Financial Bomb Yet Influential Works

[t209]

Just remembered a movie called "Final Fantasy: Spirits Within", a movie with name of a game yet has non of its elements.
YET at the same time, said movie inspired two hits like Mass Effects game and Points of Authority music video.
I am wondering if there are similar movies/works that had those effects despite being known for financial failure or mediocre yet have left influence to (better) works?

[SerTabris]

I've never heard of FF Spirits Within being an influence on Mass Effect, though if you happen to remember the source for that I'd be curious to read it.
(Also, to be fair, having nothing to do with any (other) FF game is how Final Fantasy usually works.)

[Mechalich]

I've never heard of FF Spirits Within being an influence on Mass Effect, though if you happen to remember the source for that I'd be curious to read it.
(Also, to be fair, having nothing to do with any (other) FF game is how Final Fantasy usually works.)

Maybe on the technical side? Spirits Within did a number of innovative things in the VFX zone, several of which showed up in later Square-Enix games and potentially could have impacted things like facial animations in Mass Effect.

That's how most financial bombs are influential - through some bit of technical trickery that's really cool and interesting and gets adopted by a better work. I can think of a few possible examples in that regard, like Dredd (2012), which did a bunch of innovative things with slo-mo that seem to have proliferated across Hollywood since.

[Fyraltari]

Vidocq (2001) was the first movie entirely filmed on high-resolution digital cameras. It's pretty bad, but there you go.

[Ranxerox]

Blade Runner lost money at the box office, but was incredibly influential not just in how the mass public visualized cyberpunk, but also how they visualized the future.

[t209]

I've never heard of FF Spirits Within being an influence on Mass Effect, though if you happen to remember the source for that I'd be curious to read it.
(Also, to be fair, having nothing to do with any (other) FF game is how Final Fantasy usually works.)

It was based on this where the art team watched the Spirits Within movie for inspiration.
https://www.escapistmagazine.com/mas...asy-the-movie/
Also one helmet had that vibe.

[SerTabris]

It was based on this where the art team watched the Spirits Within movie for inspiration.
https://www.escapistmagazine.com/mas...asy-the-movie/
Also one helmet had that vibe.

Interesting, thanks!

[KillianHawkeye]

As I recall, they spent a large portion of the movie's budget animating the main character's hair, which is why almost everyone else has military-style buzz cuts.

And as for "having none of the elements" of a Final Fantasy game, the setting actually bore a lot of similarities to FF7 and FF8 which were both made not too long before the movie was, although the alien ghosts were an original twist. The story for this film could have easily been made into a game instead, if it had had a bigger villain than "crazy military guy shoots giant laser".

[Vinyadan]

The big idea in Spirits Within was that of introducing digital actors. The girl was supposed to appear in other movies, portraying other characters. It didn't really gain traction, but it explains why such expenses were put on her.

For me it's pretty easy to think of works that were good, but simply didn't have as wide or rich a distribution as works inspired by them. Zamyatin wrote "Us" before Huxley and Orwell wrote "Brave New World" or "1984". Svankmejer influenced Terry Gilliam, and so on. These aren't real bombs, however, just less well-known works. Music is probably choke-full of such cases, like the guy who invented moonwalking before MJ make it famous.

Apparently, Fight Club was a bomb! And so were The Insider and Iron Giant. Fight Club certainly left a mark in pop culture.

[Easy e]

I saw Final Fantasy: The Spirits Within in the movie theatre.

I immediately knew that digital actors was going to be the future and the technology keeps going that direction, even bringing dead actors back from the grave.

[Precure]

Early Disney movies.

[Vinyadan]

Vidocq (2001) was the first movie entirely filmed on high-resolution digital cameras. It's pretty bad, but there you go.

The Room was the first and likely only movie to be entierly filmed both digitally and on film. They always had cameras set by pair, one digital and the other analogic, recording at the same time. This means that there is a lot of unreleased material out there, but it is slightly off set compared to the one that made it in the movie (and I think the compresence of two cameras occupying the same spot might partially explain some oddly off-frame scenes).

[HolyDraconus]

As I recall, they spent a large portion of the movie's budget animating the main character's hair, which is why almost everyone else has military-style buzz cuts.

