D&D Honor Among Thieves - New Trailer

[CarpeGuitarrem]

Neat movie, the big emotional beat after the climax landed really well for me, and I was having fun mentally statting it up in Fate Core. It was kinda funny how low magic it was, honestly--most of the magic was just magic items. Didn't expect that. Gave it a nice old school feel.

They're still cowards for their orc and tiefling designs, especially given

Spoiler

Show

the Tabaxi and Aaracokra characters who were very prominently portrayed

Did love seeing so much love for the martial characters, even if it partially involved Doric forgetting to use her powers during some scenes.

[Peelee]

It does surprise me a little when people are saying Edgin must be a Mastermind Rogue because he doesn't cast spells. Based on the movie, I'd be shocked if he has an Intelligence score above 12, and his plans genuinely are kinda terrible most of the time. He just has the raw charismatic chutzpah to get people to go along with them anyways, and improvises well when they fall apart.

Seconded. He's the face of the party but his plans... Even when they're good, if they fail, he just makes the same plan again. Plan C was plan A and Plan D was Plan B, with minor variations.

Also, i don't know if i said it already, but i was 100% amped up for El Kabong as soon as he dug the lute out, and i was not disappointed.

[CarpeGuitarrem]

(Side note I thought it was a bit noteworthy that the credits very quickly and prominently mention D&D as "Hasbro's Dungeons & Dragons" and from my memory, Wizards only gets a mention at the end of the credits. I guess that's how they're using the brand now?)

[Anymage]

This only just hit me after reading a review, but "Simon the Sorcerer" and "Doric the Druid" sound like the sorts of characters you'd expect from players just making their first characters.

[Devlerbat]

Main reason I don't understand criticisms of Doric's design is because her design reminds me of Neeshka from Neverwinter Nights 2.

[Gnoman]

One thing has occurred to me after some time to think.

Spoiler

Show

The red horn is in some ways a very similar type of Evil Artifact as Crenshinibon from the early Drizz't books. Not identical by any means, but in plot terms both artifacts have similar potential destructive power, and both would result in a very similar level of Evil Power if they were used as intended. If they're trying for similar "power level" to the books, it is tuned pretty good.

[Ranxerox]

Neat movie, the big emotional beat after the climax landed really well for me, and I was having fun mentally statting it up in Fate Core.

Yeah, right? While watching it, I noticed that it seemed much closer to a Fate game than D&D. All of the characters seemed to spend two thirds of the movie picking up compels, so that they would have lots of Fate points to spend in the big battle.

[NRSASD]

Welp, I loved it. It’s the first film or show in a long time I would recommend without hesitation to anyone.

Things I really liked:

• Basically, all of it. There wasn’t a moment where I was disappointed.
• The “natural 1s” that happened to everyone, but in such a way as to not negate their characters. No one was an idiot, everyone was just weirdly, profoundly unlucky on occasion.
• The in-character arguments and bizarre conversations/stalling tactics with authority figures.
• The utterly convoluted schemes the party invented.
• The paladin, full stop.

Two things I almost wish could be better:

• The twists were extremely predictable. This wasn’t a bad thing, (they still landed), but the film never surprised me.
• I’m still mourning the loss of the older forgotten realms lore. This was an excellent D&D flick but a poor forgotten realms movie. To be fair, it isn’t trying to be.

[Willie the Duck]

It does surprise me a little when people are saying Edgin must be a Mastermind Rogue because he doesn't cast spells. Based on the movie, I'd be shocked if he has an Intelligence score above 12, and his plans genuinely are kinda terrible most of the time. He just has the raw charismatic chutzpah to get people to go along with them anyways, and improvises well when they fall apart.

Mapping any of this to actual D&D (be it stats, classes, level, or subclasses) is fraught with issues. In particular because D&D really wants you to lean into strengths (whereas narratives often work best when someone works against weaknesses). Edgin could be a Mastermind Rogue who is really bad at what that entails, or a bard who never casts spells. Overall, they clearly aren't working hard at shoehorning everything into D&D's iconic-role-conformity -- the sorcerer seems to have low charisma (at least in the force of personality part), the druid doesn't show any particular wisdom, the paladin (while well-loved for his deeds) isn't a good conversationalist, nor honestly does the antagonist wizard show any particular notable intelligence. Also the barbarian is better vs. hordes of normal guards but has a hard time against an animated statue, the owlbear takes on the flying wizard, and the paladin does well against assassins (who don't really try to get the drop on people and who not support each other's sneak attacks).

