LaZodiac's Super Turbo Championship Edition Random Banter Thread #242

[LaZodiac]

So blizzard hurricanes and fire tornadoes. I gotta say, that's about as cool as it is terrifying.

Agreed on the programming. Very simple mistake to make, doesn't even seem like it is a mistake until the weakness in it is shown.

That being said, even in the movie, nope, the park fell before Sattler and Grant ever stepped onto the island. On the second day, Grant and the kiddos find raptor eggs. They're outside of the raptor pen, the eggs are already hatched, and apparently just that morning - you can see baby raptor footprints in the sand, IIRC. Regardless of whether Nedry crippled the system or not, they were less than 12 hours from hatching freely in the park. It was in the old enclosure, IIRC, which makes more sense.

I didn't get the sense chaos theory was really the big example in either case - both versions highlight the arrogance of corporate greed, the book just fleshes it out a lot more. Dr. Sattler still talks about how they picked plants for looks when they were poisonous, Dr. Wu still talks about how they picked what dinosaurs to breed by just blindly cloning every one they could and seeing what grew, the guy focused on money is Gennaro instead of Hammond but there's still a soulless money-man, Hammond himself still brushes off the mandatory inspection that his insurance and investors will pull out if they don't get an A grade as a fun weekend excursion and still disregards entirely everyone's concerns because they just don't understand, etc etc. Muldoon and Arnold are the only on-site staff who seem to have a decent grasp on both the dangers in general even when everything is functioning as designed (or at least appears to be), and also practicality when the **** hits the fan.

The big thing with chaos theory was the perfect storm of all the worst things happening at once. The breeding coupled with Nedry betrayal coupled with the tropical storm. No tropical storm, Nedry would have had their systems back on fairly quickly.

I genuinely do not recall that scene you're describing. I know a similar scene is in the book, and I know the second movie has a similar scene using the little pseudo-raptor guys, but beyond that I've got nothing.

Fair, I do always forget about the storm. That's part of the chaos theory vibes for the film- though also strongly an example of Nedry being a ****ing putz to decide to do his grand larceny of dino-dna on a day when they know a storm is coming, because I'm fairly certain they should have known a storm was coming.

And yeah, both book and movie have a focus on corporate greed, that's clear as crystal. I just think the book handles the chaos aspect of it better.

[Peelee]

I genuinely do not recall that scene you're describing. I know a similar scene is in the book, and I know the second movie has a similar scene using the little pseudo-raptor guys, but beyond that I've got nothing.

Fair, I do always forget about the storm. That's part of the chaos theory vibes for the film- though also strongly an example of Nedry being a ****ing putz to decide to do his grand larceny of dino-dna on a day when they know a storm is coming, because I'm fairly certain they should have known a storm was coming.

And yeah, both book and movie have a focus on corporate greed, that's clear as crystal. I just think the book handles the chaos aspect of it better.

They don't say they're raptor eggs like they do in the novel, but they're the same size and shape as the raptor eggs in the hatchery, and of the 15 species on the island, only raptors were bipedal with two-toed prints (their third toe was the claw that does not rest on the ground).


My love of Jurassic Park may border on unhealthy.

ETA: That was also the best time for Nedry to try. With the inspection going on, all eyes were on the park and the visitors, giving him significantly greater freedom to try the theft without raising eyebrows. It was planned in advance as well, so he was on a timetable that was not under his control, and when they reached the island, the storm had developed into a tropical storm (so it wasn't that before) and they still projected it to miss the island. It turned into the island against their hopes.

He could have tried to call it off because of the storm but it's unknown if he would ever get a better shot than during the inspection, and also the whole motif of greed.

And you're right, the book handles the chaos aspect better. It handles pretty much everything better. Still love the movie, though. Movie did give Lex purpose while the book had her as dead weight, which I enjoyed (both had their respective uses but I liked her being competent).

[Form]

That's horrifying. Reminds me of like, firestorms and ****.

On the continued discussion of one of my favorite books and also films; I really like the realism of the user error that helps the problems happen in the book. Designing a program to count how many dinosaurs there are, and give back an affirmative if the right number of dinos is MET... but not EXCEEDED, is one of those programming gaffs that I feel like everyone probably makes.

Of course if they had had a professional programming team that checks for edge cases and with things like code reviews, unit testing, Q&A etc. that would probably not have happened. One of many things they didn't bother with to cut costs and maximize profits, I'm sure.

