Is 750 word too long for a backstory?

[Sir-Carlos]

Well, look at that. the other day I was writing about writers-block and today I had a surge of inspiration and wrote 750 words of backstory. Before I hit my poor DM with that: Is that too much? What is your preferred backstory-length? I know that this will vary from group to group, but I would like to know!

also, thanks to all the people who gave me tips about writer-block in the other thread :)

[Kurt Kurageous]

For me, anything more than your players race, class, background, why they became adventurers, and their goals/motivators (to become the...) are all I need. Anything more is unhelpful to me as the DM at 1st tier. We playing elsewhere, then you have a history. 1st tier, you have a short past and a longer future.

Your PC should not start as a fully realized personality. Where can you grow from there? It gets boring real quick. Why not learn by playing and let yourself enjoy the growth of your PC?

Of course, this is a lot like the marshmallow experiment. If you cant delay your gratification and MUST write a fanfic tribute, that's your fun. Don't expect me to read it, use it, or tailor the campaign to it.

And for the love of all lovely, please don't tell me about your dead, unknown, dethroned parents. It's so cliche I may want to kill the PC. If you got writing chops, real writing chops, I might read it. If you are in RL not a writer as a hobby, please just give me what I can use.

I know I will be the minority opinion here.

[Mastikator]

Yes it's too long.

750 words is about 700 too many words.

My preference is between 1 and 2 paragraphs.

[Khedrac]

For me the answer is "not necessarily". The problem I have with many PC backgrounds is that they write extra skills into the character (intentionally or unintentionally) and this can then cause problems when the GM rules that a character cannot do something (due to lack of skill on the character sheet) that the player thinks they should be able to based on their background.
For example, if you character has no ranks or skill is smithing, then a background as the child of a smith is probably a bad start - you would pick up some knowlege even if not being formally trained.

Very few games assume that starting characters are anything other than pretty inexperienced (traveller is the main counter-example) - most new PCs have at most just finished their apprenticeships, and they have virtually no experience of the world.

Now, one can write a long backstory that keeps the character young and inexperienced - my sister-in-law recently told me her newest characer's backstory and she managed quite an eventful one that still worked for a new character - but most, in my experience, don't.

So, first of all I would read your character's backstory and check to see if it is trying to give the chracter knowledge they should not have (skills or game-world geography). Then check to see if it is reasonable for the character's age.
Once this is done I would tell the DM that you have written quite a long backstory and give them a quick summary. If they then want the full background they can ask for it, but be warned, they may decide it's "too much" for how they plan the campaign to run.

[Batcathat]

No, I don't think it's too long at all. It's probably longer than it needs to be, but I don't see why it'd be a problem. It's not like it's a very long read in the grand scheme of things.

As for my preferred length, I'm not really sure. Somewhere between a couple of sentences and a couple of paragraphs, I guess. I also think it depends quite a bit on the character.

[JNAProductions]

I would say that having such inspiration is awesome!

But as a DM, give me cliffnotes. It's awesome that you're so invested, but I've got an entire campaign and world to manage-I do want the whole backstory, but I also want the abbreviated version so that I don't have to read the whole thing for little details.

[Grod_The_Giant]

I don't require backstory from my players at all--if they're only interested in the campaign at hand, that's fine by me. Sometimes you come in with a fully fleshed out story and personality, other times you figure it out as the game unfolds. Both are valid.

If someone did give me a written backstory, I'd certainly read it. Heck, I'd read it even if there was a plot twist planned that would render it all moot. Having a player put that much extra time and thought into your game is one of the best compliments a GM can get, and reading the result is the least I can do to return the favor.

Do I have any sort of breaking point? I mean, probably, but (fairly or unfairly) it's going to be based on the quality of the writing. I can churn through a few pages of bad prose quickly, but I'm probably not going to do more than skim a twenty page novella if I have to struggle with each paragraph. On the other hand, if your backstory clocks in at three hundred pages but is a fun read in its own right...

I mean, I guess somewhere around the fifteen to twenty minute mark it switches from game preparation to literary workshopping. But seeing as how that's also something I greatly enjoy...

(I might ask you to give me feedback on my latest novel draft in return, though. Fair's fair.)





Tl;dr--I'm not going to ask for any sort of formal backstory, but if someone does go the extra mile I'll do my best to read the whole thing

[Psyren]

Your backstory can be as long and detailed as you want it to be, but if your primary goal is to hand something to your DM that they can work from to generate hooks and relationships, I would boil it down to an executive summary / cliffnotes.

