Jumpers Vs. Wh40k ITP OOC 1

[Rater202]

What I'm thinking is it's more...

Okay, the villains are in a similar situation. Not sure what's going on, trying to figure things out, but... Being antagonists, they have more resources.

For example, if I bring in Thanoseid... For one, gonna lean hard into the Darkseid since in terms of Jump Mechanics he's just a reskinned Darkseid... He's there, with his planet and his armies... In a completely knew Universe.

He's mostly gonna be in the background, trying to figure out what's going on, trying to figure out how to leverage this to his advantage...

Though I am imagining a confrontation just so the PCs know that he's there.

[Lord Raziere]

Yeah, that sounds good and reasonable. doesn't need to be any immediate threat, just there when we want to do something with it.

[TeChameleon]

Random aside, Frode actually is... sort of boosted. It simply hasn't come up yet, since the only combat he's seen was in cybertronian form, but he more-or-less perpetually has a suit of hard-light armour that's roughly equivalent to Tony Stark's Hologram Armour, especially in that it is invisible until it's called on or struck. Also, baseline (Marvel) mutants are somewhat stronger and faster than baseline humans- not hugely, but it's apparently noticeable. And they're apparently canonically immune to motion sickness.

[Lord Raziere]

Thanoseid just gave me a outtake joke idea:

Darkseid walks up to a bunch of imperial priests and shows the Anti-Life Equation, they look it and nod and say "Thats nice but I that doesn't tell us anything we don't already know"
and he says "What? But Darkseid never came here before"
"Well of course. don't you know your own equations? God-Emperor Is. Your a fellow worshipper, are you not?"
Darkseid confused looks at his own Equations, sees "GOD-EMPEROR IS" as the only difference where Darkseid should be and he begins screaming.

probably not how it actually goes but its funny to think about.

[Rater202]

Thanoseid just gave me a outtake joke idea:

Darkseid walks up to a bunch of imperial priests and shows the Anti-Life Equation, they look it and nod and say "Thats nice but I that doesn't tell us anything we don't already know"
and he says "What? But Darkseid never came here before"
"Well of course. don't you know your own equations? God-Emperor Is. Your a fellow worshipper, are you not?"
Darkseid confused looks at his own Equations, sees "GOD-EMPEROR IS" as the only difference where Darkseid should be and he begins screaming.

probably not how it actually goes but its funny to think about.

The canonical anti-life equation is "loneliness + alienation + fear + despair + self-worth ÷ mockery ÷ condemnation ÷ misunderstanding ⋅ guilt ⋅ shame ⋅ failure ⋅ judgment n=y where y=hope and n=folly, love=lies, life=death, self=dark side"

...Yeah, I'm assuming there's some arcane subtext there that we in the real world can't perceive because otherwise, it's just pseudo-mathematical bull****.

Since integrating the equation and trying to reconcile it with a non-nihilistic worldview is damaging to mind and soul and basically shuts down free will—after all, what's the point of it if life has no point—, Darkseid, as the New God of Tyranny, wishes to use it to essentially make his will the only will in the universe: "Darkseid is" is short for "Darkseid is the only real person" and it's his ultimate end goal. In the process, it becomes corrupted to Self=Darkseid rather than your self simply being the dark side of your personality. Essentially his will controls the shell you become.

However, the fanfic that the Jump I used is based on has a different equation than the canonical one—a fragment shown was "life=pain."

[Lord Raziere]

yes I figured, Rater its probably going be more like a Chaos Corruption situation where the Imperium just responds to anyone going "DARKSEID IS" with a lasgun round to their head/exterminatus as usual. either way it doesn't really change anything for the Imperium or how it operates, except mistaking Thanoseid for another Chaos God and adding it to their list of heresy, probably for the better. the darkness of this setting is that such threats are to a degree normal, to the Imperium, whats one more?

But did you like the joke? thats the important question.

