Villainous Competition XLVIX: Controller!

[ciopo]

Thank you, H_H_F_F

[loky1109]

H_H_F_F, friend, how does it go?

[H_H_F_F]

Back on it as we speak. I have been (and will likely continue to be) extremely busy. Basically almost every waking moment I'm not working, and many that I should have been working in but decided not to, is going towards volunteering in... Stuff we can't discuss here, unfortunately. Look it up, I guess?

I was already in it when I started working on judgements, but I've since been asked to take on a lot of responsibilities that I felt I cannot refuse at this time. I'm sorry for disappearing on you guys.

Anyway, I've been trying to also find time for this, and myself and my hobbies in general. Sometimes, it's hard to reconcile your duty to your ideals with the need to also be a person, and doing things you like for your own sake.

I fully intend to be done with judgement before April. I do apologize for vanishing for so long (again).

[loky1109]

I fully intend to be done with judgement before April. I do apologize for vanishing for so long (again).

RL goes first. I sure you're doing important and necessary things.

[H_H_F_F]

While we're waiting on my judgements, I'd like to discuss some general issues with judgement. I'd really appreciate feedback and participation from anyone reading the thread.

We (as in, the forum generally and VC specifically) have had some issues with getting judges. I've been trying to think of ways to address it. Here's what I've got so far:

1. People's Choice Award:
   replacing the HM. Instead of someone just giving HM if they'd like to, we have the people's choice award. You pick your favorite entry, and give a few words to explain what you've found compelling about it – given in terms of stuff you found particularly original, elegant, or memorable about it, or simply how powerfully optimized it was. In other words – we get people used to thinking like judges. Also, while all spectators are still welcomed (and encouraged!) to participate in the people's choice awards, I'd like to make it mandatory for entrants. This is to try and encourage us to see participation in the competition as broader than building something cool and hitting "send". We're all in this together.
2. Judge's Handbook:
   I've seen a lot of people saying they would judge, but feel unqualified to do so. In order to ease entry into judging, we could create a formalized semi-standardized judgement metric called Judge's Handbook. We have a few judges with pretty stiff metrics for judgements, that are easily replicable – I'm thinking something like that. Judging according to it would not be compulsory, but it would be a useful entry point for new judges who don't feel experienced or qualified enough to judge right now. I'd like to compound that with action 2b: officially offering new judges an open invitation to consult with the chair about judgement. It's something I'm hesitant about, with the concerns for me/future chairs showing partiality because I know who the contestants are, but I feel like it would also help making judging more accessible.
3. Constrict disputes:
   I'm thinking the dispute process could be one of the reasons people are averse to judging. Constricting disputes only to rules disagreements, judging guidelines issues and partial judgement (2 entries receiving different scores for the same strength/weakness) could help.
4. Special benefits for judges:
   I think giving judges some special benefits might be beneficial, as long as we don't overdo it and make others feel unappreciated. Here are my current ideas: At the end of most rounds, I let the community vote on the next round. I was thinking we could let judges only vote on that. Also, I think I'd like to make every X4th X9th round a guest-chair round, like this one. We could make it that only a person that has judged recently would qualify to be a guest chair.

What are your thoughts? Do you think any of these steps could help get more judges, or otherwise improve the experience? Any other ideas?

I'm especially interested in the opinions of "rarely judge" or "never judged" people here. Would anything I could do as chair make judging a less daunting and more fun task for you?

[Inevitability]

While we're waiting on my judgements, I'd like to discuss some general issues with judgement. I'd really appreciate feedback and participation from anyone reading the thread.

We (as in, the forum generally and VC specifically) have had some issues with getting judges. I've been trying to think of ways to address it. Here's what I've got so far:

1. People's Choice Award:
   replacing the HM. Instead of someone just giving HM if they'd like to, we have the people's choice award. You pick your favorite entry, and give a few words to explain what you've found compelling about it – given in terms of stuff you found particularly original, elegant, or memorable about it, or simply how powerfully optimized it was. In other words – we get people used to thinking like judges. Also, while all spectators are still welcomed (and encouraged!) to participate in the people's choice awards, I'd like to make it mandatory for entrants. This is to try and encourage us to see participation in the competition as broader than building something cool and hitting "send". We're all in this together.
2. Judge's Handbook:
   I've seen a lot of people saying they would judge, but feel unqualified to do so. In order to ease entry into judging, we could create a formalized semi-standardized judgement metric called Judge's Handbook. We have a few judges with pretty stiff metrics for judgements, that are easily replicable – I'm thinking something like that. Judging according to it would not be compulsory, but it would be a useful entry point for new judges who don't feel experienced or qualified enough to judge right now. I'd like to compound that with action 2b: officially offering new judges an open invitation to consult with the chair about judgement. It's something I'm hesitant about, with the concerns for me/future chairs showing partiality because I know who the contestants are, but I feel like it would also help making judging more accessible.
3. Constrict disputes:
   I'm thinking the dispute process could be one of the reasons people are averse to judging. Constricting disputes only to rules disagreements, judging guidelines issues and partial judgement (2 entries receiving different scores for the same strength/weakness) could help.
4. Special benefits for judges:
   I think giving judges some special benefits might be beneficial, as long as we don't overdo it and make others feel unappreciated. Here are my current ideas: At the end of most rounds, I let the community vote on the next round. I was thinking we could let judges only vote on that. Also, I think I'd like to make every X4th X9th round a guest-chair round, like this one. We could make it that only a person that has judged recently would qualify to be a guest chair.

