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Thread: The Killing of a Spectral Deer
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2022-06-23, 11:49 PM (ISO 8601)
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The Killing of a Spectral Deer
The spell "spectral stag" from player's guide to faerun makes a pseudo-creature, of the unseen servant, mordenkainen's hound, etc variety that has like half the stats a creature needs.
Of particular note is that it has a handful of hit points, and when they are depleted, it disappears. However, it also can be neither attacked nor damaged.
Obviously, the actual explanation for this is the lack of editing and overall laziness of the devs, but out of idle curiosity, what are all the ways the spectral stag specifically could use hit points without being attacked or damaged?
It's not a creature so can't take class levels and manifest empathic transfer or anything. If it walked into a greater consumptive aura, would it lose hp? Aoes just damage normally so those are probably out.
Is there a way to deplete a spectral stag's hp and make it disappear, or not?I've got a new fantasy TTRPG about running your own fencing school in a 3 musketeers pastiche setting. Book coming soon.
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2022-06-24, 02:04 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: The Killing of a Spectral Deer
It can be damaged normally by AoO's when bull rushing someone. It's right there in the spell description.
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2022-06-24, 02:23 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: The Killing of a Spectral Deer
No it can't.
Originally Posted by spectral stagI've got a new fantasy TTRPG about running your own fencing school in a 3 musketeers pastiche setting. Book coming soon.
Check out my NEW sci-fi TTRPG about first contact. Cool alien races, murderous AIs, and more. New expansion featuring rules for ships! New book here NOW!
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2022-06-24, 03:11 AM (ISO 8601)
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2022-06-24, 03:38 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: The Killing of a Spectral Deer
It takes damage from forced march?
I read it's HP pool the way I would for phantom steed: it's a limitation on how many hours I can have it run/hustles
P.s. it was reprinted in spell compendium
Edit: nevermind confused spectral stag and phantom stag
Edit2: it does map to phantom steed just the same, 7+CL hp is hustle damage food methinksLast edited by ciopo; 2022-06-24 at 03:45 AM.
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2022-06-24, 04:00 AM (ISO 8601)
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2022-06-24, 04:03 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: The Killing of a Spectral Deer
Mm, if you can somehow give the stag negative levels without attacking it, each negative level makes it lose 5 hp without being "damage". So if you cast retributive enervation and the stag successfully melee attacks you with its bull rush, it loses 5hp. The only other way I can think of to impose negative levels without an attack is via holding aligned or bane weapons, and I don't recall any that would apply to the stag (if it could even hold one).
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2022-06-24, 04:22 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: The Killing of a Spectral Deer
mh, fixed range 0, it's persistable!
(and isn't that's a laugh)
does anyone have a 3.0 PHB to make a comparison to 3.0 phantom steed? I feel that's the use case we're to reproduce
Also, "can't be damaged" and "can't take damage" are two discrete different things to me. To make a MTG comparison, it's the difference between effects that says "tap an untapped creature: do X" and creatures with "tap: do X", the first one can be paid with creatures summoned on that turn, in spite of hasteLast edited by ciopo; 2022-06-24 at 04:24 AM.
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2022-06-24, 04:32 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: The Killing of a Spectral Deer
Greater-negative planes should also work as a way to give the stag negative levels.
Last edited by Inevitability; 2022-06-24 at 04:33 AM.
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2022-06-24, 05:38 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: The Killing of a Spectral Deer
If you can do it for free it's actually a pretty decent summon or mount for a level 2 spell.
Too bad it's Malar-only, and at that level getting off-list spells isn't exactly easy.
I doubt the designers added hp just because of persist though. That kind of thoroughness would be... unusual, politely speaking.
"Lack of editing and laziness" sounds more plausible to me.
does anyone have a 3.0 PHB to make a comparison to 3.0 phantom steed? I feel that's the use case we're to reproduce
Also, "can't be damaged" and "can't take damage" are two discrete different things to me. To make a MTG comparison, it's the difference between effects that says "tap an untapped creature: do X" and creatures with "tap: do X", the first one can be paid with creatures summoned on that turn, in spite of haste
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2022-06-24, 12:08 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: The Killing of a Spectral Deer
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2022-06-24, 01:34 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: The Killing of a Spectral Deer
It is a creature, and it says "it cannot be attacked or damaged" but it can be targeted.
Couldn't you manifest Fusion on it and gain its tiny amount of HP, and more importantly, the immunity to being attacked and damaged? You'd cease to exist at the end of the spell, but surely there's a way around that.
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2022-06-24, 02:37 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: The Killing of a Spectral Deer
Interesting idea. Fusion can be dismissed, so just make sure to do that before the Spectral Stag spell runs out.
If you go with the "Astral Seed launders temporary effects into permanent changes" interpretation, which I don't recommend, then this is another improvement to the godlike power you get from that.Last edited by icefractal; 2022-06-24 at 02:40 PM.