lot that she can bring to the "what are these mystical rings" conversation. At least she pops out after a few moments. I know we're down RDJ and Chris Evans...but instead of trying to cram other Avengers in, since you already have Wong, go with Dr. Strange...or better yet, just give Shang Chi a stringer for his next (even if unrealized) adventure?


    - M
    No matter where you go...there you are!

    Holhokki Tapio - GitP Blood Bowl New Era Season I Champion
    Togashi Ishi - Betrayal at the White Temple
    Da Monsters of Da Midden - GitP Blood Bowl Manager Cup Season V-VI-VII

  6. - Top - End - #6
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    ClericGuy

    Join Date
    Jun 2020

    Default Re: Shang-Chi And The Legend Of The Ten Rings (2021)

    Okay, I generally really enjoyed it, a few nitpicks below, but my favorite piece only fell into place in the final post-credits scene:

    Spoiler: Ten Rings
    Show
    So, the diversion to pick up Shang's sister and her little empire seemed very weak to me, as did Katy's little 'girl power' moment to her for building an illegal underground fighting 'empire' which the 10 Rings disassemble in like 30 seconds at the heart of her power, causing her to instantly flee (only to come back, alone). And after she's captured, her entire 'empire' just vanishes like it never existed.

    But, with the final reveal, it became actually incredibly strong. Of course no one in her empire fought the 10 rings, her goal all along was to take them over. Every person lost on either side would be pure loss for her. I may be reading too much into it, but my read was that as soon as she knew they'd gone after Shang she knew they'd come for her. The only person with a chance to get the rings from her father is Shang, who doesn't want to be in charge, so all that needs to happen is...that. Her father wants to pass over the rings (sort of).

    Now, she obviously couldn't predict the magical soul eaters and such, but otherwise it worked out. In my view she had less a plan than a goal (take over the 10 rings and preserve her own power base) and succeeded. That worked real well for me and the foreshadowed it very well with stuff like 'if he wouldn't give me a place in his empire, I'd build my own,' while Shang just ran off to be a valet. I really thought that was just going to be dropped like it was nothing when she came back for him, but instead she got exactly what she wanted in the end. In my view, she was by far the strongest character in the movie and I really enjoyed it.


    Spoiler: Other stuff which really worked.
    Show
    The faux-Mandarin worked well (though they REALLY oversell how dangerous/effective the faux-10 rings were) as a comedy character and the magical creatures were real impressive to me.

    Wong was great, though the Abomination knocking himself out in one punch seemed ridiculous. Also, why is Wong in an underground fight club? It sounded like it was training/therapy for the Abomination? I'd really like that to be true, seems fun.

    I really liked that Shang actually did go through with his vengeance against the folks who murdered his mother. I wasn't entirely clear on why he ran off afterwards instead of going home, but I liked that he did it and he came clean with Katy rather than it being revealed by someone else.

    Speaking of which, the Katy-Shang relationship did work for me. Less romantic than friendship, but it felt pretty lived in. The only bits I actually laughed at involved that relationship.

    I really enjoyed the father's death scene and his last act was to save his son. I do wish Shang had pointed out to him the monsters that were coming out of the gate as he punched it. I mean, that's pretty good confirmation that this was bull**** and he was being played, but he never even mentions it.

    The mid-credits scene mostly worked for me (though I agree the Chitauri suggestion is silly, though I guess they're working from what samples they've got, which is basically Chitauri and maybe what Tony brought back from Infinity Wars? All of new-Thanos's stuff was dusted) as 'we don't know what this is, but it's new'.


    On the other hand:

    Spoiler: Katy
    Show
    This was...okay. I don't really like the powerless sidekick in general and I really, really wish they'd resisted the urge to have the person with like a day of training be the one to make the shot on the demon-monster thing (though to be fair, I had to step out to the restroom as she was going to the archery range, so I may have missed her having actual archery skills). She did help ground things, but I'm not real sure the ninjas vs. monks vs. dragon vs. demons wanted to be that grounded.


    Spoiler: Hidden Villages
    Show
    I don't love the hidden village thing and adding another ancient society (4000 years!) which has somehow remained the size of a village despite people living in it aging at human rates? Seriously? There ought to be basically a major country's worth of people through there, at least. And there's been no technological advancement in that time either? Why do this?

