Results 241 to 270 of 569
-
2021-10-25, 10:04 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Apr 2019
- Gender
Re: Upick 2 Thread 2: Revenge of the Upick
Here's my problem with this: I am innocent, so I know, beyond a shadow of a doubt, that one of our Clear abilities is lying. It's eerliy convenient that everyone has a clear now that it would keep them alive to have one. So, if you can Town clear me without my death, then you need to keep me alive and shoot into the horde, because you can't trust a single one of those Scry's, but you will be able to check off names if you have an extra kill AND can mech clear me without my death.
This logic, is 1, sound and 2, provides an interesting Case so I'll ask this right now:
Do you think that we started this game with 5 Wolves?
If your answer is no, you do not, then you have to clear me. Because as AV said, the only way I'm scum is if both of my gifted are Scum, which makes a 4th person still alive scum, making 5 total. But if you believe whole heartedly their aren't 5 scum, then I can't be, because I would've given at least 1 towny an ability that could ruin a Mafia game.
If I was Mafia and forced to hand out powers to town, i would've gievn my telegram day one, and then my bane and Block, never the two abilities that can check someone and perhaps out one of my supposed wolf teammates. Instead I gave us the 2 most useful wolf finding tools first.
And, to show that I'm committed to reducing the number of incorrect kills we make to raise our chances of winning, and not trying to save my own skin, I am willing to, right now, post my complete role QT unredacted. Even if it will almost certainly get me killed tonight, it saves us wasting one of our nightkills on an innocent, and streamlines the plan. If seeing everything will turn even a single head to the more efficient plan, I'm willing to post my whole QT unredacted and unedited.
-
2021-10-25, 10:05 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jul 2020
-
2021-10-25, 10:07 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Apr 2019
- Gender
Re: Upick 2 Thread 2: Revenge of the Upick
Kind of convenient that you forgot that when it's your own power which you claimed to have given him meta, that is ridiculously suspicious.
- - - Updated - - -
In fact, fearing Goofs beast at all is weird if you truly belived that he was perma immune like you said he was. If your powers are real, you would have led with the "There's no way to night Kill goof, I immuned him" argument first. But you didn't, even though that argument would have been much better than the beast one.
-
2021-10-25, 10:11 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jul 2020
-
2021-10-25, 10:11 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Nov 2019
Re: Upick 2 Thread 2: Revenge of the Upick
Sure, here you go. I'm not sure I quite live up to the requests for arguments but I really need to start cooking dinner. I'll try to add to it if I have time (but don't expect any great leaps of deduction).
AvatarVecna: Strong town lean. I wouldn't completely rule out AV playing us all in some way I don't grasp (that's pretty much what happened last game) but it really doesn't seem likely.
Snowblaze: Town lean. Will be either confirmed town or pretty much confirmed wolf (if her claim doesn't deliver) by D4.
Batcathat: Too handsome, loveable and charming to kill. Right?
SupaGoof: Leaning wolf. Mostly gut feeling (more details in my earlier ISO) and a lack of other options.
Taffimai: Neutral.
Moonfly7: Town lean. I could see a wolf giving away power to town in order to look good, but doing it twice seems very unlikely.
BladeScape: Town.
Elenna: Leaning wolf. Also mostly gut feeling and a lack of options, but if that cruise quote wasn't a trick, she seems the most likely source.
Metastachydium: Town (or at least previously without kill power, which I guess rules out wolf?)
Rogan: Strong town lean, for similar reasons to AV.
-
2021-10-25, 10:13 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Apr 2019
- Gender
Re: Upick 2 Thread 2: Revenge of the Upick
-
2021-10-25, 10:15 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jul 2020
-
2021-10-25, 10:20 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Apr 2019
- Gender
Re: Upick 2 Thread 2: Revenge of the Upick
So I really want answer before end of day though, does everyone need me to post my entire QT uncensored to prove that I'm a waste of a night kill? Once again, I'm only doing this to help us have a better chance of catching wolves, I fully expect to be killed for a full role reveal tonight. But thats going to clear one more person and that is all that matters. Taking myself out of the equation opens up options for Lynching BatCatHat today, and then Ganking Elena and Goof tonight. Then Lynching Snowblaze and/or meta if they don't confirm town. Although, if we kill BCH and he's town, that basically confirms Meta as Town because of Meta lacking a kill ability until i gave him one.
