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  1. - Top - End - #1
    Firbolg in the Playground
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    Default Magical MacGyver side-by-side comparison game

    In another thread there's been discussion about which systems might ideally enable 'magical MacGyver' sort of gameplay - resolving situations that you didn't know about or intend to be able to resolve, by fitting together existing stuff in the system that you have access to on the spot. I'm not interested so much in 'how powerful' as much as 'what is the feel of resolving these situations in different systems?'. I know the feel of it in for example D&D or Mage or Nobilis, but I didn't have personal experience with GURPS. Also characters I build might (would) end up playing differently than characters others would build.

    So here's an idea. Every Sunday starting next Sunday I'll post a scenario, covering lets say a total of six scenarios.

    if anyone is interested, make your choice of character and post it - spoilered - in this thread (or maybe we should do this in Play-by-Post? Thoughts?):

    - A Lv9 character of your choice from any D&D edition you like in a setting with magicmart access and standard WBL, with half a level worth of XP floating for any XP/component cost issues for each scenario.
    - A 250 point GURPS character with say 10 floating points ready-to-spend in any given scenario (not cumulative) in a TL8-equivalent but fantasy-themed world
    - A character from another RPG of your choice, of around the same level of power (this isn't intended to be a contest or competition, so this is mostly here if you want to make a point or try the exercise with regards to how it feels)
    - Homebrew or particular readings of ambiguous rules is fine too, just describe how it works and mark it as such.

    The intent would be that these characters should be pretty versatile, but if you want to try a known non-versatile character build and still make it work that could be interesting too? Don't expect these to be combat scenarios, though if you can use combat as a proactive tool, there's

    To simplify things, since I want this to be mostly GM-less and self-contained:

    - Anything involving a dice roll, assume that if you have over 75% success rate its 100% and below 75% success rate its 0% unless you can retry without cost/consequence, in which case any success rate above 0% is 100% but treat it as taking proportionately longer. Damage rolls and the like should never matter for this, but what do I know, maybe there are weird builds where they would - in which case take average, or take maximum if you can retry without consequence. Any one-off rolls that might come up, take average. For rolling off of lists, please only use it if you can reroll without serious consequence until you get the result you're looking for.
    - Anything involving the possibility of combat I'll use either '(weaker)', '(equal)', '(stronger)', or '(overpowering)' to denote challenge - if you've built a combat-ready character you auto-win against (equal) and below in a straight fight and auto-lose against anything else. If you've built a more non-combat character you auto-win only against (weaker). If you can justify some sort of ambush/prep/situational advantage/weakpoint targeting/etc, go up one category. I'll leave it to the poster to evaluate for themselves whether their character is combat-ready in this way.
    - When there are questions e.g. 'would this work?' or missing information, treat it like you would if you were running the game and a player tried this, fill in the information as you would if you were running the scenario, etc. Maybe mark these points where you had to self-GM in red text to keep it clear.

    So anyhow, post your reaction to/resolution of the scenario in a spoiler, and any sort of commentary about how thinking through it felt that you feel like giving.

    Again, the idea here is more about what the feeling is of working through 'how to solve these scenarios' - is it frustrating, so trivial you don't have to engage, requires book diving, can be done by thinking about character abilities alone, requires coordinating with others in the scenario (NPCs), etc? So I'd like to ask to keep the 'no, that wouldn't work' kinds of criticism to a minimum - each poster is their own GM for this so if they would let it work, if that's how they see the rules, I'd still like to know that.

    Anyone interested?

    Edit: Threadmarks

    Scenario 1: Needle in a Haystack
    Scenario 2: Nautical Forgery
    Scenario 3: Gotta be the Economy
    Scenario 4: Dreamsick
    Scenario 5: Suntan Lotion
    Scenario 6: Timeless City
    Conclusion/Bonus Scenario: Wrap-up Party

    Telok's Bonus Scenario 1: Easy
    Telok's Bonus Scenario 2: Silly
    Telok's Bonus Scenario 3: Creepy
    Telok's Bonus Scenario 4: Magical
    Telok's Bonus Scenario 5: Talky
    Telok's Bonus Scenario 6: Mayhem
    Last edited by NichG; 2023-06-12 at 07:10 PM.

  2. - Top - End - #2
    Ettin in the Playground
     
    Telok's Avatar

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    Default Re: Magical MacGyver side-by-side comparison game

    I'm game.

    Thing is I'd be more on throwing DtD40k7e, Paranoia, and Traveller characters around. Not sure how genre specific you're thinking but I'm pretty certain a kobold werewolf tech-priest riding around in a space cruiser with 1000 loyal soldiers, spellcasting dragon buddy, Khorne as his personal career mentor, and dual weilding chainswords isn't what you had in mind (and that's still first level). Although there are options for DtD40k7e and Traveller to generate "barbarian" characters from non-tech societies.
    Last edited by Telok; 2023-03-21 at 07:06 PM.

  3. - Top - End - #3
    Firbolg in the Playground
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    Default Re: Magical MacGyver side-by-side comparison game

    Quote Originally Posted by Telok View Post
    I'm game.

    Thing is I'd be more on throwing DtD40k7e, Paranoia, and Traveller characters around. Not sure how genre specific you're thinking but I'm pretty certain a kobold werewolf tech-priest riding around in a space cruiser with 1000 loyal soldiers, spellcasting dragon buddy, Khorne as his personal career mentor, and dual weilding chainswords isn't what you had in mind (and that's still first level). Although there are options for DtD40k7e and Traveller to generate "barbarian" characters from non-tech societies.
    Well, do you think it would be an interesting mental exercise to figure out how those characters would resolve conceptual/economical/existential/high-fantasy scenarios? If so, then no problem!

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    Bugbear in the Playground
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    Default Re: Magical MacGyver side-by-side comparison game

    I'm not good enough at any system to participate in this but just know that i am intrigued.
    Just a note i got adhd and autism.

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    Default Re: Magical MacGyver side-by-side comparison game

    I've recently witnessed a fair amount of builds running through one same scenario in this exact fashion. Maybe you acquired inspiration from the same source?

    Is the plan to do something very similar? Say, you put up a scenario and I create various characters perhaps from different systems entirely to attempt the run. I'm assuming this is the intent. Only real limit to those tests is getting them in before you pot the next test.

    Or is this looking to make just one character and see how well it addresses the varying scenes presented each week?

    You could start a thread in "finding players" strictly for this. It seems fun, but I've noticed that's a bit more structured and might seem to be more pressure. As long as you preface it with "constant recruiting, no player limit, just a place to test out some of your ideas through my scenarios."
    Something Borrowed - Submission Thread (5e subclass contest)

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  6. - Top - End - #6
    Firbolg in the Playground
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    Default Re: Magical MacGyver side-by-side comparison game

    Quote Originally Posted by animorte View Post
    I've recently witnessed a fair amount of builds running through one same scenario in this exact fashion. Maybe you acquired inspiration from the same source?

    Is the plan to do something very similar? Say, you put up a scenario and I create various characters perhaps from different systems entirely to attempt the run. I'm assuming this is the intent. Only real limit to those tests is getting them in before you pot the next test.

    Or is this looking to make just one character and see how well it addresses the varying scenes presented each week?

    You could start a thread in "finding players" strictly for this. It seems fun, but I've noticed that's a bit more structured and might seem to be more pressure. As long as you preface it with "constant recruiting, no player limit, just a place to test out some of your ideas through my scenarios."
    I do want the characters to be locked in before I post scenarios, because part of the point is the ability to adapt to things that you didn't expect to need to deal with (or that were even necessarily 'on the table' in the genre and expectations of the system). My observation in the other thread was that some systems (of which D&D is the one I'm most familiar) create natural puzzles based on the way their pieces can be put together whereas other systems that might be broader or more directly 'trying to be appropriate' for certain kinds of things actually end up feeling flatter - because they minimize interactions between game elements, because they give a lot of freedom to the player to just say 'I do X thing' as long as its thematically related, versus having to build out 'how' you do that X thing, etc. So there's some kind of sweet spot where things are flexible enough to be able to address out of context problems, but not so flexible that you can just say 'I make a thing that addresses the out of context problem'.

    GURPS was mentioned and I don't have experience with it (and its a lot to buy and read through just to come to a determination!), so I thought this could be a way to see how people who have that experience would put together GURPS' pieces to form new solutions in unexpected situations.

    I'm much more interested in how it feels to solve the situation than whether a character can solve the situation or how well they do in a pass/fail sense, though its completely fair if a poster said 'yeah I don't see how the character I posted could handle that'. But if you can build characters in reaction to the scenario I think you wouldn't see for example if some systems (or some options within systems) are better at letting you pivot or improvise, while with others you might be able to be good at anything but you had to decide that long before and it ends up being more brittle.

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    Default Re: Magical MacGyver side-by-side comparison game

    Quote Originally Posted by NichG View Post
    I do want the characters to be locked in before I post scenarios, because part of the point is the ability to adapt to things that you didn't expect to need to deal with (or that were even necessarily 'on the table' in the genre and expectations of the system).
    That's completely fair. If each person had the opportunity to build various characters in response to the scenarios, it wouldn't really prove much in the way of creativity or character design.

    I am interested in doing this and hope I have the time to actively contribute. I will take the time to construct my "cantripologist" based on 5e TomeLock (probably)... We'll see.

    (Don't be surprised if I show up in here with a Pony as well, claiming victory in the name of friendship.)
    Last edited by animorte; 2023-03-22 at 05:33 AM.

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    Default Re: Magical MacGyver side-by-side comparison game

    Quote Originally Posted by NichG View Post
    ... if some systems (or some options within systems) are better at letting you pivot or improvise, while with others you might be able to be good at anything but you had to decide that long before and it ends up being more brittle.
    That, I think, might also be affected by how some potential scenarios might map into different game systems. If you have a game with a couple metacurrencies where a starting character could map to D&D 5e as a "1st level" character with 16 in all stats, expertise in all skills and saves and tools, then that's going to be a bit more... competent?... no wait, they're hitting normal task/dc15 at 85% before boosts... eh, whatever... Anyways, a game that is predicated on characters being competent action heroes and manages that in it's mechanics is going to need scenarios and tasks presented differently than one which assumes characters on a zero-to-hero arc. Heck, Paranoia and Amber Diceless* characters will have hilariously different outcomes from anything you'd expect normally. Paranoia characters can die twice just trying to get their equipment requsition filled, and Amberites can just walk to a shadow with a ready made solution waiting for them to pick it up.

    Ok, ok. Yeah, I'm in. This'll be hilarious. I'll work up characters from three different games and we'll see how they do.

    * rpg based on Zelazny's 'Nine Princes in Amber' series. Characters are of the titular lineage, explicitly full adult expert immortal superhumans with reality bending powers, and only effectively challenged by other members of the family. Gameplay revolves around manipulating situations to bring your (or an allied) character's dominating ability or attribute into play and trying to impose restrictions on the other side.

  9. - Top - End - #9
    Bugbear in the Playground
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    Default Re: Magical MacGyver side-by-side comparison game

    I'm having fun trying to figure out a Chuubo's miraculous arc that is at a sweet spot between "has no relevant abilities" and "can wish to have already solved the problem". Troubled specifically designed for this kind of character, with the ability to conjure up information out of nothing, the miraculous ability to make it so whatever their gimmick is can solve the current problem, the ability to guarantee that an opportunity will arrive just before disaster, and more.

    Then again, you could get pretty far with a Mortal character that's got an affliction like "I've got whatever I need in my bag."

  10. - Top - End - #10
    Firbolg in the Playground
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    Default Re: Magical MacGyver side-by-side comparison game

    Sounds like fun!

    I... will, I guess, be an example of "what it looks like for an ignoramus to take the test", as I loathe book diving.

    Further, I plan to "cheat", and I want to get your take on whether my cheating will be within the spirit of the game. For example,
    • Some of my characters (including Quertus, my signature academia mage for whom this account is named (although he's too high level to participate)) are more "I know a guy..." than actually likely to do things themselves. "Character-diving" rather than "book-diving", as it were. Which... among other things, only helps in scenarios where they have time to do so.
    • I plan to use back-up plans. I plan to multiply the chance of failure of each of the plans together, and, if the final chance of failure is less than 25%, say that it meets the required "75% success" to win. Among other reasons, this is because, in one of the homebrew systems, almost nothing has a 75% chance of success, like, ever. I think I may have run the only character to ever have a skill that would succeed your requirements.
    • As I am AFB (in this case, meaning I don't own or cannot find my copy) for some systems, I may try some of the characters as "conceptual". Theory being, "I buy a folding boat" doesn't require a fleshed-out character sheet. While it may result in numerous "???" results for final outcome if I cannot adjudicate certain rolls, it may still give a feel for how such characters go about solving problems.


    So, I'll probably try some crazy systems, in addition to having "here's how common systems played badly (wrt book diving) look like" for comparison.

    Sound at all helpful to your experiment?

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    Default Re: Magical MacGyver side-by-side comparison game

    Quote Originally Posted by Quertus View Post
    I... will, I guess, be an example of "what it looks like for an ignoramus to take the test"
    You don't mind if I challenge you to this title, do you?
    Something Borrowed - Submission Thread (5e subclass contest)

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  12. - Top - End - #12
    Firbolg in the Playground
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    Default Re: Magical MacGyver side-by-side comparison game

    Oh... another thought - D&D usually involves a whole party, who can Voltron their abilities, alongside that of their purchases. Wouldn't it make more sense to make a <game unit> of character(s), rather than just a single character, to explore what the experience actually looks like? Or are we just using Schrödinger's party to compliment our single character?

    Quote Originally Posted by animorte View Post
    You don't mind if I challenge you to this title, do you?
    Hahaha, by all means!

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    Firbolg in the Playground
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    Default Re: Magical MacGyver side-by-side comparison game

    Quote Originally Posted by Telok View Post
    That, I think, might also be affected by how some potential scenarios might map into different game systems. If you have a game with a couple metacurrencies where a starting character could map to D&D 5e as a "1st level" character with 16 in all stats, expertise in all skills and saves and tools, then that's going to be a bit more... competent?... no wait, they're hitting normal task/dc15 at 85% before boosts... eh, whatever... Anyways, a game that is predicated on characters being competent action heroes and manages that in it's mechanics is going to need scenarios and tasks presented differently than one which assumes characters on a zero-to-hero arc. Heck, Paranoia and Amber Diceless* characters will have hilariously different outcomes from anything you'd expect normally. Paranoia characters can die twice just trying to get their equipment requsition filled, and Amberites can just walk to a shadow with a ready made solution waiting for them to pick it up.

