Adventures in Helnith: Assault on the Town of Ash (OoC)

[essCee]

Sounds good!

[WindStruck]

Here's a suggestion... you were on the phone asking a friend to call another friend and see how they are doing.

Why not, uh.. call Mina yourself? That's something you could be doing, having a conversation at least.

[Gnomes2169]

You know you can get levels up by poking your nose into trouble too, right?

When we get to the actual fighting part, I’ll let you and essCee run the opposing side if you want, so you aren’t sitting around doing nothing.

Well yes, but I'm making plans to go get in trouble, Kareeah! Gosh. Getting well and truly oopsie goofed takes a lot of preparation, I'll have you know.

Oooooooooo... like how I made life difficult for Mina earlier. Very nice, very nice.

Here's a suggestion... you were on the phone asking a friend to call another friend and see how they are doing.

Why not, uh.. call Mina yourself? That's something you could be doing, having a conversation at least.

SHHHHHH, that would be LOGICAL. We can't have me being that here. Kareeah, could we let Mark call Mina during dinner instead of being a total dork?

[gorman]

Sorry you feel that way.

From my perspective, it's pretty tough to just jump into the middle of a game that's already been running. I'm trying to do whatever plothooks are thrown my way, but seems we're just at a bottleneck, and it feels like the flow of everything is bogged down.

I don't want to make you feel "forced" to do anything, so I'll see myself out. From the pokemon center.

I just honestly don't know how to answer the questions you guys are asking... And god forbid I go back 30+ pages in game to try and find a suitable answer LOL

[Kareeah_Indaga]

Gnomes, essCee, here are the flock's statblocks:

Spoiler: Murkrow Flock

Show

Pokémon: Honchkrow lvl 35 (Shadowed)
Type: Dark/Flying
Ability: Super Luck
Gender: Female
Level: 35
Held Item: None
Stats--
HP: 125
Attack: 103
Def: 52
Sp. Attack: 89+15
Sp. Def: 52
Speed: 65+15
Moves:
Snarl (SM)
Swift (tutor)
Twister (tutor)
Nasty Plot
Swagger
Wing Attack
Shadow Moves:
Shadow Rush
Shadow Mist
Shadow Sky
Shadow Storm
Invigorate (Homebrew – Cures status effects like Poison, paralysis etc. and lets the user act twice in a round, once at normal Speed and once at half Speed)
Ether Focus (Homebrew - bumps up crit ratio, Attack, Special Attack, and Speed)

Pokémon: Murkrow A, B (Shadowed)
Type: Dark/Flying
Ability: Insomnia, Super Luck
Gender: Female, Female
Level: 30
Held Item: None
Stats--
HP: 85
Attack: 65
Def: 39
Sp. Attack: 65
Sp. Def: 39
Speed: 68
Moves:
Peck
Pursuit
Haze
Wing Attack
Night Shade
Assurance
Shadow Moves:
Shadow Rush
Shadow Mist
Shadow Sky
Shadow Storm
Shadow Panic
Ether Focus (Homebrew - bumps up crit ratio, Attack, Special Attack, and Speed)

Pokémon: Murkrow C, D, E, F
Type: Dark/Flying
Ability: Insomnia, Super Luck, Super Luck, Super Luck
Gender: Male, Female, Female, Male
Level: 25
Held Item: None
Stats--
HP: 72
Attack: 55
Def: 33
Sp. Attack: 55
Sp. Def: 33
Speed: 58
Moves:
Peck
Pursuit
Haze
Wing Attack
Night Shade
Assurance

Pokémon: Murkrow G, H
Type: Dark/Flying
Ability: Insomnia, Insomnia
Gender: Female, Male
Level: 20
Held Item: None
Stats--
HP: 60
Attack: 45
Def: 28
Sp. Attack: 45
Sp. Def: 28
Speed: 47
Moves:
Peck
Astonish
Pursuit
Haze
Wing Attack

Split them up however you like. And if you don't want to run them, let me know that too, so we can keep this running.

Kareeah, could we let Mark call Mina during dinner instead of being a total dork?

Sure.

[Lord Ruby34]

Can I give orders to Pokemon the same turn I send them out in this battle? (Hero and Dancer?) I assume not, but I'm not sure.