-
2021-10-25, 10:28 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- May 2014
- Location
- Germany
- Gender
Re: Upick 2 Thread 2: Revenge of the Upick
Elenna seems to be too powerful to be real. But if she is, she also has a watcher power (see who targeted her target) and can give Intel even if her target dies. So high risk, high reward? She is also tied to me and goof, as well as Snow. Killing her now to go into the night with more info seems helpful, even if she isn't scum.
Meta is a mixed bag. If scum, he can probably kill two people, including blades, our vig.
Still, unless he admit to being scum, his power is to useful to lose?
Snow can provide her own alignment if she is telling the truth. She might also die for doing so, if scum has a power that works on Concept names. So relying on this is dangerous?
Goof is too useful to lynch. His power can force scum to make suboptimal kill choices. It might even kill scum.
So, from the list of not lynch targets, I disagree a bit about Elenna. But I'm not married to the idea of killing her either. The problem with her scry is, we can't know if we can trust her until she dies. Even if she gives us a correct target, it could be another bus. Delays in killing her for being useful could be very dangerous if she is scum.
In this setup, there can't really be counter claims. We know there is some overlap between powers, but some differences as well.
Most kill powers we know about had some limit. Fext could not kill n1. Xihirli could not kill n1. AV can only kill under some special circumstances. Book needed to turn into Mr Hyde for his kill to work. Taff was limited in her options as well. So not seeing many kills doesn't need to continue.
Now, looking for only 3 wolves when there were 4 is dangerous. And Book was only half a killer. Starting with 4.5 hostile in an 16 player game doesn't seem to be impossible.Spoiler: I'm a seer
-
2021-10-25, 10:32 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jan 2006
- Location
- Da Goof (x3)..Is On Fire!
- Gender
Re: Upick 2 Thread 2: Revenge of the Upick
Just catching up and cherry picking the posts along the way that I found....curious, from my point of view.
Not sure how this list had Meta added to it, as the night before is was Rogan/AV/Gac/Book/Goof - subtle shade, to hide in the shadows? I mean, Snow keeps getting cleared cause of Bus, but maybe that's the plan from the start? I don't know.
Casting shade, for no factual reasons. Again, curious as to why.
I'm curious if my beast power counts as a kill power. It's not a directed power to kill, it's a "If you touch this protected person, you will die!" type of thing.
Yes. I have the one power. I can only target people with protection. Attacking said people activates my beast power. If I protect myself, and you kill me, you'll die too. That's -2 town, which is a bad plan IMO.
Scum would love to see me lynched at this point. The lynch is the only safe way they could remove me from the game (unless I be role-blocked, is possible). Because this seems to be such a (IMHO) simple logic. As such, I'm sceptical of any plan involving a lynching or killing of me by town. Which sounds like a scum logic, but it's definitely a town!Goof logic as I likely have them supa worried about how to get rid of me.
BatCatHat to get my point in, and I just feel his words want to remove me from the game with a lynch, and because of the reason above, that's the why for me.
- - - Updated - - -
And as I was writing all that up, Rogan posted....again. Rogan, is part of your role to have like.....the maximum number of posts?
But yes, I keep the wolves guessing and making bad choices, unless they had a way to know who I was targeting.....hmmm.
Speaking of which. Thank you Elenna for the confirmation on that I did target Rogan last night. I did, can confirm this two ways.
- - - Updated - - -
And by two ways I mean
1. Elenna's post stating she saw me target Rogan
2. My last post, stating I did in fact, target Rogan.
But that doesn't clear Elenna.
My suspicions are growing for Meta and Moon - their back forth is definitely making me wonder which of them might be scum.
- - - Updated - - -
Just going back to double check conversations....and I find this??? I had no idea this existed!!! *goes to read through it*
-
2021-10-25, 10:51 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Apr 2019
- Gender
Re: Upick 2 Thread 2: Revenge of the Upick
You may have missed the miles of posts where AV has questioned meta repeatedly on a couple different things, with others chiming in as well. As I understand it Meta has been on the chopping block around since Day 3 started. I'm not really sure on Meta, and I still like to hope my Kill Gift was given to a towny, but he is on the suspect list. But so is everyone not Mech cleared.