    Ok, ok. Yeah, I'm in. This'll be hilarious. I'll work up characters from three different games and we'll see how they do.
    Great!

    'Uber-competent at anything that can be resolved with a skill check' might be hardmode for some of the scenarios, easymode on others, depending on how you choose to interpret normal/hard/etc thresholds for tasks in the lens of the system, and how strict the system's boundary is about 'what can be done with a skill' vs 'what requires a power'. Anyhow, thats why I suggested bringing in Lv9 characters in D&D since that's kind of in the spot where (at least in 3.5) you'd have stopped asking questions like 'can this character succeed at the thing they're supposed to be good at?', and there should be a wide set of competencies outside of the main one envisioned. Skill list only Paranoia characters will definitely be hard mode, but if you include the ability to purchase gear from the campaign-format Paranoia then maybe... but I look forward to being surprised!

    I'm curious about Amber. Because of the GMless structure, I'll leave it to you to 'run' your own interaction with shadows based on what you think would be reasonable given the details I put in the scenario as far as e.g. 'ability to find things that interact directly/indirectly with this'. It might still give rise to interesting stories even if it doesn't give rise to meaningful difficulty, which I'd also be curious about.

    Quote Originally Posted by Quertus View Post
    Oh... another thought - D&D usually involves a whole party, who can Voltron their abilities, alongside that of their purchases. Wouldn't it make more sense to make a <game unit> of character(s), rather than just a single character, to explore what the experience actually looks like? Or are we just using Schrödinger's party to compliment our single character?
    You can if you want, but I think its more revealing if its a single character without implied party support. If you want to have a couple characters and just 'see which scenarios each character bounces off of' that's fine. Of course you can also use wealth to hire NPC services to fill in this or that missing bit - that kind of flexibility to use e.g. wealth, residual unspent XP, etc is part of the experiment. Of course also feel free to note 'if I had a cleric here, I could ..., but I don't so I can't' or things like that.

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    Firbolg in the Playground
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    Default Re: Magical MacGyver side-by-side comparison game

    OK, I guess I'll edit this to include actual stats as time goes on, but here's some placeholders for some of the characters I'm thinking of:

    Spoiler: 2e D&D - "High" Priestess Arma
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    Spoiler: Blurb
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    2e doesn't have WBL, treasure is normally quite random, so I chose the existing character I can best remember their items at 9th level, Armus, and am giving (what I can remember of) Armus' 9th level items to a brand new character. To maximize their personal ability to do stuff, I'll make them... probably a Cleric, who uses Skills & Powers to get schools of Wizard spells, too - as a Cleric, they have all their spells for free, and access to the most spells.
    Spoiler: Stats
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    Arma
    Human Fighter 2 / Cleric 9
    Str 11 -> 18(100)
    Dex 5
    Con 4
    Int 11
    Wis 17
    Chr 15

    Weapon Proficiencies: Long Sword, Short Sword, Hand Crossbow, Throwing Spikes
    Non-Weapon Proficiencies: Read/Write, Riding 3-, Rope Use 12-, Throwing 10

    Magic Items: Dwarven Short Sword +2, Sword of the Planes, Cloak of the Bat -> Daemon Wings (flight allowing her to distinguish herself as the "high" priestess), Golden Lion Figurines ("Awesome", "Charger"), Ring of Regeneration, Rechargeable Rod of Swarming Insects, Boots of Speed Sir Robin, Bag of Devouring Portable Black Hole, Potions of Healing x5, Scroll of Simulacrum x3, Amulet of Perpetual Youth and Inexperience.

    Mundane Items: Holy Symbol w/ Divine Tears, Elven Longbow, Arrows (~17 or so), tunic, breeches, snakeskin belt, waterskin, rations, poison, mallet & spikes, 50' rope, gloves, cheat sheet of names.

    Organic Resources: Homebrew Living Armor (adds to AC, HP), Homebrew ???? (flying mount, dissolves instantly in water antimagic), Ancient Shadow Dragon Simulacrum (on another plane...), undead x lots (depends on if item crafting comes online by level 9)

    Magic: 155 spell points, all Cleric spells, and Wizard spells from Illusion, Transmutation, and... Enchantment/Charm(?) schools.

    Needed: Cash on hand (mostly from 1k potions and scrolls)
    Spoiler: Comments
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    Stupid random stat rolls. I had to swap 2 of the stats to even be able to play a Cleric. As long as we're having fun with 2e, and get half the XP for the next level, I'll go ahead and spend a little of that XP on Fighter 2, requiring the purchase of Gauntlets of Ogre Power to successfully Duel Class (the rules legality of this has been brought into question, but it matches everything I've seen from 2e). Normally, a character has a 75% chance of making people at worst "Cautious"; with a 15 Charisma, this becomes a 75% chance of making people at worst "Indifferent". With an 18 Charisma, that would be a 75% chance of at worst "Friendly". Diplomancy seems an option here. Since she can only craft scrolls and potions at 9th level, I guess she'll buy items to boost those to 75% chance of success.
    Spoiler: Skills & Powers Math
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    Fighter () + Level () + Cleric (125) + Level x8 ()

    216 Major Access to all Cleric Spheres
    -102 all but Healing delayed to 9th level (Necromantic delayed to 5th)
    21 Wizard Illusion Spells, delayed to 9th level
    21 Wizard Transmutation Spells, delayed to 9th level
    21 Wizard ____ Spells, delayed to 9th level
    10 Weapon Selection (can use all weapons)

    -15 Armor Restriction (no armor)
    -5 Awkward Casting Method (Amine / MCU Dr. Strange light show on steroids)
    -2 Behavior (must break 4th wall)
    -2 Behavior/Taboo (puns are sacred)
    -10 Hazardous Spells (1 dmg / spell level, save for half)
    -5 Slower casting time (+3 init)
    -8 Talisman/Symbol (requires Divine Tears focus)
    Spoiler: History
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    Arma was always teased for her Daemon blood, but, after the world ended, she found it let her travel places no one else could live. She quickly amassed a fortune from the remains of abandoned cities, and joined the Church of Dungeons and Dragons. (Not the Revised church, or he Reborn church, or the Restored church, or the Reclaimed church, the Re:Zero church). There, she established herself as "High" priestess through the use of daemonic wings.

    Since then, she has worked to help or hinder the pockets of humanity / pockets of reality that remain in the wake of the end of the world as tickles her fancy.

    Mostly, these days, she sits around wearing her Amulet of Perpetual Youth and Inexperience to retain her youthful good looks while brewing potions... sometimes healing, sometimes poison, always a gas at parties.


    Spoiler: 3e D&D - Tainted Wizard
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    Spoiler: Blurb
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    Arcane Spellcaster has the most tools to work with, but Wizard can actually learn and repeatedly cast their spells, so I was debating on this one. So it's a choice between "best ability to buy 1-shot solutions" and "ability to buy repeated solutions to problems". Obviously, I'm being lame, and mostly just buying spells as my solutions to problems, to minimize book diving.
    Spoiler: Stats
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    Whizzy
    Human Wizard 8 / Tainted Sorcerer 1

    Str 10
    Dex 12
    Con 17
    Int 12
    Wis 16(24)(4)
    Chr 3

    Needed: Skills (Knowledges, presumably Spellcraft), Feats (mostly prereqs and "more spells"), items (mostly just Wis boost), explicit listed funds.
    Spoiler: Notes
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    Stupid random stat rolls. OK, I guess Whizzy is all alone because nobody wants to adventure with uncouth, abrasive Whizzy. I guess a talking familiar buy items from the shop (even Leadership is out of the question), and Command Undead for the heavy lifting.


    Spoiler: Paradox 1e - Telepathic Vampire
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    Spoiler: Blurb
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    In a percentile system where "75%" is an almost unheard-of level of skill, I'll be desperately trying to layer plans to make a cumulative 75+% chance of success. Which will be difficult, given how few skills the characters usually have. Totally a hard-mode entry for this contest, despite not feeling that way in game.
    Spoiler: Stats
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    Telepathic Vampire

    Telepathy 80%
    Diplomacy 70% (covers almost all social skills)
    Stealth 60%
    Perception 50%
    Barter 40% (one social skill it doesn't cover)

    Special: Probability Manipulation (+2% all rolls), Vampire (anything classic - regeneration, fangs at will, unaging, no biology, etc. Also, blood diet, blood for mana, and severe sunlight allergy.), Psychic Vampire (steals skills of those he eats)

    Dwoemers: Perfect darkness (**** sunlight, but can still see), Perfect Illusion (doesn't look like a cloud of darkness)

    Personal Items: Business suit, cell phone, personal forcefield generator, disruptor, extra blood.

    Owned: Lawnmower collection, wealth, karmic wealth
    Spoiler: History
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    This poor being thinks it's an Isekai of my old character, accidentally summoned when the Hero was summoned to defeat the Daemon Lord, but is in reality more like a Doppleganger programmed in his image.

    Needed: Fix skills? Include stolen Leadership, Command, Engineering, Science, and Business skills? Or don't even bother?


    Spoiler: Paradox 2e - Cutter Fyord
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    Spoiler: Blurb
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    I doubt we'll learn much from this, but... this character wins by "taking infinity". Given enough time, they will eventually succeed at anything. We'll see if they can actually succeed at anything first try.
    Spoiler: Stats
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    Cutter Fyord
    Physical 1 (5)
    Mental 3 (4)
    Spiritual 3 (4)
    Katana of the Forbidden Flower (Increases Physical to 3, Increases Mental to 4, allows burn health for extra actions)
    Snapblade Wakizashi (Increases Physical to 5)
    Tanto of Lost Dreams (Increases Spiritual to 4, other powers moot)
    10 lbs of Dream (think shapesand)
    Mended Gee
    of Bouncy Balls (no, that isn't a typo) (produces endless bouncy balls)


    Spoiler: Marvel FASERIP - Mutant -> Wizard
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    Spoiler: Blurb
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    Marvel uses random rolls for character creation. I don't care what the character starts out as, I'm going to spend XP to make them a Wizard, dagnabbit! This will be funny in the context of this challenge, as none of their skills will be at 75%, *but* they can spend Karma (XP) to automatically make rolls. Perhaps this character will also be an item crafter, as, with the right skills and powers, that can be huge in Marvel (note to self: research item crafting for other characters, too).
    Spoiler: Stats
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    John Faseman
    Random Mutant

    F Gd(8)
    A E(16)
    S In(36)
    E Am(46)
    R Ex(16)
    I Ex(16)
    P Am(46)

    106 Health, /149,998 Karma
    Popularity? Resources? (Resources -1 CS)

    Powers
    Hyper-Invention Rm(26)
    Energy Absorption - Magic Rm(26)
    Telekinesis In(36)
    Hyper-Speed Am(46)
    Disintegration Am(46) {20 areas, about 10 city blocks, 46 cubic feet of matter}

    Spells
    Fire Generation Ex(16)
    Cold Generation Ex(16)
    Electrical Generation Gd(8)
    Life Form Creation Ex(16) {max 1 lb, costs 1 health/oz}

    Talents

    4 powers, 3 talents, 3 contacts

    Needs: pick original talents and contacts (includes mutant group), Actually spending Karma to boost stats, buying Contacts for new world (government, guild, Isekai classmates, adventurers), purchase new talents, maybe purchase new powers and build items from time Isekai'd
    Spoiler: Initial Stats
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    John Faseman
    Random Mutant

    F Gd(8)
    A E(16)
    S In(36)
    E Am(46)
    R Ex(16)
    I Ex(16)
    P Am(46)

    106 Health, "78" Karma
    Popularity? Resources? (Resources -1 CS)

    Powers
    Hyper-Invention Rm(26)
    Energy Absorption - Magic Rm(26)
    Telekinesis In(36)
    Hyper-Speed Am(46)
    Disintegration Am(46) {20 areas, about 10 city blocks, 46 cubic feet of matter}

    Talents

    4 powers, 3 talents, 3 contacts
    Spoiler: Rules
    Show
    Decided that I'd give them enough Karma to take all their stats and powers up to the mid-point of the next level, but spend that Karma as I choose.
    Spoiler: Karma Math
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    1,400 Stat Cresting x7
    1,620 Gd(8) -> Ex(20)
    9,450 Ex(16) -> Rm(30) x3
    5,950 In(36) -> Am(50)
    36,000 Am(46) -> Mn(75) x2

    2,500 Power Cresting x5
    9,100 Rm(26) -> In(40) x2
    11,900 In(36) -> Am(50)
    72,000 Am(46) -> Mn(75) x2

    149,920 Total
    Spoiler: Comments
    Show
    Well, I rolled "Random Mutant". Mutants are known for becoming casters, so hooray. And some absolutely amazing stat rolls doesn't hurt. I was just going to be "mutant Wizard with random mutations they didn't use", except... Marvel allows rolling power categories and picking sub-powers, and I rolled such perfect categories and such high power levels for the powers, I couldn't help using them.
    Spoiler: History
    Show
    Imagine a world of sword and sorcery, where warriors make epic feats look easy, and wizards juggle arcane energies unknown to science. Where monsters lurk in dark places, and adventurer guilds call the noble heroes to safeguard humanity. Where a little faerie ripped the daemon lord in half with her bare hands.

    Turn the clock back a decade or two, and you see a classic fantasy world, prepared to summon Heroes for their Isekai adventure. As fate would have it, this particular summoning spell happened to target a classroom that was a government experiment, where mutants were with government permission secretly attending school alongside normal students, because the school was about to loose funding due to their poor performance.

    Normals and mutants alike were whisked away to a fantasy world. Our protagonist, John Faseman, was afraid of showing off his phenomenal power, and took to training as a mage. Of course the local wizards taught him spells like Fire Bolt and Ice Lance; however, the first custom spell he created on his own, Life Form Creation, proved strong enough to turn the tide of the war even more surely than his own mutant powers. He had witnessed Kryptonians (in a crossover event), and, although his capacity with the spell was limited, John created a miniature, 1' tall versions of Supergirl. This, his first daughter, proceeded to single-handedly wreck entire dungeons - sometimes literally.

