OOTS #1255 - The Discussion Thread

[The Giant]

New comic is up.

[Peelee]

I really love all the reasoned arguments here.

[dancrilis]

Don't know if I would buy it if I were Serini - also don't know if I buy it based on what Hel, Loki and Thor said but Roy doesn't know that so he can't be faulted for it.

[RMS Oceanic]

So will she be swayed, or will she move the goalposts? Interesting quandry ahead.

[Locnil]

Man, after all this time, and so many level-ups, the whole OotS is still bad at persuasion...

[Psyren]

"You've met Xykon, right?" made me chuckle.

And Roy confirms what I was saying last thread - the gods being able to destroy the world ("safely" or not) was never in doubt for them, rather the only question was when, and they can do it specifically to stop the Plan if need be.

So will she be swayed, or will she move the goalposts? Interesting quandry ahead.

Twelve gods I hope it's the former.

[Hiro Quester]

“Deeply stupid cul de sacs” really tickled me.

It also describes just about every campaign I’ve played in.

[Locnil]

Twelve gods I hope it's the former.

On the bright side, if she doesn't then we know the Giant has a lot more planned for the final book.

[danielxcutter]

Okay if she doesn't even humor them after this I don't think anyone'll think twice about hopping on the Serini Is A Damn Fool^TM bandwagon.

That being said I'm very pleasantly surprised that Roy cut straight to the point without beating around the bush. However she reacts to this should decide it either way.

[zester]

Brilliant summary, also I laughed so hard at "Twelve Gods!!" - "Yeah, them too."

[Lkctgo]

I see what Rich is doing.. he's showing us what could have happened if Roy got to try and convince Redcloak.

[danielxcutter]

I see what Rich is doing.. he's showing us what could have happened if Roy got to try and convince Redcloak.

I wouldn't quite say that - Durkon honestly got pretty close and I don't know if Roy has the emotional investment for his way to work on Redcloak.

[Kareeah_Indaga]

I enjoyed the ‘still technically a path’ punchline.

[Ionathus]

Dear god, that last panel was a delight! Excellent work as always

Notably we didn't see Serini's reaction...personally I expect her to take the news with a little less suspicion than Redcloak. It would be weird for both people who Durkon tells about the Godsmoot to reject it out of paranoia, and Serini seems to have warmed at least a tiny bit to the Order in this comic...or at least she's not flinging as many insults.

[RMS Oceanic]

Twelve gods I hope it's the former.

The final direction I see her having rhetorical room to maneuver, even if by now it's clearly a retreat into emotion, is that a controlled demolition of the world by the gods would be preferable to them making a rush job of it after the Snarl begins to turn loose and some souls are consigned to oblivion because the lifeboats were launched half full with inconsistent boarding priorities. And I wouldn't mind if she wiggles there, because I think that deepens her character, even if someone else has to persuade her emotionally, rather than logically.

[Ionathus]

I wouldn't quite say that - Durkon honestly got pretty close and I don't know if Roy has the emotional investment for his way to work on Redcloak.

Yeah, I honestly do believe Durkon was the best shot at it. He brings the religious perspective that Roy doesn't have, and he also has some great parallels to Redcloak ("finding out the gods just see ye as bargainin' chips... or crops.") that helped him relate a little better. I think Redcloak was just too hard of a sell, no matter who did the talking...at least, for the first try!

[halfeye]

So now, finally, Serini knows what's up. Hoping for at least some sense from her from here on out.

[danielxcutter]

Dear god, that last panel was a delight! Excellent work as always

Notably we didn't see Serini's reaction...personally I expect her to take the news with a little less suspicion than Redcloak. It would be weird for both people who Durkon tells about the Godsmoot to reject it out of paranoia, and Serini seems to have warmed at least a tiny bit to the Order in this comic...or at least she's not flinging as many insults.

I wouldn't say Redcloak's issue was paranoia honestly - and not just because a lot of beings really do have it out for him and his patron.

The final rhetorical room I see her having room to maneuver, even if by now it's clearly a retreat into emotion, is that a controlled demolition of the world by the gods would be preferable to them making a rush job of it after the Snarl begins to turn loose and some souls are consigned to oblivion because the lifeboats were launched half full with inconsistent boarding priorities. And I wouldn't mind if she wiggles there, because I think that deepens her character, even if someone else has to persuade her emotionally, rather than logically.