[Rater202]

yes I figured, Rater its probably going be more like a Chaos Corruption situation where the Imperium just responds to anyone going "DARKSEID IS" with a lasgun round to their head/exterminatus as usual. either way it doesn't really change anything for the Imperium or how it operates, except mistaking Thanoseid for another Chaos God and adding it to their list of heresy, probably for the better. the darkness of this setting is that such threats are to a degree normal, to the Imperium, whats one more?

But did you like the joke? thats the important question.

It was alright.

[TeChameleon]

Just mentioning that I'm still around, have actually been checking at least daily.

Have been mildly amusing myself by trying to come up with Amalgam Asgarkoliptians, dunno if you're doing this already, Rater, but figured it was a way to pass the time. Some of them have been fairly obvious, others somewhat less so

I've challenged myself to stick primarily with Thor's Asgardian foes (and those native to the same plane, like the Norns and Trolls and so forth), with a few exceptions.

* Thanoseid (canon)
* Lok D'saad (canon)
* Ulibak (Kalibak and Ulik the Troll)- this would be the incredibly obvious one; I'm not sure anything much would change for either character with this fusion. They even look the same!
* Absorbing Mantis (Absorbing Man and Mantis)- semi-obvious, mostly because both have absorption-related powers, albeit Crusher with matter and Mantis with energy.

* Grandmother Hela (Granny Goodness and Hela)- Granny is Darkseid's most prominent lieutenant, and Hela is Thor's most powerful female villain. There... honestly wasn't much more to it than that; frankly, Hela would probably mash up better with the Black Racer, but there aren't enough female Thor villains to fill out the Female Furies as it is.
* Lashilla (Lashina and Karnilla the Norn Queen)- again, Lashina is (typically) the leader of the Female Furies, and Karnilla is a lead-from-the-front type of monarch (sometimes), so they seemed a better match than some.
* Bernamora (Bernadeth and Amora the Enchantress)- Bernadeth is one of the scheme-ier members of the Furies, so I figured she'd be a decent mix with the more subtle Amora.
* Titanic Stomp (Titania and Stompa)- Titania is one of Thor's only 'brute' type female villains, so Stompa it is with her.
* ? (Mad Harriet and..?)- no idea who to mix with Mad Harriet; there aren't a lot of feral female villains in Marvel full stop, much less Thor villains. Maybe the Man-Beast or one of the Disir? Or, well, Feral from X-Force, I guess...

* Surtur the Devilance (Surtur and, well, Devilance)- both have the whole 'death of the gods' thing going on, and both are rather bigger than their opponents. Seemed like a decent match. I suppose Ymir could merge with Devilance while Surtur merged with Brimstone, but I like Surture better than Ymir and Brimstone was just a flunky.
* Kanto the Executioner (Skurge and Kanto)- Mostly paired these two because they have a similar job description, and Kanto, despite his dandified looks, is a surprisingly physical fighter, with a more similar fighting style to Skurge the Executioner than you'd expect.
* Valekith Vundabar (Virman Vundabar and Malekith)- schemer, meet schemer. Malekith is somewhat crazier than Vundabar, but they both have a fondness for byzantine plots, so why not *shrug*
* Serpentwolf (Steppenwolf and Cul Borson)- Steppenwolf is Darkseid's Uncle, whilst the Serpent/Cul is Odin's elder brother (and Thor's uncle), so the family connection was part of the reason for merging these two; both are strategists as well.

Figure that's probably enough for now, especially since I'm ignoring a bunch of Apokoliptians like Simyan and Mokkari, or the Deep Six, or (ugh) Sleez... Dunno, what do you guys think?

EDIT- Oh yeah- I discovered that there was a 'canon' Harley Amalgam character... mashed up with Spiral, of all characters. Was kind of surprised by that, I didn't think Harley had made it to the comics yet when the DC vs Marvel series came out.

[Rater202]

A number of amalgam characters were a bit... Redundant.

For example, Batman was composited with Wolverine to create Darkclaw, but there was also a Bruce Wayne, Director of SHIELD.

Likewise, Storm was composited with Wonderwoman, but there was also a Princess Diana of Thymscria who traveled Man's World with Trevor Castle(Steve Trevor amalgamated with Frank Castle) murdering criminals.