[LaZodiac]

They don't say they're raptor eggs like they do in the novel, but they're the same size and shape as the raptor eggs in the hatchery, and of the 15 species on the island, only raptors were bipedal with two-toed prints (their third toe was the claw that does not rest on the ground).


My love of Jurassic Park may border on unhealthy.

ETA: That was also the best time for Nedry to try. With the inspection going on, all eyes were on the park and the visitors, giving him significantly greater freedom to try the theft without raising eyebrows. It was planned in advance as well, so he was on a timetable that was not under his control, and when they reached the island, the storm had developed into a tropical storm (so it wasn't that before) and they still projected it to miss the island. It turned into the island against their hopes.

He could have tried to call it off because of the storm but it's unknown if he would ever get a better shot than during the inspection, and also the whole motif of greed.

And you're right, the book handles the chaos aspect better. It handles pretty much everything better. Still love the movie, though. Movie did give Lex purpose while the book had her as dead weight, which I enjoyed (both had their respective uses but I liked her being competent).

Man it's been awhile. I forgot half of that ****.

While there is a lot of stuff the book does better, I think the movie benefits from some changes it performs (like as you said, Lex having a purpose) and from the sheer... movieness, of it. "They do move in herds" is an effective scene as a story but in a film? ****ing solid gold right there, 100%.

Of course if they had had a professional programming team that checks for edge cases and with things like code reviews, unit testing, Q&A etc. that would probably not have happened. One of many things they didn't bother with to cut costs and maximize profits, I'm sure.

True, true, for sure. A cavalcade of errors to be sure!

[Jasdoif]

Of course if they had had a professional programming team that checks for edge cases and with things like code reviews, unit testing, Q&A etc. that would probably not have happened.

I do wonder how much of the screenplay's divergence from the novels was aimed for the expected movie audience of the time. This was the early 90s, after all; the all-capable computer nerd and the evil-personified lawyer tropes were in vogue. (And to be fair, professional programming has evolved a lot since those days when public Internet was still nascent)

[LaZodiac]

I do wonder how much of the screenplay's divergence from the novels was aimed for the expected movie audience of the time. This was the early 90s, after all; the all-capable computer nerd and the evil-personified lawyer tropes were in vogue. (And to be fair, professional programming has evolved a lot since those days when public Internet was still nascent)

Honestly now that you bring it up, the "Nu-uh-uh" scene screams like, trailer bait.

[BisectedBrioche]

You're confusing him with Dr. Grant, the paleontologist.

...you are absolutely correct.

[Peelee]

Got a snorkel. Need to get used to the constant mouth breathing, but man, got me a third of a mile in 13:30. That's like a 40 minute mile, shaves dang near a quarter hour off my mile time once I get going on that. Doesn't even feel like I'm exerting myself much more, either.

[Beeftank]

Dang, that’s a really good pace if you can keep that up. I remember not too long ago you were saying 1hr+ for the mile so you’re definitely showing good progress.

[TaiLiu]

Idea: A museum that mummifies the donated bodies of volunteers in the Egyptian style complete with cloth bandages and sarcophagi and displays them in a mock-up of a traditional tomb with plaques describing the person and what they did in life in summary.

Other exhibits would talk about the cultural significance of mummification and the designs of various tombs in the different eras of ancient Egyptian society and the science behind the mummification process.

I think that would be pretty neat. I know that people donate their bodies for science and medicine and all that. Having your tomb in a museum would be cool as hell. "Kids, look, that's grandma!"

Flight and tactical teleportation come online at level 6 which isn't half bad. (Also, yes, they aren't technically casters, but invocation user is just so unneccessarily long and invoker never gained an official status until 4e which used it for something else entirely.)

That's true, but I think you can't pick up both flight and the teleportation at level six, right? Cuz you only got so many invocations? I may be misremembering.

I'm not aware of that being a common practice; I was referring to broad, deep graves lined with concrete, sometimes divided into levels with slabs of concrete to increase volume, covered by more slabs of concrete and complte with an aboveground frame of concrete plus a concrete walkway surrounding the frame. These monstrosities are often packed close together as well, creating large, contiguous surfaces all covered in concrete.

Oh, I see. Gotcha. Like the underground's concrete instead of soil.

Oh, I actually have a funny story about this (also about the only time you'll ever hear 'I have a funny story' that begins like this one does).

