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    Default VtR: Setting and Character Options

    My wife and I have been wanting to play tabletop again. Since I like running better than she does, I stepped up to run a Vampire: the Requiem game. After some thought, I have decided on the setting and basic backstory. However, I have 2 different ideas on when to set the game and would like some outside opinions. (Normally I would bounce ideas off my wife. However, I want this to be a surprise to the players, so obviously can't tell her.)

    The players will be told they live in Named City. (I do know what city, but the exact location isn't relevant here.) Since I don't like playing with "embraced last night," all PCs will start with Creation +XX XP. (Maybe 30, maybe 50.) I'll leave clan (and bloodline, if desired) to the players, but will have final say and veto power. (For example, the En will not be allowed.)

    Once the party has been built, I will have them summoned to meet the Prince of Named City. Here's where the twist comes in... The Prince is going to tell them he wants to expand his influence to a nearby (about 30 miles away) college town. (The college is my alma mater.) The party is tasked with traveling to the College Town and making it acceptable to "proper vampire society."

    1) I am not sure when to set the game. It makes a lot of sense to set it late 19th Century, which would be about 10-20 years after the founding of the college. At that point, College Town would be just starting to grow and its clear the college is going to succeed. With the small city, there would not have been any reason for Kindred to have been there before and no reason for it to have attracted the Prince's attention until recently. On the other hand, part of me wants to set it Modern Nights. By now, the college has grown and I am much more familiar with the campus as it is today, rather than how it was 100+ years ago. But that raises the question of why NOW is the Prince expanding? Why hasn't someone - ANYONE - taken over College Town before now?

    Thoughts? Ideas?

    2) I am split between allowing players to pick their covenant (limited to the major ones), or tell them they all have to be same covenant. (If I set it late 19th Century, Carthian will not be allowed. It would be too new at that time.) I know my wife prefers to play Ordo, but the Dragons can be tricky to new players (which 2 of my expected players are). If I do allow them to pick their covenant, one OOC is that the party has to find a reason to get along. It may be as simple as "we were told to by the Prince," but I am not cool with backstabbing.

    Thoughts?
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    Barbarian in the Playground
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    Default Re: VtR: Setting and Character Options

    A few ideas:

    #1. If you set this in the 19th century it depends on when exactly and where in the world. If for example set in America and is at the later part, almost to the turn of the 20th century, then an attraction would be something like oil being discovered. Or if in the more middle part you could have it set to where the college town is in the path of a new railroad expansion connecting major points and the growth of the town is a result of it. Modern nights can play on the same instance but for different reason. A college town might capture the attention of the prince if something was going on their that proves to be a boon. Something tech or medical wise would probably be easier to work with as the town is becoming the new MIT or John Hopkins. And the growth is attracting new major businesses from major players like Microsoft, Johnson & Johnson, etc. for a specific reason.

    #2. Either idea can work. Though I will argue that if you set this in the 19th century there is grounds to allow the Carthian but perhaps by a different name. Much change was going on in this world, though arguably more towards the middle and later part of the century, but the Carthians could be known simply by another name. If starting with the same covenant, I would suggest to allow the players opportunities to join different ones at some point. One instance I personally use for this approach is to allow a big stink of some kind where the current leadership has gone south. This allows the players to seek out new factions based on their distaste for what has occurred in their current covenant. Those that stay do so because they like what the new leadership is bringing to the table.

    A more interesting take that fits into either period you are going with might be to allow the players to start as a pariah for one reason or another. As either the town grows or gets something to attract the Prince's attention, should the players complete the task they will be granted status back into the community with other boons/rewards. In this case you could have representatives from the covenants attempting to sway the players to their side allowing for more interesting political events to unfold.

    Though some ideas at least. Your base premise is at a good start for what seems to be an interesting game.
    Last edited by GentlemanVoodoo; 2022-05-10 at 07:18 PM.

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    Default Re: VtR: Setting and Character Options

    Quote Originally Posted by Kesnit View Post
    But that raises the question of why NOW is the Prince expanding? Why hasn't someone - ANYONE - taken over College Town before now?
    Someone did. They've recently been destroyed, and the older vampires who did it have declared the town to be cleared out. But they have better things to do than the long busywork of actually taking control of the area. Now that the main threat os gone, that's work that can be delegated to younger vampires.
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    Default Re: VtR: Setting and Character Options

    To me this reads like the kind of thing neonates might have to do to join the Invictus or rise in it's ranks, so I'd recommend having them either be unaligned, Invictus, or the kind of neonate covenants might be willing to 'lend' to a Prince. I can very much see an Ordo Dracul or Lancea et Sanctum neonate being a kind of arcane expert.