[Kareeah_Indaga]

Spoiler: ooc

Show

Feels like I'm talking a lot. Could suggest a move to Gypsy too if you want.

Up to you, she just needs to be freed for most of her attacks to do any good.

Also, could you specify which attack King is supposed to be using? He’s got multiple moves that could fit that description.

Can I give orders to Pokemon the same turn I send them out in this battle? (Hero and Dancer?) I assume not, but I'm not sure.

Yes you can, if they’re just being sent out and not replacing a Pokémon already on the field. So right now you have Leo and Princess out, if you send out Hero and Dancer in addition to them, then they get to attack, but if you recall Leo and Princess to put Hero and Dancer in their places then they don’t.

Let me know if that doesn’t make sense, there’s been confusion on that in the past.

[WindStruck]

Well, I think it would be best if King did water pulse. Seems it could potentially hit a lot of targets, and maybe even confuse them.

As for poor gypsy, I dunno.. I think, maybe Flotsam should just tell her to try to calm down, and Focus!

[Lord Ruby34]

Yes you can, if they’re just being sent out and not replacing a Pokémon already on the field. So right now you have Leo and Princess out, if you send out Hero and Dancer in addition to them, then they get to attack, but if you recall Leo and Princess to put Hero and Dancer in their places then they don’t.

Let me know if that doesn’t make sense, there’s been confusion on that in the past.

I think I've got it, but let me know if I did everything right.

[Gnomes2169]

Gnomes, essCee, here are the flock's statblocks:

Spoiler: Murkrow Flock

Show

Pokémon: Honchkrow lvl 35 (Shadowed)
Type: Dark/Flying
Ability: Super Luck
Gender: Female
Level: 35
Held Item: None
Stats--
HP: 125
Attack: 103
Def: 52
Sp. Attack: 89+15
Sp. Def: 52
Speed: 65+15
Moves:
Snarl (SM)
Swift (tutor)
Twister (tutor)
Nasty Plot
Swagger
Wing Attack
Shadow Moves:
Shadow Rush
Shadow Mist
Shadow Sky
Shadow Storm
Invigorate (Homebrew – Cures status effects like Poison, paralysis etc. and lets the user act twice in a round, once at normal Speed and once at half Speed)
Ether Focus (Homebrew - bumps up crit ratio, Attack, Special Attack, and Speed)

Pokémon: Murkrow A, B (Shadowed)
Type: Dark/Flying
Ability: Insomnia, Super Luck
Gender: Female, Female
Level: 30
Held Item: None
Stats--
HP: 85
Attack: 65
Def: 39
Sp. Attack: 65
Sp. Def: 39
Speed: 68
Moves:
Peck
Pursuit
Haze
Wing Attack
Night Shade
Assurance
Shadow Moves:
Shadow Rush
Shadow Mist
Shadow Sky
Shadow Storm
Shadow Panic
Ether Focus (Homebrew - bumps up crit ratio, Attack, Special Attack, and Speed)

Pokémon: Murkrow C, D, E, F
Type: Dark/Flying
Ability: Insomnia, Super Luck, Super Luck, Super Luck
Gender: Male, Female, Female, Male
Level: 25
Held Item: None
Stats--
HP: 72
Attack: 55
Def: 33
Sp. Attack: 55
Sp. Def: 33
Speed: 58
Moves:
Peck
Pursuit
Haze
Wing Attack
Night Shade
Assurance

Pokémon: Murkrow G, H
Type: Dark/Flying
Ability: Insomnia, Insomnia
Gender: Female, Male
Level: 20
Held Item: None
Stats--
HP: 60
Attack: 45
Def: 28
Sp. Attack: 45
Sp. Def: 28
Speed: 47
Moves:
Peck
Astonish
Pursuit
Haze
Wing Attack

Split them up however you like. And if you don't want to run them, let me know that too, so we can keep this running.

Sure.

I'll handle the shadowed pokemon, I guess. I can be... very 'fun' with them. >:D

And great! ... Mark's going to be exactly as dorky as he's always been, there's no hope for the lad I'm afraid.

[Kareeah_Indaga]

Well, I think it would be best if King did water pulse. Seems it could potentially hit a lot of targets, and maybe even confuse them.

As for poor gypsy, I dunno.. I think, maybe Flotsam should just tell her to try to calm down, and Focus!