    Also, their knowledge of the outside world seemed...unlikely given that it sounds like only one of them ever left and she didn't return? How'd they know what cars were? Or that their ancient cities were so much better than our current cities?


    Spoiler: Growing the Universe
    Show
    So, I do like it when the universe grows, but it always raises question of...where were these people during the previous events? Now, for the most part, this isn't too bad as the 10 rings are a criminal syndicate. You don't expect them to run around helping the Avengers fight off Chitauri or something. But I really wasn't clear on how powerful they were supposed to be. The first part makes it seem like they're this world-spanning organization with unlimited numbers/power/resources, but then they barely outnumber the village mooks? Maybe it's just that regrowing them has been hard after he shut them down, but that raises the question of HYDRA and them and/or SHIELD and them. Did neither group know about them? If so, everyone's even more incompetent than we thought, if not then a lot of other stuff starts to come apart.

    Similarly, it seems weird that he's been running around with these powerful magical artifacts in a VERY obvious way for centuries and the sorcerers just...never noticed? I mean, there's no mention of the rings in the archives...that seems pretty incompetent given how obvious we see him being with them.


    Spoiler: Final Battle
    Show
    I've already complained about Katy getting the shot with the bow, but I really dislike 'this thing destroyed an entire other civilization that has been claimed to be stronger/better than ours, and the best they could do was save our universe by walling it off, but now we can totally destroy it in a battle we were totally unprepared for and with out forces depleted. Also, the power-up it got from souls was way too much. It's in trouble against the dragon, it gets like 10 souls and instantly starts to win. If that's the case, then with the souls of multiple cities, how the hell did the dragon stop it in the first place? That's a broader problem of varying power scene by scene, but that's classic fiction, so I'll stop whining about that in particular.

    However, don't even get me started on the band of assassins who we KNOW use guns deciding that the right weapon against a bunch of villagers who they know have kung-fu powers are electronic crossbows that nonlethally incapacitate people and electronic melee weapons that nonlethally incapacitate people.

    I mean that almost made sense against the kids as despite everything, their leader doesn't want them dead, but the whole thing about the village is that he wants them all dead and the place burned down, but the machine guns on their vehicles (which we can see) never get fired...

    Then, even gimping themselves severely, the mooks who have barely managed to touch our heroes (who ought to be weaker than these monks, right? Given that they're trained in the same fashion as Shang's mom, who tossed his father around fairly easily?) do manage to basically win the fight with the monks, only releasing them to fight the demons?

    That whole fight is a mess and by far the weakest part of the movie.


    Generally worth the time and the movie ticket, even if you're unlucky enough to spill half your popcorn when you first sit down, as I did.
    Last edited by ecarden; 2021-09-05 at 08:11 PM.

  7. - Top - End - #7
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Rynjin's Avatar

    Join Date
    Sep 2016

    Default Re: Shang-Chi And The Legend Of The Ten Rings (2021)

    I'll have to wait until I can watch it at home, but I'm glad to hear it's getting good reviews.

  8. - Top - End - #8
    Troll in the Playground
     
    Lizardfolk

    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Shang-Chi And The Legend Of The Ten Rings (2021)

    Quote Originally Posted by Mordar View Post
    I thought it was solid - Simu Liu is good, action sequences are good, Tony Leung was very good. Awkwafina played, of course, Awkwafina and was give too much to do in the movie. One other odd/detrimental casting choice, IMO, and the usual variable power level mooks problem, but all in all, fun and enjoyable.

    Will have to consider more, but certainly in the top 50% of the MCU films for me.

    Spoiler: Post-credit scene
    Show
    Both post-credit scenes annoyed me, but the mid was far worse. Ragged looking hologram Bruce Banner asking if the Rings were Chitauri? WTF would a slave race that seems focused on organic-interfaced weapons/vehicles be doing making the Rings? And does Captain Marvel really bring any value to this conversation? I mean if you need a warship destroyed, sure, call her...but I don't see a lot that she can bring to the "what are these mystical rings" conversation. At least she pops out after a few moments. I know we're down RDJ and Chris Evans...but instead of trying to cram other Avengers in, since you already have Wong, go with Dr. Strange...or better yet, just give Shang Chi a stringer for his next (even if unrealized) adventure?