    Also first or second edition? In 2e I'd recommend fewer XP, 30 Experiences is a lot (it's 15 skill dots or 10 dots of In-Clan Disciplines). 2e Experiences are worth about 5 1e Experience Points, and are meant to be earnt slightly faster (about 1 Experience a session).

    If set in the modern day the Prince/Baron/Queen/High Elder of the college town could either have recently been deposed or engaging in behaviour that the Prince does not agree with. So the players are to set the stage so she can sweep in, remove the current leadership (violently or nonviolently) and set up a puppet government. 30 miles is probably far away enough that they won't rule directly.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zelphas View Post
    So here I am, trapped in my laboratory, trying to create a Mechabeast that's powerful enough to take down the howling horde outside my door, but also won't join them once it realizes what I've done...twentieth time's the charm, right?
    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Raziere View Post
    How about a Jovian Uplift stuck in a Case morph? it makes so little sense.

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    Default Re: VtR: Setting and Character Options

    Quote Originally Posted by GentlemanVoodoo View Post
    A few ideas:

    #1. If you set this in the 19th century it depends on when exactly and where in the world.
    It in in the US. Specifically, the western part of Virginia. Around 1890 or so.

    the growth of the town is a result of it.
    The growth of the town is due to the establishment of the college. To this day, much of the town centers on the college.

    A college town might capture the attention of the prince if something was going on their that proves to be a boon. Something tech or medical wise would probably be easier to work with
    Ooo... That could work. There is a lot of engineering research going on.

    if you set this in the 19th century there is grounds to allow the Carthian but perhaps by a different name.
    Possible. The Carthian Movement was still very young around 1890, but it could work to say someone has the beliefs and philosophy, but not the official name. My only concern is that the Prince has to have reason to trust the PCs, as he is sending them on a job without supervision. I am not sure the Prince (who will likely be Invictus) would trust someone who is spouting Carthian views.

    If starting with the same covenant, I would suggest to allow the players opportunities to join different ones at some point.
    No covenant would trust someone who switched covenants without a really compelling reason.

    A more interesting take that fits into either period you are going with might be to allow the players to start as a pariah for one reason or another.
    Again, the Prince has to trust the PCs. I can't see a Prince letting those not in favor out of his sight.

    Quote Originally Posted by Yora View Post
    Someone did. They've recently been destroyed, and the older vampires who did it have declared the town to be cleared out. But they have better things to do than the long busywork of actually taking control of the area. Now that the main threat os gone, that's work that can be delegated to younger vampires.
    I thought of something like that, but haven't been able to come up with a reason why vampires who are powerful enough to wipe out the previous occupants didn't want to take over. The infrastructure would be there from the previous occupants, so it would just be a matter of stepping into their shoes.

    Quote Originally Posted by Anonymouswizard View Post
    To me this reads like the kind of thing neonates might have to do to join the Invictus or rise in it's ranks,
    Agreed. I just don't like the Invictus and don't want to run an all-Invictus game! :) I will if that is what happens, but would like to avoid that if I can.

    Also first or second edition?
    First. I don't have the 2nd Ed books.

    If set in the modern day the Prince/Baron/Queen/High Elder of the college town could either have recently been deposed or engaging in behaviour that the Prince does not agree with.
    Not sure deposed would work as, again, why would vampires powerful enough to depose a Prince not step in and take over themselves. If the Named City Prince wants to make a play, he would need to send more powerful vampires than the party will be, as they would be contesting with the group that deposed the former Prince.

    Engaging in behavior the Prince doesn't agree with has potential. That would give the party the option to side with Named City Prince or side with the current College Town leadership. (In all honesty, I half expect the party to take over and then declare themselves independent from Named City.)

    30 miles is probably far away enough that they won't rule directly.
    I anticipated the Prince to send a "Baron" to oversee College Town once the party has taken over. Said Baron would be one of Prince's lackeys, but more powerful than the party. Of course, by the time that happens, the party will have established themselves and may have the resources and infrastructure to not go along with the new Baron...
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    Default Re: VtR: Setting and Character Options

    Quote Originally Posted by Kesnit View Post
    Not sure deposed would work as, again, why would vampires powerful enough to depose a Prince not step in and take over themselves. If the Named City Prince wants to make a play, he would need to send more powerful vampires than the party will be, as they would be contesting with the group that deposed the former Prince.
    You're assuming they were deposed by powerful vampires. I can see Carthian neonates banding together and systematically exterminating the elders of a city.