Thank you! Noted.

I think I've got it, but let me know if I did everything right.

Looks good from this angle!

EDIT:

For our new players (and some of our old players too), the multi-target rules are in the first post under "Battle." To summarize: for damaging moves you get one target for every 10 points you have in the relevant attack stat, with a minimum of two targets. Moves like Earthquake or Surf that hit friend or foe you pick half and the other half are random, but Bubble and Swift aren't in that category.

[WindStruck]

It's interesting reading the entire battle log. Almost does feel like one massive, epic pokemon game.

And then, hilariously enough, tons and tons of actions, and then a snippet of casual phone call underneath all that.

[Lord Ruby34]

I have a mechanical question about Intimidate. The ability only triggers once, right? Affecting only Pokemon on the field at the time the Pokemon with Intimidate is sent out? Or am I misunderstanding a mechanic?

[WindStruck]

I have a mechanical question about Intimidate. The ability only triggers once, right? Affecting only Pokemon on the field at the time the Pokemon with Intimidate is sent out? Or am I misunderstanding a mechanic?

Oh yeah, that's a good question. I'm not sure, why is this mechanic even happening?

And it seems like the more we are winning (as in the more crows get KO'd), then the more of our own team gets more scared, which makes no sense.

[Kareeah_Indaga]

I have a mechanical question about Intimidate. The ability only triggers once, right? Affecting only Pokemon on the field at the time the Pokemon with Intimidate is sent out? Or am I misunderstanding a mechanic?

I’ve been running it such that it’s active as long as the Pokémon is out on the field; it’s not like the Pokémon stops being scary the first time you see it, and there are plenty of ways around it, including just sticking to Special attacks.

That said, this isn’t the first time this has caused confusion so if you guys want to argue in favor of sticking to the handhelds’ method by all means make your case.

And it seems like the more we are winning (as in the more crows get KO'd), then the more of our own team gets more scared, which makes no sense.

When something’s hostile to both sides, fewer targets means a greater likelihood of being on the receiving end of whatever is trying to intimidate you.

I acknowledge this would be more intuitive if it were a rampaging Raikou doing the intimidating and not cute little fluffballs like Shinx and Luxio, but the cute little fluffballs have Intimidate and Raikou doesn’t, so… *shrug*

[WindStruck]

Oh, it's the Luxio. So, maybe the trick is, getting it to think we're a friend!

[Lord Ruby34]

I'm generally fine with Intimidate working either way, but I do have a few more questions.

1. Does Intimidate work normally when there are multiple intimidate users on one side of the battlefield? (I.E. drop attack X stages, where X is the number of Pokemon with Intimidate?
2. Does the attack drop from Intimidate stick around after the Intimidating Pokemon switches out or faints?

Spoiler: Intimidate Rambles -Big Nerd Alert - Feel Free to Ignore

Show

Assuming the answers to the above are yes and no respectively I'm going to compare this version of intimidate to the handheld games. Why? Because I'm a massive nerd, that's why! If my guesses as to your answers were wrong then please ignore everything else in the spoiler tag.

First Scenario. One on One Pokemon battle, one Pokemon has intimidate. This has exactly the same result no matter which version of Intimidate is used.

Second Scenario. Team Battle. The Pokemon with Intimidate wins it's first one on one, and does not switch out. This version means that any Pokemon that fights against the intimidating Pokemon is weaker, which makes Intimidate more powerful. In fact, an intimidating Pokemon is a pretty brutal wall against any physical attackers. With this version of Intimidate there is no way to double switch to get rid of the attack reduction. As long as the intimidating Pokemon is present, you're weakened.

Third Scenario. Team Battle. The Pokemon with Intimidate loses it's one on one, or is forced to switch out. If the attack drop does not persist, this weakens the Intimidate ability, as it goes away when the Pokemon does.

