OOTS #1264 - The Discussion Thread

[Fyraltari]

Gonna throw out here the description of a Septon (7th rank; 49 in existence)

Hey I know these guys! They prey to the New Gods. I hear they've had issues with sparrows, as of late.

Legend Lore at will, which is what I suspect Redcloak is after.

According to some of the rules I've seen, Quintons can cast Legend Lore at will. If so, this could be very useful in tracking down the Gate.

What does that do?

Does it? We already know the gods basically feed on soul power, and the reason for existence is for people to grow so they have more soul power. Seems to fit perfectly well with what we already know and doesn't really have any implications that didn't exist before.

I feel there's a difference between someone having a more powerful soul than someone else and someone having more soul than someone else, if that makes sense. Also, Roy and Durkon lost a level when they died and where resurrected. does that mean there are bits of their soul still hanging out in the afterlife separated from the rest? wait? Is that where Roy's archon comes from!?

Yep.

What the ****, WotC?

[Ivrytwr]

Read the fine print Redcloak. The fine print!!
Thanks for the okie dokie strip Giant.

[dancrilis]

I feel there's a difference between someone having a more powerful soul than someone else and someone having more soul than someone else, if that makes sense.

You could look at it like having a more concentrated soul power then someone else - Redcloak can give up a bit of that power and grow it back, it isn't flouting off somewhere plotting its revenge.

What the ****, WotC?

I am not sure if it is just me but I am completely missing what your issue is with this, the full name would be 'The Clockwork Nirvana of Mechanus' if that helps.

[Crusher]

Ah, I was wrong about Modron vision. In 5e all Modrons have True Seeing but in 3.5e they just have darkvision. My bad.

Edit - Oh, wait. Modrons are immune to mind-influencing spells and effects just like undead which I believe includes things like Illusions but probably not magical darkness. So I might be wrong again.

[Faldrath]

Given how long the singing will take, I suppose we'll go back to the OotS next strip.

How much trouble is the MitD going to be, I wonder...

[Fyraltari]

You could look at it like having a more concentrated soul power then someone else - Redcloak can give up a bit of that power and grow it back, it isn't flouting off somewhere plotting its revenge.

I suppose that makes sense, even if it's not as interesting.

I am not sure if it is just me but I am completely missing what your issue is with this, the full name would be 'The Clockwork Nirvana of Mechanus' if that helps.

We're not allowed to discuss religion here, but from my (admittedly limited) understanding of Mechanus, that names fits about as well as a round peg in a square hole.

[RMS Oceanic]

The callback to MitD's confusion about gates was comfy.

[Edward15]

Uh, oh. There's a chance that Lawful entity might reveal Serini's entire shell game to Redcloak and Xykon.

[Crusher]

You could look at it like having a more concentrated soul power then someone else - Redcloak can give up a bit of that power and grow it back, it isn't flouting off somewhere plotting its revenge.

The world would be a richer place with 1% of Redcloak's soul scheming in a corner somewhere.

[Peelee]

What does that do?

One of my favorite spells, actually.

Legend lore brings to your mind legends about an important person, place, or thing. If the person or thing is at hand, or if you are in the place in question, the casting time is only 1d4×10 minutes. If you have only detailed information on the person, place, or thing, the casting time is 1d10 days, and the resulting lore is less complete and specific (though it often provides enough information to help you find the person, place, or thing, thus allowing a better legend lore result next time). If you know only rumors, the casting time is 2d6 weeks, and the resulting lore is vague and incomplete (though it often directs you to more detailed information, thus allowing a better legend lore result next time).

During the casting, you cannot engage in other than routine activities: eating, sleeping, and so forth. When completed, the divination brings legends (if any) about the person, place, or things to your mind. These may be legends that are still current, legends that have been forgotten, or even information that has never been generally known. If the person, place, or thing is not of legendary importance, you gain no information. As a rule of thumb, characters who are 11th level and higher are “legendary,” as are the sorts of creatures they contend with, the major magic items they wield, and the places where they perform their key deeds.

What the ****, WotC?

And I think we should leave it at that.

[LadyEowyn]

Oh, neat! I like lawful/chaotic summoning as a change from the more iconic angels and fiends. Hilgya’s anarchic giraffes were great, it’ll be cool to see what these guys do. And I always enjoy Redcloak being Lawful.

[Corian]

Erased because saw the mod.

[Fyraltari]

The world would be a richer place with 1% of Redcloak's soul scheming in a corner somewhere.

Unfortunately for everyone, it turns out to be the part of Redcloak that recognizes he was wrong.

[Particle_Man]

I think back in 1st ed it was just Nirvana. When Modrons were introduced back then they were not yet clockworky (more like . . . dice?). Anyhow, later they got clockworky, and *then* the plane got the mechanus name added to it.

I am wondering if part of the use of this gate spell will just be absolutely flooding all the caves simultaneously with a near endless supply of monodrones. But the "Teleport at will" and "Clairaudience" and "Clairvoyance" of the big guy might tip the Modron (and thus Redcloak) to the teleport traps involved (maybe even harking back to Xykon's "which one of these undead are the real Xykon? Oh yeah, none of them" trick from the Sapphire Guard's city war).

I wonder if the two lawyers will make an appearance?

[drazen]

Doesn't the teleport line have some kind of illusion/invisibility component?

Now that I think about it, I suppose it couldn't, could it? Aren't liches immune to illusions?

It is scrying on the destination. It's probably not an 'illusion;' it might be more like Xykon's TeeVo crystal ball. He sees the picture displayed right at the walkover line.

