Elden Ring

[Psyren]

My biggest hope is that From Software will eventually revisit the Otogi series. Those games were every bit as difficult as soulslikes (well, if you were going for 100% completion anyway), but even for the time they were visually stunning and took place in imo a much more vibrant and interesting world.

[warty goblin]

My biggest hope is that From Software will eventually revisit the Otogi series. Those games were every bit as difficult as soulslikes (well, if you were going for 100% completion anyway), but even for the time they were visually stunning and took place in imo a much more vibrant and interesting world.

I really like the uber-Gothic Swedish doom metal album cover feel of the art direction. I just wish the game had a: a story I could detect in non-trace quantities that b: did something substantive with the aesthetic.

[Rynjin]

Just out of curiosity, how bleak is this game? I've played the previous dark souls games and Sekiro, and though I do enjoy the gameplay (even if I have a long road to go to gitting gud), most of the time it is the bleakness of the environment and storytelling that eventually causes me to put it down. Is this game like that, or is there more hope on the horizon than seems to be in the typical souls game.

I've commented a few times in chat with friends, but this game is surprisingly upbeat for a FromSoft jam.

A lot of the sidequests have happy endings. There are probably more with sad, or bittersweet ones, but there's been a surprising number of times I've finished a quest and just been like "Everything Went Better Than Expected", which feels nice.

The world itself is also a lot more alive...literally. Like, unlike Dark Souls the NPCs you meet aren't Undead. They're in no danger of going Hollow. They have their own hopes, dreams, goals and no amount of setbacks are going to make them turn into a mindless monster.

This goes for enemies as well. I thought it was pretty cool that if you go sneaking around Leyndell, the Royal Capital, a lot of enemies will just be...going about their lives until they see you. Leyndell Knights will practice their archery on nearby targets, or do spear drills. Perfumers mix concoctions behind the counters of their salon. Paiges hang out and play the flute when there's no danger.

Of course once they spot you, they quickly go into alert mode and try to kill you, because you're a filthy Tarnished and (worse) a dirty peasant besides, but it's still very cool.

And there's also, as others mentioned, the general air of hopefulness the game has. This is a bad time for the world, but it's not an inevitable end to everything. It's like...basically set after a World War where a bunch of different factions let loose their living nuke-equivalents and the world was Shattered, and everyone is kind of in rebound mode. There's been like a 17 way church schism and nobody knows the real history anymore.

But there's a very clear sense that even though this world is post-apocalypse...like all post-apocalypses there's a CHANCE TO REBUILD. Sure there's bandits everywhere, and death cults, and human sacrifice, a metaphorical plague of undead, and a literal plague of Scarlet Rot overrunning what used to be an entire nation dedicated to peace and higher learning...but this is not the end, just a part of history.

[Calemyr]

But there's a very clear sense that even though this world is post-apocalypse...like all post-apocalypses there's a CHANCE TO REBUILD. Sure there's bandits everywhere, and death cults, and human sacrifice, a metaphorical plague of undead, and a literal plague of Scarlet Rot overrunning what used to be an entire nation dedicated to peace and higher learning...but this is not the end, just a part of history.

Yeah, that pretty much sums it up. This world is alive. Dark Souls is basically a dead world trying eke out just a few more years before the end. Actually winning anything but a reprieve is impossible, and everyone knows it. Bloodborne, everyone's scared witless of the plague and locked up in their houses, unless they've already given into the madness and joined the hunt, with only a few sane survivors left to suffer in the crossfire.

Elden Ring, on the other hand, isn't dead or in hiding. People do exist (granted, most of the ones you meet are murderous lunatics, but it's suggested they aren't the majority. The grass is vibrant (unless you're in the rotting lands) and the land is full of healthy trees and fauna - not all of which is looking to kill you. "Humanity" is in shambles, but most of the lands are doing just fine. And you're painted as a chance to set things right, not just buy a little more time before the sun stops rising.

That's the positive. The down side is that the corruption that is contained in the rotting lands was only contained by reducing one of this history's greatest badasses into an inhuman berserker that they send armies after on a regular basis, though it's not quite clear whether it's to finally kill the man or to give him a meal as literally chews on his attackers. Everyone else of meaningful power is either trapped in the past or gone completely off the deep end (if not both) or simply trying to nope out of the world, leaving just the dregs to rebuild a world that they do not have the power to heal. And then a little grace shines on a worthless soul and impossible becomes simply hellishly difficult...