    Some experimentation later, and he produced something of a half-breed Kryptonian / faerie. Regrettably, his second daughter was more strong-willed, and less... covert than his original creation, and proceeded to solo the Daemon Lord, ripping him in half with her bare hands.

    Although most of the heroes went home after the Daemon Lord's defeat, John chose to stay behind (in part to clean up his mess). Now John acts as guildmaster for a prominent guild, prepared to shepherd the next group of Isekai heroes for when one of the 666 Daemon Lords inevitably gets resurrected.


    Spoiler: Shadowrun - Troll Wizard
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    Spoiler: Blurb
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    Totally a combat character, whose only ability to solve any of these non-combat challenges will likely involve inventing a new spell.
    Spoiler: Stats
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    Gear: Panther Assault Cannon (Damage: Dead (resist with 2 successes of 18+ on exploding d6's)

    Needs, like, any stats at all?


    Spoiler: Mutants and Masterminds - Matter Transmutation Mutant
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    No (M&M) book diving necessary (although science book diving may help), this character will test the ability of transformation powers and wealth to solve problems.

    Needs, like, any stats at all.


    Spoiler: Mutants and Masterminds - Omni-Wizard
    Show
    This could involve book-diving: does the system contain a power which can solve the problem? If so, the Omni-Wizard can get (at least a weak version of) it.

    Needs, like, any stats at all. Maybe. Variable 10(8).


    Spoiler: Warhammer - Total Mess
    Show
    Spoiler: Blurb
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    Yeah, this isn't a character, so much as "every ability of me picking and choosing from among every all but the one craziest Warhammer (40k and Fantasy) character I've ever run, rolled up into one conceptual character. I expect they'll have a really high failure rate at these challenges.
    Spoiler: Stats
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    6-armed half-breed chaos troll chaos marine w/ Mark of Tzeentch

    Mutations: 6-armed (3x attacks), half-breed (changes stats), Tough (adds to Toughness), Unique: mutation analysis (allows detection and identification of mutations), Wings (fly speed)... Regeneration? (regenerates 1 health per turn?)... "Eat your brain" (gain memories from eating the brains of others (yeah, Space Marines are totally normal)

    Blessings: Mark of Tzeentch (adds to casting power), Blessing of Tzeentch? Winds of Change? (adds or subtracts from stats)

    Magic Items: Sword of Gears (terrible, *but* stores the souls of those killed; can "implant" stored souls in other bodies), Burning Book (like "Book of Infinite Spells", but only for Flames of Tzeentch; miscast -> book catches fire, must put out in increasingly crazy ways or book burns to ash)

    Tech Items: Kustom 6-armed Terminator Armor, Plasma Rifle x3 (unlimited ammo when powered by armor), Infinite Possibilities Gauntlet (just a Warpstone-studded fist, causes mutations in those struck)

    Low-tek Items: Choppa x4 (really, just helicopter blades)

    Organic Resources: Bio-engineered Transparent Face-Huggers (provides extra layer of protection), Acolytes x3 (T, Sac: negate one miscast)

    Spells / Psychic Powers: Vomit (makes target throw up in their mouth) ... "spacial manipulation" (makes all ranges count as most favorable to me for perception, ranged attacks, etc (custom improvement to existing power)), Probability Manipulation (gives a bonus to rolls?)... Flames of Change? (deals damage and causes mutations)... Regeneration (so unnecessary on this character, but regenerates health, lost limbs/organs, etc)

    Skills (boy, these systems aren't terribly compatible on skills, and I'm going from memory): Um... Melee, Ranged, Psychic, Medicae, Bio-Engineering, Bluff, More Bluff, Carousing, Barter,

    Special: Infiltrator (believed to be part of systems he does not belong to), Imperial Requisitions (can attempt to requisition items from the Imperium), Chaos Requisitions (can attempt to trade (or 3e Diplomancer "trade") with others), Time Traveler (has foreknowledge of events due to being from the future), Fate Points (allows rerolls).

    Needs... base stats? Except the systems aren't compatible, so...


    Spoiler: MtG - Pauper changes to expensive Elven Chronomancer deck
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    Spoiler: Blurb
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    Also not really a character, just "can I McGyver a solution out of Magic cards?" I suspect that this not-a-character will give the strongest "Magical MacGyver" feel of any of my submissions.
    Spoiler: Rules
    Show
    Not much for rules, just trying to limit how many cards it would take, and measuring how quickly / effectively / completely it solves the problem. Also, trying to limit myself to "cheap" cards in real-world currency for the actual solutions. I should *probably* build a base deck, that the poor MtG Mage has to hack cards out of to solve whatever problem they encounter. Hmmm... it'd probably be hard for me to have a better base deck than my old "Elven Chronomancer" deck. Also, the efficacy of MtG solutions may depend greatly on how long one adjudicates a round/turn to take...
    Spoiler: Stats
    Show
    (Yeah, it's just a deck list)

    4x Llanowar Elves
    4x Fyndhorn Elves
    4x Elven Mystics
    4x Priest of Titania
    2x Wellwisher
    4x Wirewood Channeler
    4x Skullclamp
    2x Gaia's Blessing
    1x Naturalize
    1x Channel
    1x Time Walk (OK, I didn't own this one)
    1x Time Twister (Nor did I own this one)
    2x Beacon of Tomorrows
    6x Unaccounted for... (was Elvish Visionary and some mana dumps, IIRC)
    4x Tropical Island
    4x Breeding Pool
    2x Hinterland Harbor
    10x Forest

    Needs... Sideboard, Followed Footsteps, what's the mana dumps?


    Spoiler: Star Trek - Staltek Vir
    Show
    Spoiler: Blurb
    Show
    Yeah, um... not someone with personal power to do much of anything, but... how many problems can't be solved with the judicious use of a Transporter, Replicator, Holodeck, etc?
    Spoiler: Stats
    Show
    Lt. Commander Staltek Vir, Federation Psychic Phenomenon Expert
    Chief Science Officer aboard the USS Zero
    (Now embedded observing a primitive pre-industrial advanced-telepathic culture)

    St 16(+4)
    DX 20(+8)
    Ct 15(+3)
    Mn 18(+6)
    Lk 18(+6)
    Ch 10(+0)

    Skills: Sciences, Psychic Phenomenon x2, Generator Theory, Transporter Theory, Replicator Theory, Holodeck Theory, History, Psychology x2, Diplomacy

    Powers: Empathy (know emotions), Telepathy (know thoughts), Telekinesis (move objects).

    Personal Gear: Phaser, Comm Badge, Tricorder, Psychic Webbed Gloves.

    Available: Everything (Transporter, Replicator, Holodeck, Portable Shield Generators, Antigrav Lifts, portable tractor beams, etc)

    Needs: "away team" composition
    Spoiler: Rules
    Show
    This character uses a "heavily modded" version of Star Trek Frontier (the rules are so nonexistent, there's more patches than rules), most notably a highly-expanded skill list. For adjudication, the quick of it is, there's no penalty for not having a skill; skills can only provide nebulous bonuses. So all rolls - except Charisma rolls and opposed rolls - will automatically succeed at 75+%.
    Spoiler: History
    Show
    Lt. Commander Staltek Vir has always wanted to study psychic phenomenon, and assist the psychic technology or evolution of the Vulcan race. Unfortunately, he was assigned to Engineering duties straight out of the Academy as an Ensign aboard the USS Javeline. Although he managed to acquire a cache of ancient telepathic artifacts to study during his time there, to his chagrin, he managed to be assigned by Star Fleet to captain his own ship, the USS Ambergris, before finally being assigned more appropriately as Science Officer aboard the black ops USS Zero, a time-traveling D'deridex under the command of a Romulan captain, who treats federation rules and even the Prime Directive as suggestions (although, curiously, he does encourage the Federation's more... hedonistic tendencies).

    At last, Lt. Commander Vir finally has been assigned a post that allows him to pursue his life goal of studying psychic phenomenon, in the cloaked system dubbed the D'deridex Daedalus system. Initially uncertain he had adequate training to avoid breaking the Prime Directive while studying and interacting with the natives, LtC Vir quickly found that the natives a) had members powerful enough to read his mind; b) that they were aware of other worlds and could even use their psychic powers to travel between them; c) that they had no interest in "taking levels" in his "inferior alchemist class".

    Maintaining any pretense of secrecy or the need for such no longer being a concern, Staltek Vir has managed to, in the words of the Zero's security officer, "beamed down and set up everything short of a working Star Base", and the natives have shown complete disinterest in Federation or Romulan (or other "borrowed") tech, leaving LtC Vir free to openly conduct all the experiments he wants on their psychic powers. His current goal is to find some way to earn enough of their money to purchase the psychic artifacts that they simply produce and sell like common trade goods.


    Spoiler: WoD Mage - shut-in
    Show
    Spoiler: Blurb
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    Yeah, so... this young guy has agoraphobia, and never leaves his house (Sanctum). He's surrounded by friendly spirits, all in the form of video game characters.The bags under his eyes are from staying up late, playing video games (feeding the spirits Quintessence). A life-sized R2-D2 takes deliveries for him, which is how he gets groceries, and shipments of video games and systems.
    Spoiler: Stats
    Show
    Alex Knight
    WoD Mage - Virtual Adept Orphan

    Str 1 Dex 2 Sta 4 (late nights)
    Chr 2 Man 4 (influencer) App 2
    Per 4 (video games) Int 5 (illogic) Wit 2

    Magick: Arete

    Merits: Computer Adept, Spirit Nexus

    Flaws: Child

    Needs: Skills, Magick, work on probability math
    Spoiler: Notes
    Show
    I'm really gonna have to do the math, and see what level of Arete makes it even possible to hit a 75% chance roll...
    Spoiler: History
    Show
    Alex has always played video games. They were his only friends, as the outside world was scary. When his parents died, they stepped out of their games to help him cope. Over time, he has built a shrine to games, a single system that comprises all known gaming systems. Recently, his video have begun playing video games - especially one in particular, called "Another World". They aren't very good at the game, so Alex helps them cheat, by using his 'leet skills to transport goods and characters from one video game to another.


    Spoiler: WoD Mage - Harry, the Happy Hermetic
    Show
    Spoiler: Blurb
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    Yeah, that last one doesn't do WoD justice, so here's Harry, the happiest Order of Hermes mage ever, who finds that everyone completely believes in his spells.
    Spoiler: Stats
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    WoD Mage - Order of Hermes LARPer

    Needs, like, any stats whatsoever.
    Last edited by Quertus; 2023-03-25 at 05:23 PM.

  15. - Top - End - #15
    Ettin in the Playground
     
    Telok's Avatar

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    Default Re: Magical MacGyver side-by-side comparison game

    Quote Originally Posted by NichG View Post
    I'm curious about Amber. Because of the GMless structure, I'll leave it to you to 'run' your own interaction with shadows based on what you think would be reasonable given the details I put in the scenario as far as e.g. 'ability to find things that interact directly/indirectly with this'. It might still give rise to interesting stories even if it doesn't give rise to meaningful difficulty, which I'd also be curious about.
    I won't do Amber, it's probably too off from what you're thinking of. I think I'll stick with fun & capable but unoptimized characters from DtD40k7e, Traveller, and Paranoia. The only one that'll take any work is the DtD one. I'll find a random R&D gear generatior somewhere for the poor Paranoia schmuck.

  16. - Top - End - #16
    Firbolg in the Playground
    Join Date
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    Default Re: Magical MacGyver side-by-side comparison game

    Alright, scenarios written and locked in, so they won't change based on whatever characters people post.

  17. - Top - End - #17
    Ogre in the Playground
    Join Date
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    Location
    GitP, obviously
    Gender
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    Default Re: Magical MacGyver side-by-side comparison game

    Some character ideas:

    Spoiler: Cantripologist (5e)
    Show

    Probably Shadow Sorcerer/Celestial Warlock: Pact of the Tome (minimum 11 cantrips at level 4).

    Level distribution will depend on how I determine the value of meta-magic vs invocations. Don't be surprised if I toss in another class for more cantrips.

    Will very likely have a race that provides additional spell availability plus a feat (or two) that adds more spells.


    Spoiler: Tails of Equestria
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    You read that correctly, My Little Pony.

    We've got several young ones that appreciate the simplicity and it's been fun. I'll most likely just drop in the character sheet for my Telekinetic Unicorn.

    It's actually pretty darn sweet. Think 5e Psi Warrior with Mage Hand and Floating Disk (et al).


    May not get to these...
    Spoiler: Cleric (3.5e)
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    I was once asked what I thought was my most overpowered character of all time. This was my second RPG character I ever made and it's been a while. Either I'll have to rebuild the sheet or abandon this build entirely as I may not have enough time.

    I'm pretty sure it was a Dwarf with Travel and Trickery domains.


    Spoiler: NecroFist
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    Worlds Without Number

    This is such a cool system. It's not overpowered and not very difficult, but the sheer amount of skills you can build for (not at once) brings so many different possibilities to life.

    I found a pretty neat interaction (if I've understood correctly) that would allow a certain warrior/mage to recover health each time it punches something. It would very much come across as a "punch first, ask questions later" character so I fully expect it to fail miserably in anything else.


    Spoiler: Risus
    Show

    In this system, you can do literally anything you want, it seems.

    You have a limited number of Clichés you can start with (limited by your own imagination) up to 10d6 distributed as you see fit (nothing starting above 4d6 and no more than 5 different ones).

    If your few Clichés are clever enough, I expect they could account for any number of circumstances. Just make sure you don't spread yourself too thin by either metric. Only limit is you can't be too vague, though ambiguity is in the eyes of the beholder GM.

    Everything is determined by opposed rolls until somebody runs out of dice.