What are your thoughts? Do you think any of these steps could help get more judges, or otherwise improve the experience? Any other ideas?

I'm especially interested in the opinions of "rarely judge" or "never judged" people here. Would anything I could do as chair make judging a less daunting and more fun task for you?

1. Agreed with the people's choice award, though I think it should either be anonymous (I could see some funny guys doing it in-character of their entry) or after the actual judgings.

2. I'm interested in a judging handbook, and I think my own metric is pretty rigid: I could write it up and give my own perspective on how to approach judging.

3. Disinclined; I think the current dispute process is fine.

4. In favor, and while choosing the next SI/theme is an obvious perk, I am interested in alternative rewards though I cannot think of any currently.

[Goldlizard]

I'd be down to judge if there were a handbook or some kind of guide, and like the poster above, points 1 and 4 both sound like good ideas

[loky1109]

1. People's Choice Award

It's a good idea, but I don't think it could be a replacement for regular judgment.

2. Judge's Handbook

Handbook could be useful, but I don't even know how it should look.

3. Constrict disputes

For me as contestant disputes are already excessively constrict. Sometimes I use my single dispute in order to understand what the judge did mean. For me as a judge - I'm ready to answer as many times as it will be needed.

4. Special benefits for judges

For me - doesn't matter, when I can - I judge.

[H_H_F_F]

I've been sick, wounded, and (falsely) arrested (not all at the same time, thankfully) but am on the case. Also had some fun on vacation for the first time in ages, which was very good but still left me little time to work. My apologies for the repeated, repeated, repeated delays with this round. Whoof!

As for next round (50!) It's going to be very, very extraordinary. Round L - for the way you look at me.

[H_H_F_F]

Judgement coming tomorrow.

[ciopo]

Much rejoicying!

[loky1109]

I've been sick, wounded, and (falsely) arrested (not all at the same time, thankfully) but am on the case.

I'm glad all this had a good conclusion! Vacation also sounds cool!

[H_H_F_F]

Judgement has arrived.

Spoiler: Steel

Show

Originality:

Gods almighty, that is some strong fluff. Great job on that front. It works well with the theme, and harmonizes with the build's crunch.

Mechanically, there's a lot of good stuff here. Sure, a lot of the levels are just "Good_Dips^TM", and Fiend of Possession is hardly a surprise – but the gist of the build is all about utilizing a creative monster pick, and you have a few very neat tricks in there: Sun School is the main one, but Tattooed Monk is also certainly… a choice.

Also, Sword and Board! Yay! It's not relevant to what you do, obviously, but it'll always get a smile from me.

Overall, this was a very creative approach.

Score: 4.5 points.


Power:

Main trick is STRONG, especially early on. Good defensive capabilities are there, as well as escape – though I do worry about a dimensional anchor locking you down.

As far as bellflower goes: It's not really reliable enough to really justify the tattooed monk pick, IMO, and it's an enhancement bonus, but it's still nice – and you have the numbers and action economy to back it up.

I do wish you'd have invested more in disguise and bluff, especially early on. Managing to max them within a few CR points of your starting point would've been great, especially since early on is when they're at their most relevant.

Outside of your main trick, you don't have much to offer. What're you gonna do, hit them with a sword? I wish you'd have at least gotten yourself something to do in case domination is out. Another grapple schtick, perhaps, or just plain-old PA? Obviously, you don't want to pour too much effort on stuff outside the theme, I get that. But I feel like having nothing to do if one ability is out is a bit much, even if you can theoretically counter it by swallowing someone that can cast AMF – which, first of all come on, and second I'm not entirely sure works. We're going to avoid that irrelevant tangent though. You do propose some other means to deal with the issue.

Other than that, I feel like you generally don't keep up. Your DCs are dropping in comparison to the PC's saves, and what you have to offer is… Bellflower? Immunities are popping up, saves are rising, and you have no backup.

Overall, Steel is a terrifying one-trick-pony in early levels – but doesn't fully keep up, and said trick has 2 points of failure (grapple, mind-affecting) which are notoriously hard to overcome.

Score: 3.25 points.


Elegance:

Sun School and mark of Avernus take the center stage for me here. You've noticed a rules-hole that allows you to disgorge an enemy much more efficiently, and you managed to follow it up. You didn't just note "you don't have to spend the action, you can teleport!" Instead, you've found ways to make it much more efficient.