Overall, it is a highly-D&D inspired and themed movie, but it also clearly isn't conforming to D&D/beholden to enforce D&D-isms where they wouldn't work in the narrative. Honestly, it feels a little more like they are playing some OSR D&D where stats don't matter as much, there is less spellcasting to go around, non-fighters don't need to have weapons at all times (since their combat contribution, other than as distraction, is negligible), and when you aren't deploying a specific big trick like shape-changing/powerful spells/key magic item/being the barbarian it is probably better to look around for some something you can do with the scenery to help rather than spam lessor attacks or such.

[Trafalgar]

(Side note I thought it was a bit noteworthy that the credits very quickly and prominently mention D&D as "Hasbro's Dungeons & Dragons" and from my memory, Wizards only gets a mention at the end of the credits. I guess that's how they're using the brand now?)

Yeah, I noticed that too. It makes D&D sound like a game you keep on your shelf next to Monopoly and Battleship.

It would have been nice if they gave a shout out to Gygax and Arneson.

[Giggling Ghast]

I just got back from the movie. It was very tightly-plotted, surprisingly endearing and very funny at times. I don’t know if it was the best possible D&D movie that *could* be made, but it was a pretty darn good one considering how low expectations were for a new D&D movie after the 2000 film.

At the same time, Honour Among Thieves also made me intensely angry, because I suffered through Dragon Age: Absolution a couple months ago and it made me realize how much worse that series was in comparison to this movie despite all the similarities. I ended up shouting at my steering wheel a couple times on the drive home.

Spoiler

Show

So they have the arcane gate spill out the treasure to lure the people out of the arena, but like, they already saw the death tendrils coming down and the red wizard flying high in the arena. Why didn't they run out of the arena then to start with? Nothings really keeping them there.

Oh, that’s easy. Because Forge told them there would be a prize at the end of the games. Thus, any misgivings about the ominous cloud would be overruled by their expectations of a reward.

Just because they live in a fantasy world doesn’t mean the general populace isn’t dumb.

[Sian]

https://screenrant.com/dungeons-drag...ie-drizzt-cut/

Given how overexposed Drizzt is, I haven't got a problem with this

[PontificatusRex]

https://screenrant.com/dungeons-drag...ie-drizzt-cut/

Given how overexposed Drizzt is, I haven't got a problem with this

I don't think Drizzt could have been nearly as entertaining as Xenk was.

[Velaryon]

I would have been fine with a brief Drizzt cameo, something like bringing in the prisoners at the beginning of the movie and then going off to never be seen again for the rest of the film.

But in the role that Xenk ended up filling would have been way too much. Drizzt is far too angsty a character for the light tone this movie was going for.

[Lord Raziere]

Wow, my prediction that they would eventually make a Drizz't film after this is closer than I thought, they almost put Drizz't in this one. wise move that they didn't, the moment they make a Drizz't film and explain his Whole Deal, DnD movies being safe or uncontroversial will go up in smoke- which of course that they will inevitably make a Drizz't film, because Hollywood can't seem go two steps without walking into one these days.

but thats not the only problem with Drizz't. thing is, a Drizz't film wouldn't fit the fast and light mold with talkiness that post-marvel hollywood likes to do. I could see a Drizz't story working as a film, they're short and simple enough that they're almost begging to adapted onto the big screen. But they wouldn't be the kind of film that people do anymore: I could picture a Drizz't film being a slow quiet movie filled with building suspense punctured by sudden explosions of movement as Drizz't fights somebody or Drizz't being this terrifying batman-like figure that leaps from the shadows to kill you, things like that, but that would require post-marvel hollywood to stop going full throttle for a second and learn how to do things at a slower pace to fit Drizz'ts mood and tone.

but then probably they'd him into their current mold by putting him with his Icewind Dale friends and emphasizing the found family aspects and like, making Bruenor, Regis, and blonde barbarian dude the personalities to balance his quietness out while Cattie-Brie is his love interest, because thats basically what most of the books do already. would help them avoid depicting Menzobarranzan while they're at it, because if you think Drizz't is bad, imagine general audiences seeing the city where he comes from, yikes.

[t209]

Also part of me also think that Eilistraee would be less likely than Drizzt as well.
By that I wasn’t just saying Dark Elf, but their ritual dances.
Though I do like to see a scene where protagonists barged in the Drow “hideout” only to find that they are Good Drows making cookies for orphans and their quest giver was paranoid idiot who thinks that they are planning something devious with flour, milk, and sugar.
Maybe animated spinoff might work.