[TeChameleon]

Yeh, I know a little bit about Amalgam comics; I was just surprised that Harley had an Amalgamation when she didn't make it into comics until two years after the last set of Amalgam comics were published.

[TeChameleon]

Apologies for the double post, but don't know how else to make it so the thread shows as being updated; Raziere, almost literally no time passed with Frode's teleporting out- he was outside the stream of time while he was gone, so he basically just flickered for a moment before being interrupted.

Also, he has his Watchmaker perk running (for himself only), would Tzeentch be able to punch through that?

[Lord Raziere]

Okay sorry, edited, just know your focusing on a LOT of questions here, with a lot of information as answers, and I don't want this to devolve into endless exposition again. there is an entire galaxy out there to do stuff in, which I can just SHOW which is far more interesting then TELLING you all this. and I'm trying to get other things in motion and its a bit overwhelming to answer tons of questions while doing so.

[TeChameleon]

Sorry, Raziere. I'm trying to set something up and wanted to make sure I had all my groundwork laid, since what I want to do is a bit weird.

I am, however, done with setup, so once Lok D'saad is dealt with, we can move on.

[Rater202]

Not Lok D'Sad. Thanoseid came in person.

[TeChameleon]

Oh joy. To be clear, Frode doesn't expect anything he's done up until this point to do anything except maybe mildly inconvenience or distract Thanoseid- even the high-speed grenade to the back of the head was in hope of distracting him so that he wouldn't notice the stasis field in time to resist it.

[Rater202]

...So this actually wasn't supposed to be a fight. This was just supposed to be an introduction so all the PCs knew he was there.

[TeChameleon]

*shrug*

My actual plan (assuming Cegorach agrees to it) is for Frode to go TARDIS, grow giant, engulf the Black Library world, and teleport the entire planet out from under Thanoseid (TARDIS-es can choose which passengers they want to bring with them, you see it in Blink, for example). So not much of a fight- Frode is nowhere near prepared for that level of combat, as far as he's concerned.

[Lord Raziere]

Cegorach's cool with that as long as the Black library is still somewhere hidden, the Black Library is supposed to be something secret and safe, not something that can just be found and visited casually, and we just....have really powerful people who can just bypass the usual defenses/methods to keep it that way.

and yeah.....welcome to PCs misinterpreting things, Rater. that happens. things like this are why I'm hesitant to just introduce any of my villains directly, because PCs as a rule tend to have a "eliminate threat immediately" response to them, probably based on moviegoer "just kill him now" logic, which you can't really do anything about unless everyone agrees to not attack.

its also probably why evil viziers are so popular for DMs in DnD, because they can introduce villains without the PCs without immediately killing them so they can have some form of story arc villain.

[Rater202]

Okay well, still need to figure out where to go from here...

Also, Frode trying to interact with Fathergauntlet is probably a bad idea.

[TeChameleon]

A-heh... yeah, typically when Darkseid shows up, you're in for a bad time.

... unless he's sitting in your most comfortable chair. Then he's there to give exposition. No idea where that all started, but there's a borderline shocking number of examples of Darkseid just showing up in peoples' living rooms and claiming their most comfortable chair/the sofa.

EDIT- And Frode poking at the Father Gauntlet was a calculated risk; technology in all its forms tends to fall quite firmly under his control. It's just when said technology is a fully sentient reality warper that things get a little hinkier.

[Lord Raziere]

To explain a bit whats going with Ensara here:
In Exalted 3e terms, she has both Willpower 10 and Integrity 5 stats, the highest one can get those stats in Exalted 3e, and 30 years being a Jumper would be more than enough time to get those stats. Furthermore she has Infernal Integrity charms and while there are no 3e examples of those yet, such charms would be on the same level as Solar Integrity charms such as Invincible Solar Aegis which would protect from all sorts of psychic assaults, fiat level alterations to destiny or other things as long as she upholds a Defining Principle against what is being thrown at her. The Defining Principle she would have is "Freedom is the right of all beings" and the Anti-Life Equation would be considered a psychic assault or social influence no matter how "true" it claims to be. The powers of the Exalted do not care if something is true or not, they only care if its something that is trying to convince the Exalted to go against themselves, which with high Integrity the answer is "No". (In Exalted's setting this can also be a bad thing because if an Exalted king hears things they don't like they can easily dismiss the facts being told at them.)