If that happens I imagine that'd also put the "Serini's position is Right^TM" argument to rest, but I'll settle for her at least seriously considering it instead of just being insufferably smug.

[Fyraltari]

It would be weird for both people who Durkon tells about the Godsmoot to reject it out of paranoia

Well, Redcloak rejected it, not out of paranoia, but a deep-rooted inability to face his own guilt, but otherwise, yes, it'd be odd.

[Ivrytwr]

"deeply stupid" - my new favorite descriptor.

Thanks Giant!

... Yeah, them too!

[hamishspence]

Belkar's digressions are still hilarious.

[Peelee]

So will she be swayed, or will she move the goalposts? Interesting quandry ahead.

"Twelve gods I hope it's the former.

Seconded.

On the bright side, if she doesn't then we know the Giant has a lot more planned for the final book.

I'm not sure. Between monstrous equality and the world in the rifts, it seems like there plenty of ground to tread.

Okay if she doesn't even humor them after this I don't think anyone'll think twice about hopping on the Serini Is A Damn Fool^TM bandwagon.

I'll buy a first class ticket to ride that train, yep.

[Fyraltari]

Also, surprised Belkar is actually onboard with going beck to Firmament to finish off nay straggler vampire.

Figured he'd want to leave the busywork to somebody else.

[dancrilis]

Also, surprised Belkar is actually onboard with going beck to Firmament to finish off nay straggler vampire.

Figured he'd want to leave the busywork to somebody else.

He spent a long time hating a vampire and I would not be surprised if he has transfered that hate to any who are in league with said vampire.

Edit: It is also important so that a) the world survives and b) Durkon (and family) not getting damned to Hel.

[Shining Wrath]

I don't think Serini is buying this. Why should she?

But I also think she's thinking about the possibility that this might be true.

[Windscion]

Honestly, I thought Durkon did a crap job of persuading RC. I feel he would have done better to stress how much leverage TDO has due to possibly containing the Snarl, which should (if believed, which is admittedly a sticking point) make him more interested in opening negotiations. More importantly, it means that TDO has something to lose by not doing so. I feel like right now the logic of what TDO knows gives him no reason not to wait for his position to get stronger.

[Shining Wrath]

Also, we just got a count of previous worlds: billions. I don't know if that's been explicitly stated before.
Which accounts for some of the weird worlds - the gods must be profoundly bored by now.
Which also means that if they decide this one is boring, they may deep six it and recreate, which means they need the Dark One to survive this cycle.

[Kaed]

Also, surprised Belkar is actually onboard with going beck to Firmament to finish off nay straggler vampire.

Figured he'd want to leave the busywork to somebody else.

He has grown a lot over the story. While I wouldn't say he's a paragon of virtue, I can definitely see him wanting to finish off the last of the baby vampires as sort of a final screw you to thier departed sire. Who he very much disliked. He is also repulsed by vampires on an emotional level after Durkon* ("they're like the trendy juice bars of monsters").

The fact that it is a noble goal may slightly factor in too because he does appear to have become cognizant of the fact that people like heroes more than horrible little murderers.

[Peelee]

I don't think Serini is buying this. Why should she?

Because it's a remarkably convoluted claim to be presented with while still remaining consistent between multiple presenters with little to no gain to themselves, considering they have already neutralized her.

Sure, they may be lying to get her to disclose the rest of the defenses, but they could just try to figure it out themselves without a needlessly complex plot to ensure her acceptance. And even if she raises that objection, they could respond with the idea that they don't need or want to know the exact location of the Gate because they already are between it and Xykon.

[danielxcutter]

Because it's a remarkably convoluted claim to be presented with while still remaining consistent between multiple presenters with little to no gain to themselves, considering they have already neutralized her.

Sure, they may be lying to get her to disclose the rest of the defenses, but they could just try to figure it out themselves without a needlessly complex plot to ensure her acceptance. And even if she raises that objection, they could respond with the idea that they don't need or want to know the exact location of the Gate because they already are between it and Xykon.

In short: they're not Nale Tarquinson.