[5e Feat] Drow Mage Sign

[Segev]

This proposed feat is based on the idea that a language is a language, so how would a silent one handle verbal components?

Drow Mage Sign
Prerequisite: Must be a drow spellcaster or have Drow High Magic
You know the Drow Sign Language, and have honed it to the point that you can cast spells in it. When you cast a spell with a verbal component, you can provide that component with a free hand. This hand may not be used for somatic components nor to hold material components or a focus; the lingustic gestures are too intricate.



I am debating whether this feat should be a half feat. It would grant Int, Wis, or Cha if it were.

[Segev]

I continue to be torn on whether this is overpowered for a feat. It isn't quite subtle spell, but it would overcome the troubles of public casting by at least removing the audible portion, as well as allowing for casting in areas of magical silence or underwater or the like.

But it also is very not good for gishes, requiring two free hands if the spell also has a material or somatic component (or both).

[animorte]

Why Drow specific? I mean I guess it helps to narrow the availability, which is already only really useable as long as both hands are free (except for single component spells). Anyway...

No, I don't think it's too strong. It's similar to having subtle spell from Metamagic Adept except requires an extra hand, but it's unlimited use, the only reason it might be too much as a half-feat. I'd still be ok with it though, personally.

Another question on the mechanics of this: How does the casting of a V/S/M spell work when you need one hand on the material (or focus), one hand gesturing for somatic, and then no hand available for sign language to replace verbal?

[Wintermoot]

This proposed feat is based on the idea that a language is a language, so how would a silent one handle verbal components?

Drow Mage Sign
Prerequisite: Must be a drow spellcaster or have Drow High Magic
You know the Drow Sign Language, and have honed it to the point that you can cast spells in it. When you cast a spell with a verbal component, you can provide that component with a free hand. This hand may not be used for somatic components nor to hold material components or a focus; the lingustic gestures are too intricate.



I am debating whether this feat should be a half feat. It would grant Int, Wis, or Cha if it were.

Is the idea here that V/S spells becomes (DS)/S with drow sign on one hand and somatic on the second hand?
V/M spells become (DS)/M with drow sign on one hand and holding the material component with the second hand?
V/S/M spells are not transferrable because (DS)/S/M would require three hands?
V spells become (DS) and you have to have one hand free to cast?

Seems weak if so. Pretty much precludes gish builds entirely (one hand free means V only spells and there isn't a lot of them) and excluding V/S/M excludes a LOT of spells.

If so I would definitely make it a half feat,

[Ilerien]

Another question on the mechanics of this: How does the casting of a V/S/M spell work when you need one hand on the material (or focus), one hand gesturing for somatic, and then no hand available for sign language to replace verbal?

Spells with all 3 components are fine in this case, actually. A spellcaster must have a hand free to access a spell’s material components—or to hold a spellcasting focus—but it can be the same hand that he or she uses to perform somatic components.

[animorte]

Spells with all 3 components are fine in this case, actually. A spellcaster must have a hand free to access a spell’s material components—or to hold a spellcasting focus—but it can be the same hand that he or she uses to perform somatic components.

Umm, yeah. I may have overlooked the technicality. Nice!

Another thing that popped into my noggin. I'm wondering about the mechanical function with War Caster as well, which only mentions somatic components.

[Segev]

Why Drow specific? I mean I guess it helps to narrow the availability, which is already only really useable as long as both hands are free (except for single component spells). Anyway...

At least in other editions, drow have had a well-developed sign language that was exclusive to them. The idea for this feat builds off of that concept, which is why it's drow-specific. It could be "must speak a sign language," or it could just include TEACHING a sign language (as it kind-of does, now, since there's no specific drow sign language in 5e, and this feat gives it to you...which at the least would let you treat it like a secret language between other holders of the feat, I guess).

No, I don't think it's too strong. It's similar to having subtle spell from Metamagic Adept except requires an extra hand, but it's unlimited use, the only reason it might be too much as a half-feat. I'd still be ok with it though, personally.

Another question on the mechanics of this: How does the casting of a V/S/M spell work when you need one hand on the material (or focus), one hand gesturing for somatic, and then no hand available for sign language to replace verbal?

As noted, the same hand can specifically do somatic components and manage the material components of a spell, so you can do DS/S/M just fine as long as you have one hand free and one hand managing the somatic/material components. (I reiterate this only for completeness; I know you saw it and responded later.)

Another thing that popped into my noggin. I'm wondering about the mechanical function with War Caster as well, which only mentions somatic components.

War Caster lets you do somatic components even if both hands are occupied by weapons or shields. If you aren't needing a material component, then, you could have one hand (the one doing somatic components) holding a weapon or shield and use the other one for "verbal" components as long as it's actually empty. So an einhander gish could work this way, and I think that actually goes nicely with the style that bladesingers are known for, now that I think about it.

[sf_yak]

Being able to do magic silently is a pretty big deal out of combat situations. The requirement to use both hands for most spells is mostly a balancing point in combat situations as out of combat it's not a big deal to have both hands behind your back or both hands under the table.

I really like the feat but I agree with other comments that maybe it shouldn't be Drow only. I do think it should require proficiency with a sign language rather than requiring Drow. This is a bit awkward as sign languages weren't included in the base game but it might be enough to say "For example Common Sign Language or Drow Sign Language." With that requirement, I think making it a half feat would probably be ok considering the prominence of combat over non-combat in the default D&D game.