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2021-11-24, 08:42 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Fee-Fi-Fo-Fum, Form smells a Random Banter #235
Hate me if you want. But that's your issue to fix, not mine.
Primal ego vos, estis ex nihilo.
When Gods Go To War comes out March 8th
Discord: HalfTangible
Extended Sig
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2021-11-24, 10:27 PM (ISO 8601)
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- May 2013
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Re: Fee-Fi-Fo-Fum, Form smells a Random Banter #235
Last edited by Rater202; 2021-11-24 at 10:54 PM.
I also answer to Bookmark and Shadow Claw.
Read my fanfiction here. Homebrew Material Here Rater Reads the Hobbit and Dracula
Awesome Avatar by Emperor Ing
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2021-11-25, 03:33 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Oct 2009
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- In my library
Re: Fee-Fi-Fo-Fum, Form smells a Random Banter #235
It's impressive, but it isn't superhuman. Because humans beat cancer everyday, it is a very human achievement.
Which should be enough. Humans have achieved amazing and sometimes terrible things. By working together we've made a reasonable attempt at taming a planet, we've driven plagues to extinction, if we sat down and tried we could feed the world without much additional effort. And on the individual level some people achieve outstanding feats of athleticism or overcome the most horrible diseases known.
Who cares about superhuman? Everybody who survives cancer is amazing, and they have to be nothing more than human to do it.
So... Whose turn is it to do the next thread?
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2021-11-25, 04:05 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Jul 2020
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2021-11-25, 04:19 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Aug 2017
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Re: Fee-Fi-Fo-Fum, Form smells a Random Banter #235
Forum Wisdom
Mage avatar by smutmulch & linklele.
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2021-11-25, 04:27 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Jul 2020
Re: Fee-Fi-Fo-Fum, Form smells a Random Banter #235
That's not for a lack of trying.
Aye, but let's not focus on the ngative, shall we.
"Dude, you nuked a whole city from orbit. A hundred thousand people died!"
"Let's not focus on the negative, shall we? We are doing awesome!"
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2021-11-25, 04:42 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Aug 2017
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Re: Fee-Fi-Fo-Fum, Form smells a Random Banter #235
It kinda is, actually. The problem is more a lack of caring.
"That pesky serial killer will trouble us no more!"
"Dude, you nuked a whole city from orbit. A hundred thousand people died!"
"Let's not focus on the negative, shall we? We are doing awesome!"Forum Wisdom
Mage avatar by smutmulch & linklele.
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2021-11-25, 04:44 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Oct 2009
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- In my library
Re: Fee-Fi-Fo-Fum, Form smells a Random Banter #235
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2021-11-25, 04:56 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Jul 2020
Re: Fee-Fi-Fo-Fum, Form smells a Random Banter #235
The two don't exclude each other, in fact.
That's not analoguous. The development of antibiotics and vaccines is completely unrelated to the current ecological crisis.
Otherwise fair. So let me try again:
"Look at those infrastructural developments! [Fictional dictator]'s time was an age of prosperity!"
"Dude. Guy ordered literal genocides."
"Bah! Stop focusing on the negatives!"
You specifically said "amazing and sometimes terrible" things, and based on your other examples, I figured that was supposed to count as "amazing, rather than terrible". Sorry if I misunderstood.Last edited by Metastachydium; 2021-11-25 at 04:57 AM.
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2021-11-25, 05:17 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Oct 2009
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- In my library
Re: Fee-Fi-Fo-Fum, Form smells a Random Banter #235
What I'm getting is that antibiotics are fine, as long as the population that uses them practices effective and reliable birth control?
Yeah, guess humanity completely fails there then.
You specifically said "amazing and sometimes terrible" things, and based on your other examples, I figured that was supposed to count as "amazing, rather than terrible". Sorry if I misunderstood.
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2021-11-25, 05:27 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Aug 2017
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- France
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Re: Fee-Fi-Fo-Fum, Form smells a Random Banter #235
They do, though. You don't try to do something you're apathetic about. People aren't trying to bring an ecological crisis, it's a side effect of what we're doing.