-
2021-10-25, 10:58 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- May 2014
- Location
- Germany
- Gender
Re: Upick 2 Thread 2: Revenge of the Upick
No. This is something I am very sure about since day 1. 5 wolves would be too much.
Giving the telegram first would be NAI. It's not that useful, but it would not hurt as much if scum got it.
Handing out the scry could be a very good move for scum. Snow gave her reads in the night. She was unlikely to check someone else. This means, the risk of hitting scum was low, while the reward in town cred was high.
The kill is a good argument. Giving something else away would be safer. But you might have thought you needed every kill you could get or every town cred possible.
If you want to post the link to the QT, that's forbidden, as far as I know. Showing the full role description would help scum more, I think. So no, don't post unless someone has very strong arguments.
Hmmm... from a practical standpoint, you might flip wolf by proxy, since we will learn Metas alignment one way or the other.
So, you don't need to die just yet.
On the other hand, flipping you now could help us with judging Meta. Unfortunately, I don't think we could stop Meta in the night, even if we wanted to.
Soo... no lynch target?
This argument was based on an easy to prove misunderstanding. So it feels like something town would do more than something scum would try.Spoiler: I'm a seer
-
2021-10-25, 11:09 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Apr 2019
- Gender
Re: Upick 2 Thread 2: Revenge of the Upick
I didn't mean post the link, I was just going to literally copy and paste the entiee QT unredacted.
And I will literally do it if it will save one of our NK's for someone whose actually guilty, or has a chance to be. I'm fine with dying, but I hate to think my death would be a waste of a kill if I can find any other way to hard clear myself. And as we've stated, me dying hurts town very little, as I can still pop off my ability before I go. Thing is, Night Killing me since I'm innocent does hurt us, if only because it could have been used to check someone else. Chances are good wolves might get a free Gank if I give out my role name and concept, sure, but as AV has said, I'm the most expendable anyways. If I go out saving us the use of a nighkill to check someones else, fine by me. Because I'm the least important role, and I can still be useful as I die.
-
2021-10-25, 11:20 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- May 2014
- Location
- Germany
- Gender
Re: Upick 2 Thread 2: Revenge of the Upick
Welcome to the chaos, Goof! Please take a tinfoil hat.
I Agree that lynching you (Goof) is a very bad idea. Your power is extremely useful. And, as long as you agree to it and there is the need for it, we can check you at night with a kill. You protect someone else, blades kills you. Blades won't trigger your power (unless you are lying) and we can be sure you are town and be reasonably sure your target was protcted.
No, I'm just taking a lot on principle. I want to give you all a chance to check and correct my line of thoughts at this moment. On my own, I was wrong a bit to often...
I'd rather kill Elenna than you, since we can't trust her scrys unless she flips and flips town. Even if she points us at scum, it could be another bus. And there would need to be a bus at this point.
A fair word of warning regarding the linked role list, we can't be sure everything works as described there. But it is a nice resource to see what kind of powers are in use from time to time.
Argument for killing Elenna: Info about RAC, trusting her scry (which won't help that much right now, but every bit helps).
Argument for killing Bat: Info about Taff (not very relevant, since we can't act on it).
Is there anybody else we could realistically lynch without losing important options in the night?
- - - Updated - - -
@Moon
I don't think posting your QT content will help a lot. It would be hard for you to fake it, especially if it's long, but not impossible.
But that's true for lots of things about you. Hard to fake for scum, but possible. I don't really suspect you, but I can't clear you 100%.
So you are not a good target for a night kill, but not a terrible one for practical reasons. If we have better targets, go for them. But otherwise, knowing your alignment for sure seems better than wasting a kill.Last edited by Rogan; 2021-10-25 at 11:28 AM.
-
2021-10-25, 11:59 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Apr 2019
- Gender
Re: Upick 2 Thread 2: Revenge of the Upick
Fair enough. And from your knowledge base I am still an unknown. Although I will be cleared if either snow or Meta flips town tomorrow, depending on your opinion on my gift actions.
