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  1. - Top - End - #121
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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by hungrycrow View Post
    It depends on what the effect was. Elan was able to revive V, and presumably V was hit by the same poison.
    V was not knocked out, and Elan explicitly neutralized the poison but not the effect.
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  2. - Top - End - #122
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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by hungrycrow View Post
    It depends on what the effect was. Elan was able to revive V, and presumably V was hit by the same poison.
    I think you're right. Serini probably hit Roy with the same poison that she used against O-chul and Lien, given that he's the same sort of target, and based on her comments after the pair woke up, it might not be a poison that does ability damage, instead just knocking them out and keeping them knocked out for a while. Obviously it'd be something stronger than the poisons listed on this chart, at least in terms of Save DC, but something like Drow Poison listed there would be sensible for Serini to have been using.

    I mean, Roy might need a smack in the face to wake him up after the poison keeping him asleep is removed, but that'd be it if its the same stuff that hit V.

    EDIT: I think you're looking at the wrong battle. First panel in 1244 shows Elan Neutralizing Poison on V, who is asleep from one of Serini's induced poisons.
    Last edited by Wraithfighter; 2021-10-14 at 06:06 PM.

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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Wraithfighter View Post
    Ah, forgot about that (and feel a bit silly now). Probably still had to wake V up after neutralizing it, though, since they do call out how it stops the poison but that's it.
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  4. - Top - End - #124
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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    Neutralize poison only neutralizes the poison. It doesn't undo any damages or effects already done by the poison.
    You're correct about ability damage, but not temporary effects (like sleep from sleep poison). NS does end those. Another example would be eyeblast poison which causes blindness for as long as the poison is in their system.
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  5. - Top - End - #125
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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Psyren View Post
    You're correct about ability damage, but not temporary effects (like sleep from sleep poison). NS does end those. Another example would be eyeblast poison which causes blindness for as long as the poison is in their system.
    Oh, cool! I never really encountered it in gameplay so I'm not as sharp on that as some other things. Thanks!
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  6. - Top - End - #126
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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    Calling it : Elan will seduce Sunny using his bardly wiles.

    He's done it before .
    It's his solemn duty to seduce female bad guys.

    I don't know what Sunny identifies as - male, female, or other. But where is it written that a bard's abilities only work on the opposite sex? Or only on other humans? Elan's got 18 charisma, and there's always the chance of a natural 20 on any die roll.

    Tongue-in-cheek,

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    Last edited by pendell; 2021-10-14 at 07:04 PM.
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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    Sunny is coded as a child (or at least immature) so I don't think we're going the seduction route. Friends, however...
    Quote Originally Posted by The Giant View Post
    But really, the important lesson here is this: Rather than making assumptions that don't fit with the text and then complaining about the text being wrong, why not just choose different assumptions that DO fit with the text?
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  8. - Top - End - #128
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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    Well, Sunny did Charm Elan earlier... so maybe Elan just accepted the friend request.
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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    So Haley just says “nine ball, corner pocket” is code for Sunny (ball with nine eyes) to stop them, but I’m thinking it was intended as a specific method to use, namely for Sunny to block the hole. That was likely just obvious to everyone else, I suppose? I still feel a bit uncertain about the interpretation, for some reason.
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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Quebbster View Post
    Nice to see what number eight was already.
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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Xel View Post
    So Haley just says “nine ball, corner pocket” is code for Sunny (ball with nine eyes) to stop them, but I’m thinking it was intended as a specific method to use, namely for Sunny to block the hole. That was likely just obvious to everyone else, I suppose? I still feel a bit uncertain about the interpretation, for some reason.
    That's what I assumed it to mean: sink the ball in the pocket. It's an even better fit than that since 9 ball is also yellow (albeit striped, not solid).
    Last edited by Hurkyl; 2021-10-14 at 09:27 PM.

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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    I might be reeeeeeeeeeeeally late to this party, but, I'm starting to think Sunny and MitD are related.

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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Breccia View Post
    I might be reeeeeeeeeeeeally late to this party, but, I'm starting to think Sunny and MitD are related.
    I dont know. The eyes dont exactly fit and as far as I know and the monstrous strenght doesnt seem to fit either.
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  14. - Top - End - #134
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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Hurkyl View Post
    That's what I assumed it to mean: sink the ball in the pocket. It's an even better fit than that since 9 ball is also yellow (albeit striped, not solid).
    Another possible interpretation is they count the anti-magic eye as the ninth eye, and Sunny was shining the 9th eyeball in the hole (until Elan distracted her).