It kind of is: plagues regulate population dynamics to a certain degree. Fewer plagues mean faster population growth and more people mean more problems.
Otherwise fair. So let me try again:
"Look at those infrastructural developments! [Fictional dictator]'s time was an age of prosperity!"
"Dude. Guy ordered literal genocides."
"Bah! Stop focusing on the negatives!"Forum Wisdom
Mage avatar by smutmulch & linklele.
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2021-11-25, 05:40 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Jul 2020
Re: Fee-Fi-Fo-Fum, Form smells a Random Banter #235
You know exactly what I mean: folks are actively, if unwittingly, working towards an outcome.
Overpopulation is a myth.
Again, doesn't work. What in your example the second speaker is pointing out a way in which the first speaker's statement is incorrect (it wasn't an age of prosperity since a large portion of the population died) when you're bringing out stuff that was unrelated to what Anon was saying. That's like saying "Tenth century europe saw the apex of romanesque architecture. -But that's when the Crusades happened!"
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2021-11-25, 05:45 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Oct 2009
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- In my library
Re: Fee-Fi-Fo-Fum, Form smells a Random Banter #235
It still works if we use awesome to mean 'worthu of awe' rather than 'amazing'.
Like, I was trying to make no implications on if these things are good or right, just that doing them is awesome. Yes, humans are killing the planet and haven't transitioned to more environmentally friendly power and diet fast enough. No this doesn't make domesticating planets and animals not amazing.
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2021-11-25, 05:51 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Jul 2020
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2021-11-25, 06:02 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Jun 2010
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- Netherlands
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2021-11-25, 06:17 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Feb 2007
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- Manchester, UK
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2021-11-25, 06:31 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Oct 2009
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- In my library
Re: Fee-Fi-Fo-Fum, Form smells a Random Banter #235
I take no responsibility for any words but my own.
And let's be honest, I don't always take responsibility for those.
Yes, but they still don't require a figure more than human.
I think. Never looked into how the chemicals and radiation are made.
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2021-11-25, 07:02 AM (ISO 8601)
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- May 2013
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- Where I am
Re: Fee-Fi-Fo-Fum, Form smells a Random Banter #235
1: I strongly recommend looking up the Dorkly video "If Thano had an assistant" because it perfectly summarizes why resource depletion from overpopulation is bullcrap. I'm not gonna ink it becuase it has a lot of uncensored swearing and I don't fully understand what the rules for linking that are but if it's censored on the forum I think it's safe to avoid anything with too much of it.
To summarize: There's more than enough food on earth to feed everyone, and people still starve because various factors et in the way of supply lines.
2: You could comfortably fi the entire human population of the planet in Texas or New Zealand.
3: About 75% of greenhouse gas emissions are generated by the same 100 corporations. Personal responsibility is all well and good, but your personal carbon footprint is utterly irrelevant in comparison. Everybody on Earth could be driving hybrids and the world would still be doomed if the corporations don't change. If you ignore corporations entirely and focus explosively on life-style emissions, that's still only a fraction of total worldwide emissions, and the 10% richest portions of the population are personally responsible for the majority of lifestyle emissions.I also answer to Bookmark and Shadow Claw.
Read my fanfiction here. Homebrew Material Here Rater Reads the Hobbit and Dracula
Awesome Avatar by Emperor Ing
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2021-11-25, 07:25 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Jul 2020
Re: Fee-Fi-Fo-Fum, Form smells a Random Banter #235
That's cute, but here's the thing: emissions from residential consumption in itself may amount to barely more than 10% of all emissions, I do not contest that. Sole problem is, the rest mostly comes from agriculture, transport, mining, manufacturing and other industrial processes and so on and so forth, i.e. it arises from feeding and housing all those people, producing energy to make that possible, build and maintain your fancy will-save-everyone hybrid cars and wind turbines and make the funny little lives of billions of people comfortable so you could theorize about what Thanos or what's his name should do.
But you know what? I support the proposal. All those humans should just be dumped in Texas, never to leave its borders again.