As unimpressed as I am with the actual utility of tattooed monk, trying to get more umph for your ability through a now-accessible move action is commendable.

I'm sympathetic to the argument that RAW you wouldn't take a swallowed enemy with you, and that there's no clear RAI on the subject – mostly seems like oversight. I also do not think there's a strong case that the opponent wouldn't make saving throws: the ability isn't called "disgorge", but "spewed", which means "disgorged" is used in the sense of natural language and not rules language; I'm not a native English speaker, but I think there's certainly a natural language case to be made that an enemy was "disgorged" from your stomach when you disappeared and it dropped to the floor. So, it's good that you didn't assume the cheesy reading, as I don't think it's supported enough.

So far, so good – but there's bas stuff, too.

You've miscalculated your CR, my friend. Unless I'm mistaken, 8 Outsider HD + your size category increase is a total of a 5 CR increase, according to the rules. A 14 HD gulthir is CR 11. That's a very hefty penalty from me.

Additionally, the strong cohesion of your core tactic is contrasted by what feels sometimes like a grab-bag of classes. It's not terrible by any means – you utilize your type, your high Cha, and you do try to push the main idea further at 20 with blink shirt – but Steel doesn't feel like he truly has a cohesive and holistic identity, where every aspect of the build is truly necessary.

Overall, this build has a lot of mechanical cleverness and beauty on display, but suffers from a lack of identity during the later CR points, and from a major issue in CR calculation.

Score: 3 points.


Memorable Villainy:

Steel definitely has some strengths in this category, first among which is working well with the theme. He's definitely focused first and foremost on controlling others, even if he mainly just has one way to do so. He can do it powerfully, and often. He's also very slippery, which helps keep the theme of "not interested in fighting you".

Lack of access to a (well, non-[mind-affecting] and) non-grapple option is a downside here. I'm not going to take the approach that "it's useless late levels". But still, it would've been much better if you had invested in more means of control. Diversity is always a +, and that's especially true when your main approach is so negatable.

Other strengths: Steel as an anti-demon crusader first and foremost gives a lot of nuance and interest to his evil, offering a lot of morally questionable roleplay opportunities. A villain like this is certainly more memorable than "that **** that gets away every time because DM decided they're a recurring villain."

However, he certainly has some weaknesses. Not showing up before CR 10 (11, technically) is not too bad, but not great either. That is compounded by the issue that Steel is pretty much all there once he gets his first monk level. That's when his tactics almost fully turn on, and his DC is at its peak compared to the party's saves. Anything happening at the next 9 CR points is just mechanical tweaking, trying to keep up with the party. It's fine to not keep up with them (well, in this category) but you still need to change. They've been fighting him for half the campaign, a white mask is pretty irrelevant at that point. His saves become significantly better, he's somewhat better at troubling mages. He doesn't grow, he doesn't change, he doesn't use any tactics or pose any threats he didn't pose when the party was early level. The closest thing to a meaningful tactical change is Blink Shirt. He really has to solely rely on mooks and equipment to play as a truly different encounter – otherwise, he's mainly just on repeat. You really want your party to say "oh ****, that's new" whenever they encounter your bad guy, and that doesn't really happen here.

Overall, both commitment to the theme and general memorability could've been improved, but they're both pretty strong nonetheless, and you make a STRONG first impression.

Score: 4.25 points.


Total Score: 15 points. Steel is an excellent villain, hindered more than anything by mechanical stagnation.

Spoiler: Angus McQuestGyver

Show

Originality:

I have a soft spot for doppelgangers. In fact, my only entry into this competition was a doppelganger utilizing deep cover. Still, it's hardly a surprise given this theme, and I did assume we might see some coming. The chameleon pick is cute and makes good use of that racial choice, but chameleons always make me yawn. Zhentarim spy is cute.

However, I don't see anything really all that unique or interesting in your tactics (auto-extending, sudden still and sudden silence are cute, though) and the way you actually approach the round's theme and limitations is mostly being able to cast enchantment spells, which isn't very original to me.

Overall, despite making a very fun entry, this is a weak category for you.

Score: 2.5 points.


Power:

I should note that I'm ignoring items and inherent bonuses here. "We're the DM" is true for everyone, and how much wealth the villain have / the way it's allocated is up to the specific DM. Also, it's easier not to muck about with equipment and treasure, and simply assume "equal and helpful for everyone". Recommending specific equipment is one thing; assuming it (and not even differentiating between crucial and barely-necessary) is another.

You make for a very good social encounter, and that does factor here. You also have the means of being a new and interesting social encounter at different points in time. Otherwise, however, I think you know you're unimpressive for a lot of your career. You can't really do much, as far as an encounter goes. The middle of the CR range is far better, but the end is not as great for you again.

I find the choice not to take epic skill focus: disguise slightly odd, given your emphasis on it. Same for picking motivate dex and not cha. Both come very late in the build, so it's not as crucial as it could've been, but still.