  15. - Top - End - #135
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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Dion View Post
    Another possible interpretation is they count the anti-magic eye as the ninth eye, and Sunny was shining the 9th eyeball in the hole (until Elan distracted her).
    I think that Sunny herself is the 9th ball, the "give supporting fire and block the hole" interpretation seems most probable.

    Wait, is Sunny a boy or a girl? Have we heard them have pronouns used in reference to them?


    I'm guessing Elan is going to convince Sunny to let them through because they need to get V to come back and help Durkon, as opposed to because they want to catch Serini.
    Last edited by Squire Doodad; 2021-10-14 at 10:47 PM.
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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    I think beholders reproduce through paranoid delusion made real, so I'm not sure they would even have genders.

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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    In 3.5e the method of reproduction is uh... gross, but either way it's an asexual method.

    Frankly, considering that Sunny is literally a floating ball with magic laser eyes gender is probably the least strange thing about them.
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  18. - Top - End - #138
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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Hurkyl View Post
    That's what I assumed it to mean: sink the ball in the pocket. It's an even better fit than that since 9 ball is also yellow (albeit striped, not solid).
    Can you or somebody else explain to me what Serini's phrase means in the context of a game? Obviously, the comic makes clear what it meant tactically, but I don't know anything about billiards so I don't understand why it works as a metaphor.

    Of course, maybe you just explained it in the post I'm quoting, but since I still don't understand I guess I'm going to need a more detailed explanation.
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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Emanick View Post
    Can you or somebody else explain to me what Serini's phrase means in the context of a game? Obviously, the comic makes clear what it meant tactically, but I don't know anything about billiards so I don't understand why it works as a metaphor.

    Of course, maybe you just explained it in the post I'm quoting, but since I still don't understand I guess I'm going to need a more detailed explanation.
    In the game of pool (or billiards), to oversimplfy a lot, your goal is to knock billiard balls into the pockets -- holes arranged around the edge of the pool table. (note that the meaning of the word "pool" as used here has nothing to do with water)

    One rule people sometimes use is that you have to "call your shots" -- you have to state which of the balls you intend to sink and into which pocket.

    A stereotypical format for doing so is "nine ball, corner pocket", with a gesture to indicate which corner of the table you mean. Pool balls are numbered 1 through 15, so this means you intend to sink ball #9 in the indicated pocket in the corner of the table. (there are also "side pockets")

    In media, you often hear this with the nine ball or the eight ball specifically, since those balls are related to the victory conditions in some versions of the game. Also, "nine ball" flows off the tongue well.
    Last edited by Hurkyl; 2021-10-15 at 01:55 AM.

  20. - Top - End - #140
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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    You'd think Serini, an Epic Rogue, would know that a code word whose meaning is obvious is a useless code.
    Last edited by Fyraltari; 2021-10-15 at 03:19 AM.

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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    I mean Sunny seems to be even more of a "kid" than Elan, and that's saying a lot.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Squire Doodad View Post
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  22. - Top - End - #142
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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    You'd think Serini, an Epic Rogue, would know that a code word whose meaning is obvious is a useless code.
    Unless the codeword is much shorter than the commands it replaces.

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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by danielxcutter View Post
    Well, Sunny did Charm Elan earlier... so maybe Elan just accepted the friend request.
    *Chuckle*
    Quote Originally Posted by Hurkyl View Post
    That's what I assumed it to mean: sink the ball in the pocket. It's an even better fit than that since 9 ball is also yellow (albeit striped, not solid).
    Nice call.
    Quote Originally Posted by Hurkyl View Post
    I think beholders reproduce through paranoid delusion made real, so I'm not sure they would even have genders.
    There is no need for Sunny to have a gender, being a beholder.
    Quote Originally Posted by danielxcutter View Post
    In 3.5e the method of reproduction is uh... gross, but either way it's an asexual method.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Werbaer View Post
    Unless the codeword is much shorter than the commands it replaces.
    We had a variety of brevity codes in the military that were used for just that purpose.
    As two examples: the radio communication terms "Wilco" and "Roger" are each shorthand for a longer phrase. (Understand and will comply and I heard and understood respectively).
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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by DaOldeWolf View Post
    I dont know. The eyes dont exactly fit and as far as I know and the monstrous strenght doesnt seem to fit either.
    There's also the obvious issue of that I highly doubt the author planned for someone as notable as the monster in the dark to be something that's not in the open license.