The bits about possibilities and her Seven-Winged form are mostly for show, but reference the Yozi Oramus, the Dragon Beyond The World which is a primordial being that once did things like determine what stuff is real or not but now is imprisoned in his own wings due to a long ago war and shapeshifts into various things often in his prison. this combined with Ensara's stunting is my justification for how the laws of reality are bit fudged here to do things like point at the Equation itself and attempting to intimidate it.

[Rater202]

Only Frode was exposed to the equation.

Edit: Also, if it was as easy as just rationalizing the Equation away it wouldn't be a threat in the first place.

[TeChameleon]

Yup, that's why I specified that it was the Mental Fortress perk that... basically de-fanged the partial equation, and that most of what Frode was thinking was bravado.

EDIT- Is anyone going to react to Frode teleporting the entire planet out and blowing up an entire chunk of webway..?

[Rater202]

The post was mosly directed at Raz.

[Lord Raziere]

Only Frode was exposed to the equation.

Edit: Also, if it was as easy as just rationalizing the Equation away it wouldn't be a threat in the first place.

I wouldn't say she is rationalizing it, she is just outright rejecting the concept through sheer willpower and belief, backed by Exalted divine power

Yup, that's why I specified that it was the Mental Fortress perk that... basically de-fanged the partial equation, and that most of what Frode was thinking was bravado.

EDIT- Is anyone going to react to Frode teleporting the entire planet out and blowing up an entire chunk of webway..?

Oh sorry, that happened? I skimmed over your post, I thought we were still buying time for that and made my post assuming it had yet to happen.

Edit: Hm, my post doesn't make sense if that was your post before it....sigh I liked that moment to....hm....

[Rater202]

Fair enough but... Like, laughing it off because you already believe something else about life? Doesn't work that way.

Even if it did... Nobody but Frode got hit with it so your post doesn't make sense in context.

[Lord Raziere]

Ugh, this is why I HATE the Anti-Life Equation as a concept, its such a binary I-win button. I can't even imagine Ensara submitting to it, just...not sure if I could handle that. Next AT or two I get, I'm finding whatever infinite willpower/mental defense perk I can get and purchasing it, I don't care what I have to do.

But fine, if you insist only he got hit, I'll take it. still not sure how I'm going to edit my post now that my cool moments not viable.

[Rater202]

Ugh, this is why I HATE the Anti-Life Equation as a concept, its such a binary I-win button. I can't even imagine Ensara submitting to it, just...not sure if I could handle that. Next AT or two I get, I'm finding whatever infinite willpower/mental defense perk I can get and purchasing it, I don't care what I have to do.

Ensara would have been fine. Cegorath was the Problem.

But fine, if you insist only he got hit, I'll take it. still not sure how I'm going to edit my post now that my cool moments not viable.

Sorry.

To be fair, I did explcitly clarify that Frode was the only one who got hit nine hours ago give or take.

[Lord Raziere]

okay, if I edit to explain that Cegorach is less of life form and more an idea himself would that suffice as a defense? Like the Equation is real weird, because its a lot like Chaos Corruption but a surprisingly a lot of stuff in Wh40k has resistance to Chaos Corruption. Humans are honestly just abnormally vulnerable to Chaos Corruption.

like Tyranids are just straight up immune to Chaos Corruption, and their minds are so alien I doubt they understand the concept of a society much less the concept of tyranny, they're this weird combination of being an animal operating food/energy management logic and a supercomputer that can coordinate on a massive scale that no one can match. I have no idea what the Anti-Life Equation would even do to them.

most species and people would probably be vulnerable to the Equation, but I'm not sure about the more godlike beings of the setting.

[Rater202]

If anything that would make him more vulnerable since the equation is basically just an idea that gets jammed in you and refuses to leave unless someone with the right powers and inclination extracts it.

But it's irrelevant since he wasn't exposed.