I am not a D&D expert but V said it had a scrying/divination component, not an illusion component. Also if Xykon can see through illusions what was the need for Redcloak to cast True Seeing, exactly? I thought it was "mind affecting" spells that don't work on X.

[Fyraltari]

It is scrying on the destination. It's probably not an 'illusion;' it might be more like Xykon's TeeVo crystal ball. He sees the picture displayed right at the walkover line.

I am not a D&D expert but V said it had a scrying/divination component, not an illusion component. Also if Xykon can see through illusions what was the need for Redcloak to cast True Seeing, exactly? I thought it was "mind affecting" spells that don't work on X.

Well, at the very least we know True seeing can see the Invisble and Xykon cannot.

[Psyren]

Does D&D really call it that?

Pathfinder too, but not the LN plane (which was renamed to Axis.)

I am wondering if part of the use of this gate spell will just be absolutely flooding all the caves simultaneously with a near endless supply of monodrones. But the "Teleport at will" and "Clairaudience" and "Clairvoyance" of the big guy might tip the Modron (and thus Redcloak) to the teleport traps involved (maybe even harking back to Xykon's "which one of these undead are the real Xykon? Oh yeah, none of them" trick from the Sapphire Guard's city war).

I'm not sure what good they'll do. I'd have thought he'd gate in a swarm of things that can detect evil, as that would be the fastest way to "re-rule out" doors Xykon has been down..

[bunsen_h]

It looks like it has five arms to me. Which as far as I can tell doesn't match the description of any modron, unless it's a Quinton and the fifth arm is actually its tail.

There's an old riddle, often attributed to Abraham Lincoln though actually in circulation decades before he used it. "How many legs does a [donkey/bull/dog/sheep/etc.] have if you call its tail a leg?" Answer: four, since calling its tail a leg doesn't make it so.

Am I the only one getting Minions vibes from the one-eyed Modrons?

I did too.

lowkey thinking the word "Gate" might be some kind of mental conditioning / trigger word to make Mitd's mind retroactively erase recent memories and not form new memories for a time.

You're reminding me of some of the "safeguards" built into Florence, in the webcomic Freefall.

[Fyraltari]

There's an old riddle, often attributed to Abraham Lincoln though actually in circulation decades before he used it. "How many legs does a [donkey/bull/dog/sheep/etc.] have if you call its tail a leg?" Answer: four, since calling its tail a leg doesn't make it so.

Spoiler: How do you call a legless dog?

Show

You don't. You go get him.

[Wintermoot]

Supposition:

The Gated in Quinton has the ability to bring in their entire coterie of lesser modrons, so I expect Redcloak's intention is to have them map out the entire complex using logical cartography skills.

However, I expect the Modrons will reveal the dimensional trap that no one on Team Evil has the ability to perceive instead, or as part and parcel of the mapping.

[Ruck]

Considering Sunny, I am fairly sure that the Giant has at least some agreement in place with WotC to use some of their content.

Why? The strip pointedly goes out of its way not to use the term "beholder."

A baseball game has 9 innings, so putting your best guy in during the 7th means they will have go longer than if you put them in right at the end. Which is OK if they've got the stamina for it.

And they usually don't - most top relievers rarely pitch more than one inning.

The real point here is that the situation is dire enough now to bring in the big guns, rather than waiting until they can be used to secure victory.

Also, thanks, Better Call Saul, I can never see or hear that word without thinking of that scene now.

What word?

Also, there are too many football players named Quinton for me to not think about how funny it would be if Redcloak summoned one of them to help with the search. "Tackling is really more my skill..."

[Peelee]

What word?

I see you haven't seen the penultimate episode yet.

[Resileaf]

Why? The strip pointedly goes out of its way not to use the term "beholder."

It's still visibly one though.

[Jasdoif]

I am not sure if it is just me but I am completely missing what your issue is with this, the full name would be 'The Clockwork Nirvana of Mechanus' if that helps.

...but from my (admittedly limited) understanding of Mechanus, that names fits about as well as a round peg in a square hole.

The entire plane is an infinite realm of tremendously overscaled clockwork gears, like some sort of giant mechanism; so I could see where "Mechancus" might have come from....And I suppose it's possible it smells like teen spirit in some places?

[Ruck]

I see you haven't seen the penultimate episode yet.

I have, but I still don't know what word you're referencing.

It's still visibly one though.

And so was the mind flayer, and yet.

[Fyraltari]

It's still visibly one though.

Isn't Sunny missing an eye for a beholder?

[Coppercloud]

Isn't Sunny missing an eye for a beholder?

I think he is missing two. Beholders have ten eyestalks, Sunny has eight.

[Resileaf]

And so was the mind flayer, and yet.

Yeah, for a throwaway gag back when the comic was just random stuff the Giant posted as a parody of D&D campaigns. Sunny's a major character in the story though.

[Duncun]

I love Red Cloak's subtle jab at Xykon in the last panel.

[bunsen_h]

Spoiler: How do you call a legless dog?

Show

You don't. You go get him.

"I can call puppies from the vasty deep." "Why, so can I, or so can any man; But will they come when you do call for them?"

Yeah, for a throwaway gag back when the comic was just random stuff the Giant posted as a parody of D&D campaigns. Sunny's a major character in the story though.

There's a "fair use" element in play. Marvel didn't kick up a fuss over Dave Sim's introduction of the "Wolverroach" parody character in Cerebus until the character's third appearance. They were willing to pass off the first two as satire, but after that, they felt that the character was infringing on their trademarks.