    - M
    Spoiler
    Show
    Captain Marvel is there because, assuming they can't reach the GotG for whatever reason, she has more experience with alien civilizations then anyone else they would know and there is the possibility that the rings are extraterrestrial.

    I actually don't know why Bruce asked if the rings were Chitauri other than him taking a wild guess with the small handful of alien civilizations he knows of; which I think is just Chitauri, Sakaran, and Asgardian (he has seen other aliens, but doesn't really know what they are. I don't think he was there when Thor mentioned what Korg was, but that would also have been a bad guess anyways). Each of which would be a bad guess, but Asgardian would be the best one since they are at least known to have visited Earth in the ancient past. The earliest known Chitauri encounter was the Battle of New York (and the Sakaran culture never visited Earth, though they could have gained immigrants or prisoners with jobs that did). With all that said, it would have made more sense for him to just say extraterrestrial.

    I also don't know why he isn't in his Professor Hulk form, but maybe She-Hulk or another future project can explain that.
    Last edited by Lizard Lord; 2021-09-06 at 04:26 AM.

  9. - Top - End - #9
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    Daemon

    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    insides of Pandora's box
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Shang-Chi And The Legend Of The Ten Rings (2021)

    Quote Originally Posted by DaOldeWolf View Post
    Really?! That good. IŽll check it out on Disney+ when it finally drops.
    I don't want to discredit Bartmanhomer, but he likes every movie he sees.

  10. - Top - End - #10
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
    Talakeal's Avatar

    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Denver.
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Shang-Chi And The Legend Of The Ten Rings (2021)

    Quote Originally Posted by Cen View Post
    I don't want to discredit Bartmanhomer, but he likes every movie he sees.
    It really was good. My roommate said it was the best out of the entire MCU, and while I wouldn’t go that far, it is up there.


    The only bad review I have seen was the one on Yahoo news which claimed it was just a bland retread of Black Panther… and I can’t really take that criticism seriously in any good faith way.
    Looking for feedback on Heart of Darkness, a character driven RPG of Gothic fantasy.

  11. - Top - End - #11
    Titan in the Playground
     
    DrowGuy

    Join Date
    Dec 2015

    Default Re: Shang-Chi And The Legend Of The Ten Rings (2021)

    Quote Originally Posted by Cen View Post
    I don't want to discredit Bartmanhomer, but he likes every movie he sees.
    I don't like all the movies.
    It's time to get my Magikarp on!

  12. - Top - End - #12
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
    Flumph

    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Shang-Chi And The Legend Of The Ten Rings (2021)

    Quote Originally Posted by ecarden View Post
    Spoiler: Hidden Villages
    Show
    I don't love the hidden village thing and adding another ancient society (4000 years!) which has somehow remained the size of a village despite people living in it aging at human rates? Seriously? There ought to be basically a major country's worth of people through there, at least. And there's been no technological advancement in that time either? Why do this?

    Also, their knowledge of the outside world seemed...unlikely given that it sounds like only one of them ever left and she didn't return? How'd they know what cars were? Or that their ancient cities were so much better than our current cities?
    Spoiler
    Show
    Eh, the world's got various uncontacted or very isolated tribes that have probably been around about that long with village sized populations. Minimum population required to guard against genetic drift is only 500 or so.

    Plus anyone who's watched Star Trek knows that the first thing you do on becoming an enlightened wise ancient civilisation is revert to a pastoral idyll. Various Enterprises tripped over them every few dozen light years.
    Last edited by GloatingSwine; 2021-09-06 at 06:11 PM.

  13. - Top - End - #13
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Mystic Muse's Avatar

    Join Date
    Mar 2009

    Default Re: Shang-Chi And The Legend Of The Ten Rings (2021)

    Quote Originally Posted by Bartmanhomer View Post
    I don't like all the movies.
    You do ovedwhelmingly give positive reviews to almost everything you see. I think I recall one 3 in the past few months (Boss Baby 2?), and the rest or nearly all the rest have been 7 or higher.

