Fallout official trailer

[oudeis]

I've never really been a big fan of the series and I have no faith whatsoever in Prime's ability to not **** up everything they touch, but I have to admit this has gotten me excited:

[Errorname]

If I wasn't an existing fan of the games with strong opinions about how certain setting elements should be handled I think I'd be pretty unreservedly excited for this.

[J-H]

I see Shady Sands, and what looks like the Glow. The Brotherhood of Steel does not have Vertibirds, so I suspect we're seeing evidence of the Enclave as well.
No indications that they're going to ruin it with gratuitious sex, as Vault Dweller's likely friend/frenemy/battle buddy is a ghoul cowboy, and the BoS is a bit more monk-ish.

It looks kind of fun, but I also have very little trust for modern media.

I don't think my wife will be interested in watching it, but I might check it out on my own. If I have time. ha ha ha

[Batcathat]

I wasn't very impressed by the last trailer (or teaser? Something like that), but I have to say this does look pretty promising.

Though disliking elements not being handled the way I think they should be is a definite risk for me too. I think one of the reasons I've never been very fond of Fallout 3 is that I haven't gotten over it feeling too different from the first two games (though I love New Vegas, which I think combines the good parts about 1, 2 and 3, so there's that ).

[Errorname]

The Brotherhood of Steel does not have Vertibirds, so I suspect we're seeing evidence of the Enclave as well.

East Coast Brotherhood does, so it seems likely that the group from Fallout 3 and 4 which have prospered in the east have sent forces back west.

[J-H]

I only played 1 & 2.
That's disappointing. I'd rather have the BoS be the slightly odd and somewhat misguided good guys, instead of the bad guys in the setting. Let's leave the power-armored mass murdering to the Enclave, and maybe get some sweet PA vs PA fights.

[t209]

I only played 1 & 2.
That's disappointing. I'd rather have the BoS be the slightly odd and somewhat misguided good guys, instead of the bad guys in the setting. Let's leave the power-armored mass murdering to the Enclave, and maybe get some sweet PA vs PA fights.

Also since we did see NCR flag. I think they are also going for Van Buren’s NCR-Brotherhood War.

[Errorname]

I only played 1 & 2. That's disappointing. I'd rather have the BoS be the slightly odd and somewhat misguided good guys, instead of the bad guys in the setting. Let's leave the power-armored mass murdering to the Enclave, and maybe get some sweet PA vs PA fights.

The Brotherhood have never been uncomplicated good guys. The story of the West Coast Brotherhood is one of decay and failure and while the East Coast Brotherhood has prospered, they have done so by becoming effectively the same force they once opposed.

I'd also say that, since this is meant to be canon to the game timeline, it's a good call to not bring the Enclave back. They've had two games as the big bads and frankly they probably shouldn't have been in 3 either. New Vegas buried them and gave them a perfect send-off, let them stay gone.

Also since we did see NCR flag. I think they are also going for Van Buren’s NCR-Brotherhood War.

Or indeed, following up on the NCR-Brotherhood conflict that featured in New Vegas's backstory and that game's Brotherhood sidequests.

[Rynjin]

The main reasons I remain cautiously optimistic for this one are twofold:

1.) Fallout is a very open-ended setting. While it has a lot of specific visual trappings that help construct its "vibe", there's very little in terms of an overarching plot between the different games in the franchise. Everything is standalone, so there's very little continuity-based lore to be mangled.

2.) Apocalyptic tales like this are tailor made for your standard Hollywood writers. It's a basic framework that works, is popular, and is used frequently so these writers have a lot of practice working within that box.

Plus, visually, the series looks pretty good.
---

Re: The Brotherhood: Yeah, the Brotherhood has always been a splintered, complicated faction. The West Coast Brotherhood were isolationist, elitist dregs of the former military and thought they were the true inheritors of the will of America. The only real difference between them and the Enclave is the Enclave was willing to actually go out there and do something about it. They had similar thoughts, but the Brotherhood never (metaphorically or literally) pulled the trigger.

The East Coast Brotherhood, meanwhile, set out to find any remnants of the former government, and failing that settled into their role as "protectors of the Wasteland". They did genuine good in Fallout 3, even if they were snooty about it.