Overall, you make for a challenging social encounter and have a lot of flexibility and some spellpower by the later levels, but otherwise you're somewhat meh. I think you know this; this is the price we pay for such a concept-heavy build.

Score: 2.75 points.


Elegance:

You're "fiating" quite a lot here. I feel the need to remind you that rules decisions are up to the DM in an actual game, but here, they're up to… well, the judge. Me. You could make the case that multiple castings of heroics stack, but given that this comes down to "nothing says I can't" as your best argument for extreme, boring, nearly unnecessary cheese… I think you'd rather just not make that case.

Cross setting material is something I'm not a fan of, generally speaking.

"I have such and such effect on while leveling" is normally pretty sketchy to me, but I'd definitely say just having your floating feat set to skill focus isn't a stretch. That being said – this is brilliant. I don't think I've seen it done before, and it's very clever. Unlike qualifying for something with a floating feat, which compels you to say "well, actually, Dragon Disciple". Well done.

Otherwise: everything seems legal, and the mesh between race, spy and chameleon clicks very well. You don't pull any really clever stunts aside from the aforementioned marshal trick, but the overall synergy is good, and serves a purpose that defines the build.

Overall, well done.

Score: 4.1 points.


Memorable Villainy:

The idea of a "handler" that works with the PCs under different identities is fun, and is certain to make a great impact once they figure it out, or a reveal happens. Between chameleon and Zhentarim spy, your ability to pretend to be different adventurers is truly great. Those choices haven't paid off well in other categories, but they do here: you truly have the mechanical flexibility to back up your concept. This is the strongest point of the build, IMO.

Being present from CR 3 is great, and always a boon here – but "being present" does not necessarily mean "doing something". You're not very impressive during your early CR range, though you do make for an interesting social encounter.

Dominate only comes on at CR 10, and as a spell, and only 1/day at this level before items. Your DCs aren't above the curve at any point in the build, and you don't feature many ways to overcome other forms of resistance. You do have some extra stank on your spells thanks to your feats, and you do have access to enchantment spells from CR 6 forwards, which isn't too bad. That is, as long as your aptitude focus isn't required elsewhere. This unfortunately stays true throughout the build: when you do the thing that actually makes you memorable (pretending to be different adventurers with different classes), you're often completely unable to at all comply with the demands of the competition. Having a strong emphasis on bluff helps, but not enough.

Overall, this ranges between fairly good and very good on multiple fronts, but an inherent tension between the different aspects making up this category holds Angus back from doing very well here.

Score: 2.75 points.


Total Score: 12.1 points. Like the concept a lot, but I feel like you would've done significantly better in an "infiltrator" rather than "controller" round.

Spoiler: Ddernyn Siotta

Show

Originality:

Love half-fey, one of my favorite templates – but also one that loses you points here. Other than that though – you've got a very strong mechanical base going here. Can't say I had nagas in mind, and 19/20 CR here is naga stuff. "Wizard spells FTW" is always bad here, of course, but it's certainly more interesting than doing it with conventional class levels.

Finding a semi-direct way to utilize diplomacy against PCs… very cool, and very hard to resist. However, I don't really see when a Chaotic Evil naga and a bunch of adventurers are meant to sit around drinking tea and making snide remarks at each other. Still – pretty awesome for this category.

Once the chassis has been established, everything else flows forth pretty expectedly, but the chassis is still relatively fresh.

Overall, pretty good.

Score: 3.5 points.


Power:

You start out not much more than decent at CR 9, but you quickly get over that hurdle. By CR 20 you're a real beast, but even beforehand, you manage to pick up some nastiness pretty quickly. I honestly don't have that much to say here – you're not really a physical threat, which is a great shame. Like a lot of Serpent Kingdoms material, Banelar nagas are broken as ****, and they can cast a spell as a free action while attacking. Would've been great if you had a reason to attack every once in a while. Your hugeness is mostly wasted. Oh well, can't have everything.

Overall, this is a powerful and versatile caster/leader, and not as vulnerable as a lot of our competitors during early levels.

Score: 4.65 points.


Elegance:

Nice and straightforward. Simplicity does have a sort of elegance, I guess. Practiced spellcaster doesn't work; you need to choose a spellcasting class you possess, and you don't possess any spellcasting class. I think you've let Naga Lord make you complacent.

Speaking of: I'd say the unique language of Naga Lord is very clear and certainly works here. Nice catch! However, I feel like the unique language of the class also ****s you over. It asks you to be able to cast Dominate Person as a spell, specifically – and you qualify with an SLA. I don't feel confident enough to say this is enough to disqualify you in a build that doesn't live by the RAW, but it's still rough, and makes for a hefty penalty. You're welcome to dispute if I'm forgetting some general rule that addresses this clearly enough. Still think there's a case to be made here, but see dispute.

Cross setting material is something I'm not a fan of, generally speaking. Yes, it’s not a severe case, but still.

Overall, a somewhat problematic category but not a disaster.

Score: 2.75 3.25points.


