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  1. - Top - End - #61
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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Thecommander236 View Post
    Yeah, they are chasing her, but now it's 3 v 1 and they were losing 7 v 2. The odds haven't improved. In fact, they are worse.
    I know I'm not a storytelling expert, but if you asked me for my overall read on this scene so far, it feels like it's set up to show that Serini is competent and prepared for lots of contingencies, and will probably try some further ambush tricks in the next room, but also that she is absolutely on the back foot and stubbornly refusing to talk -- to a fault.

    Quote Originally Posted by KorvinStarmast View Post
    Or into the passageway beyond, or into the cave beyond, or into the pit beyond, or into the hole beyond since she knows that there's a pit trap ... (Rogue's gotta rogue)
    Although, it would be truly delightful in an "early OotS incompetence humor" way if Sunny had just created, like, a 5-foot-deep hole in solid rock and Serini ran into a dead end

    My guess, though, is that we will continue to get a dynamic, thrilling, and imaginative chase sequence, with plenty of heart and humor in the dialogue. Oh, well. Guess we'll just have to slog through.

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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by pendell View Post
    What eye did Vaarsuvius get hit with? It's not disintegration or petrification. Does anyone recognize what hit, or will we only find out in a few strips?

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    Brian P.
    Someone used the eye position to deduct it would be sleep. Which would not work on V at all, since Elf.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Unavenger View Post
    All the discussion of how weird the half-hour start is seems weirdly prescient, in retrospect.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rogan View Post
    Can I use my prediction of the half an hour being used to set up Factional chats as proof I am the Seer?
    Quote Originally Posted by rogue_alchemist View Post
    only IRL, not as in game proof, as we all know that recruitment threads don't count for making IG decisions



  3. - Top - End - #63
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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Rogan View Post
    Someone used the eye position to deduct it would be sleep. Which would not work on V at all, since Elf.
    Which makes a little more sense given that it was aimed at Haley, who yoinked V out of the way of their intended eye ray and into hers. And if Haley was thinking that far ahead and realized V would be immune to her intended effect, then she's truly got that admirable rogue's cunning!

  4. - Top - End - #64
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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Rogan View Post
    Someone used the eye position to deduct it would be sleep. Which would not work on V at all, since Elf.
    Eye position doesn't work, though. Unless Elan actually got zapped by Disintegrate earlier, or Charm Person made the hole in the wall.
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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    So, uh, Sunny, why did you attack me and my friends?

    Sunny: Because mom says you're going to blow up the world! I can't trust you!

    (*makes several expressions of confusion and surprise*) ...Even I'm not dumb enough to do that twice.



    Really, what are the odds of someone in the Order - probably Roy - getting frustrated that even after they've stopped being the inept random noobs that blunder into something, break a lot of stuff, and stop it from getting too much worse, they're still forced into that role?
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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Thecommander236 View Post
    Yeah, they are chasing her, but now it's 3 v 1 and they were losing 7 v 2. The odds haven't improved. In fact, they are worse.
    Sure, that's one way of looking at it.

    The other way is that the group being left behind is a petrified Durkon, a KO'd-by-poison Roy, a Cohort-power Minrah... and Elan. Yes, Elan's the most powerful current member of the group left behind.

    And the group following her are Belkar, who's at full strength, Haley, who doesn't have her best weapon but has others on her because Rogue, and Vaarsuvius, who might be affected by one of the eyes but otherwise is a high-level wizard with dozens of spells available to cast (and hey, maybe he made his saving throw).

    Including probably Dimensional Anchor, which would shut down Serini should she try to escape, since its also a spell that he would have likely prepared when originally planning on facing Xykon and Redcloak, who they know have teleportation magic.

    Basically, just about everyone that was still capable of really fighting is chasing after Serini. It really depends on where she's running to, because Vaarsuvius alone is probably a lot more power than she's capable of beating.