[LaZodiac]

Another fun comparison. Look at the invasion factions.

Dark Souls had the brutal, kinda edgy but cool assassin guys who served the darkseeker. There's a degree of coolness, this idea that "hey **** this fire ****, the world is doomed lets have fun killing while it happens". There's also cool dragon folk who do duels of honour and glory.

And in contrast, Elden Ring has this guy. If you wanna invade, you gotta hang out with Mr Eats Poo and his dang of miscreant stanklords. Also has duelists, who are characterized as honourable if a little stab happy, but given the player needs to summon them for a fight it is, like with the dragons, clearly not connected to the full on Invader faction.

[Rynjin]

There is actually a "cool" sort of invasion faction, but they only send you out on NPC invades. It's a very interesting faction though.

Much Later Edit: You know, on the "Elden Ring isn't as bleak as Dark Souls" train, it's also the only game with regular, non-hostile mobs in every area. And not just the harmless cute ones either (like turtles and goats), but the jellyfish. I love the jellyfish. Big live and let live attitude.

Closest thing Dark Souls had before that was Torch Buddy in Dark Souls 2.

[Lord Raziere]

this game has factions? I didn't know that, given how they got rid of the covenant slot I thought they'd gotten rid of such things entirely.

sucks that the dung eater is the invader faction though, but then I'm apparently a weird person who prefers the edge.

[Rynjin]

this game has factions? I didn't know that, given how they got rid of the covenant slot I thought they'd gotten rid of such things entirely.

sucks that the dung eater is the invader faction though, but then I'm apparently a weird person who prefers the edge.

There are a bunch of factions, some joinable and some as far as I can tell, not. They're not the same as Covenants though, a sthey're more very in-depth sidequests with certain NPCs and their aligned vassals and allies, that have their own rewards, but there's no need to grind for some arbitrary token or medal to buy rewards or anything.

Spoiler: Spoilers for Mt. Gelmir

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For example, the Volcano Manor faction (which you can learn of early on in Liurnia, but don't learn the purpose of until you get there) involves a lot of NPC invades, and killing your targets gets you free wepaons, armor, and talismans as rewards. It's sort of similar to a Dark Souls-ified Dark Brotherhood, but not as evil(?) depending on how well your ideology aligns with theirs.

[LaZodiac]

this game has factions? I didn't know that, given how they got rid of the covenant slot I thought they'd gotten rid of such things entirely.

sucks that the dung eater is the invader faction though, but then I'm apparently a weird person who prefers the edge.

I should clarify that you are not the same as him. You want to do cool honourable fights. The Loathsome Dungeater wants to ruin people's day. You are not the same.

And like Rynjin said there are other folk

Spoiler

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(I even encountered a group called the Rose Church, which is... gross but meat instead of literal feces, and also anti two fingers).

[Lord Raziere]

.....I mean if you call attacking people with bleed weapons, poison, crossbows, bombs if I get them prepared and frost, "honorable" yeah sure, lets go with that.

anyways....

Spoiler: Journey of Serendipity II: The Quest for Absolution

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So I ran into an obstacle in the whole Nokron quest thing: I killed Sellen in the Witchbane ruins which uh, screwed it up. I can't advanced the questline if she's dead. so apparently I have use a celestial dew to absolve my sins at turtle-pope place, then Sellen's resurrected. sounds easy enough, there is a place to purchase it at Caria manor after all so I tried looking all over Caria.....and didn't find them. instead I got myself an Urumi. basically a metal sword-whip I really like that Elden Ring is just pulling all sorts of unusual weapons out and leaving them there for you to wield. how many other games let you use a flail or an urumi? because I can't recall a single one.

so I gave up on that, and then fought clifford the magic sword-shooting red wolf, then went north because thats where the grace was pointing to find a mine, with miners, bats and those vulgar militia minis, ending with this magma wyrm that with the help of an NPC summons I killed, and got to the Altus plateau.