  14. - Top - End - #14
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    ClericGuy

    Join Date
    Jun 2020

    Default Re: Shang-Chi And The Legend Of The Ten Rings (2021)

    Quote Originally Posted by GloatingSwine View Post
    Spoiler
    Show
    Eh, the world's got various uncontacted or very isolated tribes that have probably been around about that long with village sized populations. Minimum population required to guard against genetic drift is only 500 or so.

    Plus anyone who's watched Star Trek knows that the first thing you do on becoming an enlightened wise ancient civilisation is revert to a pastoral idyll. Various Enterprises tripped over them every few dozen light years.
    Spoiler: Response
    Show
    My objection isn't that they remain isolated (indeed, I think their isolation can't be that complete both due to human nature and because there were sufficient clues to lead the Ten Rings to them in the first place) or that they started at a small size.

    I couldn't tell if they still had access to the rest of their world (and its cities more magnificent than ours) but they clearly aren't anywhere near the carrying capacity of their region as they're able to support a large group of warriors and artisans despite that group apparently producing nothing of value for multiple millennia! And despite allegedly coming from a superior civilization and then getting an additional advantage in the form of the dragon, they're still right where they were technologically thirty seconds after the Dweller was locked away (based on the art we see as this is explained to us? I mean, medieval stasis is a trope and all, but I really dislike it here and in the 'back to nature'/'magical native' episodes of Star Trek.

    I mean, this isn't unique to Shang-Chi, there's plenty of settings where this is common and even elsewhere in the MCU (I think the Asgardians are actually the worst example of this, but at least there it might be argued that they've reached some peak of technology/magic and there's nowhere further to advance. I think that's wrong, but it's not absolutely crazy). Tolkein also isn't great on this and don't get me started on Forgotten Realms and most D&D settings crazy long history with only the occasional ancient magic/tech (that's BETTER than modern stuff) to suggest any real advancement.

    But this one is extra weird to me because they're humans and we see their technology level when we arrive, as they're farming off to the side of the shot (unless I'm misremembering) and they clearly do have some form of external contact (given they can communicate with everyone, recognize what a car is and have an external guard and know the path through their external defenses (why even have a path through those defenses if you aren't going to go out and do stuff in the world?)


    Not a big deal, but it makes me cranky. The broader trope makes me cranky and the ridiculously long timeline they put on it for no real reason just made it really jump out to me.

  15. - Top - End - #15
    Titan in the Playground
     
    DrowGuy

    Join Date
    Dec 2015

    Default Re: Shang-Chi And The Legend Of The Ten Rings (2021)

    Quote Originally Posted by Mystic Muse View Post
    You do ovedwhelmingly give positive reviews to almost everything you see. I think I recall one 3 in the past few months (Boss Baby 2?), and the rest or nearly all the rest have been 7 or higher.
    What can I say? I love good movies.
    It's time to get my Magikarp on!

  16. - Top - End - #16
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
    Talakeal's Avatar

    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Denver.
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Shang-Chi And The Legend Of The Ten Rings (2021)

    Quote Originally Posted by Bartmanhomer View Post
    What can I say? I love good movies.
    And also X-men Dark Phoenix
    Looking for feedback on Heart of Darkness, a character driven RPG of Gothic fantasy.

  17. - Top - End - #17
    Titan in the Playground
     
    DrowGuy

    Join Date
    Dec 2015

    Default Re: Shang-Chi And The Legend Of The Ten Rings (2021)

    Quote Originally Posted by Talakeal View Post
    And also X-men Dark Phoenix
    Yes, X-Men Dark Phoenix was an amazing movie.
    It's time to get my Magikarp on!

  18. - Top - End - #18
    Ettin in the Playground
     
    Ramza00's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location

    Default Re: Shang-Chi And The Legend Of The Ten Rings (2021)

    So how much choreography and outfits were inspired by anime / manga?
    Stupendous Man drawn by Linklele

  19. - Top - End - #19
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    ClericGuy

    Join Date
    Jun 2020

    Default Re: Shang-Chi And The Legend Of The Ten Rings (2021)

    Quote Originally Posted by Ramza00 View Post
    So how much choreography and outfits were inspired by anime / manga?
    I didn't catch much of anything. There's some obvious wuxia influences, but this was clearly more a love letter to Chinese cinema than anything to do with Japan, at least to my eyes, but I'm far from an expert.