[MarkVIIIMarc]

Also part of me also think that Eilistraee would be less likely than Drizzt as well.
By that I wasn’t just saying Dark Elf, but their ritual dances.
Though I do like to see a scene where protagonists barged in the Drow “hideout” only to find that they are Good Drows making cookies for orphans and their quest giver was paranoid idiot who thinks that they are planning something devious with flour, milk, and sugar.
Maybe animated spinoff might work.

I played an Eilistraee Drow Druid for a year. Plenty of panther and spider forms. The other players AND characters kept an eye on my character the whole time.

I tried unsuccessfully to make it apparent the character acted "drow" because that is how you did not appear weak, and like you don't worship Lolth.

Them daywalkers were too busy staring at the cursed yellow orb and never figured it out.

Drizz't in an ensemble cast just may work. Alone he'd be like watching batman grouch for 2 hours.

[Talakeal]

Drizz't in an ensemble cast just may work. Alone he'd be like watching batman grouch for 2 hours.

As if that could be a problem!


I feel like the casting / makeup for drow is going to be a mine keg no matter how they do it.

[Giggling Ghast]

Jesus Christ, Craig, are you wearing blackface?

[Wintermoot]

If they are smart, when they bring dark elves into the movies, they'll tint their skin the kind of light blue or light purple (or light grey) that is prevalent in dark elf art online rather than go full black.

Going full black would be IP suicide.

I'd rather have 10 angry nerds yelling at me online because Drizzt isn't supposed to have light blue skin, than 10 million angry movie fans.

[Zevox]

If they are smart, when they bring dark elves into the movies, they'll tint their skin the kind of light blue or light purple (or light grey) that is prevalent in dark elf art online rather than go full black.

Going full black would be IP suicide.

I'd rather have 10 angry nerds yelling at me online because Drizzt isn't supposed to have light blue skin, than 10 million angry movie fans.

Purple is often how they're drawn even on their own book covers (Drizzt included), so I can't imagine there even being too many angry nerds if they were to go that route.

[t209]

Hence why they should have animated spin-off. Not much problem compared to live action and much more free form to not look weird (except if they go “Alien looking” Elder Scrolls variant).

[Talakeal]

Purple would be a good choice, if not book accurate, but I still feel like it wouldn’t be without controversy. Ditto with any racial choice they went with for casting. Total powder field.

[Bartmanhomer]

Purple would be a good choice, if not book accurate, but I still feel like ti wouldn’t be without controversy. Ditto with any racial choice they went with for casting. Total powder field.

Or the Pokemon Jynx.

[J-H]

Back in Baldur's Gate II, they did Viconia DeVir as blue-ish, and kind of light. I think black skin in a dark environment is going to be really hard to see, and support going blue/purple for drow. What did they do for the "Dark Elves" in the second Thor movie? I don't remember aside from giving them all identical masks (except the leader).

I don't think they'll get a movie though.

[t209]

In honesty, only animation, comic, and anime seems to have dark elves (but anime one leans towards swarthy skinned except for Dungeon Meshi…even if they are part of Elven culture).

[Eldan]

Back in Baldur's Gate II, they did Viconia DeVir as blue-ish, and kind of light. I think black skin in a dark environment is going to be really hard to see, and support going blue/purple for drow. What did they do for the "Dark Elves" in the second Thor movie? I don't remember aside from giving them all identical masks (except the leader).

I don't think they'll get a movie though.

In Thor 2, they were extremely pale.

[Giggling Ghast]

On a semi-related note, do you think the sequel could get away with a non-human villain, like a mind flayer? I mean, what with the cultural shift towards no longer depicting entire races as evil, human villains are probably a safe choice.

[t209]

It’s only Orcs, Goblins, and Drows, mostly for having popular facade than Illithid.

Spoiler: Baldur’s Gate 3 spoiler

Show

Even then, BG3 had non-evil Illithid for now.

Ironically, latter can also be WoTC fault if you remember Smedman’s Eilistraee or trying to amp up “evil Drows” to make Drizzt special.
Eilistraee still have issues, mostly their clothing optional religious practices. Though I do like to see some bullies whacking away cookies tray from a good Drow and heroes standing up to them.

[Gnoman]

On a semi-related note, do you think the sequel could get away with a non-human villain, like a mind flayer? I mean, what with the cultural shift towards no longer depicting entire races as evil, human villains are probably a safe choice.

"This particular <race> is evil" =/= "All <race> are evil". The movie actually explored that already with Thayans.