[Palanan]

Originally Posted by Grod_The_Giant
Having a player put that much extra time and thought into your game is one of the best compliments a GM can get, and reading the result is the least I can do to return the favor.

+10 to this.

I have some players who struggle to put together a short paragraph, and I can work with that. But I deeply value a player who’s willing to spend the time and effort to write a detailed character background, because it tells me that player is imaginative and invested in the game.

So no, 750 words is not remotely too long. If you’ve written that much backstory, don’t for an instant feel bad about it, no matter what some people say. Be glad of the inspiration, and your DM will be glad as well.

And just because you develop a history and personality for your character, doesn’t in any way prevent you from growing and developing that character in the game.

[Vahnavoi]

Depends on format of a game. I've written backstories of equal and greater length for play-by-post games, where a game master and other players have a lot of time between turns and can read such things at their leisure. For such games, a long backstory is a resource, just like all other preparatory game materials. Same applies for tabletop games where a game master has a long time between sessions to receive and review material from players.

For more traditional tabletop games where character creation is done at the table, it's excessive. You can communicate the gist of where your character comes from with three short sentences. Focus of the game also matters: when the focus is on the immediate situation or a location, player character backstories are de-emphasized. To get and keep things moving, personality and alignment (in the sense of values and objectives a character pursues) are far more important than backstory; backstory is mostly an explanation for why those things are as they are. "Why" can be kept short and vague, because "whys" of the initial position are naturally obsoleted and replaced by "whys" stemming from actual play.

[Telonius]

I'd give that a bit, "It depends." For a first-level character? That's probably more than you need to give the DM. But, it might be exactly the right amount of backstory you need to play the character.

To put this another way, when I'm DMing, I fully expect about 75% of the background materials I prepare to never see the light of day. The players don't decide to interact with the world in that way; they go for the fancy hotel instead of the dive bar, they decide against two potential plot hooks and opt for a third, the awesome quirky merchant I prepped comes off completely wrong and they don't interact. Instead of info-dumping them, I give them what they need to know. I have the DM Notebook (TM) off to the side in case I need it, but I don't beat players over the head with it (unless they start building a Pun-Pun).

Absolutely don't feel bad about doing that much work, if it helps you to get into character. But unless the DM asked for something that detailed, all they really need to know is a general sketch. Who's your character, why are they there, general personality, any particularly strong motivations (feuds, oaths, family, relationships, any specific traumas like "family was killed by orcs" or "orphaned at a young age"). Give them the jacket blurb, not the full novel. And let them know that you have a longer version if they want to read it.

[Thrudd]

It depends on the type of game and what function the backstory serves. If the GM intends to use PC backstories as a way to create content that will be personal to the players, then a longer, more detailed story can be good. In most other cases, a long backstory is totally unnecessary. If it's fun for you to write it, that's fine, and a polite GM will at least read it, regardless of whether they will use it in their prep. But you generally don't need that much.

You just want to establish generally what your character wants (as of the start of the game), their morals and ideals, whether they serve a cause or group greater than themselves, and maybe a couple general personality traits- so that you and the GM will both be on the same page about how to motivate that character into action. You don't usually need to decide the character's full life history, the exact details of their training, all the members of their family, the sources of their psychological trauma, etc. Don't expect that type of information to come into play, unless the GM tells you that's what they want.

That said, 750 words isn't really that much...what is that, 2 pages in 12 pt double spaced? I wouldn't write that much unless it was explicitly asked for, but I wouldn't necessarily see it as an imposition to read it as a GM, regardless of whether I'd use any of it.

[vasilidor]

This is dependant on the DM and the type of game you are playing.
If the basis is the kick in the door and kill/loot monsters, then yes it is too much.
If the basis is some sort of intrigue/mystery game it may be just right.

[Tawmis]

Others covered it nicely.

For me, as a player - having a backstory helps me set up myself mentally for stepping into my character's shoes (boots, whatever) right from session 1. Rather than going along the adventure, and eventually figuring out the personality. If I know the personality and backstory from the get go - I can RP the character that much faster. Characters should always grow, so things that happen to the character, may change their personality and views on things - and I think when that happens, it's pretty cool. And that's difficult to pull off if you're making up the personality as you go.