    I'll be coming back to edit these as I have more time to do so. Looking forward to it!
    Something Borrowed - Submission Thread (5e subclass contest)

    TeamWork Makes the Dream Work 5e Base Class Submission Thread




  18. - Top - End - #18
    Ettin in the Playground
     
    Telok's Avatar

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    Default Re: Magical MacGyver side-by-side comparison game

    Ok, DtD40k7e v1.t character, plus a silly backup one.
    Spoiler
    Show

    Dungeons the Dragoning 40K 7e v1.t, a d10 exploding dice pool roll & keep Frankenstein's monster of a system. We aren't considering this character actually buying or looting anything but a few cheap spaceship consoles and some better armor & weapons for the bodyguards. This is a dryad vampire vice president of new markets for the Aztechnology megacorporation, with a personal space cruiser and a lot of contacts. The character isn't optimized, they're quite competent but not optimized for anything. If you want optimized we could thrown down a character with with followers (10k), wealth(millions), contacts(many), backing(faction leader), holdings(a planet) at 5s, 3 other exalt allies, and fame 1.

    stats (specialty allows rerolling 1s if they apply):
    Spoiler
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    intelligence 4 (puzzle solver)
    wisdom 4 (attentive)
    willpower 3
    strength 2
    dexterity 3
    constitution 2
    charisma 4 (eloquent)
    fellowship 4 (persuasive)
    composure 3

    skills (and the most common attribute used):
    Spoiler
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    arcana(int) 1 -> 5k4
    academic lore(int) 1 -> 5k4
    forbidden lore(int) 1 -> 5k4
    tech use(int) 1 -> 5k4
    common lore(int 1) -> 5k4+5
    craft(wis) 1 -> 4k4
    perception(wis) 0 -> 4k3
    medic(wis) 1 -> 5k4
    politics(wis) 1 -> 5k4

    brawling(level) 2 -> 5k2
    ballistics(level) 2 -> 5k2 if proficient in weapon
    drive(int/dex) 1 -> 5k4, cars, tanks, mecha, trains, etc.
    pilot(int/dex) 1 -> 5k4, planes, spaceships, hovercraft, submarines, etc.
    weaponry(level) 0 -> 1d10-1
    acrobatics(dex) 1 -> 4k3
    athletics(con/str) 1 -> 3k2
    larceny(dex) 1 -> 4k3
    stealth(dex) 1 -> 4k3

    scrutiny(cmp) 3 -> 6k3
    charm(fel) 1 -> 5k4
    persuade(cha) 3 -> 7k4
    animal ken(cmp) 1 -> 4k3
    command(cha) 1 -> 5k4
    deceive(cha) 1 -> 5k4
    intimidate(cha) 0 -> 3k3
    disguise(fel) 1 -> 5k4
    perform(fel) 0 -> 3k3

    backgrounds:
    Spoiler
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    inheritance 3 (best cybernetic cortex implant = +1 int & +5 on common lore tests)
    wealth 3k3+5 (easily buy easily buy meltaguns, anti-tank rockets, grand daiklaives, chain-swords, powered exoskeletons, medevac helicopters or top of the line laptop computers, if using tricks to reduce target numbers then las cannons, power armor, lightsabers, and Bugatti Veyron luxury sports cars are not difficult)
    contacts 5k5 (leader of all Ventrue clan vampires, regional manager of ComStar FTL communications for the Mt. Celestia political region, an Inquisitor of the human Imperium, an admiral in the Elven Imperial Navy, Factol of the Doomguard Sigil Faction)
    followers 2 (20 fanatic loyal personal guards/assistants)
    mentor 3(the spirit of Tiamat who is temporarily dead again)
    holdings 3 (spelljammer, a light frigate of 325 meters and 530 crew)
    backing 4 (is the vice president at large of new markets for the Aztechnology megacorporation)

    Species: dryad: size 4, +fellowship or + wisdom, +animal ken & +scrutiny, ability - pollenate: duplicate the effects of Attraction spell using level+fellowship instead of the spell casting test (Attraction, TN 20, full action, mind affecting, saving throw wisdom+arcana, non-combat, subtle, touch, one hour duration, affects creatures within 30 meters, if targeted on a person they get +1k1 all social rolls else if targeted on a thing people will interact with it)
    Exaltation: vampire, bitey, undead, see in the dark, old money
    Spoiler
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    powers: old money (extra background points), undead resilience (requires an explosive/energy crit-5 to the heart or power weapons, artifacts, or magic to kill and cannot die from limb critical damage), sunlight weakness (negated - see feats), blood dependency (lose 1 resource point per day & comatose without blood), bite attack (+1k1 rending natural weapon with brawling tag and does extra fatigue damage), doesn't eat breathe bleed or get poisoned/drugged
    resource: blood, 5x power stat, spend up to power stat per round, used to gain extra reactions, gain extra dice on checks, or heal hit points.
    power stat 1: see in all darkness & +1k0 perception checks
    power stat 2: spend 1 blood to gain Fear(1) for the rest of the scene (will save vs TN 15 - in combat roll on shock table for stun fleeing penalties and insanity damage OR out of combat take penalties & if save fails by 10+ take 1d5 insanity damage)
    power stat 3 (character does not yet have, costs 400 xp): spend 1 blood point to gain 1 extra half action

    classes - negotiator, courtier, diplomat (class completion bonuses +2 resolve)

    feats & assets & xp spending (estimating about 2500 xp gain to "half way to max" although it really depends on the class track, this is about 11 game sessions worth of xp):
    Spoiler
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    starter xp 600 + 400 from 4 hinderance + 2500 to mid level = 3500 total
    600 xp charisam 1->4, 300 xp composure 1->3, 800 xp assorted skill ranks, 400 xp backgrounds (mentor holdings backing), 100 xp vampire Ventrue clan asset (+5 wealth tests & +1 contacts & peer(Ventrue vampires +2k0 social checks)), 200 xp power stat 1->2, 100 xp veteran asset (+1 wisdom & +1 tech use & enemy), 100 xp dryad photosynthesis species asset (for vampires removes sunlight sensitivity), 100 xp academy asset (weapon proficiencies basic & ranged 1), 900 xp feats -> courtier's privilege x3 (bonus backgrounds), discipline (+1 resolve), protocol (int+common lore vs 15 save against damn fool mistakes), peer (dragons) & good reputation (dragons) (+2k1 charm persuade & command skills), eidetic memory (never forgets), language (elven)


    stat line: hp 10, resilience 5, armor 0, static defense 23, dodge 4k3(avg +10 def), fatigue limit 3, speed 5m & run 30m, initiative 1d10+6, mental/social defense 20, resolve 9, devotion/religiousness 6(Raven Queen), sanity 100, resource points 10 & regain by biting, hero points 2, languages: dryad, trade, assimar, tifeling, elven

    combat (most NPC/monster static defense TNs are in the 15-20 range, armor runs 0-10 points, and resilience is mostly 3-5):
    bite: 5k2 @ 3k2 rending, pen 0, inflict fatigue if wounds, regain 1 resource and +1 more fatigue damage point on wounding
    lasgun on full-auto: 7k3 @ 3k2 energy, pen 0, range 30/120/180/240, rof s/3, ammo 60 & 1 full turn reload, +1k0 damage per 5 over defense to max +3k0, reliable - misses instead of jamming(requires rolling four 1s)

    Starting gear: knife, common clothing, lasgun & 2 e-clips, med-kit, comm-bead, tricorder, laptop computer.
    Easily purchased (and proficient with) if needed: grenade launcher, flamethrower, web gun, plasma grenades, best Quality silver cestus, low quality power fist, laser sniper rifle, automatic lockpicking tool.
    not proficient with but can easily afford: plate armor, powered exoskeleton, light ballistic mesh, high quality flak jackets, electro-flail, goremaul, meltagun, plasma rifle.

    roll percentages:
    Spoiler
    Show

    Weirdly the game came out 2 years before D&D 5e but has the absolutely exact same TN/DC chart in it with 15=normal & 30=near impossible.
    Resource points can be spent for extra +1k0 on any skill/ability check or save, up to 2/round
    hero points (refresh per session) can be spent for a reroll after rolling or a -5 target number Before rolling, or both.
    Stunting can be done as often as the GM will put up with, simply describe what the character is doing pretty well and involve the scenery/setting in some way, allows for some minor player directed scenery editing (if you need curtains to dramatically swing on then they're there), gives 1-3 bonus rolled dice.

    3k2 - 80% 10+, 45% 15+, 20% 20+
    5k2 - 95% 10+, 60% 15+, 35% 20+
    3k3 - 90% 10+, 65% 15+, 35% 20+, 15% 25+
    4k3 - 85% 15+, 55% 20+, 30% 25+, 15% 30+
    6k3 - 95% 15+, 80% 20+, 50% 25+, 30% 30+
    7k3 - 85% 20+, 60% 25+, 35% 30+, 20% 35+
    4k4 - 90% 15+, 65% 20+, 40% 25+, 25% 30+
    5k4 - 85% 20+, 60% 25+, 35% 30+, 20% 35+
    7k4 - 95% 20+, 85% 25+, 60% 30+, 40% 35+
    5k5 - 90% 20+, 70% 25+, 45% 30+, 25% 35+
    6k5 - 95% 20+, 85% 25+, 65% 30+, 45% 35+


    Common benchmark NPCs
    Spoiler
    Show

    Generic humanoids: commoner, guard, soldier
    Spoiler
    Show

    Prole: size 4, Level 0, stats 2s, initiative +4, common lore & JOB SKILL 3k2, perception 1k1
    hp 4, resilience 3, ap 0, def 14, dodge 2k2, speed 4/24, mdef 15, resolve 4, devotion 6
    brawl 1k1 @ 2k1 I pen0 +fatigue, gear: clothing, pocket change, chrono or cheap comm or job tool

    Guard/Law: size 4, level 1, CON&WIS 3, else 2, init +2, perception 4k3, brawl 2k1, shoot 3k2, common
    lore & politic & scrutiny 3k2, first aid 4k3, 50/50 command or persuade 3k2
    hp 6, resil 4, ap 5 chest (armor vest), def 17, dodge 2k2, speed 4/24, mdef 15, resolve 4, dev 6
    brawl 2k1 @ grapple 6k2 v sz+str, hand cannon 3k2 @ 3k2 I p3 35m s/- 6a 2f
    K.O spray: dodge tn 15, 4m*2m cone, con 15 inhale vs +fatigue, 2 ammo, 2 full reload
    gear: armor vest, comm-bead, spray reload, hand can & 2 clips, handcuffs, badge, donut, torch

    Soldier: size 4, level 2, phy 3, else 2, init +5, athletic & acrobat 4k3, weapon & shoot 4k2, scrutiny & intimidate & perception 3k2, 50% drive 4k3, 50/50 command or craft 3k2
    hp 7, resil 5, ap 5 (FLAK body & head), def 17, dodge 4k3, speed 6/36, mdef 15, resolve 4, dev 6
    knife 4k2 @ 4k2 R p0 throw 5m @ 2k2, lasgun 4k2/6k3 @ 3k2 E p0 60m s/3 60a 1f reliable
    gear: flak vest & helmet, 2 knife, lasgun & 2 clip, 2 smoke grenades(2k2 @ blast[5] 9m), comm-bead
    chrono, torch, collapsible shovel, uniform, mission gear (rebreather - multitool - maps - MREs)


    Combat Servitor: kill-bot death machine
    Spoiler
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    size 6, level 2, str con 5, dex will 3, wis 2, else n/a, init +3,
    fight 5k3, perception 4k1, +MINDLESS +FEARLESS +pre-loaded IFF software & datajack back of head
    hp 16, resil 4, ap 10 all(machine), def 13, dodge 2k2, speed 3/18 no-swim crawler
    light vehicular multilas (heavy): 5k3/7k4 @ 3k2 E p0 s/8 60m 80a +reliable +recharge 1 shot/min, claw: 5k3 @ 6k2 R p0 +snare
    immune fatigue toxic disease breath eat environment bleed mental biology (not stun immune)
    SPECIAL: crawls over impassible terrain, gun in gizzards hit loc, 2 claws & 2 arms


    Cocaine Wizard Journeyman: is high
    Spoiler
    Show

    level 2, sz 4, cha int wis will 3, else 2, init+4, arcana & academic 6k3, deceive & common & forbid 4k3, charm 3k2, scrutiny & ballistic & brawl 4k2, TESTED, perf. memory, foresight(10m=+1int)
    backing 2(CW guild), wealth 2, mentor 3(coke wiz L3), ally 2(wiz L2), contact 1(dealer)
    hp 5, resil 4, ap 5 all(mageAC), def 19, dodge 2k2, speed 4/24, mdef 15, resolve 5, devotion 6
    autopistol: FAB 4k3 @ 2k2 I p0 30m -/6 12a 1f, slap fight: 2k2 @ 2k1 I p0 +fatigue
    gear: implement(rod staff wand orb), charm, magic theory book, chrono, nice clothes, autopistol & 2 clips, Cocaine Wizard Guild Official Member Card & Discount Coupon, 10g of coke, serious pocket money
    Abj 2: 1% warp
    shield : 10 Re S,self : parry d10 => 1=+7, 2-3=+10, 4-7=+12, 10=+15
    mage armor : 15 Hf S,touch, 24h : d10 => 1-2=fail, 3-6= ap 3, 7-9=ap 4, 10=ap 5
    Evo 1: 5% warp, ignores 2 points of Aura for damage
    magic missile : 15 Hf S,attack,30m,auto-hit : 2k1+1 E dmg d10 => 1-2=fail 3-7=1x & 8-10=2x



    spelljammer:
    Spoiler
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    Type: Thresher (Frigate), Class: Destroyer, Price: Holdings 3
    Shields: Standard Mk III (125 points & 20 regeneration)
    Hull Points: 60, Crew: 16, Crew Quality: 3, Fore Guns: 3, Aft Guns: 2
    Initiative: +15, Speed: 10 VU (60,000 km per turn), Static Defense: 14, Maneuver: +5, Acceleration: +10, Sensors: +5
    Ship Size: 57 = about 325 m. Crew Number: about 536 people

    Weapons:
    3x fore Torpedo Launcher
    2x aft Light Positron Array (fires as a single weapon), Range 16 (96,000 km), Arc normal (aft and sides), Accuracy +0, Damage 6k4, Shield Disruption 8, Critical Chart Roll +0
    light array orbital bombardment: 600m radius, 6k4 damage, armor penetration 8

    Torpedoes:
    15x Quath Torpedo, Range 20 (120,000 km), Arc narrow (forwards only), Accuracy +0, Damage 4k4 (phases through shields to hit but crit is reduced to +0 if shields are up), Shield Disruption +0, Critical Chart Roll +8
    quath orbital bombardment air burst: 1200m radius, 8k8 damage, armor penetration 16
    quath orbital bombardment ground burst: 200m diameter crater (automatic vaporization of targets), 400m radius blast increment (damage halves at every additional increment), 10k10+15 damage, ignores armor