Forth Scenario. Team Battle, pivots. The value of intimidate is far lower here than it might otherwise be. For example, let's pretend we have a Torterra out on one side of the field. Pretend we're the other trainer. Our best answer to Torterra is something like a silver wind from a frail Bug Pokemon, but it's not necessarily a one shot. Earthquake, on the other hand, will probably one shot our bug if we switch in. If intimidate works like it does in the handheld games, we can try to get our bug in after a series of defense drops. Right now, we have a water Pokemon out. We can assume a grass attack, and switch into something like Luxio, dropping Torterra's attack and easily taking a razor leaf or giga drain, especially after lowering Torterra's attack. Then, in anticipation of Earthquake on our Electric type, we can switch in Gyarados (pretend it doesn't have any flying type attacks for this example), cutting attack again while dodging earthquake. Now, we're safe to switch our bug in, and silver wind twice, almost certainly surviving the earthquake (as long as it doesn't crit) that we're hit with on the second turn. But if Intimidate doesn't stick around after the intimidating Pokemon is gone, we can't make this play, as the earthquake will likely cleanly knock out our bug, no matter what we do.

Fifth Scenario. Multibattle with two sides, and enough Pokemon that intimidate doesn't hit everything. With this version of intimidate, as long as the intimidating Pokemon is on the field the enemy team is debuffed. That debuff will spread to the stronger Pokemon as their weaker allies fall. This makes good flavorful sense. With the handheld rules, the Pokemon that were intimidated at the beginning of the fight are the Pokemon who are intimidated, full stop.

Sixth Scenario. Multibattle with more than two sides, and enough Pokemon that not all targets are intimidated. (Current situation.) With the current intimidate rule, this can lead to some awkwardness. As the stronger side eliminates the weaker Pokemon without intimidate, then the Pokemon that weren't originally intimidated become scared because of their own success. Awkward flavor. With the Handheld version of the ability, the Pokemon that are intimidated at the beginning stay intimidated, and no additional Pokemon will become intimidated.

Seventh Scenario. Multibattle with many Pokemon with the Intimidate ability on one side. Either way, this sucks if you're trying to attack physically. With the current rule, there's no way to stop this from sucking. Your physical attacks are going to do next to no damage, so you better have some special attacks to clear out some of the intimidaters. With the handheld ability, you can swap twice to clear the debuff, but you'll suffer from not attacking or using any moves for two turns. Or you can clear with special attackers.

Additional note. The RPG format doesn't lend itself to cleanly having Pokemon come out at the same time, every time. That could make applying the handheld ability awkward.

/End Tangent. My opinion is still that I'm basically fine with the ability working either way, though if it doesn't work the same way as in the games it should probably be noted in a tab on the first page.

This rambling has also made me realize that Less should probably get a dedicated special attacker on his team. He's leaning pretty heavily towards the physical side at the moment. Hero will help out after evolution and a lot of SMs, but that'll be a ways away.


EDIT: Question came to me. For actual trainer battles are we playing on switch or set mode?

[Kareeah_Indaga]

Oh, it's the Luxio. So, maybe the trick is, getting it to think we're a friend!

Yes. It also functions as a bit of a cushion since this is the first in-game fight for most of you.

1. Does Intimidate work normally when there are multiple intimidate users on one side of the battlefield? (I.E. drop attack X stages, where X is the number of Pokemon with Intimidate?

Correct, if there had been 3 Luxio with Intimidate, the Attack drop would have been three levels.

2. Does the attack drop from Intimidate stick around after the Intimidating Pokemon switches out or faints?

No, Pokémon with Intimidate can’t be intimidating if they’re unconscious or not present.

Spoiler: Intimidate Rambles -Big Nerd Alert - Feel Free to Ignore

Show

Assuming the answers to the above are yes and no respectively I'm going to compare this version of intimidate to the handheld games. Why? Because I'm a massive nerd, that's why!

That is absolutely fine! I would much rather any issues come up in OoC hypotheticals than in the middle of something IC. They’re easier to fix that way.

Spoiler: Intimidate Rambles -Big Nerd Alert - Feel Free to Ignore

Show

Seventh Scenario. Multibattle with many Pokemon with the Intimidate ability on one side. Either way, this sucks if you're trying to attack physically. With the current rule, there's no way to stop this from sucking. Your physical attacks are going to do next to no damage, so you better have some special attacks to clear out some of the intimidaters. With the handheld ability, you can swap twice to clear the debuff, but you'll suffer from not attacking or using any moves for two turns. Or you can clear with special attackers.

This scenario would be problematic regardless, if you came to it without warning. But making a team of all Physical attackers is like making a team of Pokémon that are all one type; there are going to be situations where you’re at a disadvantage when you specialize, and if you plan to specialize, also plan some counter-measures for those situations.