But yeah, killing me still answers a question for you guys. It just sucks from my point of view, not because I'm gonna die, but because I know you'd be better off killing someone else because I don't have to question my own innocence. But I'm a realist, you guys DO still have to question me. So if you need to wack me, it is still a decent call.
-
2021-10-25, 12:00 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jun 2005
- Location
- GMT
- Gender
Re: Upick 2 Thread 2: Revenge of the Upick
Spoiler: Vote historyCode:Meta Supagoof (1) Taffimai Taffimai (1) AV Elenna (1) Rogan Wombat (1) Moonfly Wombat (2) Elenna Meta (1) Snow Wombat (3) Blade Wombat (4) BatCat Wombat (5) Elenna BatCat (1) Meta (0) Meta BatCat (2) Supagoof (0) Rogan BatCat (3) Dead Wombat (4) Moonfly -Supagoof- (1) Dead Wombat (3) Moonfly -Elenna- (2) Supagoof (0) Rogan Elenna (3) BatCat (2) Snow Elenna (4) Dead Wombat (2) BatCat Elenna (5) Dead Wombat (1) AV BatCat (3) Elenna (4) Snow BatCat (4) Elenna (3) Moonfly BatCat (5) Elenna (2) Supagoof BatCat (6) No previous vote or I missed it
If anyone -struck through- their vote after I started reading, I may have missed it. I'm not vouching for this to be accurate, but I have to go shop. Only one still kicking a dead Wombat is Bladescape.78% of DM's started their first campaign in a tavern. If you're one of the 22% that didn't, copy and paste this into your signature.
-
2021-10-25, 12:05 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jan 2014
Re: Upick 2 Thread 2: Revenge of the Upick
Unless the scumteam is moon/snow/meta/BCH, moon 100% gifted powers to at least one townie. And while some powers could be useful in a "causing mind screwage" kinda way, that potential "can i trust moon" energy is insignificant next to the power of giving a scumbuddy an extra kill or roleblock. Moon can't be lying about his power on the general points, because then snow or meta would know they're lying. And that means moon can gift powers that don't require you to give up the use of your normal power. Why would a scum!moon ever give a power to a townie instead of a scumbuddy? It boggles the mind that anybody is considering Moon as a possible scum at this point.
When you get a role that hands out powers as wolf, always always always give them to a scumbuddy. Give them to town? What, are you throwing???
Currently Recruiting WW/Mafia: Logic's Deathloop Mafia and Book Wombat's A Small Wager - A Practical Guide To Evil
Avatar by AsteriskAmp
My Homebrew
-
2021-10-25, 12:09 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Apr 2019
- Gender
-
2021-10-25, 12:11 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jan 2014
Re: Upick 2 Thread 2: Revenge of the Upick
Currently Recruiting WW/Mafia: Logic's Deathloop Mafia and Book Wombat's A Small Wager - A Practical Guide To Evil
Avatar by AsteriskAmp
My Homebrew
-
2021-10-25, 12:19 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Apr 2019
- Gender
Re: Upick 2 Thread 2: Revenge of the Upick
It would be remiss to ignore that Rogan has pointed out that a restriction could be that a Wolf! Me could only empower townies. My counter argument to that is that I would have handed out my useless abilities first. Not my good Mafia hunting ones.
- - - Updated - - -
So, we're about 3 hours and 50 minutes from the EOD. Let's talk finalizing strategies: who are we lynching, whose getting nightkilled, and who needs a bane on them.
Also, which ability do I drop? Bane or block?
-
2021-10-25, 12:22 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jan 2014
Re: Upick 2 Thread 2: Revenge of the Upick
Currently Recruiting WW/Mafia: Logic's Deathloop Mafia and Book Wombat's A Small Wager - A Practical Guide To Evil
Avatar by AsteriskAmp
My Homebrew
-
2021-10-25, 12:30 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- May 2014
- Location
- Germany
- Gender
Re: Upick 2 Thread 2: Revenge of the Upick
Looking at the way the votes moved, Elenna managed to deflect votes away from her very well. Her claim might be the greatest reason? I didn't check the time line, but it would fit.