    Consoles:
    Arcana 1/1, Command 1/1, Engineering 0/1, Tactical 2/2, Universal 1/1, Total 2/6.
    Teleportarium: Arcana, Boarding Actions at 5 VU (30,000 km) if there are no shields plus Star Trek transporter style beaming about
    Partial Wing: Universal, Antigrav plus landing gear allows ship to land safely
    Library Computer: Command, Gain +1k1 to all Lore tests and make them untrained when using it
    Murder Servitors: Tactical, Gain +2k1 to repel boarders and put down mutinies (total 5k4 unless the ship's tactical officer has brawling/weaponry skill of 4+)
    Cargo Bays: Universal (in tactical slot), Big open spaces to ship lots of stuff


    alternate silly super focused optimized character: 2500 xp gnome daemonhost mercenary, tactical officer, chief security officer, walking gunshow, living fortress, filthy rich teleporting monster summoner who leads a bunch of mercenaries.
    Spoiler
    Show

    stats: int 2, wis 3, will 5(stubborn), str 2, dex 2, con 3, cha 2, fel 2, cmp 2
    skills: ballistics 5(heavy metal), brawling 5(biting), academic lore 1, craft 1, medic 1, perception 3, command 3, intimidate 3, scrutiny 2
    backgrounds: allies 3 (rogue trader starship captain, cocaine wizard, cleric of Lolth), wealth 5 (filthy rich), followers 3 (100 loyal mercenaries)

    species: gnome, size 3, weapon proficiency basic, armor proficiency light
    exaltation: daemonhost, bitey, resist damage, free magic school
    resource: essence, will+cha+2x power stat, on use change to resonance, clear resonance with bite or will vs 10+2/resonance if fail still clear resonance & -1 hp & retry until success
    power stat: 1= reduce damage by con+power stat unless from silver or magic
    classes: mercenary, tactical officer, chief security officer, walking gunshow, living fortress

    xp & stuff: 4x hinderances (law of the stars(principled), slowpoke, intolerance(politicians & lawyers), night terrors), +2 wealth, +1 ballistics, +2 brawling, +3 hp from mercenary & walking gunshow, +2k2 leading & resisting boarding attacks if serving as tactical officer on a ship, veteran (+will +ballistics +old enemy), language(), sound constitution (+1 hp), master of orbital bombardment, worf barrage (space combat buff), extracurricular study (crisis zone 1), worf effect (enemies shoot me first), match frequency (space combat buff), paranoia (+2 initiative), lend expertise (space combat buff), rock & roll (+5 to hit per consecutive round of full-auto shoots), improved weapon focus (+0k1 with machine guns), crushing bear (free auto-damage while grappling), death before defeat (spend a hero point to ignore the effect of a non-killing critical hit), +1 followers & +1 style point

    gear: power armor, las cannon, machine gun, missile launcher, magic carpet*, jet pack*, fancy clothes, power fist, doc-bot 9000*, AT-ST*, pet T-Rex*, animal handler android (use the repair android stats with swapped skills), smart autonomous air-car*, auto-repair android*, 10 to 20 cargo/passenger vans* for the mercs and stuff.

    * stats not included here but available on request

    stat block: hp 20, resilience 6, armor 12-all & daemonhost -4 (not vs silver & spells), static defense 11, dodge 2k2 (use the porte spell instead), speed 4 meters & run 24 (or cast blink for 40), initiative 1d10+6, mental defense 15, resolve 7, devotion 6(Raven Queen), sanity 100, resource points 9 & regain by biting or 5k5 vs 10+2/spent if fail lose 1 hp and re-try, hero points 2

    las cannon: 10k6 reroll 1s for 5k5 energy, armor penetration 10, ranges 150/600/900/1200, rof 1+recharge, ammo 5, 2 full turns reload
    machine gun: 10k8 reroll 1s +5 per turn of consecutive full auto for 3k2 impact +1k0 per 5 over target's defense to max +10k0, armor penetration 5, ranges 60/240/360/480, rof 10+only full auto, ammo 100, full turn reload
    missile launcher: 5k5 reroll 1s for 4k3 explosive & 6 meter blast radius, armor penetration 5, ranges 100/400/500/600, rof 1, ammo 1, 2 full turn reload, may also use anti-armor missiles for 5k4 X pen 12 but only 1m blast
    bite: 10k5 reroll 1s for 3k2 rending, pen 0, +1 fatigue, recover resource points equal to wounds dealt
    power fist: 10k5 for 5k3 impact, penetration 4, +1 fatigue, power field (if parries or parried by a weapon without power field or is an artifact then 4+ on 1d10 to other weapon breaks)

    gun kata: crisis zone 1 & 1 extra style point
    with heavy weapons, on a standard half action attack, may not repeat on consecutive rounds, +2k0 to attack rolls

    magic: conjuration 5
    call item (free action, conj+will vs 15, verbal, summon prepared item to hand)
    web (half action, conj+will vs 15, verbal, somatic, material(sticky candy), attack, save dex+arcana, 25 meter range, 10 meter radius, immobilized 5 rounds, str or size vs casting roll to move half speed)
    porte (half action OR reaction, conj+will vs 20, somatic, 5 hour duration, 3 meter portal on a flat surface within 100 meters, needs two castings to have an exit, con only have two portals at one time, portals must be immobile relative to each other, like a portal-gun)
    greater servant (full action, conj+will vs 30, material(candle), 5 minute duration, somatic, summon thing with 4 all stats and 4 in 4 skills adjacent you, does what you tell it)
    gate (full action OR 1 hour, conj+will vs 35, somatic, 5 hour duration, full action is as porte but both portals at once and minimum duration even if they would pop is the end of your next turn, hour long cast uses a doorway or arch or corridor and places the other end anywhere except across crystal sphere boundaries & planar boundaries & teleport shielded locations plus the physical anchor can be moved after casting)

    casting: do these two
    fettered casting = 98% 15+, 85% 20+, 70% 30+, 29% 35+, never any warps
    full power dropping 10s = 97.7% 25+, 80% 30+, 45% 35+, 0.014% chance of warps at +10
    casting: don't do these
    full power 10k5 = 95.8% 30+, 85% 35+, 65% chance of warps (60% +10, 30% +20, 9% +30, 1% +40)
    pushed casting (10k7) = 96.7% 35+ & average of +70 on the warp tables
    pushed casting dropping 10s = 95% 30+, 80% 35+, 1.3% chance of +50 warps & 98.7% chance of +40 warps

    warpy crap(do not add too 100% because of multiple effects at a time and chances for doubles & triples):
    +10 warps: 78% safe, 0.001% death, 0.007% demons, 6% gain insanity, 13% save vs insanity, 4% take damage, 2% fatigue, 1% tech scorn, 6% trigger enemy hinderance, 3% stunned, 1% roll on the mental trauma table, 0.001% warp vortex % demonic possession & gouging out your eyeballs
    +40 warps: 43% safe, 1.5% death, 4% demons, 10% gain insanity points, 40% save vs insanity, 7% take damage, 5% fatigue, 1% knocked out, 6% triggers enemy hinderance, 6% stuns, 1% warp vortex, 2% roll on the mental trauma table, 1% mutation, 2% falling damage, 0.5% demonic possession, 0.2% gouge out your eyeballs.
    +70 warps: 13% safe, 20% death, 29% demons, 15% automatic insanity, 58% save vs insanity, 4% take damage, 5% fatigue, 3% tech scorn, 2% knocked out, 6% trigger enemy hinderance, 18% warp vortex, 2% falling damage, 0.2% demonic possession, 0.1% gouge out your eyeballs

    Hilarity: There's no size limits on the gate spell and it's literally like a portal-gun portal, line of sight & effect go right through. You can throw a huge one up on hanger door and pass jumbo jets though. You can use a tiny fairy house tchotchke and summon monsters anywhere by sticking your finger through.


  19. - Top - End - #19
    Bugbear in the Playground
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    Default Re: Magical MacGyver side-by-side comparison game

    Since someone else was planning on using risus i might as well use it. It's just gonna be a hodge podge of my favourite cliches i haven't used (yet). I'll say he is really high level.

    Spoiler: problem solver chan
    Show




    Name: problem solver-chan

    6d6 master of random facts and trivia.

    6d6 ninja.

    6d6 "i know a guy."

    6d6 wealthy.



    This is a character that is really good at solving problems. Btw the highest dc is 30 in risus which is "actually impossible" and this gal can actually do those things if she rolls lucky.
    Last edited by Ameraaaaaa; 2023-03-23 at 07:48 AM.
    Just a note i got adhd and autism.

  20. - Top - End - #20
    Bugbear in the Playground
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    Default Re: Magical MacGyver side-by-side comparison game

    Spoiler: James Bond (Chuubo's Mortal)
    Show


    Skills:
    Secret Agent 4 - Run. Jump. Shoot. Brawl. Drive. Pilot. Sabotage. Lie. Look good in a suit.
    "The name's Bond. James Bond." 2 - Catchphrase for making an impactful first impression, often for seduction or intimidation.
    Cool 2 - This is gives a penalty to anyone who tries to directly mess with Bond.

    Affliction: Gadgets - It's a law of the universe that James Bond happens to have just the right gadget for whatever insurmountable problem he's faced with.
    Bond: "I am driven to become romantically entangled with dangerous women." - Bond gets a boost to his seduction when there is competition or a good reason why they shouldn't be together. When this tendency gets him in trouble, he gets a boost of resources to spend on doing things.

    Bonus Perks:
    Power Up: Secret Agent - 2x per scenario Bond can treat his Secret Agent skill as a level 2 Superior Skill, letting him push it to superhuman levels.
    Chi-Boost - 1x day Bond cand spend an MP to get a +2 tool bonus to a skill he has at least 2 points in.
    Extra Tough Health level.

    Will: 8
    Health: 2 Normal, 3 Tough

    Last edited by solidork; 2023-03-22 at 10:44 PM.

  21. - Top - End - #21
    Bugbear in the Playground
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    Default Re: Magical MacGyver side-by-side comparison game

    Quote Originally Posted by Quertus View Post
    OK, I guess I'll edit this to include actual stats as time goes on, but here's some placeholders for some of the characters I'm thinking of:

    Spoiler: 2e D&D - totally not Armus
    Show
    Spoiler: Stats
    Show
    Arma
    Human Fighter 2 / Cleric 9
    Str 11
    Dex 5
    Con 4
    Int 11
    Wis 17
    Chr 15
    Spoiler: Blurb
    Show
    2e doesn't have WBL, treasure is normally quite random, so I chose the existing character I can best remember their items at 9th level, Armus, and am giving (what I can remember of) Armus' 9th level items to a brand new character. To maximize their personal ability to do stuff, I'll make them... probably a Cleric, who uses Skills & Powers to get schools of Wizard spells, too - as a Cleric, they have all their spells for free, and access to the most spells.
    Spoiler: Comments
    Show
    Stupid random stat rolls. I had to swap 2 of the stats to even be able to play a Cleric. As long as we're having fun with 2e, and get half the XP for the next level, I'll go ahead and spend a little of that XP on Fighter 2, requiring purchase of Gauntlets of Ogre Power to successfully Duel Class. Note to self: Research what Charisma gives a 75% chance to what (especially on Reaction Checks).


    Spoiler: 3e D&D - Tainted Wizard?
    Show
    Arcane Spellcaster has the most tools to work with, but Wizard can actually learn and repeatedly cast their spells, so I'm debating on this one. So it's a choice between "best ability to buy 1-shot solutions" and "ability to buy repeated solutions to problems". Obviously, I'm being lame, and mostly just buying spells as my solutions to problems, to minimize book diving.


    Spoiler: Paradox 1e - Telepathic Vampire
    Show
    In a percentile system where "75%" is an almost unheard-of level of skill, I'll be desperately trying to layer plans to make a cumulative 75+% chance of success. Which will be difficult, given how few skills the characters usually have. Totally a hard-mode entry for this contest, despite not feeling that way in game.


    Spoiler: Paradox 2e - Cutter Fyord
    Show
    I doubt we'll learn much from this, but... this character wins by "taking infinity". Given enough time, they will eventually succeed at anything. We'll see if they can actually succeed at anything first try.


    Spoiler: Marvel FACERIP - ??? -> Wizard
    Show
    Marvel uses random rolls for character creation. I don't care what the character starts out as, I'm going to spend XP to make them a Wizard, dagnabbit! This will be funny in the context of this challenge, as none of their skills will be at 75%, *but* they can spend Karma (XP) to automatically make rolls. Perhaps this character will also be an item crafter, as, with the right skills and powers, that can be huge in Marvel (note to self: research item crafting for other characters, too).


    Spoiler: Shadowrun - Troll Wizard
    Show
    Totally a combat character, whose only ability to solve any of these non-combat challenges will likely involve inventing a new spell.


    Spoiler: Mutants and Masterminds - Matter Transmutation Mutant
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    No (M&M) book diving necessary (although science book diving may help), this character will test the ability of transformation powers and wealth to solve problems.


    Spoiler: Mutants and Masterminds - Omni-Wizard
    Show
    This could involve book-diving: does the system contain a power which can solve the problem? If so, the Omni-Wizard can get (at least a weak version of) it.


    Spoiler: Warhammer - Total Mess
    Show
    Yeah, this isn't a character, so much as "every ability of every Warhammer (40k and Fantasy) character I've ever run, rolled up into one conceptual character. I expect they'll have a really high failure rate at these challenges.


    Spoiler: MtG - don't ask
    Show
    Also not really a character, just "can I McGyver a solution out of Magic cards?" I suspect that this not-a-character will give the strongest "Magical MacGyver" feel of any of my submissions.


    Spoiler: Star Trek - Vulcan Telepath
    Show
    Yeah, um... not someone with personal power to do much of anything, but... how many problems can't be solved with the judicious use of a Transporter, Replicator, Holodeck, etc?
    Some cool characters man. I'm especially excited to see how the vulcan, mtg, and m&m mutant can do. Depending on what challenges the "gm" gives us i can totally see any of these being useful.

    Quote Originally Posted by animorte View Post
    Some character ideas:

    Spoiler: Cantripologist (5e)
    Show

    Probably Shadow Sorcerer/Celestial Warlock: Pact of the Tome (minimum 11 cantrips at level 4).