Memorable Villainy:

CR 9 is a little bit late for a first encounter, but not terrible. I don’t feel that I've gotten a really meaty motivation, tactic, or nature here – the BBEG is some ****ed up naga, but not much more than that. It's a proper villain, and meaningfully changes with the campaign, but it doesn't feel as memorable to me as some of the other entries on the board.

As far as being a controller goes: sometimes quantity does mean quality. Spells, SLAs and Su abilities galore! You also have a very high DC on two of those, and your spell DC is also alright. Getting mad DCs oor ways to overcome immunities would've helped. It's also hard not to overshadow yourself with high level casting, but that really couldn't be helped.

Overall, good controller, pretty good villain.

Score: 4 points.


Total Score: 14.9 15.4 points.Naga overlord was a cool idea that didn't leave you a lot of space to explore, but you did well with what you have.

Spoiler: Acerath

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Originality:

Our second chameleon doppelganger this round gets the same treatment here as the first regarding these elements.

Blood Magus! One of my favorite PRCs since time immemorial, and not something I expected at all with this ingredient. The associated trick is certainly creative – but I'm sorry to say we'll also discuss it later in elegance, as well.

Mother cyst is a cool way to go with the ingredient (though again, I'll have some thoughts in the coming categories).

Jester + warlock is thematically nice for your character, and fell conspiracy and combat charm should both be acknowledged here.

Overall, a good category for you.

Score: 3.85 points.


Power:

I have to give an unfortunate disclaimer here: this category is going to make a lot more sense once you read elegance.

Not a great start, as you've acknowledged. You're a decent social encounter, and remain so for your entire career. Other abilities grow slowly and steadily through the build, but I feel that you're still constantly behind – your damage, your DCs, your actual abilities – all of it mostly feels like it's a few levels too late. This problem worsens during late levels.

Your last two feats honestly disgust me here. You don't mention them in your tactics section, and for good reason. Fell conspiracy, as noted, is a good and creative pick on your villain, and one ceremony or another should be "always on", as you've said. Which means Blessing of the Godless is a virtually dead feat. You can't have 2 ceremonies active at the same time, the benefits suck… Why this feat?

And why oh why scribe scroll? Like, what the hell? You have scribe scroll for your skin, and you have a floating feat for more. Is it in case you want more than 6 scrolls from bloodline feats at the same time? Is that really necessary? Is this worth your last (and epic) feat?

Generally, you don't mention a lot of what Blood Magus gives you, and the things you do mention don't get enough support from other sources within the build. Like, yeah, you can jump through someone at CR 20. When I got my hands on Complete Arcane as a kid, I thought that was the coolest thing freaking ever. I still kind of do, but you don't really… do anything with it. It's 35 damage. Kay.

Overall, I'm sorry to say I see this build as way too limited and stagnant to be an impactful villain for most parties.

Score: 1.5 points.


Elegance:

Your leveling is a bit chaotic, and not fully justified IMO. You stick with Blood Magus to the end, which is nice, but it's hardly the center of what you do. Most of the benefit you get from it comes at level 2, and could be replicated with a feat that you end up taking. Generally, the build feels confused and aimless, aside from its main core trick. Also, Acerath suffers from multiclass penalties from as early as possible. It's just a slap on the wrist in a villain competition though, not a real penalty. Also, this isn't a penalty, but try to point out which invocation comes from which book in the future. Looking through 3 books is a bit of a hassle.

Also, 2 entries ****ing up with practiced spellcaster in a row. Warlock isn't a spellcasting class you possess, so you cqan't take practiced spellcaster for it. This is much more severe in your case, since you don't qualify for Blood Magus without it. It's a real shame, because if it worked, you could've gone Blood Magus at CR 6, but you still chose to take a bunch of warlock levels – and they weren't enough. The way to fix the build would be taking the feat for jester, not for warlock – but if I have to change your feats for you, it's always a serious penalty here. By the way, even if it had worked, I wouldn't buy the increased damage from EB: it normally increases when you progress the class through spellcasting advancement. Caster level doesn't bring new spell levels, and it doesn't bring better EB damage. You'd have to have ardent-like language to convince me otherwise. This isn't a penalty, just a note.

Let's talk about your scroll trick. First, I'd like to acknowledge your comment about using level appropriate spells, which is obviously meant to be a nod towards common sense, even if not RAI. Still, while not trying to necessarily break anything, this is still obviously meant as cool RAW abuse – getting to scribe scrolls of spells you have no way of casting. I'm generally very in favor of that: most builds I've made which I really like are based on RAW abuse. However, I do have a rule for these scenarios: live by the RAW, die by the RAW. So, how does your trick do?

Blood Magus doesn't really pull any weight here: scarification is explicitly just a different medium of scribe scroll, and is subject to "all rules" that apply to scribe scroll. The interaction we're interested in, therefore, is the interaction between mother cyst and scribe scroll. And, well…
[quote= Mother Cyst explicitly counts the spell list as [b]known[/b], no ifs ands or buts]

Show me the line.