Spoiler: Intimidate Rambles -Big Nerd Alert - Feel Free to Ignore

Show

/End Tangent. My opinion is still that I'm basically fine with the ability working either way, though if it doesn't work the same way as in the games it should probably be noted in a tab on the first page.

This is absolutely correct. Should be added now (under “Battle”).

Which also reminds me, I need to note the non-typical Abilities somewhere. Might put that in a tab on the Excel sheet though.

(The relevant bit for you is that you can give Dancer Insomnia if she holds an Espresso while she evolves, if that is something useful or of interest to you.)

This rambling has also made me realize that Less should probably get a dedicated special attacker on his team. He's leaning pretty heavily towards the physical side at the moment. Hero will help out after evolution and a lot of SMs, but that'll be a ways away.

Never hurts to be prepared.

EDIT: Question came to me. For actual trainer battles are we playing on switch or set mode?

Not familiar with the terminology. What do you mean?

In the mean time (going back to being prepared) I’ve got the rest of your list and the rest of WindStruck’s as far as Pokémon you’re interested in, but everyone else, throw out a few Pokémon you’d want to have. It’s been a while since I asked for some of you and it would be nice to have a record on this forum, in addition to any updates you may or may not want to make.

EDIT: Gnomes I need targets for that Shadow Storm. It's a Special move so it hits six seven because guess what happened.

[Gnomes2169]

Ah, I thought Shadow Storm was the weather/ field move, but I'll select some targets, one sec...

Edit: Targets have been selected. Shadow bolts have been fired. Everyone gets ZZZZZZAPPED.

[WindStruck]

Another question. Do wild pokemon ever target humans in these games, if they have their own pokemon out?

I know this is very similar to the handheld games so... no?

Though I have heard stories of some trainers being captured or killed so I guess I assume that might only happen after all their pokemon faint?

[Kareeah_Indaga]

Ah, I thought Shadow Storm was the weather/ field move

Oh, that’s Shadow Sky. I blame Gale of Darkness for being horribly uncreative with their Shadow move names.

Another question. Do wild pokemon ever target humans in these games, if they have their own pokemon out?

I know this is very similar to the handheld games so... no?

Though I have heard stories of some trainers being captured or killed so I guess I assume that might only happen after all their pokemon faint?

They can. With wild Pokémon it’s a lot more likely if they’re Shadowed. Usually the trainer’s Pokémon will protect them.

[Gnomes2169]

Oh, that’s Shadow Sky. I blame Gale of Darkness for being horribly uncreative with their Shadow move names.

Well, I wrote what I wrote and selected targets, so we'll just go with Shadow Storm this time.

[Lord Ruby34]

Not familiar with the terminology. What do you mean?

In the handheld games (at least gen IV and prior, I haven't made my way through the later games yet.) there's a setting that asks you whether you'd like to go with the default or change to set mode.

The default, switch mode, is that when you knock out an opponent's Pokemon the game tells you what Pokemon your opponent is going to send out and gives you the opportunity to switch. Notably, the opposing trainers do not have this option.

Set mode simply means that your opponent will simply send out their next Pokemon after one faints. This is the default for online battling, and is what is used (to the best of my knowledge, which is admittedly not much) for competitive Pokemon.

In the mean time (going back to being prepared) I’ve got the rest of your list and the rest of WindStruck’s as far as Pokémon you’re interested in, but everyone else, throw out a few Pokémon you’d want to have. It’s been a while since I asked for some of you and it would be nice to have a record on this forum, in addition to any updates you may or may not want to make.

I'll go with some updates/rehashing. Assumption is that I fail to catch anything before the list becomes relevant (and omitting anything present in the current encounter). No particular order, though Beldum/Phantasea/Naedire is at the top. But I'm honestly easy to please. EDIT: If I were to pick additional Pokemon from later gens this list gets a lot longer. Like I said, easy to please.

1. Beldum line
2. Phantasea
3. Naedire
4. Magnimite line
5. Eevee
6. Rotom
7. Mankey Line (Browsed Gen IX and Annihilape is really cool)
8. Bagon line
9. Electrike line
10. Slowbro Line
11. Feebas Line
12. Shuckle
13. Lucario Line
14. Spiritomb
15. Any tanky Pokemon with a type combination that includes two of (Steel, Psychic, Electric, Grass, Ghost)
16. A bunch of Pokemon from gen V+, with Mudsdale topping the list.