So my dad died when I was 19. Big shock, came out of nowhere, very unexpected. I actually have a whole 'nother story, the lasagna story, about that. But for this story, we're going to skip ahead directly to the funeral. My brother and I were still fairly young, so one of the attendees is his college roommate, Joey. Joey is a really great guy, and he was from Blountsville out in Blount County. For those unfamiliar with Alabama, there's nothing in Blount County except Blountsville, and even that barely counts. I know about it and even I couldn't point to it on a map. It's the boonies. Anyway, the whole funeral, he's being very respectful but he's also looking around every so often with this confused look on his face. Funeral ends and everyone starts to leave, and he goes into concern, bordering on full panic. Apparently Blount County has their own microculture - at a funeral, the attendees are expected to bury the deceased. As in, actually bury them. Shovel the dirt on them until the hole is filled. Joey had not been to a funeral in a big city before, and the whole time he was confused because he didn't see the shovels. He kept wondering if the graveyard staff would bring them afterwards since maybe in cities they didn't want the shovels visible during the funeral, and when people started to leave he thought that nobody was going to finish burying the coffin and started to panic, because he couldn't very well let his good friends father just lie in an unfilled hole in the ground! We had to explain to him that the cemetery would fill it in with earth movers and people weren't expected to shovel dirt at funerals and he calmed down.

With the benefit of hindsight it was really sweet that he would come thinking it would involve a good deal of manual labor. He's still a good friend to this day. To me as well. Just saw him after work tonight, in fact. He's got the best stories about boonie life, most of them involving Johnny or his mom, who actively went by the moniker "Johnny's Mama".

I like this story and like that you shared it. That's a pretty neat tradition. I wonder if there are any psychological benefits when you physically bury your loved ones.

[Jasdoif]

That's true, but I think you can't pick up both flight and the teleportation at level six, right? Cuz you only got so many invocations? I may be misremembering.

No, you're correct; invocations known is atrocious....You start knowing one invocation and learn one additional invocation every even level and at 11th level (to sustain the pattern of access to new grades of invocations, I presume).

[Rater202]

Spoiler

Show

This is William Grant Nelson. He is the son of Tigra and Giant-Man. Kinda. It's complicated.

He is adorable... But I can't get over the fact that his name is William Nelson.

This kid... This kid's gonna have a problem with catnip as an adult.

[enderlord99]

Just edited my last post in the MTG thread with a weird thing that happened. I would have made a new post, but... y'know.

[Peelee]

Dang, that’s a really good pace if you can keep that up. I remember not too long ago you were saying 1hr+ for the mile so you’re definitely showing good progress.

Feels like the same pace, I think it's just an issue of being significantly more aerodynamic and having less resistance against the surface.

Now if only they had swim time as a metric instead of running and strength, I'd be made in the shade. As it is the swimming is just a little treat for myself after the regular workout.

[LaZodiac]

Thinking about the term/concept of the "No-Prize", created by Stan Lee in response to people overthinking his work and finding reasonable in-universe explanations for things that happened that were decided on... for lack of a better term "off the cuff" writing. I've always kinda read this as intended to be like, a negative thing, at least in the intent he used it?

But to me it feels way more like a positive thing. You're engaged with and thinking about the media. That's cool! I think that disconnect is interesting.

[Rynjin]

I mean, Marvel definitely treated it as a positive thing, in a really tongue-in-cheek way. It never really seemed mean-spirited when No-Prizes were "given" in a letters column; at most it was treated as a lighthearted rebuff of "we appreciate you putting so much thought into this, but try to calm down a bit lol".

[Rater202]

That feel when your spelling/grammar checker tries to tell you that you need to replace "they" with "it" when you're talking about what is for all intents and purposes a human.

[Rynjin]

Not sure if the typo there is for added effect or not...

[LaZodiac]

I mean, Marvel definitely treated it as a positive thing, in a really tongue-in-cheek way. It never really seemed mean-spirited when No-Prizes were "given" in a letters column; at most it was treated as a lighthearted rebuff of "we appreciate you putting so much thought into this, but try to calm down a bit lol".

Yeah, fair, I'm probably just reading into it poorly. Never mind, thought removed.

[Rater202]

The thought occurs to me, not for the first time, that Tobirama Senu from Naruto is the thematic opposite of Goku from Dragon Ball.

He's constantly overshadowed by his contemporaries and successors and all of his signature techniques are associated with other people.