Fallout 4, however, shows the flaws in their mindset. Maxson was raised on that ideal, as well as the original ideals of the West Coast Brotherhood. He was raised, groomed, and set to become the next leader of the Brotherhood by the time he could walk. He, in essence, believed the Brotherhood's hype to the letter, and it instilled in him the exact same elitism that the West Coast Brotherhood had...with the East Coast chapter's willingness to act.

As of the "present day" in-setting the only difference between the East and West chapters' beliefs is that the East Coast chapter is willing to actually go out there and do something...oops. Who does that sound like?

People give Bethesda a lot of **** for their writing, and rightfully so, but every now and then they nail it, and the evolution of the East Coast Brotherhood from their isolationist roots to a force for good, to a force for...frankly just force, out to impose their will on the Wasteland for "the greater good" is an extremely logical progression of events.

[Tyndmyr]

So, this world looks amazing. If it lives up to the trailer, I'm pretty excited.

The character, however, appears pretty forgettable. I do not yet care about her one way or the other.

[The Patterner]

So, this world looks amazing. If it lives up to the trailer, I'm pretty excited.

The character, however, appears pretty forgettable. I do not yet care about her one way or the other.

Hopefully it's just the trailer, but I kind of agree.

It looks great though and I'm really looking forward to it.

[Tyndmyr]

Oh...oh no.

https://boundingintocomics.com/2024/...3t__x0eMXtX9bc

That's not a good sign.

[t209]

Oh...oh no.

https://boundingintocomics.com/2024/...3t__x0eMXtX9bc

That's not a good sign.

I can agree with the issue, even if I find Bounding Into Comics as an iffy source.
Then again Todd Howard being the active part of development along with “ultimate universe” (think taking all pre existing story and make it into single narrative)…if you remember how Ultimate Marvel ended up.
Plus 3 did set the trend for retro future and taking all known Fallout icons (bottle cap currencies, Vaults, and Supermutant) didn’t help. Like 1 and 2 had more “modern” aesthetics (especially fire arms).

[LibraryOgre]

Oh...oh no.

https://boundingintocomics.com/2024/...3t__x0eMXtX9bc

That's not a good sign.

OTOH, Bounding Into Comics isn't a terribly reliable news source.

[InvisibleBison]

Personally, I'm not worried by the director acknowledging that some fans of the games won't like the show, because I already knew that was going to be the case. And frankly, that article seems to have been written by the exact kind of "fan" a franchise would be better off without, so I'm not concerned about them not being happy about the show.

[Darth Credence]

Oh...oh no.

https://boundingintocomics.com/2024/...3t__x0eMXtX9bc

That's not a good sign.

I disagree completely - this is a good sign. That statement is 100% correct - chasing fan approval makes for crap. Trying to appease fans leads to the same kind of art by committee that studio meddling creates.

"If it's an idea you would have thought of anyway, fine. It's okay for a manga artist to adapt like that. But if you go around absorbing everything your fans give you, you end up with gibberish, like this. Listen, fan mail is something to encourage you, not something to steal ideas from. If you start using all these suggestions, then your work won't be Muto Ashirogi's anymore. It'll be something your fans created... understand?"

Same idea there from a manga creator.

[Lemmy]

Oh...oh no.

https://boundingintocomics.com/2024/...3t__x0eMXtX9bc

That's not a good sign.

Ah, yes... The good ol' "Let's disparage the fans of the franchise we're exploiting, even though those fans are exactly why the giant corporation bothered to buy the rights for said franchise instead of creating a new IP. We definitely know better than these commoners who have kept the franchise alive for decades"...

Because it always works out so well... How's Star Wars, Star Trek, Marvel and The Witcher doing these days? Business is booming, surely...

[Bavarian itP]

Star Trek

Six new shows in the last seven years, four of them still running. I really don't know what point you're trying to make here. And when did Star Trek disparage their fans? Wasn't Picard season 2 and 3 about 100% nostalgia fanservice?

[Lemmy]

Six new shows in the last seven years, four of them still running. I really don't know what point you're trying to make here. And when did Star Trek disparage their fans? Wasn't Picard season 2 and 3 about 100% nostalgia fanservice?