  20. - Top - End - #20
    Ettin in the Playground
     
    Ramza00's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location

    Default Re: Shang-Chi And The Legend Of The Ten Rings (2021)

    Quote Originally Posted by ecarden View Post
    I didn't catch much of anything. There's some obvious wuxia influences, but this was clearly more a love letter to Chinese cinema than anything to do with Japan, at least to my eyes, but I'm far from an expert.
    So I have not watched this movie, even though I am super excited, due to the covid numbers being bad in my area and I live with an immune compromised family member even though our family is vaccinated.

    ————

    But Destin Daniel Cretton, the director, has mentioned some of the scenes were influenced by Dragonball in interviews. Likewise one of Shang Chi jackets is a specific shade of orange 🍊, that Goku is famous for, even if Shang-Chi wears many outfits.

    Thus I am curious if anyone in theaters noticed anything I should be aware of?
    Stupendous Man drawn by Linklele

  21. - Top - End - #21
    Orc in the Playground
     
    OrcBarbarianGuy

    Join Date
    Aug 2013

    Default Re: Shang-Chi And The Legend Of The Ten Rings (2021)

    Quote Originally Posted by ecarden View Post
    [SPOILER=Response]My objection isn't that they remain isolated (indeed, I think their isolation can't be that complete both due to human nature and because there were sufficient clues to lead the Ten Rings to them in the first place) or that they started at a small size.

    I couldn't tell if they still had access to the rest of their world (and its cities more magnificent than ours) but they clearly aren't anywhere near the carrying capacity of their region as they're able to support a large group of warriors and artisans despite that group apparently producing nothing of value for multiple millennia! And despite allegedly coming from a superior civilization and then getting an additional advantage in the form of the dragon, they're still right where they were technologically thirty seconds after the Dweller was locked away (based on the art we see as this is explained to us? I mean, medieval stasis is a trope and all, but I really dislike it here and in the 'back to nature'/'magical native' episodes of Star Trek.
    There are countless small villages across Asia, Africa and South America where despite having contact with the modern world, the people for the most part live lives not all that different from there ancestors from centuries gone by. Heck, even in the United States, that is pretty much what the Amish do. As for their not being more people, perhaps each generation loses some their young to outward immigration. It could be that not all chose to stay, but they generally respect the village not talk about where they came from.

  22. - Top - End - #22
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Rynjin's Avatar

    Join Date
    Sep 2016

    Default Re: Shang-Chi And The Legend Of The Ten Rings (2021)

    Quote Originally Posted by Ramza00 View Post
    But Destin Daniel Cretton, the director, has mentioned some of the scenes were influenced by Dragonball in interviews. Likewise one of Shang Chi jackets is a specific shade of orange 🍊, that Goku is famous for, even if Shang-Chi wears many outfits.
    And Dragonball was inspired by martial arts movies. Like literally Toriyama came up with the idea from watching kung fu movies while in a funk over Dr. Slump being kind of boring for him to write after so long.

    Add in some Journey to the West and other Chinese novel inspirations alongside, funnily enough, old Disney movies (apparently he loves 101 Dalmatians) and you have Dragon Ball.

    It all comes full circle.

  23. - Top - End - #23
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    ClericGuy

    Join Date
    Jun 2020

    Default Re: Shang-Chi And The Legend Of The Ten Rings (2021)

    Quote Originally Posted by Ranxerox View Post
    There are countless small villages across Asia, Africa and South America where despite having contact with the modern world, the people for the most part live lives not all that different from there ancestors from centuries gone by. Heck, even in the United States, that is pretty much what the Amish do. As for their not being more people, perhaps each generation loses some their young to outward immigration. It could be that not all chose to stay, but they generally respect the village not talk about where they came from.
    There are countless small villages where life has not changed since the bronze age (which is what 4000 years ago gets us to)? I really don't think that's true. And to the extent it is, they aren't a bunch of people from a 'superior' society whose fall was caused entirely by external invasion. It's not even the bull**** 'we grew decadent and dug into things man was not meant to know, so we must stay primitive and not advance' they were just attacked, right? Am I misremembering? Why wouldn't they want to rebuild what was lost, which they (and their dragon buddy) ought to remember?