    Also also... look, she left Sunny alone in the room with Elan. Elan's not a great combatant, but he's a great charmer. She's just begging for him to win Sunny over now that she's not around to stop him from talking. Doubly so since Minrah's also quite friendly, and knows all of the details, including the whole "gods will destroy the world if the Xykon takes the gate" bit that we're not sure has filtered out to the rest of the party.
    Last edited by Wraithfighter; 2021-10-14 at 10:23 AM.

  7. - Top - End - #67
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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by danielxcutter View Post
    So, uh, Sunny, why did you attack me and my friends?

    Sunny: Because mom says you're going to blow up the world! I can't trust you!

    (*makes several expressions of confusion and surprise*) ...Even I'm not dumb enough to do that twice.
    I don't know how to break this to you but Elan voted to do it to twice.
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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    Eye position doesn't work, though. Unless Elan actually got zapped by Disintegrate earlier, or Charm Person made the hole in the wall.
    Good point. I just noticed the charm effect is on different eyes when used on Elan 1241 or Haley 1244 respectively.
    So eye position seems to be unreliable for identifying the effect.

    It still might be sleep. Mind effecting is unlikely, since the eyes are normal for V, while Elan and Belkar had orange eyes in 1241. V doesn't look like stone when we see her last. So it's either sleep or slow again.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Unavenger View Post
    All the discussion of how weird the half-hour start is seems weirdly prescient, in retrospect.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rogan View Post
    Can I use my prediction of the half an hour being used to set up Factional chats as proof I am the Seer?
    Quote Originally Posted by rogue_alchemist View Post
    only IRL, not as in game proof, as we all know that recruitment threads don't count for making IG decisions



  9. - Top - End - #69
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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Rogan View Post
    Good point. I just noticed the charm effect is on different eyes when used on Elan 1241 or Haley 1244 respectively.
    So eye position seems to be unreliable for identifying the effect.

    It still might be sleep. Mind effecting is unlikely, since the eyes are normal for V, while Elan and Belkar had orange eyes in 1241. V doesn't look like stone when we see her last. So it's either sleep or slow again.
    I'm totally hoping it's sleep, I'll admit.
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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    I don't know how to break this to you but Elan voted to do it to twice.
    You know what I mean.
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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    I mean, we need to also keep in mind that the Eyestalk Beams have a DC 18 saving throw. That's in the hard, but not unbeatable territory, especially for high-level characters.

    Honestly, I'm a little surprised that the entire party failed their saving throws last time. Hell, Flesh to Stone's save is Constitution-based, and Durkon's a high-level Dwarven Cleric (who get high-progression on Fort saves) who's much more of a bashing-faces type cleric (thus would likely have a high Constitution on top of the Dwarven racial bonuses), it's honestly pretty surprising that he managed to fail that.

    Sure, obviously, we're reading a story and not following a campaign, the rule on when a character makes or fails their saving throw is "When the plot says so", not pesky things like rules, but the point is just that it might only be setting up a gag in the next strip where Haley asks which beam V got hit by, V doesn't know but says he's fine, and Belkar comments "...wait, we can make saving throws?" or something >_>.

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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    Here is what I would do if I was Serini. First of all, the hole in the wall would not have an outlet. Instead, once I got to the far end I would teleport back out to the room with Sunny and close up the hole. That way I have split the party and are now dealing with the weaker of the remaining combatants.

  13. - Top - End - #73
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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    Sunny is lovely and must be protected at all costs.

    Also "Pew! Pew! Pew!"
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  14. - Top - End - #74
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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Wraithfighter View Post
    I mean, we need to also keep in mind that the Eyestalk Beams have a DC 18 saving throw. That's in the hard, but not unbeatable territory, especially for high-level characters.

    Honestly, I'm a little surprised that the entire party failed their saving throws last time. Hell, Flesh to Stone's save is Constitution-based, and Durkon's a high-level Dwarven Cleric (who get high-progression on Fort saves) who's much more of a bashing-faces type cleric (thus would likely have a high Constitution on top of the Dwarven racial bonuses), it's honestly pretty surprising that he managed to fail that.