EDIT: After reading through the last IC thread, the Pokemon that taskmaster had at the shrine of light were both really cool, and could be put up there with Beldum. Phantasea and Naedire.

[Gnomes2169]

In the mean time (going back to being prepared) I’ve got the rest of your list and the rest of WindStruck’s as far as Pokémon you’re interested in, but everyone else, throw out a few Pokémon you’d want to have. It’s been a while since I asked for some of you and it would be nice to have a record on this forum, in addition to any updates you may or may not want to make.

Oh hey, didn't see this one. Honestly my team is pretty solid right now, but I wouldn't mind picking up:
-Any of the Snivy line
-Any of the Rowlet line (either-or for the Rowlet/ snivy. They're m' BOIS, but two grass starters seems a bit redundant)
-Any of the Tyranitar line
-Any of the Dragonite line
-One of the "Lesser" legendaries (you know, Latias, Latios, Suicune, etc). This is definitely going to happen and is very reasonable.
-A totally reasonable level 1 Arceus and all the type orbs. This is absolutely reasonable. The most reasonable request I've ever made. This won't just get power-leveled and become stupid. Don't worry about it.

[Feathersnow]

Pokemon requests-

Litwick line
Goomy line
Kommo-o line

[essCee]

In the mean time (going back to being prepared) I’ve got the rest of your list and the rest of WindStruck’s as far as Pokémon you’re interested in, but everyone else, throw out a few Pokémon you’d want to have. It’s been a while since I asked for some of you and it would be nice to have a record on this forum, in addition to any updates you may or may not want to make.

Whoo list update! All aren't just the Pokemon but the line overall

1. Makuhita
2. Venomoth
3. Fearow
4. Burmy
5. Altaria
6. Pinsir
7. Dunsparce

Since Dunsparce's evolution came 7 gen later and requires a move it didn't get until then, I'm guessing Dudunsparce is off the table?

[Kareeah_Indaga]

The default, switch mode, is that when you knock out an opponent's Pokemon the game tells you what Pokemon your opponent is going to send out and gives you the opportunity to switch. Notably, the opposing trainers do not have this option.

Set mode simply means that your opponent will simply send out their next Pokemon after one faints. This is the default for online battling, and is what is used (to the best of my knowledge, which is admittedly not much) for competitive Pokemon.

I don’t think I’ve ever codified it, but in general one-on-one official, League-sanctioned fights like Trainer Hill (and Gym fights, which I spell out because it has tripped up one or two players before) are switch mode, with the caveat that the opposing trainer CAN also switch. (In general, I try to assume that the rules that apply to the party are the same rules that apply to the NPCs. Also, PvP has happened occasionally.)

Double battles and free-for-all fights like the one you’re currently engaged in are set.

-A totally reasonable level 1 Arceus and all the type orbs. This is absolutely reasonable. The most reasonable request I've ever made. This won't just get power-leveled and become stupid. Don't worry about it.

Since Dunsparce's evolution came 7 gen later and requires a move it didn't get until then, I'm guessing Dudunsparce is off the table?

Remember the Move Tutor can tutor moves for other Generations, as long as your Pokémon is the level to learn the move in that Generation. So in other words, you can get Dudunsparce, but your Dunsparce has to get to level 32 and then you need to tutor Hyper Drill onto it first.

But that is not a no.

[WindStruck]

I guess I'll say for the record, I kinda like my pokemon cute and unevolved. Kind of like how Ash always had this Pikachu that was insanely strong but never turned into a Raichu?

But that said, Flotsam really does like her pokemon and wants them to be happy, so, if they want to do the evolving, then.. whatever!

[Kareeah_Indaga]

I guess I'll say for the record, I kinda like my pokemon cute and unevolved. Kind of like how Ash always had this Pikachu that was insanely strong but never turned into a Raichu?

But that said, Flotsam really does like her pokemon and wants them to be happy, so, if they want to do the evolving, then.. whatever!

Up to you either way; I will probably let you know when they're capable of evolving, but don't feel pressured.

[WindStruck]