Like yeah, obviously. Obviously you know these spells. But the feat doesn't say that does it? It says it "grants access" to these spells, and that "You cast these spells like any other spell you can cast". If we're doing dumb blind RAW, than you don't know these spells, and cannot scribe them, end of story. If we're going RAI, than obviously you only know the spells when you can cast them. I'd say this is also a very reasonable interpretation of the RAW of bloodline feats (emphasis on the word "bonus" and on the special section) which at the very least means you don't have an ironclad RAW case for them either.

Furthermore, even if we were to ignore this very harsh reading, scarification is still subject to all rules guiding scribing scrolls and those say:

The act of writing triggers the prepared spell, making it unavailable for casting until the character has rested and regained spells. (That is, that spell slot is expended from her currently prepared spells, just as if it had been cast.)

Which, yeah.

And also

A creator can create an item at a lower caster level than her own, but never lower than the minimum level needed to cast the needed spell.

So even if we were to ignore everything else, you still need your caster level – which is stagnated from the start, and never passes 12 (16, according to your flawed approach).

To sum up, I think your trick fails on multiple critical junctures, and cannot be accepted. Very clever though. As a note, I think that if it would've worked, you shouldn't have shied away from 9ths. If you're pulling TO nonsense, do it to the fullest!

So far, this has been very harsh. Furthermore, a flaw is an automatic loss of a point here, as per the Secret Laboratory rules :( Not telling me which flaw it is is a further slap on the wrist from me.

Overall, this isn't enough to make me take you down to 0, but with everything going on here… Sorry.

Score: 1 point.


Memorable Villainy:

I find the whole "resurrected by the god of undeath" thing kind of shaky, but Blood Magus is just an invitation to bring back an opponent which the PCs have already killed, which is great in this category. It can become frustrating incredibly quickly, but once is nice. Other than that, you stick around from CR 3 and meaningfully change and evolve throughout, and the evil doppelganger warlock with blood magic is very flavorful and sticks well to the mind.

Unfortunately, due to mother cyst inscribing not working, you fail to be a real controller until you get devil's whispers, and you never fully flesh out. You get valiant attempt credit here, but this is a hard blow.

Score: 2.75 points.


Total Score: 9.1 points. OOF, I like this build a lot more than the score betrays. Acerath was an ambitious project, for sure, but it ended up being a mess. Better luck next time! Keep up the good work.

Spoiler: IllIIlIl

Show

Originality:

Aboleth! Awesome. Not super surprising, in a round like this, but still awesome. Love me an Aboleth. Psion is very much expected though, and a lot of what you do comes down to psionic dominate, which IMHO is a pretty obvious route to take this ingredient in. It makes sense, but it still means that out of the "free" 8 CR points this build had, you'd chosen perhaps the most expected.

Powers are mostly standard telepath stuff, with a couple of exceptions. I'll also give you a boost for the soulmeld stuff.

You do use some very well-known cheese that gets an eye roll from me with feat leech abuse. It has a good justification given your slaves – but still.

Overall, pretty standard stuff, but a nice approach nonetheless.

Score: 2.25 points.


Power:

Easy category for you. You start well, and you keep doing well, and you have plenty of cheese accessible. You have some potent combinations, high DCs, good survivability – what's not to like? Honestly, I don't have much to say here. You don't pull off anything new or crazy, but it's clearly a very strong build.

Score: 4.75 points.


Elegance:

Using your bonus feats to get the prereqs the exact moment you need them, while opening up slots for soulmeld shenanigans. Tight. The shenanigans themselves really aren't tight at all though. Instead of taking psycarnum infusion, expanded capacity, and psionic meditation, you could've just taken bonus essentia twice. 1 less feat, a DC lower by 1 but permanent. Way better. IMO, you should've either stuck to psycarnum infusion only or gone that route. Feels kind of wasteful as is. I was wrong, see dispute.

You messed up the psicraft ranks, taking 3 instead of 4 at the level you take practiced manifester. Easy, obvious fix, but still a rookie mistake and a penalty you could've avoided by being more careful.

Not much to say here, otherwise. Everything is legal, sources are well sourced, tactics are a bit lean for my taste but not too bad – you cover the big stuff.

Overall, a clean, focused and purposefully built villain.

Score: 4 4.35 points.


Memorable Villainy:

First showing up at CR 7 is fine. Great old one fluff is nice, aboleths are easy to do that way. You're pretty much given decent memorability on a plate, if you don't **** them up. You also have the means to back it up – telepaths with your range of powers can easily create interesting interactions. Some of the mid levels are slightly stagnant, but other than that, you change and grow well as the campaign progresses.

As far as being a proper controller go: Shatter mindblank is very good here. Mind Blank is one of the most common ways for high level characters to get [mind-affecting] immunity, and you have a way to overcome it. A problematic way, granted – takes a standard action, and your ML is behind CR – but still good.