And as for "having none of the elements" of a Final Fantasy game, the setting actually bore a lot of similarities to FF7 and FF8 which were both made not too long before the movie was, although the alien ghosts were an original twist. The story for this film could have easily been made into a game instead, if it had had a bigger villain than "crazy military guy shoots giant laser".

Ironically enough, the plot kinda been cribbed for ff7r.

[Murk]

The Room was the first and likely only movie to be entierly filmed both digitally and on film.

Yeah, but The Room was both a financial success and an influential work, so that doesn't count!

[Gnoman]

Early Disney movies.

Disney didn't have a real bomb with their animated features until shockingly late. The somewhat lukewarm initial box office results of Pinocchio and Fantasia had more to do with those markets being cut off in the early 1940s for some reason, and were hugely successful on later rereleases during more peaceful times. After that, they had an unbroken string of box office successes until Alice in Wonderland in 1951. This proved to be an outlier, with their next real bomb being The Black Cauldron in 1981.

[halfeye]

Quite a lot of "fine art", Van Gogh and Rembrandt particularly, whose works are now sold for huge sums, but were skint in life. On a somewhat lighter note, Crumb and Banksie.

[Lord Torath]

How about "The Princess Bride"? It was not a financial success, but started a new genre of movie (which was why it wasn't a great success - the marketing department couldn't figure out what kind of film it was).

[Murk]

Quite a lot of "fine art", Van Gogh and Rembrandt particularly, whose works are now sold for huge sums, but were skint in life.

Rembrandts paintings were financially very succesful! In the periods that he was actively making and selling paintings he was very wealthy.

He had some periods of poverty when he stopped making and selling paintings (but kept the rich lifestyle), but that's not the paintings' fault.

[halfeye]

Rembrandts paintings were financially very succesful! In the periods that he was actively making and selling paintings he was very wealthy.

He had some periods of poverty when he stopped making and selling paintings (but kept the rich lifestyle), but that's not the paintings' fault.

Compared to the current prices of the paintings, he was always skint. Not that they are really worth their current prices, but that forbidden politics.

[MCerberus]

There have been entire documentaries just about why it bombed, but Citizen Kane did not make the money it was expected to, not even close. Again, the why is wild.

The movie is still the inspiration for modern cinematography to the point where its camera movements are still being dissected in academic environments. Also fun note, did not win best the oscar for that category.

[OracleofWuffing]

Do the Apple Lisa and Apple Newton qualify for this discussion?

[Gnoman]

Neither were particularly influential, so no. The Newton was just another early-90s PDA, and not even the first one. It had little impact on the market. LisaOS was heavily derived from Xerox work, and had little market impact in and of itself. MacOS did have real impact, but owed fairly little to LisaOS - the two were developed in parallel, and MacOS used a lot of ideas that had been discarded from the Lisa.

[The Glyphstone]

Neither were particularly influential, so no. The Newton was just another early-90s PDA, and not even the first one. It had little impact on the market. LisaOS was heavily derived from Xerox work, and had little market impact in and of itself. MacOS did have real impact, but owed fairly little to LisaOS - the two were developed in parallel, and MacOS used a lot of ideas that had been discarded from the Lisa.

The Newton - well, its inventor at least - did coin the phrase 'Personal Digital Assistant' in the first place. The Newton may not have been technically innovative or financially successful, but I'd give it some partial credit for creating the name of its entire product type.

[Cikomyr2]

The Thing was a critical and financial flop on release.

I am hard pressed to express how much influence it had on horror genre.

Edit: Roshomon was a flop in Japan, but its later popularity in the West (especially America) convinced him to make other samurai movies. Like Yojimbo and Seven Samurai

[OracleofWuffing]

Neither were particularly influential, so no. The Newton was just another early-90s PDA, and not even the first one. It had little impact on the market. LisaOS was heavily derived from Xerox work, and had little market impact in and of itself. MacOS did have real impact, but owed fairly little to LisaOS - the two were developed in parallel, and MacOS used a lot of ideas that had been discarded from the Lisa.

I was more concerned with whether they counted as "Works" before establishing them as stepping stones to later Apple products, but fair enough.

[Bohandas]

According to the studios most of the world's most influential films didn't make a profit. Because if the studios admitted they made a profit they would have to pay their taxes and their staff. The Fellowship of the Ring made such "horrendous losses" that they made two sequels and three prequels. Similarly Return of The Jedi lost so much money for Lucasfilm they only made eight more Star Wars movies.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hollywood_accounting