    Sure, obviously, we're reading a story and not following a campaign, the rule on when a character makes or fails their saving throw is "When the plot says so", not pesky things like rules, but the point is just that it might only be setting up a gag in the next strip where Haley asks which beam V got hit by, V doesn't know but says he's fine, and Belkar comments "...wait, we can make saving throws?" or something >_>.
    Have we been reading the same comic? The only time the protagonists make a save is when it’s an actual save-or-lose.
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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    Give Sunny her own t shirt, please.

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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by danielxcutter View Post
    You know what I mean.
    And I always know what Serini means - she doesn't trust them not to, whether intentionally or accidentally. The people she doesn't trust saying "but trust us anyway!" doesnt make for a strong argument.
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  17. - Top - End - #77
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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Ionathus View Post
    And if Haley was thinking that far ahead and realized V would be immune to her intended effect, then she's truly got that admirable rogue's cunning!
    Haley being smart (if imperfect) is a long established character trait.
    Quote Originally Posted by danielxcutter View Post
    Really, what are the odds of someone in the Order - probably Roy - getting frustrated that even after they've stopped being the inept random noobs that blunder into something, break a lot of stuff, and stop it from getting too much worse, they're still forced into that role?
    High.
    Quote Originally Posted by Wraithfighter View Post
    The other way is that the group being left behind is a petrified Durkon, a KO'd-by-poison Roy, a Cohort-power Minrah... and Elan. Yes, Elan's the most powerful current member of the group left behind.
    Low level moans of "we're doomed" are seen coming form Roy's mouth.
    Basically, just about everyone that was still capable of really fighting is chasing after Serini. It really depends on where she's running to, because Vaarsuvius alone is probably a lot more power than she's capable of beating.
    So far as we know, but I suspect she has a wand or two in her pockets.
    She's just begging for him to win Sunny over now that she's not around to stop him from talking. Doubly so since Minrah's also quite friendly, and knows all of the details, including the whole "gods will destroy the world if the Xykon takes the gate" bit that we're not sure has filtered out to the rest of the party.
    Elan getting some spotlight time will work nicely while the able, competent fighters are off trying to capture Serini.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rogan View Post
    So eye position seems to be unreliable for identifying the effect.
    So much for my "sleep/elf" thought.
    Quote Originally Posted by Duncun View Post
    Here is what I would do if I was Serini. First of all, the hole in the wall would not have an outlet. Instead, once I got to the far end I would teleport back out to the room with Sunny and close up the hole.
    Not sure how she "closes up the hole" since Sunny used disintegrate on it, but I'm willing to be amazed by what Serini comes up with. (Wand of stone shape?)
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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    And I always know what Serini means - she doesn't trust them not to, whether intentionally or accidentally. The people she doesn't trust saying "but trust us anyway!" doesnt make for a strong argument.
    No, I meant “you get what feel I was going for” irrelevant to the actual “is Serini right with the wrong info” argument; what Elan might say in that situation.

    Edit:

    Low level moans of "we're doomed" are seen coming form Roy's mouth.
    …So like, CR 6 at the most right?
    Last edited by danielxcutter; 2021-10-14 at 11:05 AM.

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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    so we finally find out what number 8 does! disintegrate!

    guess those walls are pretty thin! https://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/disintegrate.htm okay as much as a 10 foot cube and that hole sure ain't 10 feet tall. wonder how thick that back wall was.
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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by danielxcutter View Post
    Have we been reading the same comic? The only time the protagonists make a save is when it’s an actual save-or-lose.
    Hey, I think the last time we saw Haley fail a Reflex save was back in strip 168! And almost half the party beat the Vampiric Gaze save!

    But hey, that's why I think it'd be a funny joke, to lampshade how rarely characters manage to make their saving throw :D.
    Last edited by Wraithfighter; 2021-10-14 at 11:26 AM.