    Engaging in behavior the Prince doesn't agree with has potential. That would give the party the option to side with Named City Prince or side with the current College Town leadership. (In all honesty, I half expect the party to take over and then declare themselves independent from Named City.)
    Ah, yes. Because declaring yourself Prince always works.

    More seriously, I'm not sure this is a strict loss for the Prince. It's not as good a win as putting a more loyal servant on the throne, but it's still somebody likely in their debt.

    I anticipated the Prince to send a "Baron" to oversee College Town once the party has taken over. Said Baron would be one of Prince's lackeys, but more powerful than the party. Of course, by the time that happens, the party will have established themselves and may have the resources and infrastructure to not go along with the new Baron...
    I mean, you also need to decide how obvious the Prince wants their rule to be. Requiem generally has the top dog pick their title in comparison to the more unified system in Masquerade, so said lackey could pretend to be working for themselves while taking a lower aristocratic title.

    I personally prefer the titles of Baron or Count anyway, feels more authentic for the area they tend to rule. My personal write-up for modern London has it run by a Council of Barons.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zelphas View Post
    So here I am, trapped in my laboratory, trying to create a Mechabeast that's powerful enough to take down the howling horde outside my door, but also won't join them once it realizes what I've done...twentieth time's the charm, right?
    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Raziere View Post
    How about a Jovian Uplift stuck in a Case morph? it makes so little sense.

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    Default Re: VtR: Setting and Character Options

    Quote Originally Posted by Kesnit View Post
    I thought of something like that, but haven't been able to come up with a reason why vampires who are powerful enough to wipe out the previous occupants didn't want to take over. The infrastructure would be there from the previous occupants, so it would just be a matter of stepping into their shoes.
    They do want to take over. But they have other more important things that require their personal attention, so they send some of their vassals to take care of it.

    Actually, feudalism might be a good model for this situation. The people at the top have a claim to a large territory, but they can't control all of it directly themselves. So they basically lease it out to less powerful individuals who are given permission to use the fiefs given to them for their own use, but with the obligation to serve their liege when he calls upon them.
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    Default Re: VtR: Setting and Character Options

    Quote Originally Posted by Anonymouswizard View Post
    Ah, yes. Because declaring yourself Prince always works.
    I didn't say it would work! I just said I half-expect them to declare it.

    More seriously, I'm not sure this is a strict loss for the Prince. It's not as good a win as putting a more loyal servant on the throne, but it's still somebody likely in their debt.
    Depends on how the party approaches it. If they take a "live and let live" approach towards the Prince, the Prince may be willing to let them have their little fiefdom but prepare to pull them back under his control when necessary. If they go full antagonistic towards the Prince, he will pull out the stops to... fix the situation.

    I mean, you also need to decide how obvious the Prince wants their rule to be.
    At the moment, I anticipate the Prince will expect them to hold College Town in his name. Whether that happens by them overtly turning it over to him once they have control or they take control and the Prince just treats them like they are his vassals will be determined in-game.

    Quote Originally Posted by Yora View Post
    They do want to take over. But they have other more important things that require their personal attention, so they send some of their vassals to take care of it.
    Huh... That could work.

    Actually, feudalism might be a good model for this situation. The people at the top have a claim to a large territory, but they can't control all of it directly themselves.
    That is where I was going with the Prince sending a Baron to oversee College Town once it is under control. The Baron runs the day-to-day, but reports to the Prince.
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    Default Re: VtR: Setting and Character Options

    ****creak of opening coffin****
    ****shakes torpor from head****
    ****reads thread****


    I would look at your Carthian book they talk about why cities get abandoned in their "setting up new experiments" section

    And I would agree that the best thing for a modern game is that "Something blocked expansion until now"

    Now that could be broken down into two main groups.
    "Other Vampires" and "Non-Vampires"

    lets start with the "Non Vampires":
    The most obvious would be a hostile pack of werewolves or a Circle of Mages who dislike vampires for whatever reason. In either case they had the power to drive off/kill any vampire who set up in their territory and so the nearby Prince never got to expand into the area.
    This has the advantage that Mages and Werewolves have their own business and the loss of the power centre may have otherwise nothing to do with vampires. A single VERY nasty spirit infestation may have weakened the main pack which when weakened fell to a couple local Pure tribes who couldn't care about the local vampires. Or the circle of wizards turned on each other and died/were scattered to the four winds. You could also get weirder. Cults, Major spirits, Changing Breeds families. . . any of these could also work. And they either self imploded or were killed by outside forces that are focused on that things nature not vampire nature.