    I mean sure, he uses Sunny now, but I don't know how secure he would have been way back when the monster in the dark was set.

    Quote Originally Posted by Squire Doodad View Post
    Wait, is Sunny a boy or a girl? Have we heard them have pronouns used in reference to them?
    Considering they aren't exactly wearing any clothes, either we would have known by now one way or another - or it's like Pokemon where apparently there are issues with them having a gender identity and gender attraction even though there's not way of actually telling what the other pokemon is.

    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    You'd think Serini, an Epic Rogue, would know that a code word whose meaning is obvious is a useless code.
    Code words have many uses in battle actually. Not only are they shortening out, but even if it's easy to figure out, it could still take you a second or two to realize and your enemy will always have to consider what exactly do you mean.

    A good example of that in the OOTS is in the desert, where V gave the instruction that Xykon is feeling chilly. Notice that it wasn't that obvious at first what it means to everyone (specifically Belkar).

    I also loved this panel they had in Marvel back in Civil War 2. Someone was about to blast one of the heroes on their side, so Ms Marvel shouts : "Peter look out!"
    Then Spiderman (Peter Parker), Colossus (Piotr Rasputin) and Star-Lord (Peter Quill) turn around and get distracted and all of them get blasted.

    Then Ironman goes : "That's why we use code words in battle"

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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    I thought beholders had 2 methods of reproduction

    1) reproduce via eggs laid from their mouth incubated under their tongue, this results in beholders identical to the "parent" beholder
    2) they dream of another beholder who then apears in reality, this beholder is different from the original beholder

  26. - Top - End - #146
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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    method 1. is 3e/3.5e, and possibly older editions like 2e as well. Beholders produced this way differ a little - they're not identical

    method 2. is 5e, and possibly 4e. Method 1 does not apply in 5e, method 2 does not apply in 3e.
    Last edited by hamishspence; 2021-10-15 at 09:16 AM.
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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by a_flemish_guy View Post
    I thought beholders had 2 methods of reproduction

    1) reproduce via eggs laid from their mouth incubated under their tongue, this results in beholders identical to the "parent" beholder
    2) they dream of another beholder who then apears in reality, this beholder is different from the original beholder
    In Lords of Madness they gave birth to a bunch at a time, then murdered the ones that looked insufficiently similar to them and left the rest.
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  28. - Top - End - #148
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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by SlashDash View Post
    There's also the obvious issue of that I highly doubt the author planned for someone as notable as the monster in the dark to be something that's not in the open license.

    I mean sure, he uses Sunny now, but I don't know how secure he would have been way back when the monster in the dark was set.
    Considering that he had an eye tyrant back in the first year of the strip, I would wager that he was banking on parody granting fair use, but that's about as close to the legal side as I'm willing to go.
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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by SlashDash View Post
    Code words have many uses in battle actually. Not only are they shortening out, but even if it's easy to figure out, it could still take you a second or two to realize and your enemy will always have to consider what exactly do you mean.

    A good example of that in the OOTS is in the desert, where V gave the instruction that Xykon is feeling chilly. Notice that it wasn't that obvious at first what it means to everyone (specifically Belkar).

    I also loved this panel they had in Marvel back in Civil War 2. Someone was about to blast one of the heroes on their side, so Ms Marvel shouts : "Peter look out!"
    Then Spiderman (Peter Parker), Colossus (Piotr Rasputin) and Star-Lord (Peter Quill) turn around and get distracted and all of them get blasted.

    Then Ironman goes : "That's why we use code words in battle"
    Seriously? That's not even code words, that's their superhero names. Sloppy going not using those names when (I imagine) they're in costume. Loose lips sink ships, stuff like that can get Aunt May killed.
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    Default Re: OOTS #1246 - The Discussion Thread

    I mean Sunny is basically a floating ball with magic laser eyes, gender is hardly the most important thing I’d say!

    Quote Originally Posted by SlashDash View Post
    I also loved this panel they had in Marvel back in Civil War 2. Someone was about to blast one of the heroes on their side, so Ms Marvel shouts : "Peter look out!"
    Then Spiderman (Peter Parker), Colossus (Piotr Rasputin) and Star-Lord (Peter Quill) turn around and get distracted and all of them get blasted.

    Then Ironman goes : "That's why we use code words in battle"
    God they so missed an opportunity to make a joke like this in Avengers: Endgame.
    Last edited by danielxcutter; 2021-10-15 at 09:43 AM.

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