    Level distribution will depend on how I determine the value of meta-magic vs invocations. Don't be surprised if I toss in another class for more cantrips.

    Will very likely have a race that provides additional spell availability plus a feat (or two) that adds more spells.


    Spoiler: Tails of Equestria
    Show

    You read that correctly, My Little Pony.

    We've got several young ones that appreciate the simplicity and it's been fun. I'll most likely just drop in the character sheet for my Telekinetic Unicorn.

    It's actually pretty darn sweet. Think 5e Psi Warrior with Mage Hand and Floating Disk (et al).


    May not get to these...
    Spoiler: Cleric (3.5e)
    Show

    I was once asked what I thought was my most overpowered character of all time. This was my second RPG character I ever made and it's been a while. Either I'll have to rebuild the sheet or abandon this build entirely as I may not have enough time.

    I'm pretty sure it was a Dwarf with Travel and Trickery domains.


    Spoiler: NecroFist
    Show

    Worlds Without Number

    This is such a cool system. It's not overpowered and not very difficult, but the sheer amount of skills you can build for (not at once) brings so many different possibilities to life.

    I found a pretty neat interaction (if I've understood correctly) that would allow a certain warrior/mage to recover health each time it punches something. It would very much come across as a "punch first, ask questions later" character so I fully expect it to fail miserably in anything else.


    Spoiler: Risus
    Show

    In this system, you can do literally anything you want, it seems.

    You have a limited number of Clichés you can start with (limited by your own imagination) up to 10d6 distributed as you see fit (nothing starting above 4d6 and no more than 5 different ones).

    If your few Clichés are clever enough, I expect they could account for any number of circumstances. Just make sure you don't spread yourself too thin by either metric. Only limit is you can't be too vague, though ambiguity is in the eyes of the beholder GM.

    Everything is determined by opposed rolls until somebody runs out of dice.


    I'll be coming back to edit these as I have more time to do so. Looking forward to it!
    2 things. 1 i really find the unicorn and necrofist funny. 2 risus has 3 task resolution systems actually. Skill checks for unopposed actions like climbing a mountain or dodging a crossbow trap. A single opposed roll for stuff like pick pocketing or being the 1st to grab the mystic artifact of doom. A the one you described for stuff like a court battle, a wizard duel, or a messy divorce.

    Quote Originally Posted by Telok View Post
    Ok, DtD40k7e v1.t character, plus a silly backup one.
    Spoiler
    Show

    Dungeons the Dragoning 40K 7e v1.t, a d10 exploding dice pool roll & keep Frankenstein's monster of a system. We aren't considering this character actually buying or looting anything but a few cheap spaceship consoles and some better armor & weapons for the bodyguards. This is a dryad vampire vice president of new markets for the Aztechnology megacorporation, with a personal space cruiser and a lot of contacts. The character isn't optimized, they're quite competent but not optimized for anything. If you want optimized we could thrown down a character with with followers (10k), wealth(millions), contacts(many), backing(faction leader), holdings(a planet) at 5s, 3 other exalt allies, and fame 1.

    stats (specialty allows rerolling 1s if they apply):
    Spoiler
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    intelligence 4 (puzzle solver)
    wisdom 4 (attentive)
    willpower 3
    strength 2
    dexterity 3
    constitution 2
    charisma 4 (eloquent)
    fellowship 4 (persuasive)
    composure 3

    skills (and the most common attribute used):
    Spoiler
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    arcana(int) 1 -> 5k4
    academic lore(int) 1 -> 5k4
    forbidden lore(int) 1 -> 5k4
    tech use(int) 1 -> 5k4
    common lore(int 1) -> 5k4+5
    craft(wis) 1 -> 4k4
    perception(wis) 0 -> 4k3
    medic(wis) 1 -> 5k4
    politics(wis) 1 -> 5k4

    brawling(level) 2 -> 5k2
    ballistics(level) 2 -> 5k2 if proficient in weapon
    drive(int/dex) 1 -> 5k4, cars, tanks, mecha, trains, etc.
    pilot(int/dex) 1 -> 5k4, planes, spaceships, hovercraft, submarines, etc.
    weaponry(level) 0 -> 1d10-1
    acrobatics(dex) 1 -> 4k3
    athletics(con/str) 1 -> 3k2
    larceny(dex) 1 -> 4k3
    stealth(dex) 1 -> 4k3

    scrutiny(cmp) 3 -> 6k3
    charm(fel) 1 -> 5k4
    persuade(cha) 3 -> 7k4
    animal ken(cmp) 1 -> 4k3
    command(cha) 1 -> 5k4
    deceive(cha) 1 -> 5k4
    intimidate(cha) 0 -> 3k3
    disguise(fel) 1 -> 5k4
    perform(fel) 0 -> 3k3

    backgrounds:
    Spoiler
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    inheritance 3 (best cybernetic cortex implant = +1 int & +5 on common lore tests)
    wealth 3k3+5 (easily buy easily buy meltaguns, anti-tank rockets, grand daiklaives, chain-swords, powered exoskeletons, medevac helicopters or top of the line laptop computers, if using tricks to reduce target numbers then las cannons, power armor, lightsabers, and Bugatti Veyron luxury sports cars are not difficult)
    contacts 5k5 (leader of all Ventrue clan vampires, regional manager of ComStar FTL communications for the Mt. Celestia political region, an Inquisitor of the human Imperium, an admiral in the Elven Imperial Navy, Factol of the Doomguard Sigil Faction)
    followers 2 (20 fanatic loyal personal guards/assistants)
    mentor 3(the spirit of Tiamat who is temporarily dead again)
    holdings 3 (spelljammer, a light frigate of 325 meters and 530 crew)
    backing 4 (is the vice president at large of new markets for the Aztechnology megacorporation)

    Species: dryad: size 4, +fellowship or + wisdom, +animal ken & +scrutiny, ability - pollenate: duplicate the effects of Attraction spell using level+fellowship instead of the spell casting test (Attraction, TN 20, full action, mind affecting, saving throw wisdom+arcana, non-combat, subtle, touch, one hour duration, affects creatures within 30 meters, if targeted on a person they get +1k1 all social rolls else if targeted on a thing people will interact with it)
    Exaltation: vampire, bitey, undead, see in the dark, old money
    Spoiler
    Show

    powers: old money (extra background points), undead resilience (requires an explosive/energy crit-5 to the heart or power weapons, artifacts, or magic to kill and cannot die from limb critical damage), sunlight weakness (negated - see feats), blood dependency (lose 1 resource point per day & comatose without blood), bite attack (+1k1 rending natural weapon with brawling tag and does extra fatigue damage), doesn't eat breathe bleed or get poisoned/drugged
    resource: blood, 5x power stat, spend up to power stat per round, used to gain extra reactions, gain extra dice on checks, or heal hit points.
    power stat 1: see in all darkness & +1k0 perception checks
    power stat 2: spend 1 blood to gain Fear(1) for the rest of the scene (will save vs TN 15 - in combat roll on shock table for stun fleeing penalties and insanity damage OR out of combat take penalties & if save fails by 10+ take 1d5 insanity damage)
    power stat 3 (character does not yet have, costs 400 xp): spend 1 blood point to gain 1 extra half action

    classes - negotiator, courtier, diplomat (class completion bonuses +2 resolve)

    feats & assets & xp spending (estimating about 2500 xp gain to "half way to max" although it really depends on the class track, this is about 11 game sessions worth of xp):
    Spoiler
    Show

    starter xp 600 + 400 from 4 hinderance + 2500 to mid level = 3500 total
    600 xp charisam 1->4, 300 xp composure 1->3, 800 xp assorted skill ranks, 400 xp backgrounds (mentor holdings backing), 100 xp vampire Ventrue clan asset (+5 wealth tests & +1 contacts & peer(Ventrue vampires +2k0 social checks)), 200 xp power stat 1->2, 100 xp veteran asset (+1 wisdom & +1 tech use & enemy), 100 xp dryad photosynthesis species asset (for vampires removes sunlight sensitivity), 100 xp academy asset (weapon proficiencies basic & ranged 1), 900 xp feats -> courtier's privilege x3 (bonus backgrounds), discipline (+1 resolve), protocol (int+common lore vs 15 save against damn fool mistakes), peer (dragons) & good reputation (dragons) (+2k1 charm persuade & command skills), eidetic memory (never forgets), language (elven)


    stat line: hp 10, resilience 5, armor 0, static defense 23, dodge 4k3(avg +10 def), fatigue limit 3, speed 5m & run 30m, initiative 1d10+6, mental/social defense 20, resolve 9, devotion/religiousness 6(Raven Queen), sanity 100, resource points 10 & regain by biting, hero points 2, languages: dryad, trade, assimar, tifeling, elven

    combat (most NPC/monster static defense TNs are in the 15-20 range, armor runs 0-10 points, and resilience is mostly 3-5):
    bite: 5k2 @ 3k2 rending, pen 0, inflict fatigue if wounds, regain 1 resource and +1 more fatigue damage point on wounding
    lasgun on full-auto: 7k3 @ 3k2 energy, pen 0, range 30/120/180/240, rof s/3, ammo 60 & 1 full turn reload, +1k0 damage per 5 over defense to max +3k0, reliable - misses instead of jamming(requires rolling four 1s)

    Starting gear: knife, common clothing, lasgun & 2 e-clips, med-kit, comm-bead, tricorder, laptop computer.
    Easily purchased (and proficient with) if needed: grenade launcher, flamethrower, web gun, plasma grenades, best Quality silver cestus, low quality power fist, laser sniper rifle, automatic lockpicking tool.
    not proficient with but can easily afford: plate armor, powered exoskeleton, light ballistic mesh, high quality flak jackets, electro-flail, goremaul, meltagun, plasma rifle.

    roll percentages:
    Spoiler
    Show

    Weirdly the game came out 2 years before D&D 5e but has the absolutely exact same TN/DC chart in it with 15=normal & 30=near impossible.
    Resource points can be spent for extra +1k0 on any skill/ability check or save, up to 2/round
    hero points (refresh per session) can be spent for a reroll after rolling or a -5 target number Before rolling, or both.
    Stunting can be done as often as the GM will put up with, simply describe what the character is doing pretty well and involve the scenery/setting in some way, allows for some minor player directed scenery editing (if you need curtains to dramatically swing on then they're there), gives 1-3 bonus rolled dice.

    3k2 - 80% 10+, 45% 15+, 20% 20+
    5k2 - 95% 10+, 60% 15+, 35% 20+
    3k3 - 90% 10+, 65% 15+, 35% 20+, 15% 25+
    4k3 - 85% 15+, 55% 20+, 30% 25+, 15% 30+
    6k3 - 95% 15+, 80% 20+, 50% 25+, 30% 30+
    7k3 - 85% 20+, 60% 25+, 35% 30+, 20% 35+
    4k4 - 90% 15+, 65% 20+, 40% 25+, 25% 30+
    5k4 - 85% 20+, 60% 25+, 35% 30+, 20% 35+
    7k4 - 95% 20+, 85% 25+, 60% 30+, 40% 35+
    5k5 - 90% 20+, 70% 25+, 45% 30+, 25% 35+
    6k5 - 95% 20+, 85% 25+, 65% 30+, 45% 35+


    Common benchmark NPCs
    Spoiler
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    Generic humanoids: commoner, guard, soldier
    Spoiler
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    Prole: size 4, Level 0, stats 2s, initiative +4, common lore & JOB SKILL 3k2, perception 1k1
    hp 4, resilience 3, ap 0, def 14, dodge 2k2, speed 4/24, mdef 15, resolve 4, devotion 6
    brawl 1k1 @ 2k1 I pen0 +fatigue, gear: clothing, pocket change, chrono or cheap comm or job tool

    Guard/Law: size 4, level 1, CON&WIS 3, else 2, init +2, perception 4k3, brawl 2k1, shoot 3k2, common
    lore & politic & scrutiny 3k2, first aid 4k3, 50/50 command or persuade 3k2
    hp 6, resil 4, ap 5 chest (armor vest), def 17, dodge 2k2, speed 4/24, mdef 15, resolve 4, dev 6
    brawl 2k1 @ grapple 6k2 v sz+str, hand cannon 3k2 @ 3k2 I p3 35m s/- 6a 2f
    K.O spray: dodge tn 15, 4m*2m cone, con 15 inhale vs +fatigue, 2 ammo, 2 full reload
    gear: armor vest, comm-bead, spray reload, hand can & 2 clips, handcuffs, badge, donut, torch

    Soldier: size 4, level 2, phy 3, else 2, init +5, athletic & acrobat 4k3, weapon & shoot 4k2, scrutiny & intimidate & perception 3k2, 50% drive 4k3, 50/50 command or craft 3k2
    hp 7, resil 5, ap 5 (FLAK body & head), def 17, dodge 4k3, speed 6/36, mdef 15, resolve 4, dev 6
    knife 4k2 @ 4k2 R p0 throw 5m @ 2k2, lasgun 4k2/6k3 @ 3k2 E p0 60m s/3 60a 1f reliable
    gear: flak vest & helmet, 2 knife, lasgun & 2 clip, 2 smoke grenades(2k2 @ blast[5] 9m), comm-bead
    chrono, torch, collapsible shovel, uniform, mission gear (rebreather - multitool - maps - MREs)


    Combat Servitor: kill-bot death machine
    Spoiler
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    size 6, level 2, str con 5, dex will 3, wis 2, else n/a, init +3,
    fight 5k3, perception 4k1, +MINDLESS +FEARLESS +pre-loaded IFF software & datajack back of head
    hp 16, resil 4, ap 10 all(machine), def 13, dodge 2k2, speed 3/18 no-swim crawler
    light vehicular multilas (heavy): 5k3/7k4 @ 3k2 E p0 s/8 60m 80a +reliable +recharge 1 shot/min, claw: 5k3 @ 6k2 R p0 +snare
    immune fatigue toxic disease breath eat environment bleed mental biology (not stun immune)
    SPECIAL: crawls over impassible terrain, gun in gizzards hit loc, 2 claws & 2 arms