    And now for "Other Vampires": Lots of reason the city was basically abandoned.

    The city's vampiries were interested in the occult and they made a mistake. Perhaps they were Ordo of the palantine rite and summoned a dark spirit to learn the nature of demons so they could compare their own beasts to it. Perhaps the circle was a little too good at blood sacrifice and woke some ancient evil. Either way...something went wrong. Perhaps a few fled in time, or perhaps not. Either way once their were no vampires the problem went away....or at least went quiet (who knows if the PC's cane awake it again)

    A traveler came in and baited the local sheriff into consuming her soul and then all the deputies changed somehow and the next couple of months saw a rash of Amaranth...and the few "survivors" have taken to the highways looking for new homes. and looking at the Night Horror's books you might find other such ideas like the Ragmen. The idea that something can attack, hunt, mess with vampires is a theme in the horror stories fledglings tell each other when away from the shadows of their elders and betters....And sometimes the monsters that feed on monsters are real.

    And sometimes the monster are one of their own. Perhaps the area was politically based around a single powerful elder (very possible in a small city) who after hitting BP 7 started hunting the other vampires (Vitae addiction and maybe Diab addiction pushing things harder) killing/driving off the other vampires before eventually starving into torpor (the Prince thinks....and well the party is "expendable" and gives you lots of rumour horror stories to have them face down. Maybe during this time, or instead of thickening blood driving the change, the elder in question looses themselves to the beast...which would give a different flavor but a similar outcome.

    The political system there broke down into conflict. Vampiric tyrannies are all too common. Perhaps there was pushback and effectively a civil war. Or perhaps some group tried to exert too much control and the other vampires fled instead of comply. Eventually the social system didn't have enough members to support itself and the controlling group had problems (lost faith when no-one showed up in the congregation? no quorum to vote? etc) and either broke up of turned on each other in a last pathetic splash of blood. There is an example of this in the Carthian book if you want a breakdown of what I mean.

    A blood vendetta spiraled out of control. Two powerful elders, or two covenants, or whatever started to fight. Open conflict. Ghouls and childer dying. They started to bring in allies. The town isn't that big but they pulled. Old favors get called, emotions run hot. Soon "staying out of it" isn't possible. If you aren't with us you are with them becomes the call each night. Vampires hate and fear this kind of thing...for good reason because once it starts it can be hard to stop....here nothing stops it. An eye for an eye, a life for a life...The death toll mounts. A few flee but most are drawn into the maelstrom of death and unleashed beasts. Eventually the victors are too damaged to hold the city. Perhaps the "victors" are a couple of ghouls who killed the last vampire after that vampire killed their master...or perhaps the last survivor was a low level member of one side who looked upon what had been made of their fair city once the last enemy had been slain and saw only ruin lost coterie mates (even lovers) and knew they couldn't stay with the memories of the lost and the war. And so cede the city to whomever would have it free of their trauma, namely the PC's

    perhaps some "other" type of vampire that could never hold the town caused the problem. A rampant contagious run of Malkavia (most fled, some stayed and died, perhaps a couple are still hiding out) could do the trick. Or perhaps the Brood swept through. A couple nomadic packs hitting the town like a blitzkrieg and weakening the Masquerade so badly that no sane vampire would stay even if they had survived (and this "patching the masquerade could be part of the party's job too). And as for blitzkrieg.....Seven. Seven came, Seven killed, none survived, Seven vanished. I mean this is the kind of thing Seven was put in the game for IMO.
    Even a single nasty traveling vampire could possibly disrupt the city if it was already under tension and suddenly the upper layers get blown away. Morris Spiegel is an example from one of the later books (I think one of the Night Horror books but not sure off the top of my head nor sure I got the name exactly right) who likes blowing up whole elysiums to get one of his targets from years ago....And The Unholy may also work for such a trick. In either case once the main leadership suddenly finds themselves brightening sunsets the lower ranks run/turn on each other, see the ghouls of the elders turn on the young, and in all have a really bad time leading to more ash piles or highway trips.

    all just a few ideas on why the town is creepily abandoned in vampire terms in the modern nights.

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