I 100% get why you didn't take psionic dominate as a power, but I still feel that you maybe should have as far as this category is concerned. Still, between your telepath powers and your Aboleth Savantism, you're doing great. Pushing DCs higher than they should be is another definite +.

Overall, you're definitely living up to the theme of the round, and make for a good BBEG.

Score: 4.25 points.


Total Score: 15.25 15.6 points. I'll be honest – it's not my favorite build for this round. I usually like it way more when there's a weird trick or some unforeseen synergy. But it got a high score fair and square. It's competent, clear, and fits the theme. Well done.

[loky1109]

H_H_F_F, thank you!

I need to make some research and maybe will send dispute.

[loky1109]

Venger, you need to clear some space in your mailbox.

---

UPD: In the meantime, I brought you the table!

Name	Alignment / Race	Class Levels	Chef	H_H_F_F	Total	Place
Steel, the Conscript Lord	LE Advanced Prodigy Gulthir	Monk 1/Fiend of Possession 2/Paladin of Tyranny 2/Tattooed Monk 3/Totemist 2		15.00	15.00	3rd
Angus McQuestGyver	NE Doppelganger	Chameleon 10/Expert 2/Marshal 1/Zhentarim spy 5		12.10	12.10	4th
Ddernyn Siotta	CE Advanced Half-Fey Balenar Naga	Naga Overlord 10		15.40	15.40	2nd
Acerath, Hand of Orcus	LE Doppelganger	Jester 1/Warlock 4/Blood Magus 10/Chameleon 2		9.10	9.10	5th
IllIIlIl	LE Psionic Aboleth	Telepath 8/Psionic Savant Aboleth 5		15.60	15.60	1st

Table is updated.

[Venger]

There's space now.

Dispute:

First of all, thanks a bunch for judging!

I have a few remarks that are minor.



Firstly, I think there is a great flavorful identity at later levels, which is 'being a better devil'. Monk and Paladin are two classes with strong Lawful flavor, Paladin of Tyranny adds Evil to that, and totemist is all about manipulating souls: that's all devil stuff!

Like, imagine: you waltz into Steel's base, and this armor-clad giant slowly turns to face you, the pure energy of Evil and Law coalescing into a protective veil, while the damned souls flitting around him snap together into a loose flickering garment. Even the 'oh, he's a monk' moment that'll accompany the first unarmed strike will probably be followed by 'well i guess he is lawful and had that weird asceticism thing going on...'

----

Lastly, a bit about the supposed stagnation of Steel, which I acknowledge but think can be subverted with resources present in the build.

Steel is a villain, but he's a villain who can make his presence be felt indirectly. The PCs might fight him only a few times during the game, and terrain differences (greater teleport, baby!) and dominated minions provide enough versatility to make those different fights feel memorable.

As a villain, he has a bit less need for flexibility than a PC. The build as-presented loses to FoM. The build as-presented can also pull that dominated caster trick and win, or get support to dispel, or even just show up, make everyone think he is gonna fight, and then teleport away and leave the rogues he served as a distraction for sneak attack from ambush. Encounters with Steel draw memorability from his minions, yes, but those minions are still internal to the build, because they are drawn from a trick that the build invests a lot into: the permanent domination.

I can't stress enough how convenient Steel is as a villain. A 15th-level cleric would logically have other plans, other attachments, agendas of his own, self-preservation: but sometimes you just want to throw one into an encounter and not worry about all that: Steel lets you!

Again, thank you.

EDIT: additional disputes:

Spoiler: Dispute

Show

Instead of taking psycarnum infusion, expanded capacity, and psionic meditation, you could've just taken bonus essentia twice.

It was my first idea, but... I actually couldn't. Bonus essentia feat has no permission to take it more than once.

You do use some very well-known cheese that gets an eye roll from me with feat leech abuse.

Well, it sounds fair, but I should say, I only mentioned this cheesy trick and didn't rely on it at all.

Thanks, H_H_F_F!

Spoiler: Dispute

Show

Like a lot of Serpent Kingdoms material, Banelar nagas are broken as ****, and they can cast a spell as a free action while attacking.

Actually, Banelar originates in Monsters of Faerûn and was even more broken there - it has CR 5 and was Magical Beast. )))

I feel like the unique language of the class also ****s you over. It asks you to be able to cast Dominate Person as a spell, specifically – and you qualify with an SLA.
You're welcome to dispute if I'm forgetting some general rule that addresses this clearly enough.

I think you are.

A requirement based on a specific spell measures whether the character or creature in question is capable of producing the necessary effect, and as such, invocations and spell-like abilities that generate the relevant effect meet the requirements for specific spell knowledge. For example, a prestige class with a spellcasting requirement of “Must know (or be able to cast) darkness” is met by a warlock who chooses darkness as one of her invocations, or by any creature with darkness as a spell-like ability.

About part "be able to cast as a spell". "As a spell" part is meaningless here.
"Be able to cast as a spell" is a full equivalent of "be able to cast". Because there are no other things, but spells which anybody could "cast" in the 3.5. For example, you can't "cast" SLA, you only can "use" SLA.