    Emigration, as I said, is certainly possible, as is some sort of artificial limit on population. But the estimate I found for world population in 2000 BC are 27 million, which grew to 7.78 billion as of the present, that's a lot of growth, even hampered by fairly minimal tech for much of it and no magic. Sort of seems like the village might have grown quite a bit over the same period. Also, even if their population was limited, given that half of it was snapped out, they'd probably have been desperately trying to repopulate, then they'd have come back. There ought to be a lot of little kids running around.

    But the more I think about this, the weirder it seems, given that they're theoretically protecting the planet, maybe they should put some time into improving their defenses? They've got a village, a big moat and then the gate itself. They had four thousand years and couldn't maybe throw up a wall? Or remove the outcropping by the gate so there's not a nice landing platform for anyone who wants to open it? Or have some sort of warning system to wake up the dragon that isn't someone randomly getting knocked directly into her underwater lair? I mean, if you can wake her up when Wenwu walks away from the battle, it seems sort of unlikely he makes it to the gate at all (though relative power levels are real hard to tell in this movie). Or for that matter, don't place your village right in the path to the gate, but have only the monastery there to ensure access control and have the plan be to retreat in the face of overwhelming odds to defend the gate, with the dragon?

    The big problem here is 4000 years is longer than recorded history (ETA: nope, I was misremembering, recorded history began a bit earlier than this). Every language, every culture, every people you see around you was basically created over that time, or massively changed. But they just...didn't and that makes the world feel fake to me. ETA: Now, to be fair, you could go a different route and say that the art we see when the past is being described has been done in a Ta-Lo modern style, as they don't really know what happened 4000 years ago, because no one does (though they've got an eyewitness in the form of an immortal dragon and prove to be 100% correct in everything they predict). And there's no evidence of grander cities or anything, let alone how the Dweller came to attack them. There's lots of ways a society like this could come into existence and remain at this tech level/size, but most of them require significant outside involvement (which, hey, exists in the form of would-be invaders and the dragon). So, I can come up with a head-canon which explains it, but it doesn't cast the Great Protector in a great light to be honest.

    Also, I really assume you can't just fly over the moving forest and get into Ta-Lo by landing in the permanent clearing and going through the waterfall? Given the Dweller and its minions all fly, I assume that doesn't work. But again, if the goal is defense, why even have a way in and out?

    Alternatively, as they recognize a car and must have some outside contact, a few guns and dragon-scale bullets would be pretty effective. Given what we saw one arrow do to the Dweller, a bit of modernization and they don't need the 10 rings to kill him. Just shoot him. A lot.
    Last edited by ecarden; 2021-09-07 at 09:39 AM.

  24. - Top - End - #24
    Barbarian in the Playground
    Join Date
    Jun 2021

    Default Re: Shang-Chi And The Legend Of The Ten Rings (2021)

    *reads forum so far*

    well time for a voice of dissension I guess.

    I didn't particularly care for this movie. I didn't HATE it, like I did Iron Man 2 or Avengers 1 or 2, but I found it be be aggressively mediocre. Nothing new or interesting came out of it for me and except for a few portions, it felt kind of sloppily put together.

    I thought the lead was okay. didn't seem to have a lot of range, kind of felt sleepy in his performance, but I didn't find him offensive. I thought his sister was about the same. Although she did more for moving the plot and had a more tragic story so I'd almost make her a co-main if I'd been making this movie. I don't know who Awkwafina is, I don't know if she's a singer or a comedian or what, but I didn't really care for her. I'd put her pretty far down the stable of sidekicks. But, hey, at least now we know why Hawkeye is so good. In the MCU it only takes two days of casual practice to become an expert archer. So there's that.

    I really liked the bus fight in act one. This is the kind of action I -want- more of in my superhero movies. The hero versus a named villain with an interesting power and a small number of thugs. I loved how we got to SEE the choreography, see how each punch and kick flowed from one to the next. How each had consequence. How they used the setpeice as part of the action, from razorfist accidently cutting the brakecord, to Shang Chi using him to cut the bus in half, to using the stop request cord as a signal, to using his martial arts to keep people from falling off the bus, to seeing the HERO striving to save the civilians. I mean, that was a GREAT superhero set piece. One of the best of the MCU to date IMO. It showed a true economy of action and an understanding of what makes superhero action different than normal action.