For me as a DM - since I never run existing modules, my world is all homebrew, I love me a good backstory - especially if it has hooks that I can use. And those hooks don't need to be immediate. But I always feel like if you use things from a character's background - that typically increases their investment in the campaign and story, and also makes them feel like they're more than just a character in the world. That something from their backstory is also an ongoing part of the world.

[Hytheter]

The story happens at the table, not on your character sheet. I'm on the side of 'yes'.

[Telok]

As a DM I'd rather several pages of backstory to "generic male elf wizard #37", no matter what the game.

Even in Paranoia, the ultimate game for disposable characters, I'd rather pages of backstory than someone who does not know anything about their character except the stats.

[ngilop]

YES.


I think a couple paragraphs is plenty for 99% of all characters.

Of course.. there is 'hey we are starting at 16th level and middle aged+.. what did you do to get here" would be a bit more

as would the DM being a jerk and necessitating a 48 page backstory (times new roman 12 point maybe double spaced?)

[Mr Blobby]

+1 for the 'well, it depends' crowd.

It depends on what game it is for.

It depends on the age/skill level of the character.

It depends on what kind of game you're playing.

It depends on what your writings cover.

It depends on what your GM desires.

Some games simply make heavier demands on creation, and then breed acres of 'supplementary material' while in-play. A very quick look at my Mage the Ascension char tells me they've got 1.1k backstory, 1.8k on their magic, 1.2k on various misc details [like possessions], another 400 as a kind of 'backstory suppliment' [NPCs they've met on the adventures so for etc] and another 500 on basic descriptions...

However, I will say this regardless; go back, re-read and do a 'prune'. I always see writing a backstory like doing an longer obituary; perhaps ~500 words for a basic/low level char. It's a bit of an art form; to boil down your char's very essance to the minimum of facts. In fact, I often advise to not be *too* precise in backstories; not only does it offer possible play-hooks for the GM, but allows you a bit of character flex/growth over time. [Yeah, I broke my own rule with my mage. Wasn't my 'fault'; she had a couple of semi-unicorn elements which needed 'explaining' to be allowed into the game].

And to ask your GM what they desire/expect.

[Tanarii]

Anything more than 5-6 sentences, all of which describe your character motivations in some way, is too long. If I was your DM. YMMV with other DMs

By which I mean anything 'historical' must clearly call out what kind of motivation it is as a primary purpose. You've got a family? Great! It needs to phrased as something like:
- I promised my wife and children I'd always come back
or
- I steal gold to support my wastrel extended family of cousins

[Cheesegear]

What is your preferred backstory-length?

Depends how good it is.

Typically, I don't give a **** about backstories, because backstories aren't for me. Backstories are for the player who writes them. In fact, I don't even care if a player has a backstory or not. Because when Session 1 hits, they - not me - need to know WTF they're roleplaying as:

1. Who are you? Where do you come from?
2. Why are you here? What are you looking for?
3. Where are you going? What are your goals?

If a player can answer these three questions, in the first 10 minutes of session 1, in-narrative or OOC, then their backstory is irrelevant.

Backstories happen 'off-screen', they are the least important part of anything. Very, very, very rarely have I even seen a player integrate their backstory into the narrative. I have to do that, and I can always choose not to - and I usually do. Because why would I focus on one player's character when there are four others at the table that I also have to take care of?

I'm more than happy with a single paragraph. But I'm also happy with no backstory at all...So long as you have an understanding of how to play your character.

If your backstory is longer than a single page, though...I'm almost definitely not even going to read it. That's too much detail for something that didn't even happen at the table.

[Palanan]

Originally Posted by Tawmis
But I always feel like if you use things from a character's background - that typically increases their investment in the campaign and story, and also makes them feel like they're more than just a character in the world. That something from their backstory is also an ongoing part of the world.

Absolutely this. A player in my current campaign asked if one of his characters from another game could be his current character’s mentor—in the background only, with no mechanical benefit. I ended up incorporating his prior character into the broader storyline, and it’s added that much more depth to his character and the story overall.

[Cheesegear]

Absolutely this. A player in my current campaign asked if one of his characters from another game could be his current character’s mentor—in the background only, with no mechanical benefit. I ended up incorporating his prior character into the broader storyline, and it’s added that much more depth to his character and the story overall.

A player in my last campaign wanted to rope everyone into looking for her rightful heirloom that was in her background, and didn't want to go on any quest that wasn't directly related to her family.

Umm...No?