Ah, yes... Those incredibly popular, well-writen and beloved series... How could anyone forget about them?

Well... I won't get into it because I don't think there's much worth discussing about ST these days...

Anyway... The point still stands even if you decide to remove ST from the equation.

The whole "it's not for the fans" thing never works.
It just reveals tthe new show/movie/game/whatever is being made by ppl who don't know and/or don't care about the original source material... And probably even look down on its fans. It's the whole" We know better than the fans" attitude again, so common these days...

And then, when it inevitably fails, we get once again the old and tired slandering and gaslighting of fans "it wasn't the fault of our horrible product, incompetent producers or soulless corporation... It's the fans who are wrong! They don't like us just because they are immature hateful biggoted man-children. Yup. There's no other possible explanation. No, sir.".

Meanwhile... The once beloved franchise takes another step towards the abyss of apathy...

[Bavarian itP]

Anyway... The point still stands even if you decide to remove ST from the equation.

So we agree that Star Trek does not belong into that list, thanks for the clarification.

[Lemmy]

So we agree that Star Trek does not belong into that list, thanks for the clarification.

That's not what said, but ok...

What specific franchises are used as examples isn't all that important. We have enough cases (some more blatant, others less) that the point stands anyway.

And that point is: "it's not made or the fans" is just a shorter way of saying "We don't know or respect the source material, its fans or its authors. And we will ruin this adaptation trying to prove how much more enlightened than them we are".

Fast forward a couple months and we have yet another case of a huge studio essentially paying hundreds of millions of dollars for the benefit of weakening their brand and shrinking their audience...

I wish i could find that montage of a bunch of showrunners, movie makers and producers saying "I never read/watched/played [source material]"... The same ones who went on to make highly acclaimed and profitable gems of entertainment, such as Rings of Power, The Marvels, She Hulk, The Witcher, Ahsoka, etc...

[Errorname]

Saying that these shows and films are getting ruined because creatives don't care about the source material is a common narrative because it's easy, not because it's true. Someone getting brought in to lead on a project they don't care about does happen, but equally common these days is the lifelong fan who has a ton of nostalgia and passion and respect for the original films who produces completely meritless garbage anyways. I'd actually say that of the two, the latter tends to be worse.

[Lemmy]

Saying that these shows and films are getting ruined because creatives don't care about the source material is a common narrative because it's easy, not because it's true. Someone getting brought in to lead on a project they don't care about does happen, but equally common these days is the lifelong fan who has a ton of nostalgia and passion and respect for the original films who produces completely meritless garbage anyways. I'd actually say that of the two, the latter tends to be worse.

Oh, it's definitely not the only factor (there's also the absolute lack of creativity and talent plaguing Hollywood and many of the people chosen to lead these projects), but it's certainly a big one.

I'll complain about the awful movies, series and games created by "lifelong fans with tons of nostalgia" when we have a whole decade of horrible adaptations made by such people...

But right now, I don't see that nearly as often as the sequels and adaptations led by people who couldn't care less about the source material, its authors or its fans.

[Talakeal]

It would be interesting to see some sort of statistical breakdown of movies made by people who loved the original as compared to film quality and over time.

I can think of plenty of examples from my youth of bad movies made by a superfan and good movies made by someone who hated the original (Starship Troopers for example).

[Errorname]

I'll complain about the awful movies, series and games created by "lifelong fans with tons of nostalgia" when we have a whole decade of horrible adaptations made by such people...

You brought up Star Wars and Star Trek, both of which are absolutely drowning in this sort of thing and have been for years.

[Joran]

And that point is: "it's not made or the fans" is just a shorter way of saying "We don't know or respect the source material, its fans or its authors. And we will ruin this adaptation trying to prove how much more enlightened than them we are".

Fast forward a couple months and we have yet another case of a huge studio essentially paying hundreds of millions of dollars for the benefit of weakening their brand and shrinking their audience...

I wish i could find that montage of a bunch of showrunners, movie makers and producers saying "I never read/watched/played [source material]"... The same ones who went on to make highly acclaimed and profitable gems of entertainment, such as Rings of Power, The Marvels, She Hulk, The Witcher, Ahsoka, etc...