    Contrast that to act three. I'm sick and tired of superhero movies turning into Lord of the Rings. I don't want to see any more nameless good guy army vs nameless bad guy army fights. We got that in Wakanda. We got that in Infinity War and Endgame. We've had plenty thanks. The moment they showed up in Tae Lo and we saw all the red-robed mooks with their dragonscale staves (indestinquishable from Vibranium weapons or the Electro-charged weapons of the Ten Ring mooks as far as power goes) I just groaned because we know where that's going.

    I think it's silly they movie is called "Legend of the Ten Rings" which the Ten Rings don't actually get delved into. it's really the Legend of Tae Lo and the Soul Eater Gate and the creature who lives beyond right? It was all about the legend of Shang Chi's mother. The Ten Rings were just random unknown artifacts unrelated to the rest of the narrative and they didn't go into where they came from or what they were or how they were important beyond that the evil endboss happened to think "hey, those might be strong enough to cave in this door. thank God this immortal warlord just HAPPENED to stumble from his story into this other unrelated story"

    Beyond that, their power is so undefined I have no connection to it. So really you can shot them off really fast at things right? And they have some sort of tractor field connecting them together so you can use them like whips I guess. And if you shoot them at the ground you can launch yourself into the sky and use them to slow down again... and they make you immortal? So do you heal fast or just don't age? I don't know. I'm really hoping they get a better explanation in the follow up movie and aren't just a replacement for the Infinity stones in the next phase of the MCU.

    Next question: Why is Wong pit fighting in Macau? Why is he work-release counselling the Abomination? Why is the Abomination regressed mentally from where he was in Incredible Hulk? Why is Wong consulting on the Rings instead of Strange? I'm very interested in all of this and really hope it goes somewhere and isn't as random as it seems.

    I didn't particualry find Tae Lo appealing. The various chinese inspired creatures were CGIed pretty poorly and looked super fake. they didn't blend in at all and so it really destroyed my ability to get invested. The explanation of "oh this is just a tiny village, we have huge cities just kind of over there... you know... who won't be involved in this fight" actually made me mad it was so pointlessly stupid.

    I -did- enjoy Ben Kingsley coming back. Didn't expect it, caught me by surprise. He obviously loves playing Trevor. But once he was rendered into a translator for what the tribble butt-with-wings was saying it kind of got old. Although the one-off shot during the obligatory training/preparing for invasion montage of him teaching kids how to play football was hilarious.

    Once again, the whole impact of the snap/blip was reduced to a few posters on walls and nothing else. Apparently the during blip and post blip economy was strong enough that Shang Chi and Katy could stay employed as Parking Valets through the whole period. That makes sense.

    I knew that would happen after they reduced it to a joke in Spider-Man: Far from Home, but it's still sad. At least the Disney+ series are putting SOME thought into the impact it would have on future world building.

    I don't know. Perhaps my hopes were too high. I know I went in with really high expectations (versus the upcoming Eternals where my expectations are rock-bottom) so I probably am being overly harsh. But yeah. For me this is near the bottom of the broad middle of the MCU.

    Lastly, let's talk about the end-boss. The nameless thing from beyond the gate. What a lame random tentacle monster. Seriously, all that build up for what? another random Kaiju with zero personality and no more powerset than flying around running into things. Seriously, the least impactful movie monster. If my superhero is a martial arts master, I would like his end boss to be someone he can fight with his martial arts skills, not reduced to flying on the back of a magic dragon as the magic dragon fights the big bad. Also, its hard to take this creature seriously as a world-destroying threat when he gets ripped apart by some alien rings in his tummy. Not sure why anyone was afraid of it in the first place. Hawkeye could've destroyed it. It was less impactful and menacing than the Chitauri space worms.
    Last edited by Wintermoot; 2021-09-07 at 10:23 AM.

  25. - Top - End - #25
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    Iruka's Avatar

    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Germany

    Default Re: Shang-Chi And The Legend Of The Ten Rings (2021)

    Quote Originally Posted by Cen View Post
    I don't want to discredit Bartmanhomer, but he likes every movie he sees.
    Seems to me like he spends his cinema budget wisely.
    Last edited by Iruka; 2021-09-07 at 09:55 AM.


