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  1. - Top - End - #1
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    DrowGirl

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    Jul 2019

    Default Dhampir as template

    Being the "vampire" race, I really wish this had been made as a template. A character gets infected with vampirism, and now they have these additional abilities. It bugs the heck out of me that if, narratively, you're playing as race X that was bit by a vampire and now you can't do any of the things you used to be able to. Some things, like elves' trance, make enough sense, but losing things like claw attacks, natural armor, etc., are super dumb.

    What would be fair/balanced if Dhampir were a template?

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    Ogre in the Playground
     
    Greywander's Avatar

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    Default Re: Dhampir as template

    Fair/balanced would be including both a bonus and a penalty. Mechanically, dhampirs don't have any downsides, but the lore does seem to reference a kind of thirst that they experience. Not always for blood, but I suppose that's the default. Not sure how I'd implement that, though. I'd prefer to avoid the disruption of having to roll saves at random intervals. And it's not like adventurers don't have a renewable supply of fresh corpses you can drain.

    You could also pull in traditional vampire weaknesses. Sunlight Sensitivity could be a good place to start. Running water might inflict some kind of condition on you, such as the poisoned condition or something. Though this is starting to blur the lines between a dhampir and a vampire-lite.

    You could also just give up on the idea of making it balanced and focus instead on just making it functional. For example, see the half-dragon template in the Monster Manual. It's a power upgrade, but asymmetrical balance isn't a problem at every table.

  3. - Top - End - #3
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    DrowGirl

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    Default Re: Dhampir as template

    Sunlight sensitivity seems pretty fair actually, and obviously thematically appropriate. I'd def put up with that - even enjoy it, honestly.

    I love the idea of them not being able to enter a home uninvited too. Could make for some great RP.

  4. - Top - End - #4
    Spamalot in the Playground
     
    Psyren's Avatar

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    Default Re: Dhampir as template

    Losing your prior abilities is fine. They kind of already are a template in the sense that you can be Medium or Small, which means there are Dhampir that descended from Halflings and the like too (see also the new Aasimar.) That's enough of an indicator that Dhampirs can be based on multiple "stocks."
    Quote Originally Posted by The Giant View Post
    But really, the important lesson here is this: Rather than making assumptions that don't fit with the text and then complaining about the text being wrong, why not just choose different assumptions that DO fit with the text?
    Plague Doctor by Crimmy
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  5. - Top - End - #5
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    Greywander's Avatar

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    Default Re: Dhampir as template

    Quote Originally Posted by Psyren View Post
    Losing your prior abilities is fine. They kind of already are a template in the sense that you can be Medium or Small, which means there are Dhampir that descended from Halflings and the like too (see also the new Aasimar.) That's enough of an indicator that Dhampirs can be based on multiple "stocks."
    Actually, your size is independent of your former race. You could start as an elf and then choose to become small when you become a dhampir, or you could start as a halfling and choose to become medium. Not sure how that works, but there it is.

    "Size. You are Medium or Small. You choose the size when you gain this lineage."

  6. - Top - End - #6
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    DrowGirl

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    Default Re: Dhampir as template

    Quote Originally Posted by Psyren View Post
    Losing your prior abilities is fine. They kind of already are a template in the sense that you can be Medium or Small, which means there are Dhampir that descended from Halflings and the like too (see also the new Aasimar.) That's enough of an indicator that Dhampirs can be based on multiple "stocks."
    It doesn't bother you in the slightest that a lightfoot halfling who becomes dhampir is no longer lucky, no longer nimble, no longer brave, and no longer naturally stealthy? And so and so on for each race. Like that just doesn't make sense to me.

  7. - Top - End - #7
    Spamalot in the Playground
     
    Psyren's Avatar

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    Default Re: Dhampir as template

    Quote Originally Posted by Skrum View Post
    It doesn't bother you in the slightest that a lightfoot halfling who becomes dhampir is no longer lucky, no longer nimble, no longer brave, and no longer naturally stealthy? And so and so on for each race. Like that just doesn't make sense to me.
    No more than when the same happens for an Aasimar, no. I view Dhampir like Elans - such a fundamental physiological and metaphysical transformation that your size is more or less all that remains.
    Quote Originally Posted by The Giant View Post
    But really, the important lesson here is this: Rather than making assumptions that don't fit with the text and then complaining about the text being wrong, why not just choose different assumptions that DO fit with the text?
    Plague Doctor by Crimmy
    Ext. Sig (Handbooks/Creations)

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    Orc in the Playground
     
    ChaosStar's Avatar

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    Default Re: Dhampir as template

    Quote Originally Posted by Psyren View Post
    No more than when the same happens for an Aasimar, no.
    That doesn't happen for Aasimars, they are born that way. Aasimars are not created after birth.

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    Spamalot in the Playground
     
    Psyren's Avatar

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    Default Re: Dhampir as template

    Quote Originally Posted by ChaosStar View Post
    That doesn't happen for Aasimars, they are born that way. Aasimars are not created after birth.
    But they can explicitly arise from any population - so you can have a Small Aasimar be born to a community consisting of nothing but halflings due to a celestial event or a trace in their bloodline, and it will instantly and completely override every single Halfling racial they would have gotten from their parents.
    Quote Originally Posted by The Giant View Post
    But really, the important lesson here is this: Rather than making assumptions that don't fit with the text and then complaining about the text being wrong, why not just choose different assumptions that DO fit with the text?
    Plague Doctor by Crimmy
    Ext. Sig (Handbooks/Creations)

  10. - Top - End - #10
    Orc in the Playground
     
    GreataxeFighterGuy

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    Default Re: Dhampir as template

    Quote Originally Posted by ChaosStar View Post
    That doesn't happen for Aasimars, they are born that way. Aasimars are not created after birth.
    But they are created from a halfling. Same with Genasi and Tieflings. It's more a template race than anything. A halfling with demonic/angelic/elemental blood is no longer nimble, or lucky. Why shouldn't it run out when a vampire bite takes over if the above overwrite it? Seems about as potent.

  11. - Top - End - #11
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    Greywander's Avatar

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    Default Re: Dhampir as template

    I really wish there were some generic rules for halfbreeds. It could be as simple as each race including the traits you'd get for being a halfbreed of that race, and then you just combine the halfbreed traits of both races to get your racial traits. Then it would be quite straightforward to do things like a dhampir, aasimar, or genasi whose other half was X, Y, or Z race.

    I suppose a simple set of rules could be employed. Something like, "Pick two traits from one and one trait from the other, and you can keep X, Y, or Z traits (e.g. darkvision) if either race has them." This is also pretty similar to my simple custom race , which could also be used to make halfbreed races.

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