    Cocaine Wizard Journeyman: is high
    Spoiler
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    level 2, sz 4, cha int wis will 3, else 2, init+4, arcana & academic 6k3, deceive & common & forbid 4k3, charm 3k2, scrutiny & ballistic & brawl 4k2, TESTED, perf. memory, foresight(10m=+1int)
    backing 2(CW guild), wealth 2, mentor 3(coke wiz L3), ally 2(wiz L2), contact 1(dealer)
    hp 5, resil 4, ap 5 all(mageAC), def 19, dodge 2k2, speed 4/24, mdef 15, resolve 5, devotion 6
    autopistol: FAB 4k3 @ 2k2 I p0 30m -/6 12a 1f, slap fight: 2k2 @ 2k1 I p0 +fatigue
    gear: implement(rod staff wand orb), charm, magic theory book, chrono, nice clothes, autopistol & 2 clips, Cocaine Wizard Guild Official Member Card & Discount Coupon, 10g of coke, serious pocket money
    Abj 2: 1% warp
    shield : 10 Re S,self : parry d10 => 1=+7, 2-3=+10, 4-7=+12, 10=+15
    mage armor : 15 Hf S,touch, 24h : d10 => 1-2=fail, 3-6= ap 3, 7-9=ap 4, 10=ap 5
    Evo 1: 5% warp, ignores 2 points of Aura for damage
    magic missile : 15 Hf S,attack,30m,auto-hit : 2k1+1 E dmg d10 => 1-2=fail 3-7=1x & 8-10=2x



    spelljammer:
    Spoiler
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    Type: Thresher (Frigate), Class: Destroyer, Price: Holdings 3
    Shields: Standard Mk III (125 points & 20 regeneration)
    Hull Points: 60, Crew: 16, Crew Quality: 3, Fore Guns: 3, Aft Guns: 2
    Initiative: +15, Speed: 10 VU (60,000 km per turn), Static Defense: 14, Maneuver: +5, Acceleration: +10, Sensors: +5
    Ship Size: 57 = about 325 m. Crew Number: about 536 people

    Weapons:
    3x fore Torpedo Launcher
    2x aft Light Positron Array (fires as a single weapon), Range 16 (96,000 km), Arc normal (aft and sides), Accuracy +0, Damage 6k4, Shield Disruption 8, Critical Chart Roll +0
    light array orbital bombardment: 600m radius, 6k4 damage, armor penetration 8

    Torpedoes:
    15x Quath Torpedo, Range 20 (120,000 km), Arc narrow (forwards only), Accuracy +0, Damage 4k4 (phases through shields to hit but crit is reduced to +0 if shields are up), Shield Disruption +0, Critical Chart Roll +8
    quath orbital bombardment air burst: 1200m radius, 8k8 damage, armor penetration 16
    quath orbital bombardment ground burst: 200m diameter crater (automatic vaporization of targets), 400m radius blast increment (damage halves at every additional increment), 10k10+15 damage, ignores armor

    Consoles:
    Arcana 1/1, Command 1/1, Engineering 0/1, Tactical 2/2, Universal 1/1, Total 2/6.
    Teleportarium: Arcana, Boarding Actions at 5 VU (30,000 km) if there are no shields plus Star Trek transporter style beaming about
    Partial Wing: Universal, Antigrav plus landing gear allows ship to land safely
    Library Computer: Command, Gain +1k1 to all Lore tests and make them untrained when using it
    Murder Servitors: Tactical, Gain +2k1 to repel boarders and put down mutinies (total 5k4 unless the ship's tactical officer has brawling/weaponry skill of 4+)
    Cargo Bays: Universal (in tactical slot), Big open spaces to ship lots of stuff


    alternate silly super focused optimized character: 2500 xp gnome daemonhost mercenary, tactical officer, chief security officer, walking gunshow, living fortress, filthy rich teleporting monster summoner who leads a bunch of mercenaries.
    Spoiler
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    stats: int 2, wis 3, will 5(stubborn), str 2, dex 2, con 3, cha 2, fel 2, cmp 2
    skills: ballistics 5(heavy metal), brawling 5(biting), academic lore 1, craft 1, medic 1, perception 3, command 3, intimidate 3, scrutiny 2
    backgrounds: allies 3 (rogue trader starship captain, cocaine wizard, cleric of Lolth), wealth 5 (filthy rich), followers 3 (100 loyal mercenaries)

    species: gnome, size 3, weapon proficiency basic, armor proficiency light
    exaltation: daemonhost, bitey, resist damage, free magic school
    resource: essence, will+cha+2x power stat, on use change to resonance, clear resonance with bite or will vs 10+2/resonance if fail still clear resonance & -1 hp & retry until success
    power stat: 1= reduce damage by con+power stat unless from silver or magic
    classes: mercenary, tactical officer, chief security officer, walking gunshow, living fortress

    xp & stuff: 4x hinderances (law of the stars(principled), slowpoke, intolerance(politicians & lawyers), night terrors), +2 wealth, +1 ballistics, +2 brawling, +3 hp from mercenary & walking gunshow, +2k2 leading & resisting boarding attacks if serving as tactical officer on a ship, veteran (+will +ballistics +old enemy), language(), sound constitution (+1 hp), master of orbital bombardment, worf barrage (space combat buff), extracurricular study (crisis zone 1), worf effect (enemies shoot me first), match frequency (space combat buff), paranoia (+2 initiative), lend expertise (space combat buff), rock & roll (+5 to hit per consecutive round of full-auto shoots), improved weapon focus (+0k1 with machine guns), crushing bear (free auto-damage while grappling), death before defeat (spend a hero point to ignore the effect of a non-killing critical hit), +1 followers & +1 style point

    gear: power armor, las cannon, machine gun, missile launcher, magic carpet*, jet pack*, fancy clothes, power fist, doc-bot 9000*, AT-ST*, pet T-Rex*, animal handler android (use the repair android stats with swapped skills), smart autonomous air-car*, auto-repair android*, 10 to 20 cargo/passenger vans* for the mercs and stuff.

    * stats not included here but available on request

    stat block: hp 20, resilience 6, armor 12-all & daemonhost -4 (not vs silver & spells), static defense 11, dodge 2k2 (use the porte spell instead), speed 4 meters & run 24 (or cast blink for 40), initiative 1d10+6, mental defense 15, resolve 7, devotion 6(Raven Queen), sanity 100, resource points 9 & regain by biting or 5k5 vs 10+2/spent if fail lose 1 hp and re-try, hero points 2

    las cannon: 10k6 reroll 1s for 5k5 energy, armor penetration 10, ranges 150/600/900/1200, rof 1+recharge, ammo 5, 2 full turns reload
    machine gun: 10k8 reroll 1s +5 per turn of consecutive full auto for 3k2 impact +1k0 per 5 over target's defense to max +10k0, armor penetration 5, ranges 60/240/360/480, rof 10+only full auto, ammo 100, full turn reload
    missile launcher: 5k5 reroll 1s for 4k3 explosive & 6 meter blast radius, armor penetration 5, ranges 100/400/500/600, rof 1, ammo 1, 2 full turn reload, may also use anti-armor missiles for 5k4 X pen 12 but only 1m blast
    bite: 10k5 reroll 1s for 3k2 rending, pen 0, +1 fatigue, recover resource points equal to wounds dealt
    power fist: 10k5 for 5k3 impact, penetration 4, +1 fatigue, power field (if parries or parried by a weapon without power field or is an artifact then 4+ on 1d10 to other weapon breaks)

    gun kata: crisis zone 1 & 1 extra style point
    with heavy weapons, on a standard half action attack, may not repeat on consecutive rounds, +2k0 to attack rolls

    magic: conjuration 5
    call item (free action, conj+will vs 15, verbal, summon prepared item to hand)
    web (half action, conj+will vs 15, verbal, somatic, material(sticky candy), attack, save dex+arcana, 25 meter range, 10 meter radius, immobilized 5 rounds, str or size vs casting roll to move half speed)
    porte (half action OR reaction, conj+will vs 20, somatic, 5 hour duration, 3 meter portal on a flat surface within 100 meters, needs two castings to have an exit, con only have two portals at one time, portals must be immobile relative to each other, like a portal-gun)
    greater servant (full action, conj+will vs 30, material(candle), 5 minute duration, somatic, summon thing with 4 all stats and 4 in 4 skills adjacent you, does what you tell it)
    gate (full action OR 1 hour, conj+will vs 35, somatic, 5 hour duration, full action is as porte but both portals at once and minimum duration even if they would pop is the end of your next turn, hour long cast uses a doorway or arch or corridor and places the other end anywhere except across crystal sphere boundaries & planar boundaries & teleport shielded locations plus the physical anchor can be moved after casting)

    casting: do these two
    fettered casting = 98% 15+, 85% 20+, 70% 30+, 29% 35+, never any warps
    full power dropping 10s = 97.7% 25+, 80% 30+, 45% 35+, 0.014% chance of warps at +10
    casting: don't do these
    full power 10k5 = 95.8% 30+, 85% 35+, 65% chance of warps (60% +10, 30% +20, 9% +30, 1% +40)
    pushed casting (10k7) = 96.7% 35+ & average of +70 on the warp tables
    pushed casting dropping 10s = 95% 30+, 80% 35+, 1.3% chance of +50 warps & 98.7% chance of +40 warps

    warpy crap(do not add too 100% because of multiple effects at a time and chances for doubles & triples):
    +10 warps: 78% safe, 0.001% death, 0.007% demons, 6% gain insanity, 13% save vs insanity, 4% take damage, 2% fatigue, 1% tech scorn, 6% trigger enemy hinderance, 3% stunned, 1% roll on the mental trauma table, 0.001% warp vortex % demonic possession & gouging out your eyeballs
    +40 warps: 43% safe, 1.5% death, 4% demons, 10% gain insanity points, 40% save vs insanity, 7% take damage, 5% fatigue, 1% knocked out, 6% triggers enemy hinderance, 6% stuns, 1% warp vortex, 2% roll on the mental trauma table, 1% mutation, 2% falling damage, 0.5% demonic possession, 0.2% gouge out your eyeballs.
    +70 warps: 13% safe, 20% death, 29% demons, 15% automatic insanity, 58% save vs insanity, 4% take damage, 5% fatigue, 3% tech scorn, 2% knocked out, 6% trigger enemy hinderance, 18% warp vortex, 2% falling damage, 0.2% demonic possession, 0.1% gouge out your eyeballs

    Hilarity: There's no size limits on the gate spell and it's literally like a portal-gun portal, line of sight & effect go right through. You can throw a huge one up on hanger door and pass jumbo jets though. You can use a tiny fairy house tchotchke and summon monsters anywhere by sticking your finger through.

    This is the most impregnable system i have ever seen. Looking forward to see what happens

    Quote Originally Posted by solidork View Post
    Spoiler: James Bond (Chuubo's Mortal)
    Show


    Skills:
    Secret Agent 4 - Run. Jump. Shoot. Brawl. Drive. Pilot. Sabotage. Lie. Look good in a suit.
    "The name's Bond. James Bond." 2 - Catchphrase for making an impactful first impression, often for seduction or intimidation.
    Cool 2 - This is gives a penalty to anyone who tries to directly mess with Bond.

    Affliction: Gadgets - It's a law of the universe that James Bond happens to have just the right gadget for whatever insurmountable problem he's faced with.
    Bond: "I am driven to become romantically entangled with dangerous women." - Bond gets a boost to his seduction when there is competition or a good reason why they shouldn't be together. When this tendency gets him in trouble, he gets a boost of resources to spend on doing things.

    Bonus Perks:
    Power Up: Secret Agent - 2x per scenario Bond can treat his Secret Agent skill as a level 2 Superior Skill, letting him push it to superhuman levels.
    Chi-Boost - 1x day Bond cand spend an MP to get a +2 tool bonus to a skill he has at least 2 points in.
    Extra Tough Health level.

    Will: 8
    Health: 2 Normal, 3 Tough

    Ah a fellow rules light systems guy. Curious how james bond chuubo edition will compete with my trivia ninja risus edition.
    Just a note i got adhd and autism.

  22. - Top - End - #22
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    HalflingRangerGuy

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    Default Re: Magical MacGyver side-by-side comparison game

    Sounds interesting. If I get time I'll run up some characters for Exalted and Scion. Maybe Shadowrun, WFRP, SoIaF too.

    Just as a benchmark - we'd be assuming level 9 would take around 35 sessions to get to, right? That sounds about right based on googling. Just want to get a rough idea for how much XP these bad boys would have.

  23. - Top - End - #23
    Firbolg in the Playground
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    Default Re: Magical MacGyver side-by-side comparison game

    Quote Originally Posted by Peat View Post
    Sounds interesting. If I get time I'll run up some characters for Exalted and Scion. Maybe Shadowrun, WFRP, SoIaF too.

    Just as a benchmark - we'd be assuming level 9 would take around 35 sessions to get to, right? That sounds about right based on googling. Just want to get a rough idea for how much XP these bad boys would have.
    You could do it like that, but the idea is to have a character that has matured fully into their schtick and is starting to need to advance horizontally.

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    Ogre in the Playground
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    Default Re: Magical MacGyver side-by-side comparison game

    Quote Originally Posted by Ameraaaaaa View Post
    2 things. 1 i really find the unicorn and necrofist funny. 2 risus has 3 task resolution systems actually. Skill checks for unopposed actions like climbing a mountain or dodging a crossbow trap. A single opposed roll for stuff like pick pocketing or being the 1st to grab the mystic artifact of doom. A the one you described for stuff like a court battle, a wizard duel, or a messy divorce.
    Just a few weeks ago I started my very first Risus game on this very forum, so I appreciate your input on the matter! Still new, but it's neat.Thanks for reading my entries (so far).
    Ah a fellow rules light systems guy. Curious how james bond chuubo edition will compete with my trivia ninja risus edition.
    I have also recently been seeking out rules light systems (clearly) so this will be fun.
    Quote Originally Posted by NichG View Post
    You could do it like that, but the idea is to have a character that has matured fully into their schtick and is starting to need to advance horizontally.
    I was thinking, for anything that doesn't have the 1-20 leveling, I plan to take "max - 1" and run with that.
    Something Borrowed - Submission Thread (5e subclass contest)

    TeamWork Makes the Dream Work 5e Base Class Submission Thread




  25. - Top - End - #25
    Ettin in the Playground
     
    Telok's Avatar

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    Default Re: Magical MacGyver side-by-side comparison game

    Quote Originally Posted by NichG View Post
    You could do it like that, but the idea is to have a character that has matured fully into their schtick and is starting to need to advance horizontally.
    There's a thing where more point-buy like systems can go really super focused into one thing. Like the characters I put up, one is very spread out (that's the character concept anyways) and the other is super focused on maxxing out just a couple tricks (fighting & one school of magic) but they both have the same amount of XP. The "matured fully into their schtick" is really... subjective? I guess?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ameraaaaaa View Post
    This is the most impregnable system i have ever seen. Looking forward to see what happens
    It's really no more difficult than D&D (AD&D with a bunch of options turned on, 3e, 4e, 5e with all books in play). It looks whonky because I over describe a bit and this way I don't have to refer back to any documents, I can just scan back to my posts. Also, in my rewrite and for my running the game I've built an assortment of simulators, so when I want to do something like convert the tarrasque into DtD40k7e numbers I can easily run tests to set it at the correct level of danger. It's like having a CR calculation that actually works.