    "Children grow up to be people? All the children I knew grew up to be machines."
    ~Augustus von Fabelrath~
    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    Somebody should have that sigged.
    Member of Peelee's Church of Sudden Skylight

  26. - Top - End - #26
    Barbarian in the Playground
    Join Date
    Aug 2013

    Default Re: Shang-Chi And The Legend Of The Ten Rings (2021)

    Quote Originally Posted by Wintermoot View Post
    *reads forum so far*

    well time for a voice of dissension I guess.
    Many of the points you raise is the same I have with this movie.

  27. - Top - End - #27
    Orc in the Playground
     
    BardGirl

    Join Date
    Nov 2019

    Default Re: Shang-Chi And The Legend Of The Ten Rings (2021)

    Overall, I liked it, but it's a firm "good not great" for me. I liked the characters a lot, and the comic relief characters weren't overused, and good work in that area can carry nearly anything unless the plot is Black Widow levels of incoherent. I agree that the bus fight was a standout--I always love it when superhero movies remember that the distinctive feature of a superhero is that they save people.

    With that said, I think that my one real gripe is that it felt it was REALLY struggling with the rating it got--
    Spoiler: Minor spoilers
    Show
    -notably two pivotal deaths happening off-camera. Something like Shang-Chi killing his mother's murderer was a pivotal character moment that should definitely have happened on screen rather than in exposition.
    Last edited by Azuresun; 2021-09-07 at 04:37 PM.

  28. - Top - End - #28
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    Mordar's Avatar

    Join Date
    Mar 2008

    Default Re: Shang-Chi And The Legend Of The Ten Rings (2021)

    Quote Originally Posted by Azuresun View Post
    With that said, I think that my one real gripe is that it felt it was REALLY struggling with the rating it got--
    Spoiler: Minor spoilers
    Show
    -notably two pivotal deaths happening off-camera. Something like Shang-Chi killing his mother's murderer was a pivotal character moment that should definitely have happened on screen rather than in exposition.
    Have to disagree. Acceptable in the two-part format, I think.
    Spoiler
    Show
    How else could he lie to Katy about it? Show the truth and hear the lie? Good for some films, but would probably confuse a lot of viewers in this one. A second flashback? We've already seen his skills in two major fights by the time he admits it, so an action scene from when he was 14 (?) probably just regresses.


    - M
    No matter where you go...there you are!

    Holhokki Tapio - GitP Blood Bowl New Era Season I Champion
    Togashi Ishi - Betrayal at the White Temple
    Da Monsters of Da Midden - GitP Blood Bowl Manager Cup Season V-VI-VII

  29. - Top - End - #29
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    Daemon

    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    insides of Pandora's box
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Shang-Chi And The Legend Of The Ten Rings (2021)

    Hmm so basically the plot of this movie is that superpowered martial artist has to go back to magicla kingdom he came from and despite being said as being top martial artist trianed from childhood to be this undefeatable warrior he is outperformed and humiliated on every step... I have Iron Fist flashbacks...

    And his sister said she trained HERSELF while he was on trainning bordering with torture... and she is better then him? I smell ****e

    Aquafina... that's a weird name wasn't she this dolphin rapper in BoJack? got superduper good with bow and arrow after one day of training... beacause of course she did.

    I miss times where male lead was allowed to be good at something without being humiliated by 'a brave strong and powerful female'.

    Overall this movie was wonderfully medicore. Not good, not terrible.

  30. - Top - End - #30
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    ElfWarriorGuy

    Join Date
    Sep 2016
    Location
    United States
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Shang-Chi And The Legend Of The Ten Rings (2021)

    I liked the movie and don't have much to say about it, apart from one petty fanboy gripe:

    Spoiler
    Show
    Was anyone disappointed that what appeared from the trailers to be Fin Fang Foom just turned out to be the far less interesting Abomination?
    The desire to appear clever often impedes actually being so.

    What makes the vanity of others offensive is the fact that it wounds our own.

    Quarrels don't last long if the fault is only on one side.

    Nothing is given so generously as advice.

    We hardly ever find anyone of good sense, except those who agree with us.

    -Francois, Duc de La Rochefoucauld

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •