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  1. - Top - End - #1
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    Chimera

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    Default Does Xykon have split personalities like vampire Durkon did?

    This is a weird question but I just recently read through the entirety of the web comic and I remember this question popping up in my head. What we saw of Durkon seems to imply that undead are just the worst aspects of a person. So are Lich Xykon and Human Xykon bantering in Xykon’s head all the time with Lich Xykon keeping his slightly less evil self trapped? Is Human Xykon just back seat gaming all the time telling Lich Xykon what he should have done in a situation? Is this why Xykon has so much trouble remembering things because Human Xykon is messing with him?
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    Jasdoif's Avatar

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    Default Re: Does Xykon have split personalities like vampire Durkon did?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jervis View Post
    What we saw of Durkon seems to imply that undead are just the worst aspects of a person.
    It's not that general.
    Quote Originally Posted by The Giant View Post
    Nothing that happens with vampires in this comic can be extrapolated to work similarly with other undead. All types of undead work differently, that's why they are different types in the first place. Xykon is still Xykon.
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  3. - Top - End - #3
    Ettin in the Playground
     
    NecromancerGuy

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    Default Re: Does Xykon have split personalities like vampire Durkon did?

    I don't think so?
    At least we've seen no indication towards it.

    I'd say no, because otherwise Xykon'd probably have gloated in some way about it.
    Then there's the "anything to avoid the big fire down below" rant regarding V's arrangement with the three gentlebeings donwstairs.
    It would feel wrong if he's just a passenger puppeteering the body.
    And unlike Durkon* he has no real reason to pretend to be his former self.

    Also, because turning into a lich is usually something you do to yourself while turning into a vampire (and most other forms of undeath) is usually inflicted on you, so them working differently just makes sense to me.

    Besides, as the big bad he's gonna die anyway and it makes no difference personality wise, so it wouldn't come up anyway.

    (I'm not sure, did he kill Master Fyron before or after undergoing a radical weightloss?
    Because that'd be another pointer towards "no" in that Xykon both counts for the whole vengeance nonsense and didn't something like telling Roy he's barking up the wrong tree. Well, right tree, wrong cat.)
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  4. - Top - End - #4
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    PaladinGuy

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    Default Re: Does Xykon have split personalities like vampire Durkon did?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kantaki View Post
    I don't think so?
    (I'm not sure, did he kill Master Fyron before or after undergoing a radical weightloss?
    Because that'd be another pointer towards "no" in that Xykon both counts for the whole vengeance nonsense and didn't something like telling Roy he's barking up the wrong tree. Well, right tree, wrong cat.)
    He killed Fyron while still human. Start of Darkness shows the battle, and also makes it pretty clear that the human Xykon acted pretty much just like the lich Xykon does.

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    NecromancerGuy

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    Default Re: Does Xykon have split personalities like vampire Durkon did?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jason View Post
    He killed Fyron while still human. Start of Darkness shows the battle, and also makes it pretty clear that the human Xykon acted pretty much just like the lich Xykon does.
    It might've been a while since I read that book.
    So yeah, even without that WoG, all signs point towards Xykon being Xykon before and after his makeover.
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  6. - Top - End - #6
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    KorvinStarmast's Avatar

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    Default Re: Does Xykon have split personalities like vampire Durkon did?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kantaki View Post

    (I'm not sure, did he kill Master Fyron before or after undergoing a radical weightloss?
    Before.
    Quote Originally Posted by Jason View Post
    human Xykon acted pretty much just like the lich Xykon does.
    But he could still taste coffee.
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  7. - Top - End - #7
    Ettin in the Playground
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    Default Re: Does Xykon have split personalities like vampire Durkon did?

    Quote Originally Posted by KorvinStarmast View Post
    But he could still taste coffee.
    Which makes all the difference.

    When Xykon was mortal he did enjoy non-evil things (subject to your personal beliefs) i.e coffee, the presence of attractive women etc.

    Now he can't enjoy any of that at the same level and so he defaults to his other hobby - murder.

    Spoiler: SOD
    Show

    While many think that Redcloak's 'definately evil' moment was killing his brother, I think it might have been planning to (and eventually doing) turn his ally into a monster for his own convenience - Xykon did consent and Redcloak was desperate at the time but Redcloak had been planning towards it for a while and Xykon didn't know what he was getting himself into.

  8. - Top - End - #8
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    Flumph

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    Default Re: Does Xykon have split personalities like vampire Durkon did?

    Whether there is a little Xykon exist in his skull or not, real Xykon died in Lirian's prison years ago. What's left is an abomination, a killing machine who pretends to be him.

  9. - Top - End - #9
    Orc in the Playground
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    Default Re: Does Xykon have split personalities like vampire Durkon did?

    Human Xykon was pretty evil and cruel, even as a child and teenager.

    (paraphrasing)

    I think Rich himself wrote somewhere that he wanted Redcloak to be a complex villain and Xykon to be a bastard through and through.

  10. - Top - End - #10
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    HalflingPirate

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    Default Re: Does Xykon have split personalities like vampire Durkon did?

    Liches in D&D bind their souls into a dead corpse through the use of a magic item called a phylactery. The soul that animated the corpse is the soul of the lich.

    Some non-core splatbooks and works of fiction allow the bound soul to inhabit corpses which are not their own, but the soul remains the soul of the former living person.

    Libra Mortis for 3.x specifically cited vampires as a bound formerly living soul trapped in its body, which is controlled by a negative energy spirit created at the time the vampire is created. This is how it allows formerly Good characters to become Evil instantly, and is justification for a DM to turn the former PC into an NPC if the DM does not wish to play a game of "Interview With A Vampire."
    Last edited by brian 333; 2022-06-16 at 09:36 PM.

  11. - Top - End - #11
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    PaladinGuy

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    Default Re: Does Xykon have split personalities like vampire Durkon did?

    Quote Originally Posted by dancrilis View Post
    Spoiler: SOD
    Show

    While many think that Redcloak's 'definately evil' moment was killing his brother, I think it might have been planning to (and eventually doing) turn his ally into a monster for his own convenience - Xykon did consent and Redcloak was desperate at the time but Redcloak had been planning towards it for a while and Xykon didn't know what he was getting himself into.
    Redcloak is Evil because he treats everyone as either resources to be used or obstacles to be destroyed in trying to fulfill The Plan.

    Spoiler: SOD
    Show
    He never saw Xykon as anything but a means to an end, so it was no problem for Redcloak to strip Xykon's remaining humanity from him by turning him into a lich if it furthered The Plan.
    In the same way he eventually saw his brother as only an obstacle to The Plan, so he killed him.


    He doesn't really care about goblin suffering. He cares only about carrying out The Plan.

  12. - Top - End - #12
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    RangerGuy

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    Default Re: Does Xykon have split personalities like vampire Durkon did?

    I see the "evil spirit takes over the body" part of vampirism in this comic as a way to explain the sudden alignment shift caused by a change in physical condition that should not, in principle, change a character's morals so abruptly. Why does getting forcibly turned into a monster make a Good character instantly Evil? It doesn't, it's technically another character on the wheel. They could have gone in different directions, for instance saying the negative energies that fuel a vampire's body are so corrupting that no soul can stand their influence for long, but they decided to go with this instead.

    Liches have no need for this same thing, narratively speaking. They're a transformation that doesn't happen without the character's consent, and it just happens to be so Evil that no character of other alignments would choose to go through it. Xykon was just as capable of evil before being a lich than he was after the transformation, becoming undead just made him crankier due to the loss of some few things that made him happy without hurting others.
    Last edited by Roland Itiative; 2022-06-22 at 08:09 AM.
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  13. - Top - End - #13
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    Fyraltari's Avatar

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    Default Re: Does Xykon have split personalities like vampire Durkon did?

    Quote Originally Posted by Roland Itiative View Post
    I see the "evil spirit takes over the body" part of vampirism in this comic
    It's actually from a D&D rulebook that the vampire is controlled by an evil spirit. All this comic innovated was a reason for the spirit to be evil.
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  14. - Top - End - #14
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    RangerGuy

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    Default Re: Does Xykon have split personalities like vampire Durkon did?

    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    It's actually from a D&D rulebook that the vampire is controlled by an evil spirit. All this comic innovated was a reason for the spirit to be evil.
    Different writers, same logic

    Actually, being from a rulebook potentially adds another reason for things to work like that: avoiding having players try to rules lawyer their way into being immune to the alignment change using magic.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stricken View Post
    I tip my hat to you, Giant. For every person who rules-nitpicks you, there are bound to be ten times as many fans who are just blown away by how excellent your storytelling is.

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