There I sneaked by a bunch of guys who were clearly picking through a wreckage of a bunch of carriages to suddenly be attacked by a dragon right off the bat, died then decided to go a different direction, found some perfumers killed them for their clothes, then found a dungeon that I decided to come back to later because it was full of those big warty guys who're fast for their size.

so I just decided to....grind out getting the fire Monk set, then grind out get the Kaiden gear I didn't have. I got both, leveled up a bit while doing so then decided to go find this Agheel dragon in Limgrave, and fight it figuring that I've encountered like, two dragons so far maybe a third if you count the magma wyrm that supposedly was once human but tried to themselves into a dragon? so I foguht and killed Agheel on horseback with the help of my skeleton bandit, got a dragon heart, spoke to the guy about the church of dragon communion and turns out the maga wyrm did count as a dragon with its heart and now I got two dragon spells. I decided to try and fight Adula for the third, going back to caria and use the same mounted tactics and I got Adula down to half health....then they just flew away the coward! I'm getting Monster hunter flashbacks now.

but then it call came full circle when I wandered about after Adula left and found the place that led to Pidia, the merchant the sold the dew for absolution. all I had to do to find it was to stop looking and thus I stumbled across it! also I got a weird axe that scales with Arcane from Pidia, so new weapon to test out and upgrade.

[Cespenar]

So, mildly spicy take (like a jalapeno?): as it was in previous games, the dungeon designs and not-instakilling-minor-gotchas in Elden Ring are much more enjoyable then the bossfights.

Like, I'll always get more of a kick upon noticing a lowly enemy waiting in ambush on the ceiling, rather than killing a boss on the first try or what-have-you.

[Lord Raziere]

Eh, the messages on the ground kind of do that part for me. they're one of the more helpful variations of message, warning me of ambushes and such. I'm also starting to disparage any message that says "fake wall ahead" but has no fake wall in hopes that it will make them go away. might start disparaging the fortnite ones as well.

honestly I feel proud if I beat any boss under 5 tries. first trying is great, but second or third trying is almost as good to me. like under 5 tries, thats a good range to be in. anything over 5 tries generally means its one of the harder more frustrating ones, and past a certain point you lose count and it becomes "I don't know how many times I've fought you, but I've finally beaten you! YES!"

[Chen]

...Did you try turning off motion blur before refunding?

Yes its not that. Its the camera moving to recenter as you move and try to look in different directions. Looks like the same person who modded this for Sekiro on PC is working on it. Guess if that works I will rebuy it (assuming it works like the Sekiro one)

[Anteros]

I have a mod that lets you raise the FoV. Maybe that would help you? It's helped me in other games where I get motion sick. I can send you the link if you want it. It also uncaps frame limits, and launches the game without anti-cheat. Helps performance a bit. You'd have to play in offline though (as with any mod) or risk getting banned.

Finally have a few days off to really dig into this game, and I've just reached Stormreach castle after getting sidetracked quite a bit. This section....this is Dark Souls at its absolute worst. Linear, repetitive gameplay that punishes the player for each death by making them walk down the exact same hallway for 20 minutes. It's not fun. It's not difficult. It's tedious. They avoided doing this to the player in Sekiro, and also in the open world parts of this game, but it's back here in all it's truly awful "glory."

Really hoping the rest of the game is more open and less linear or my opinion on the game is going to tank quickly.

[Rynjin]

You should look around more for shortcuts and whatnot, Stormveil has a ton of them and they all link back to one of two central hub bonfires.

Remember they added a jump button. There are paths that may be non-obvious. If you're "walking down the same hallway for 20 minutes", something has gone wrong.

[Anteros]

You should look around more for shortcuts and whatnot, Stormveil has a ton of them and they all link back to one of two central hub bonfires.

Remember they added a jump button. There are paths that may be non-obvious. If you're "walking down the same hallway for 20 minutes", something has gone wrong.

There's definitely 2 sections that are basically long hallways. The side entrance, and when you trek back to the main gate to open it. Especially egregious since I did them back to back. I suppose if you went in the main gate from the start it would be a different experience.

[Rynjin]

There's definitely 2 sections that are basically long hallways. The side entrance, and when you trek back to the main gate to open it. Especially egregious since I did them back to back. I suppose if you went in the main gate from the start it would be a different experience.

Main gate is entirely optional, and not recommended. Side path is...not 20 minutes long? Maybe 5? 10 if you're both really struggling and also scouring for all the loot.

It's also a pretty dynamic path with a lot of hazards and multiple side routes, so it's also definitely not just "a hallway".

Keep in mind that a lot of the "story dungeons" are pretty harshly level gated, so if you're struggling to the point that a certain area is taking what feels like an egregiously long time to finish, it's usually best to just dip for a bit and go do some other stuff. If you ever get the feeling of "this is tedious" or "this just isn't fun" you're probably a little underleveled or undergeared.

I went to and left Stormveil Castle like 3 or 4 times over the course of doing it. Most of the content in Limgrave and the Weeping Peninsula (save Castle Morne) is easier than Stormveil Castle by a long shot.

The castle, and especially the boss at the end are supposed to be a "wall" of sorts, though you can literally just kind of walk around the castle if you know where to go.

[Lord Raziere]

Keep in mind that a lot of the "story dungeons" are pretty harshly level gated, so if you're struggling to the point that a certain area is taking what feels like an egregiously long time to finish, it's usually best to just dip for a bit and go do some other stuff. If you ever get the feeling of "this is tedious" or "this just isn't fun" you're probably a little underleveled or undergeared.

Yeah, I pretty much did everything other than Stormveil before really diving into it, and did everything in Liurna before really tackling Raya Lucaria academy and I didn't have that much trouble with either of them. like the only time I really kept dying a lot was against Margit, but when I decided to go away a bit and explore some more, get a few upgrades and level ups, he was a bit easier enough to tip the balance in favor of victory. this game is practically designed for you to go off the beaten path and not care about the "main story" until you've done everything else there is to do. like trying to speed blitz through this game and only do what is "required" pretty much seems to only lead to pain, while consistent exploration and curiosity has awarded me a wealth of weapons, ashes, spirit summons, some armor and a lot of spells I can't even use that make me wish my character was a hybrid caster at least. like I'm torn between going dangerously off build so I can become a dragon-fanatic on one hand, and making a faith character just to actually play with all the stuff I have by going forth and finding it all again now that I know where it is despite knowing how much time that would take.

[Anteros]

Main gate is entirely optional, and not recommended. Side path is...not 20 minutes long? Maybe 5? 10 if you're both really struggling and also scouring for all the loot.

It's also a pretty dynamic path with a lot of hazards and multiple side routes, so it's also definitely not just "a hallway".

Keep in mind that a lot of the "story dungeons" are pretty harshly level gated, so if you're struggling to the point that a certain area is taking what feels like an egregiously long time to finish, it's usually best to just dip for a bit and go do some other stuff. If you ever get the feeling of "this is tedious" or "this just isn't fun" you're probably a little underleveled or undergeared.

I went to and left Stormveil Castle like 3 or 4 times over the course of doing it. Most of the content in Limgrave and the Weeping Peninsula (save Castle Morne) is easier than Stormveil Castle by a long shot.

The castle, and especially the boss at the end are supposed to be a "wall" of sorts, though you can literally just kind of walk around the castle if you know where to go.

Considering I killed Godrick on the second try (seriously, why is he weaker than random mini-bosses in the starter area?) I don't think I was particularly weak for the area. It's just tedious wading through dozens of the exact same boring enemy to get there, screwing up one dodge and dying to a ballista, and having to wade through the same dozen enemies again.

You can say things like "oh that route is optional and not recommended" but it's there so obviously the devs intended it to be explored. I don't play with the wiki open, so things like optimal routes and such are not obvious until after the fact. If you don't explore it, you'll never know what you might have missed. Besides, you have to eventually take that route to activate the rune.

[Lord Raziere]

Considering I killed Godrick on the second try (seriously, why is he weaker than random mini-bosses in the starter area?) I don't think I was particularly weak for the area. It's just tedious wading through dozens of the exact same boring enemy to get there, screwing up one dodge and dying to a ballista, and having to wade through the same dozen enemies again.

Yeah I also killed Godrick second try. it seems to be a pattern that faster enemies that don't wear armor seem to be the weaker ones: Godrick, Evergaol Bloodhound Knight, Leonine Misbegotten, Ancient Hero of Zamor, red wolf of radahn.....the list goes on. meanwhile Crucible Knight in his armor and horn shield is still standing tall and undefeated in my playthrough.

[Cespenar]

You can say things like "oh that route is optional and not recommended" but it's there so obviously the devs intended it to be explored. I don't play with the wiki open, so things like optimal routes and such are not obvious until after the fact. If you don't explore it, you'll never know what you might have missed. Besides, you have to eventually take that route to activate the rune.

Honestly, something like a recommended level number (or something) alongside the bosses' names would be an immense QoL upgrade.