[H_H_F_F]

Dispute Responses:

Spoiler: Steel

Show

Lawful Flavor: Not significant enough to impact the score here, IMO. Maybe if you would've taken ascetic knight or something. No change in score.

Change through minions: I agree that various different minions change encounters with steel. I even noted so in my judgement: "He really has to solely rely on mooks and equipment to play as a truly different encounter – otherwise, he's mainly just on repeat." I acknowledge that, but you have to acknowledge that this is true for everyone in this field, and other villains change more significantly. Again, No change in score.

Sorry to disappoint!

Spoiler: IllIIlIl

Show

Bonus Essentia: Well, I’ll be damned. You're right. My "fixing the Tarrasque with feats" thread just took a huge blow. Well, your shenanigans are tight after all, and a slight punishment for inefficiency just became a boost for cleverness. +0.35 points in Elegance.

Cheese: You would have done a lot worse in originality if you entirely relied on feat leech. You got some credit in power, and a mild penalty in originality. Compare and contrast with taking more surprising and weird powers and making good use of them. Score stands.

Spoiler: Ddernyn Siotta

Show

As a spell: I had CAr in mind, I even thought I mentioned it (I didn't). To me, it seemed not articulated enough, and I had "specific trumps general" in mind here – unless a more explicit general ruling could be found.
However, I have to acknowledge that "cast" is also spell-specific language that's being overcome by the general rule. I'm not 100% convinced here, but you've made a good case. +0.5 Elegance.

I'll update the original judgement momentarily.

[H_H_F_F]

Hey Venger, any further news from our contestants?

[Venger]

I have not heard anything and there's room in my inbox if there's anything further. If that's the case, reveal tonight or tomorrow morning sound good?

[Venger]

Reveal!

Name	Alignment / Race	Class Levels	Chef	H_H_F_F	Total	Place
Steel, the Conscript Lord	LE Advanced Prodigy Gulthir	Monk 1/Fiend of Possession 2/Paladin of Tyranny 2/Tattooed Monk 3/Totemist 2	Inevitability	15.00	15.00	3rd
Angus McQuestGyver	NE Doppelganger	Chameleon 10/Expert 2/Marshal 1/Zhentarim spy 5	ciopo	12.10	12.10	4th
Ddernyn Siotta	CE Advanced Half-Fey Balenar Naga	Naga Overlord 10	loky1109	15.40	15.40	2nd
Acerath, Hand of Orcus	LE Doppelganger	Jester 1/Warlock 4/Blood Magus 10/Chameleon 2	RaiKirah	9.10	9.10	5th
IllIIlIl	LE Psionic Aboleth	Telepath 8/Psionic Savant Aboleth 5	loky1109	15.60	15.60	1st

Congratulations all around.

[Inevitability]

Grats to loky for not one but two medals! I'm glad Steel could still eke out a podium spot, but I'd be lying if I wasn't hoping for a higher rank: the core trick felt really cool to me when I submitted it all those months ago.

edit: Also, with Chainsaw Man growing so big in the past half-year, I'm unreasonably amused to realize that I entered a Devil into the Controller round. I wasn't really aware of the show when building Steel, but it's really funny in hindsight.

[H_H_F_F]

COngratulations to all! I wasn't the hugest fan of my judgements this round, but I hope they got the job done - and after much waiting, round 50 is coming to you soon! Hooray!

[Thurbane]

Congrats to all the entrants, and great job Loky!

VC is probably my fave GitP comp, so I'm really looking forward to number 50

[ciopo]

Thank you for judging H_H_F_F

My reasoning for motivate dexterity and epic skill focus sleight of hand was to pump up that skill trick for making a spell seem to be another spell. Which is to say it's a "soft" bypass of saving throws, but of course I couldn't write something along the lines of "they willfully fail their save because they think you're casting heroism on them". Since there is a bit of meta-deception going there, and telling your player "the NPC is casting heroism on you, do you want to resist?" Is suspicious, very suspicious. Gotta coach it somehow!

[H_H_F_F]

Thank you for judging H_H_F_F

My reasoning for motivate dexterity and epic skill focus sleight of hand was to pump up that skill trick for making a spell seem to be another spell. Which is to say it's a "soft" bypass of saving throws, but of course I couldn't write something along the lines of "they willfully fail their save because they think you're casting heroism on them". Since there is a bit of meta-deception going there, and telling your player "the NPC is casting heroism on you, do you want to resist?" Is suspicious, very suspicious. Gotta coach it somehow!

Good point.

[loky1109]

VC is my favorite competition and I so glad to obtain double medals! Thanks H_H_F_F for judging and Venger for holding the event!
Congratulations for Inevitability with Bronze!

[H_H_F_F]

New round is up!

Due to the special nature of this round, and the convergence with other comps, you have just about a full month to submit entries - and I'd be willing to extend it past that, too.