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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by danielxcutter View Post
    No, I meant “you get what feel I was going for” irrelevant to the actual “is Serini right with the wrong info” argument; what Elan might say in that situation.
    Yes, I got that that's what you think Elan might say in that scenario, and the response from, Sunny would probably be "you already did, you bozo". And replacing "twice" with "thrice" doesn't really have as much punch, especially when there's only five.
    Last edited by Peelee; 2021-10-14 at 11:34 AM.
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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    It's really hard to see that panel as anything but Haley deliberately shielding herself with V, so I hope the idea that was the Sleep beam is correct. It'd be pretty nuts if she could remember and deduce that particular eye's effect AND make such a judgment call in an instant like that though.
    Last edited by Kamunami; 2021-10-14 at 11:46 AM.

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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by gatemansgc View Post
    so we finally find out what number 8 does! disintegrate!
    Technically we already knew that - MM1 pg. 27

    Quote Originally Posted by gatemansgc View Post
    guess those walls are pretty thin! https://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/disintegrate.htm okay as much as a 10 foot cube and that hole sure ain't 10 feet tall. wonder how thick that back wall was.
    Probably as thick as the front wall, i.e. not very.
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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    Yikes. It strikes me that Haley's spoken rationale for trying to capture Serini -- so they can get plot information out of her -- will probably go a long way to reinforcing Serini's antagonism towards the party.

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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    Why would it?
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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by danielxcutter View Post
    Why would it?
    Because that's one of the specific things a gate guardian would be wary of? Not to mention plot details have been forced out of her once before and look what followed up from that.

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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Hurkyl View Post
    Yikes. It strikes me that Haley's spoken rationale for trying to capture Serini -- so they can get plot information out of her -- will probably go a long way to reinforcing Serini's antagonism towards the party.
    Ooof, yeah, that's worrying, that might make her start to cause problems for them! She might even attack them, poison and petrify critical party members, and try to wipe their memories to completely destroy their efforts to save the world! They better be careful!

    Sorry, but while you're not exactly wrong, taking her from "hostile" to "even more hostile" doesn't seem like that much of a worry for them.

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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Wraithfighter View Post
    Ooof, yeah, that's worrying, that might make her start to cause problems for them! She might even attack them, poison and petrify critical party members, and try to wipe their memories to completely destroy their efforts to save the world! They better be careful!

    Sorry, but while you're not exactly wrong, taking her from "hostile" to "even more hostile" doesn't seem like that much of a worry for them.
    Yeah that. She's already being pretty opposite of helpful.
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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by smuchmuch View Post
    Could be wrong but I do not believe that anti magic can reverse petrification effect, especialy if it comes from a supernatural ability rather than the flesh to stone spell, once the petrification is complete.
    It might reverse Bloodfeast the Xerminator back to a dinosaur if the lizard was in the cone radius (but I doubt it, Belkar probably took em back with him.)
    Quote Originally Posted by hamishspence View Post
    Since it suppresses but does not dispel magical things (even supernatural ones), it should actually suppress petrification, but only while the petrified being is in the field. Take it out of the field and the petrification effect reappears.
    Quote Originally Posted by SRD
    Flesh to Stone
    Transmutation
    Level: Sor/Wiz 6
    Components: V, S, M
    Casting Time: 1 standard action
    Range: Medium (100 ft. + 10 ft./level)
    Target: One creature
    Duration: Instantaneous
    Saving Throw: Fortitude negates
    Spell Resistance: Yes
    The subject, along with all its carried gear, turns into a mindless, inert statue. If the statue resulting from this spell is broken or damaged, the subject (if ever returned to its original state) has similar damage or deformities. The creature is not dead, but it does not seem to be alive either when viewed with spells such as deathwatch.

    Only creatures made of flesh are affected by this spell.
    Note the bold. Dispel and antimagic have no effect on petrification, because once the spell takes effect, there is no longer any magic present to counter or suppress.

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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    The effects of Conjuration spells with Duration: Instantaneous, work in an antimagic field, because the conjured matter isn't magical.

    But I don't know that the same is true of other spell schools with spells with Duration: Instantaneous.


    Lightning Bolt is Duration: Instantaneous - but if you aim a lightning bolt into an antimagic field, it won't affect things within - it's Evocation, not Conjuration.
    Last edited by hamishspence; 2021-10-14 at 12:43 PM.
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