(Also, apologies, but I'm not going to watch that video. I don't tend to watch youtube stuff.)Last edited by Metastachydium; 2021-11-25 at 07:25 AM.
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2021-11-25, 07:46 AM (ISO 8601)
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- May 2013
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Re: Fee-Fi-Fo-Fum, Form smells a Random Banter #235
I also answer to Bookmark and Shadow Claw.
Read my fanfiction here. Homebrew Material Here Rater Reads the Hobbit and Dracula
Awesome Avatar by Emperor Ing
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2021-11-25, 07:52 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Jul 2020
Re: Fee-Fi-Fo-Fum, Form smells a Random Banter #235
Granted. Make no mistake: I'm not defending the people "owing to" whom, say, monocultures are still a thing. I'm just skeptical regarding just how far that "far more efficiently" could carry us, and I happen to think that many of the proposed "fixes" are perpetuating the problems rather than actually fixing them.
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2021-11-25, 07:54 AM (ISO 8601)
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- May 2021
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- Massachusetts
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Re: Fee-Fi-Fo-Fum, Form smells a Random Banter #235
I think Meta is being a little unnecessarily combative, she is kind of right about the carbon emission stuff. It is the corporations that produce the emissions, but it isn’t as if General Motors runs factories for fun, they do it because people like you and me drive cars. Companies have pushed the narrative that individual responsibility narrative to help shift the blame for the climate crisis, and any effective attempts to address said crises need to come from the top down. However, there isn’t any scenario where we fix the issue and peoples lifestyles don’t change.
They best way to do that is to create better public transportation in most major cities (looking at you Los Angeles), invest more in the transportation railways, shift from coal power to a combo of solar, hydroelectric, and nuclear, and reduce red meat consumption.
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2021-11-25, 08:08 AM (ISO 8601)
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- May 2013
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Re: Fee-Fi-Fo-Fum, Form smells a Random Banter #235
You don't even need to reduce red meat consumption: The methan cows produce is a product of their diet. There's a species of kelp that's relatively cheap to farm that, fed to tcows in moderation, reduces cow methane production significantly. And despite common jokes, it's cow burps, not cow farts, that have them than, and there's been some development on masks to put on the cows that filter out the methane and store it.
Investing in one or both of those on a grand scale would go a long way to solving the issue in regards to meat farming.
And believe it or not one of the most efficient ways to fight carbon emissions is to just plant more trees.
Putting a stop to organic farming on the industrial scale would help too—organic farming needs more land to produce enough crops because organic fertilizers and pesticides don't work as well, which is a contributor to deforestation. Furthermore, despite claims that organic fertilizers and pesticides are more environmentally friendly... They're not. Most synthetic farming chemicals are actually designed to degrade relatively quickly to limit their impact now.
We have genetically modified plants that are healthier and need less fertilizer and pesticide than natural plants and we have synthetic pesticides and fertilizers that are more efficient than natural methods while breaking down before they can have a significant environmental impact. We have solved the problems of agriculture, we just need to kill the propaganda that prevents that from being used.I also answer to Bookmark and Shadow Claw.
Read my fanfiction here. Homebrew Material Here Rater Reads the Hobbit and Dracula
Awesome Avatar by Emperor Ing
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2021-11-25, 08:27 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Jul 2020
Re: Fee-Fi-Fo-Fum, Form smells a Random Banter #235
Putting a stop to farming in general at the industrial scale would help a lot more.
—organic farming needs more land to produce enough crops because organic fertilizers and pesticides don't work as well, which is a contributor to deforestation. Furthermore, despite claims that organic fertilizers and pesticides are more environmentally friendly... They're not. Most synthetic farming chemicals are actually designed to degrade relatively quickly to limit their impact now.
We have genetically modified plants that are healthier and need less fertilizer and pesticide than natural plants and we have synthetic pesticides and fertilizers that are more efficient than natural methods while breaking down before they can have a significant environmental impact. We have solved the problems of agriculture, we just need to kill the propaganda that prevents that from being used.