I could see Meta/BCH/Moon in an worst case scenario.
It would mean Moon gave the scry to Snow for town cred without that much risk. The POE snow suggested seems to be 100% town, after all.
But this seems very unlikely. Keep it in mind if Bat and Meta flip scum.
Gifting the kill to town would be an extremely bold move for scum. Even if they were required to gift their powers to town, the kill is too dangerous at the moment. If given in night 1, perhaps (low danger for scum and probably a dead townie).
So... not locked town, but very townie.
- - - Updated - - -
We should concentrate on the lynch right now. Night actions will depend on the lynch.
I bet someone in the dead chat is taking notes right now
But yeah, being forced to gift town the powers would need to be connected to an advantage if town actually uses them. Otherwise it would be an disadvantage more than a power.Spoiler: I'm a seer
-
2021-10-25, 12:39 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jul 2020
Re: Upick 2 Thread 2: Revenge of the Upick
That would indeed be lovely. I'm not sure who I'm supposed to kill right now (and I would, again, like to request that it not be the Goof).
Also, which ability do I drop? Bane or block?
-
2021-10-25, 12:48 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Apr 2019
- Gender
Re: Upick 2 Thread 2: Revenge of the Upick
I do think waiting till after Lynch might be prudent. If Batcathat flips town, you meta are going to be cleared via there no kill power ability. Which in turn would be good for my credibility for Rogan and the others who aren't sure about me. It'll also give you a better idea of who to keep alive.
-
2021-10-25, 12:48 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jan 2014
Re: Upick 2 Thread 2: Revenge of the Upick
Lynch BCH.
blade and meta kill Moon, Goof, or Elenna (depending on personal preference). That's for y'all to coordinate depending on who you want checked. I'd personally want elenna checked just cuz I trust moon and goof but it's whatever.
Supagoof and meta bane AV. Give wolves no good choices on who to NK.
@Rogan Is there any question you want me to ask of you tonight?
Currently Recruiting WW/Mafia: Logic's Deathloop Mafia and Book Wombat's A Small Wager - A Practical Guide To Evil
Avatar by AsteriskAmp
My Homebrew
-
2021-10-25, 12:50 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jul 2020
-
2021-10-25, 12:52 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Apr 2019
- Gender
Re: Upick 2 Thread 2: Revenge of the Upick
AV, important question: does the plan change if BCH flips town? It will immediately clear meta, which would make Elena, good, or snow better options for our night kills. Although if he flips mafia obviously I don't think anything changes.
Though I think you should whack Elena definitley out of those NK options.
-
2021-10-25, 12:55 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- May 2014
- Location
- Germany
- Gender
Re: Upick 2 Thread 2: Revenge of the Upick
Right now, bat is on the chopping block.
If he flips town, Meta is locked town. If Bat flips scum, Meta is a bit more suspicious.
Elenna is the alternative. If she flips town:
I am 100% mech clear. Goof is more likely to be town, unless lying about the power. Snow is more suspicious, for the RAC quote.
If Elenna flips scum: I won't be cleared but I would have to be bussing this time. Goof is a bit more suspicious. Snow is a bit less suspicious.
From a practical perspective, if Elenna gets her power off, we will have a Seer and Watcher answer, but we won't know if we can trust her.
If Bat gets his power to work, we will have a limmited psydo Seer, but we won't know if we can trust him. Bat can only check persons without a kill power. Everyone should claim kill/no kill before he selects his target.Spoiler: I'm a seer
-
2021-10-25, 12:56 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Apr 2019
- Gender
-
2021-10-25, 12:56 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jan 2014
Re: Upick 2 Thread 2: Revenge of the Upick
Snow is also an acceptable NK, regardless of result. Depending on her self-reveal power (or rather, depending on her being honest) is the main concern there. I don't think you're scum, but I have a feeling some people aren't going to be persuaded by anything that isn't pure mechanical confirmation so.
Currently Recruiting WW/Mafia: Logic's Deathloop Mafia and Book Wombat's A Small Wager - A Practical Guide To Evil
Avatar by AsteriskAmp
My Homebrew