Overall, though, I'm a bit disappointed in the game. The world design is pretty good as always, but in boss fights, we've gone back to the Dark Souls days of "I'm gonna walk inside the 18-foot tall bosses' feet and hope the camera doesn't fail me" after tasting the excellent back-and-forth duels of Sekiro.

[Anteros]

Yeah I also killed Godrick second try. it seems to be a pattern that faster enemies that don't wear armor seem to be the weaker ones: Godrick, Evergaol Bloodhound Knight, Leonine Misbegotten, Ancient Hero of Zamor, red wolf of radahn.....the list goes on. meanwhile Crucible Knight in his armor and horn shield is still standing tall and undefeated in my playthrough.

Leonine took me quite a few tries. I tend to struggle more with enemies that make me delay my dodge I think. Also, the damn dragons. I do not enjoy horse combat at all.

[Yora]

Spotting quite a few things that look like Demon's Souls references to me.

Spoiler

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The whole opening cinematic.
Running into a miniboss that kills you in the first area that isn't part of the rest of the world.
Having a tutorial area.
A Maiden.
Round Table is like the Nexus.
The blacksmith is like Blacksmith Ed.
The silent guy looks to me a lot like Mephistopheles.
Storm Castle reminds me of Castle Boletaria.
Crystal miner caves reminded me of Stonefang Mine (though that might be a stretch)

I'm sure there's a lot more to come in the rest of the game.

[Rynjin]

Godrick definitely took me a few more than two tries. Not sure if it's just because I was too low level (I was around 25 IIRC) or those bleed daggers I shackled myself to for so long actually sucked that bad.

meanwhile Crucible Knight in his armor and horn shield is still standing tall and undefeated in my playthrough.

I hate to break it to you, but Crucible Knight isn't a boss. There's like a dozen and a half of them scattered around, one is in Stormveil Castle actually.

[Lord Raziere]

I hate to break it to you, but Crucible Knight isn't a boss. There's like a dozen and a half of them scattered around, one is in Stormveil Castle actually.

the Evergaol one is a boss. much bigger, has wings.

[Yora]

I'm now 28 hours into the game, and encountered (and beat) two main bosses so far.

This game will easily take me over 100 hours, and I won't be surprised if it ends up over 200.

And then I'll play it again!

[Dienekes]

the Evergaol one is a boss. much bigger, has wings.

Yeah I literally just skipped him. I was in a somewhat odd place with my zwei where even my light attacks were too slow to then react to his response (at least on my reaction times) and I still didn’t do enough damage to ever stagger him.

I should go back and kick his teeth in sometime.

[Lord Raziere]

Yeah I literally just skipped him. I was in a somewhat odd place with my zwei where even my light attacks were too slow to then react to his response (at least on my reaction times) and I still didn’t do enough damage to ever stagger him.

I should go back and kick his teeth in sometime.

Yeah, I went back and beat him in the session I just did, mostly by using magic crossbow bolts I crafted myself 'cause he's vulnerable to magic, but I still had to constantly time my attacks to shoot when his shield was down which mean constantly shooting in between rolls as he attacked. still hurt me a lot even though I killed him in that run. but this is why I say the other way of playing Elden Ring is to become batman and figure out all the little items and how you can use them to screw up the enemies day, it really helps if you know what to use where, and I have a floating inventory of things I just wait to craft for a specific situation or moment.

(a good easy mode version of this is playing Nioh 2 as a ninjutsu user and going for all the bombs, shuriken and whatnot. they basically give you more items that refill at a checkpoint, so it cuts out all the grinding for firebombs while still making you use the items tactically.)

[Rynjin]

I THINK Elden Ring does this for some stuff as well. I'm pretty sure, though haven't tested it, that any craftable item that says "Use FP to do X" is actually an item you just craft once and can re-use as long as you have enough Ritual Pots to put the item in.

It's the same text used on the Mimic Veil which I also thought was a consumable for a long time until someone informed me otherwise.

[Lord Raziere]

I THINK Elden Ring does this for some stuff as well. I'm pretty sure, though haven't tested it, that any craftable item that says "Use FP to do X" is actually an item you just craft once and can re-use as long as you have enough Ritual Pots to put the item in.

It's the same text used on the Mimic Veil which I also thought was a consumable for a long time until someone informed me otherwise.

...that makes the slight FP boost that bandit gets with an 11 in mind make more sense. problem is, I'm not sure how much I should raise mind, if at all.