As for GMO, setting aside health concerns (GM soy has been associated with cardiac and liver problems if consumed in larger quantities if I remember correctly), they have a huge environmental impact and not a positive one. Introducing overly resilient organisms into an ecosystem is not a very bright idea. Cases of GMO crops transferring genes to realated weed species that subsequently go invasive to the detriment of much everything else in the area are well documented.
Hm. You're probably right. Apologies go to everyone if my tone was too much!Last edited by Metastachydium; 2021-11-25 at 08:31 AM.
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2021-11-25, 11:04 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Feb 2007
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Re: Fee-Fi-Fo-Fum, Form smells a Random Banter #235
Sorry, that's just an excuse to abrogate personal responsibility for global emissions. Those 100 corporations producing 70% of emissions may well be a true fact, but who do you think they're producing those emissions on behalf of? For example, if a power generating corporation produces significant emissions, the most effective way to get them to produce fewer emissions is for the people consuming the power--e.g. *us*--to consume less of it. A corporation that produces mobile phones will produce fewer emissions if people don't change their phone every couple of years and instead keep their old ones for longer. See where I'm going with this?
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2021-11-25, 11:11 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Dec 2009
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Re: Fee-Fi-Fo-Fum, Form smells a Random Banter #235
Yes, and Alice's boyfriend only punches her because he loves her, and the most effective way to stop it is for her to leave her home and go to a shelter.
Now, sure, that's an effective method, but ya know, I can't help but think that maybe we should focus on "maybe we should focus on making the puncher stop without putting the onus on the one being punched".Cuthalion's art is the prettiest art of all the art. Like my avatar.
Number of times Roland St. Jude has sworn revenge upon me: 2
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2021-11-25, 11:25 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Fee-Fi-Fo-Fum, Form smells a Random Banter #235
It's not the same situation at all. Sure, we can ask those corporations to produce what they produce more efficiently, but don't you think there's already plenty of incentive for them to do that? For the energy corporation to produce fewer emissions means they burn less fuel, which reduces their on-going costs--why would they *not* try to make things as efficient as possible? But there's a limit to how far that can be taken. If you're seriously suggesting that everyone can just do nothing and the corporations will magically fix it all, then I propose that's arrant nonsense--we cannot consume our way out of something that is at least partially a resource shortage. (One of the resources in this case being the capacity of the atmosphere to absorb CO2).
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2021-11-25, 11:31 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Fee-Fi-Fo-Fum, Form smells a Random Banter #235
Sure it's not a perfect analogy. But no these are not innocent corporations who are only doing what they do as a service to us ingrates. They are maximizing their profit, and if they could do it without having to bother with the common people at all, they would in a second.
And I also think we should stop asking them nicely.Cuthalion's art is the prettiest art of all the art. Like my avatar.
Number of times Roland St. Jude has sworn revenge upon me: 2
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2021-11-25, 11:34 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Fee-Fi-Fo-Fum, Form smells a Random Banter #235
Not really
Corporations are about short-term profits. Renovating their infrastructure to be eco-friendly is very costly. It's not uncommon to see companies neglecting repairs or basic maintenance unless forced by law (and even then, many would rather get away with breaking the law) because a leak every month is a more acceptable finenciary loss than a big overview and update of the facilities every decade.
There also the problem of companies whose entire business model is by itself polluting, such as fossil fuel production. These have no financiary incentive to switch to eco-friendlier sources of energy.
Edit: There's another whole angle I could develop as to why big companies deserve sonmuch of the blame, but I can't word it without infringing on the board rules, so I'll have to leave it to your imagination.Last edited by Fyraltari; 2021-11-25 at 11:36 AM.
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2021-11-25, 11:37 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Fee-Fi-Fo-Fum, Form smells a Random Banter #235
I don't think I said otherwise, did I? But it's just as incorrect (IMHO) to say that responsibility for climate change is entirely down to corporations and Joe Public can't have any effect on it, as it is to say that corporations are entirely innocent and every else needs to do all the work. It's a shared responsibility, and that old saw of "70% of emissions are produced by 100 corporations so we can't really affect things at all" is just plain wrong.