The counter-example would be Tony Gilroy and Andor; he's distinctly not a lifelong Star Wars fan. He also mentions that he's specifically hired people he thought were good, but were not Star Wars people and to tell others not to let Star Wars get into their head.

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/tv...rs-1235226261/

[Rynjin]

You brought up Star Wars and Star Trek, both of which are absolutely drowning in this sort of thing and have been for years.

Yeah, the inverse problem seems to be the case with franchises.

Long-running franchises have a tendency to become stagnant and far too in love with themselves. A fresh eye with fresh ideas can come in and breathe new life into it when the other alternative would be to just let the franchise die (which I think should be allowed more often, but that's a different discussion).

The issue comes in when people take this same mindset to something that...hasn't been done yet. I don't need a "fresh take" on the Wheel of Time. I want the first take. Because it doesn't exist yet. Make it like the thing you're adapting, because I have not seen that thing be adapted yet dammit.

[Mechalich]

Yeah, the inverse problem seems to be the case with franchises.

Long-running franchises have a tendency to become stagnant and far too in love with themselves. A fresh eye with fresh ideas can come in and breathe new life into it when the other alternative would be to just let the franchise die (which I think should be allowed more often, but that's a different discussion).

Franchises are also bounded creations. They were, initially designed to do one thing, to tell one specific story or kind of story and they inevitably import a lot of structural elements used to tell that story and any subsequent story within that franchise has to grapple with the existence of those structural elements. Now, it's often possible for a fresh eye to repurpose those elements in new and highly effective ways. For example, Andor takes all of the Imperial elements of Star Wars and instead of using them as the antagonists of a melodrama, uses them to tell a story about the grinding horrors of authoritarianism, but at the end of the day all of those elements are still there. Fallout, perhaps surprisingly, can do this well. As noted in this very thread it contains multiple different takes on the Brotherhood even while retaining the Brotherhood as recognizably the same thing each time (this is also done with Vault-Tec, the US Government, vaguely 1950s social mores, and several other things throughout the various games).

However, this approach requires respect. The creative team needs to understand the various essential elements and resolve to use them in a manner that honors the original material, including any choices to subvert pre-existing structures or themes if it is deemed necessary due to transition to a new medium or time constraints or some other factor that forces alterations.

The issue comes in when people take this same mindset to something that...hasn't been done yet. I don't need a "fresh take" on the Wheel of Time. I want the first take. Because it doesn't exist yet. Make it like the thing you're adapting, because I have not seen that thing be adapted yet dammit.

I think this sort of thing is a bit different. For primarily economic reasons genre fiction adaptations are incredibly beholden to pre-existing IP. A fantasy TV series that costs 15 million dollars per episode must be based on an already extant, and extremely popular series. That kind of money simply isn't being put behind an original story (heck, at this point even CW-level money isn't). This creates considerable pressure for people to try and turn something that they manage to get funded as an adaptation into their own thing, something that Hollywood executives, who really seem to have a deeply skewed understanding on how modern fandom functions don't push back against and in many cases simply aren't capable of recognizing. I mean, how many suits at Amazon are even able to understand that The Wheel of Time is butchering the source material? They haven't read it.

[Lemmy]

You brought up Star Wars and Star Trek, both of which are absolutely drowning in this sort of thing and have been for years.

Not recently, no.

Remember the not-so-subtle "Let the past die. Kill it if you have to"?

Then, when they saw the pushback and their numbers going down, suddenly it was "we are in this together", but by then, it was way too little, way too late.

Modern SW is more than happy to throw legacy characters and lorr under the bus in order to try and reshape their franchise to their current producers' taste (especially KK)... And then gladly insult and gaslight the fans when their products fail.

The people making the decisions might know and even have worked with the source material and its original creator, but they clearly don't actually respect them or their fans... And so we get things like "The Last Jedi".

Turns out that when you hire arrogant incompetent people to do a work they know nothing about, they end up making a poor job... Shocking!

[Errorname]

Remember the not-so-subtle "Let the past die. Kill it if you have to"?

The people making the decisions might know and even have worked with the source material and its original creator, but they clearly don't actually respect them or their fans... And so we get things like "The Last Jedi".

Last Jedi is over half-a-decade old. There's been a lot of Star Wars that's come out since then.