Said player's backstory was also longer than a page, that I didn't read, and I wasn't aware that she was going to do that. If I'd read her backstory, I would have rejected it almost immediately. There are five players at the table, there's no such thing as a main character. D&D is a self-insert fanfiction, that is true. But it's a cooperative fanfiction with many self-inserts.

[Tawmis]

A player in my last campaign wanted to rope everyone into looking for her rightful heirloom that was in her background, and didn't want to go on any quest that wasn't directly related to her family.
Umm...No?
Said player's backstory was also longer than a page, that I didn't read, and I wasn't aware that she was going to do that. If I'd read her backstory, I would have rejected it almost immediately. There are five players at the table, there's no such thing as a main character. D&D is a self-insert fanfiction, that is true. But it's a cooperative fanfiction with many self-inserts.

Ah, but why not make it that - whatever the campaign is - has something to do with an heirloom.
The big bad murdered her family or whatever the backstory was and took the heirloom as a "treasure" for the kill.
And now she's out to recover it and restore her family's honor.
So it's not the main story - but it's a PART of the main story.
(Like I said, no idea of the heirloom backstory - so just coming up with a quick example how a happy medium could have been found)

[Rynjin]

Give your GM the Sparknotes version, because they probably won't have time to read a mini-essay for every character before the first session.

[Mr Blobby]

A player in my last campaign wanted to rope everyone into looking for her rightful heirloom that was in her background, and didn't want to go on any quest that wasn't directly related to her family.

Umm...No?

Said player's backstory was also longer than a page, that I didn't read, and I wasn't aware that she was going to do that. If I'd read her backstory, I would have rejected it almost immediately. There are five players at the table, there's no such thing as a main character. D&D is a self-insert fanfiction, that is true. But it's a cooperative fanfiction with many self-inserts.

Well, you've only got yourself to blame for that, yes? The player *did* tell you - you simply couldn't be bothered to listen to them. Which to be frank, would make me somewhat wary of having you as *my* GM; it smells like you don't really care about player input.

In my experience, you can normally sniff out many a problem char/player at 'Sesson 0' when you're reading the backstory. Like for example, if they don't actually really get the kind of story you're planning to run.

[Rynjin]

Well, you've only got yourself to blame for that, yes? The player *did* tell you - you simply couldn't be bothered to listen to them. Which to be frank, would make me somewhat wary of having you as *my* GM; it smells like you don't really care about player input.

Good communication involves communicating your intention in brief. In short:

Spoiler: Image is kinda huge actually

Show

[Tanarii]

In my experience, you can normally sniff out many a problem char/player at 'Sesson 0' when you're reading the backstory. Like for example, if they don't actually really get the kind of story you're planning to run.

Indeed. Turning in a backstory allows me to sniff that person out as a problem player right away.

[Mr Blobby]

I see. They're all mysterious mystery persons with no history at all, where their motivations are unknowable and they're doing whatever they are just because?

Is my character even allowed a name, or is this too much backstory for you?

Good communication involves communicating your intention in brief. In short:

Spoiler: Image is kinda huge actually

Show

'I don't have time to read all this... could you please produce a summary for me, please?'

Though this is partly 'your' fault for not specifying what you did/didn't desire to see. I'm inspired by the first 'proper' GM I ever met two quite literally gave us a photocopy of a ~400 word newspaper obit and said 'like this, just the bare-bones, no centres of attention or super-specialness, it's not a novel.'

[Tanarii]

Is my character even allowed a name, or is this too much backstory for you?

Is it the Bob the Fighter II, younger brother of Bob the Fighter that died 15 minute ago?

[Schwann145]

Worth noting that 750 words is about a page and a half, for anyone who sees this and auto-thinks it's a full-on short story.

Is a page and a half too much back story? Short answer: probably. Longer answer: it'll depend on what level you're starting at, what your GM has asked/expects of the players, etc.

The important thing to remember is that your backstory is really only important to you. There may be some hooks provided that the GM possibly runs with in the future, and that's a nice gift to them, but otherwise it's pretty meaningless to anyone else.
The story that matters is the one that happens after the backstory - the game itself.

Now, again, details matter.
Are you level 1? You don't have a backstory. You have a circumstance that put you in an adventure. If you had relevant and exciting backstory, you wouldn't be level 1, would you?
Are you level 12? You obviously have quite a storied history. But is that history at all relevant to the game going forward, or is it just something neat for you to have tumbling around in your head to help you play your character? That will be an important question to answer, because saddling the GM with too much irrelevant story when they're already juggling every character, the NPCs, their own plans, etc is pretty self-serving.