question about imbued summoning feat

[Blindy]

I have been playing a summoner that has the imbued summoning feat and have been interpreting the feat pretty conservatively. I so far have only cast spells that have a range of touch and also that target creatures. But the feat has some loose ends that I want to tie up.

Firstly, is it possible to grant a summoned creatures the benefits of a magic weapon. It doesnt target the creatures. its a touch spell that targets a weapon. But the feat is worded that it confers the benefit of a touch spell to the creature. Does this mean the creatures stat block? or just hte creature. I would for example give an arcadian avenger a magic sword.

This seems unre3asonable to me. It confers the benefit to the creature, not the sword. But I dont actually know.

The second point is that the feat might get around targeting restrictions. Lets say for example that I want to cast the spell stone bones on a non undead creature. It has a range of touch and targets corporeal undead. But the feat confers the benefits of a touch spell to the creature, which to me makes the targeting restrictions irrelevant.

I think this one is reasonable due to the weird wording of the feat. Thoughts?

[Darg]

An invalid target is invalid unless it gives an explicit exception. If you target an invalid target the spell simply has no effect.

[Blindy]

An invalid target is invalid unless it gives an explicit exception. If you target an invalid target the spell simply has no effect.

My argument would be that the feat says "When you cast a spell from the summoning subschool, you can choose to grant the summoned creature the benefit of any spell of 3rd level or lower you can cast that has a range of touch." It grants the benefit of ANY spell with a range of touch.

The feat also says that you cast the spells at the same time. There is no target with this special casting of this touch spell.

[Darg]

My argument would be that the feat says "When you cast a spell from the summoning subschool, you can choose to grant the summoned creature the benefit of any spell of 3rd level or lower you can cast that has a range of touch." It grants the benefit of ANY spell with a range of touch.

The feat also says that you cast the spells at the same time. There is no target with this special casting of this touch spell.

It's the part after that which is important: "You cast the spell you wish to grant the creature (using a prepared spell or a spell slot) at the same time you cast your summoning spell." Meaning you are casting the spell targeting the summoned creature. It also means you lose the spell in addition to the summoning spell if you are interrupted. Another aspect to note is that it only applies to the "creature" not "creatures." So all you are doing is casting 2 spells that resolve at the same time.

Let's put it this way. Magic weapon targets weapons. The effect only applies to weapons. Even if the creature were to be the beneficiary of the spell it would have no effect because they aren't a weapon. Stone Bones also specifically applies its effect to corporeal undead.

You cause the skeleton of the target corporeal undead to become thicker and as strong as stone. This gives the subject a +3 enhancement bonus to its existing natural armor.

Magic weapon gives a weapon a +1 enhancement bonus on attack and damage rolls.

This spell turns an oak tree into a protector or guardian. The spell can be cast on only a single tree at a time;

[Blindy]

Well firstly it definitely affectrs all creatures you summon with the spell. its ambiguous in the feat but it was errata.

As I said I agree with eh magic weapon example. even if it does bypass targeting restrictions like I think is the case, creatures dont have weapons as part of them. (perhaps a sword archon though?)

The part where we disagree is that the spell targets teh creature as you cast it. I believe there is no creature to target when you cast the two spells. You simply confer the benefits of a touch spell. The section fromt he PHB on spell description says

Target or Targets
Some spells have a target or targets. You cast these spells on creatures or objects, as defined by the spell itself. You must be able to see or touch the target, and you must specifically choose that target. You do not have to select your target until you finish casting the spell.

This metamagic feat doesnt follow any of those rules. you cant see the target and you certainly cant redirect it. This to me means it is a special casting of these touch spells.

[Darg]

Well firstly it definitely affectrs all creatures you summon with the spell. its ambiguous in the feat but it was errata.

As I said I agree with eh magic weapon example. even if it does bypass targeting restrictions like I think is the case, creatures dont have weapons as part of them. (perhaps a sword archon though?)

The part where we disagree is that the spell targets teh creature as you cast it. I believe there is no creature to target when you cast the two spells. You simply confer the benefits of a touch spell. The section fromt he PHB on spell description says

Target or Targets
Some spells have a target or targets. You cast these spells on creatures or objects, as defined by the spell itself. You must be able to see or touch the target, and you must specifically choose that target. You do not have to select your target until you finish casting the spell.

This metamagic feat doesnt follow any of those rules. you cant see the target and you certainly cant redirect it. This to me means it is a special casting of these touch spells.

You can play how you want, it doesn't mean that others have to accept your interpretation. If you want to bring your case to the DM feel free as they will be the final arbiter. At this point there isn't much to discuss other than whether the casting constitutes a change in the target and range parameters or just the target.

Even reading it your way, there are maybe a handful of spells that don't state who it affects in the descriptive text for beneficial touch (quality category) spells which negates attempts to bypass the target line. As mentioned, a badger is not an oak tree and therefore couldn't benefit from Liveoak even if it was made a valid target for the spell.

[Blindy]

As mentioned, a badger is not an oak tree and therefore couldn't benefit from Liveoak even if it was made a valid target for the spell.

I actually agree with you on this point because the spell description calls for an oak tree. The "benefit" of the spell is turning an oak tree into a guardian. But that is because it says it in the spell description as well as the "target" field. This is also ignoring the fact that you can only imbue level three or lower spells but that is irrelevant for argument's sake.