    Any hoo, the Paranoia and Traveller characters.

    Paranoid Bob from Paranoia. A simple, fast, easy d20 roll under the number system. Instead of "9th level" we'll say ol' Bob here has survived five missions.
    The only complicated thing is weapon damage. There's a list "Ok, Snafued, Wounded, Maimed, Down, Killed, Vaporized", and something like a grenade says W3K. That means grenade damage starts at "W"ounded, caps at "K"illed and every 3 points of your attack roll is under your skill the damage goes up a level. Thus a PC with Throw-12 rolls a 9, 3 under 12, and kicks the damage on the target up to Maimed. Armor reduces damage by it's rating, if that target was wearing kevlar of armor 2 that Maimed would drop to Snafued. Congratulations, you now know 90% of what you need to play Paranoia.

    Spoiler
    Show

    Name, Clearance, Sector, Clone: Bob-O-DOOMED-4
    Gender: uncertain
    Service: Housing Personnel Development & Mind Control
    Tics: giggles in combat, loves hand grenades, occasionally argues with imaginary friend (and loses every time)
    Mandatory Bonus Duty:

    Management -- 4
    - bootlicking - 8
    - chutzpah
    - con games - 1
    - hygiene
    - interrogation
    - intimidation
    - moxie
    - oratory
    - deflect blame - 10

    Stealth -- 7
    - concealment
    - disguise - 11
    - scam radar
    - security
    - shadowing
    - sleight of hand
    - sneaking - 1
    - surveillance
    - find hiding spot - 13

    Violence -- 8
    - agility - 12
    - energy weapons - 12
    - demolition - 12
    - field weapons
    - fine manipulation - 12
    - hand weapons
    - projectile weapons
    - throwing - 1
    - unarmed combat(O5K)
    - vehicle combat - 12
    - barricade - 14

    Hardware -- 4
    - robot engineering
    - chemistry
    - electronics
    - habitat engineering
    - mechanics - 8
    - nuclear engineer - 1
    - vehicle mechanics
    - weapon & armor maintenance
    - technobabble - 10

    Software -- 9
    - bot & AI programming
    - c-bay - 1
    - data analysis - 13
    - data search
    - financial - 13
    - hacking - 13
    - computer ops
    - vehicle programming
    - cause memory overflow - 15

    Wetware -- 6
    - bioscience
    - bioweapons
    - cloning - 10
    - medical
    - outdoors - 1
    - pharmacy - 10
    - psychology
    - suggestion
    - improvise prosthetic part - 12

    Mutation: Matter eater (can safely eat & digest anything)
    Power Level: 17 (unknown to player)
    Registration: unregistered
    Secret Society: PURGE (kill the Computer, kill all computers, free intelligent beings, terrorism & sabotage)
    Secret Society Rank: 3
    Alpha Complex Access: 3 ('player' doesn't know this number)

    Secret skills
    - uncommon: demolition - 12
    - unlikely: gloating - 16
    - unhealthy: twitch-talk - 10
    - propaganda: PURGE - 6

    Equipment
    - personal: ME card, red jumpsuit, red baseball cap, red running shoes, xantrick (wakey) red pill, red grenade(W3K 20m)
    - assigned: laser pistol body(W3K 60m), red reflec armor overalls(E1 only lasers <=red), Series 1300 Personal Digital Companion
    - treasonous: biohazard sign sticker, rolactin (very very happy) blue pill, kevlar(I2 & under reflec)

    Credits, Perversity, Treason: $75, 25, 1


    Traveling Bob from classic Traveller. A simple fast easy 2d6+skill (or -2 if you lack the skill) to roll over a target number system. The insistence on hexadecimal notation is, honestly, a bit silly and over the top. It's also optional. Instead of "9th level" we'll age him 9 years.

    Spoiler
    Show

    Scientist -- looking at the skills I'm thinking xeno-archaeologist with a focus on mechanical engineering and precursor machines.
    755AC9 (str 5, dex 4, end 4, int 10, edu 12, soc 9)
    Age 46 -> 55
    7 terms
    Cr 13,000

    Skills: Carbine-3, Computer-1, Electronics-1, Jack-o-T-1, Air/Raft-1, Mechanical-4, Survival-3
    Learning: medical-1, xeno-medicine-1 (seriously, 4 years to learn them at 1 then another 4 to keep them)
    Current: self improvement (dex & end get +1s in another 3 years, made the throw to keep with it)

    Benefits: 8,000/yr Retirement Pay, Carbine, Lab Ship

    Ship:
    Spoiler
    Show

    Basic Ship Characteristics
    Tonnage/Hull 400 tons. The ship is unstreamlined.
    The lab ship requires a crew of five: pilot, navigator, medic, and two engineers. The pilot also operates the pinnace. Gunners may be added to the crew if the ship is armed. Additional crew are carried to execute the research functions.
    It has jump drive-D, maneuver drive-C, and power plant-F, giving the ship a performance of Jump-2 and 1-G acceleration. There is fuel tankage for 90 tons, sufficient to supply the power plant and one Jump-2.
    One ship computer Model/2 with software package is installed adjacent to the bridge.
    2 hardpoints (4 possible). On the forward face of the pods are hardpoints for the turret weaponry if called for.
    No turrets or weaponry are installed, but two tons of space have been reserved for later installation of fire control equipment for the ship's two hardpoints.
    The ship carries one 40-ton pinnace and two air/rafts. Two air/rafts are carried in compartments on the ring hull. They provide access to world surfaces, both for specimen gathering and for routine errands. The 40-ton pinnace is carried at the end of a central spoke, making mating easy even if the ring is rotating.
    Refueling: Since the lab ship is unstreamlined, and cannot skim fuel itself, this task falls to the 40-ton pinnace. It is assigned the routine of skimming fuel from a gas giant and ferrying it to the ship. On worlds with refined fuel available, the pinnace ferries the fuel from the starport to the lab ship.
    There are twenty staterooms and no low berths. Cargo capacity is 23 tons. An additional 85 tons are available within the ship for use as lab space.
    The ship costs MCr159. It takes 16 months to construct.


    Let's say we're modestly successful and can spend 4.5 years of retirement pay on a robot helper.
    36,000 cr
    Spoiler
    Show

    pilot-4, navigator-4, ship's boat-4, gravitics-4 [$7200 space-16/16/16/8] 72-54=18
    power interface, program interface, brain interface, video record & display, basic sensor package, voder [$6300 power-17 kg-15]
    low data logic (no learning, requires explicit commands), full natural language command [cpu-5 storage-15 $8000 int+2]
    linear cpu-5, standard storage-31(can only load 16 space of programs at a time) [liters-16.5 $9750 kg-3.6 power-1]
    urp-4 fuel cell [power+50 liters-60 kg-95 $1400 fuel-liter/hour-0.3d fuel-kg/liter-0.07]
    2x light arms 2x legs [20% chassis volume, power-4, liters-2, kg-12, $1070 dex+4 str+10]
    transmission-50 [power-25 liters-25 kg-50 $750, dex=4]
    chassis-6, large adult torso size, box, armor as mesh [150 liters, 15 kg, $1500]
    spotlight [power-1 kg-1 $50]
    500km radio [power-1.5 kg-1 $500]
    subtotal: $35970, power-0.5, kg-194, liters-47
    fuel space 100 hours [liters-30, kg-7.5]
    free space 16 liters -> let's put a bunch of little drawers and cabinets in it

    total: $35970, 201.5 kg, large adult torso size, box, armor as mesh, 2 arms, 2 legs, int 2, str 17, dex 8, edu 3, runs 100 hours on a fuel cell, has 16 liters of storage compartments. Two visual sensors, two audio sensors, a speaker for talking, bi-directional power cords, data/ethernet jacks, video camera & display screen, spotlight, and 500 km range radio. Skills are pilot-4, navigator-4, ship's boat-4, gravitics-4.
    Well it's pretty dumb and only runs one skill at a time, but it's good at doing what it's told and accepts natural language commands (although you do have to be pretty specific). Good for heavy lifting too. Plus we can buy more programs for it to use since it has to swap them out anyways. I suppose we could have gone for better CPUs and intelligence and financed it, but a $75k bot mortgages at $4500 a year for 20 years and this is just simpler.


    And from now on I'm referring to the DtD40k7e characters as Diplomat Bob and Gun Whore Bob...

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    Bugbear in the Playground
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    Default Re: Magical MacGyver side-by-side comparison game

    Quote Originally Posted by Telok View Post
    There's a thing where more point-buy like systems can go really super focused into one thing. Like the characters I put up, one is very spread out (that's the character concept anyways) and the other is super focused on maxxing out just a couple tricks (fighting & one school of magic) but they both have the same amount of XP. The "matured fully into their schtick" is really... subjective? I guess?



    It's really no more difficult than D&D (AD&D with a bunch of options turned on, 3e, 4e, 5e with all books in play). It looks whonky because I over describe a bit and this way I don't have to refer back to any documents, I can just scan back to my posts. Also, in my rewrite and for my running the game I've built an assortment of simulators, so when I want to do something like convert the tarrasque into DtD40k7e numbers I can easily run tests to set it at the correct level of danger. It's like having a CR calculation that actually works.

    Any hoo, the Paranoia and Traveller characters.

    Paranoid Bob from Paranoia. A simple, fast, easy d20 roll under the number system. Instead of "9th level" we'll say ol' Bob here has survived five missions.
    The only complicated thing is weapon damage. There's a list "Ok, Snafued, Wounded, Maimed, Down, Killed, Vaporized", and something like a grenade says W3K. That means grenade damage starts at "W"ounded, caps at "K"illed and every 3 points of your attack roll is under your skill the damage goes up a level. Thus a PC with Throw-12 rolls a 9, 3 under 12, and kicks the damage on the target up to Maimed. Armor reduces damage by it's rating, if that target was wearing kevlar of armor 2 that Maimed would drop to Snafued. Congratulations, you now know 90% of what you need to play Paranoia.

    Spoiler
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    Name, Clearance, Sector, Clone: Bob-O-DOOMED-4
    Gender: uncertain
    Service: Housing Personnel Development & Mind Control
    Tics: giggles in combat, loves hand grenades, occasionally argues with imaginary friend (and loses every time)
    Mandatory Bonus Duty:

    Management -- 4
    - bootlicking - 8
    - chutzpah
    - con games - 1
    - hygiene
    - interrogation
    - intimidation
    - moxie
    - oratory
    - deflect blame - 10

    Stealth -- 7
    - concealment
    - disguise - 11
    - scam radar
    - security
    - shadowing
    - sleight of hand
    - sneaking - 1
    - surveillance
    - find hiding spot - 13

    Violence -- 8
    - agility - 12
    - energy weapons - 12
    - demolition - 12
    - field weapons
    - fine manipulation - 12
    - hand weapons
    - projectile weapons
    - throwing - 1
    - unarmed combat(O5K)
    - vehicle combat - 12
    - barricade - 14

    Hardware -- 4
    - robot engineering
    - chemistry
    - electronics
    - habitat engineering
    - mechanics - 8
    - nuclear engineer - 1
    - vehicle mechanics
    - weapon & armor maintenance
    - technobabble - 10

    Software -- 9
    - bot & AI programming
    - c-bay - 1
    - data analysis - 13
    - data search
    - financial - 13
    - hacking - 13
    - computer ops
    - vehicle programming
    - cause memory overflow - 15

    Wetware -- 6
    - bioscience
    - bioweapons
    - cloning - 10
    - medical
    - outdoors - 1
    - pharmacy - 10
    - psychology
    - suggestion
    - improvise prosthetic part - 12

    Mutation: Matter eater (can safely eat & digest anything)
    Power Level: 17 (unknown to player)
    Registration: unregistered
    Secret Society: PURGE (kill the Computer, kill all computers, free intelligent beings, terrorism & sabotage)
    Secret Society Rank: 3
    Alpha Complex Access: 3 ('player' doesn't know this number)

    Secret skills
    - uncommon: demolition - 12
    - unlikely: gloating - 16
    - unhealthy: twitch-talk - 10
    - propaganda: PURGE - 6

    Equipment
    - personal: ME card, red jumpsuit, red baseball cap, red running shoes, xantrick (wakey) red pill, red grenade(W3K 20m)
    - assigned: laser pistol body(W3K 60m), red reflec armor overalls(E1 only lasers <=red), Series 1300 Personal Digital Companion
    - treasonous: biohazard sign sticker, rolactin (very very happy) blue pill, kevlar(I2 & under reflec)

    Credits, Perversity, Treason: $75, 25, 1


    Traveling Bob from classic Traveller. A simple fast easy 2d6+skill (or -2 if you lack the skill) to roll over a target number system. The insistence on hexadecimal notation is, honestly, a bit silly and over the top. It's also optional. Instead of "9th level" we'll age him 9 years.

    Spoiler
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    Scientist -- looking at the skills I'm thinking xeno-archaeologist with a focus on mechanical engineering and precursor machines.
    755AC9 (str 5, dex 4, end 4, int 10, edu 12, soc 9)
    Age 46 -> 55
    7 terms
    Cr 13,000

    Skills: Carbine-3, Computer-1, Electronics-1, Jack-o-T-1, Air/Raft-1, Mechanical-4, Survival-3
    Learning: medical-1, xeno-medicine-1 (seriously, 4 years to learn them at 1 then another 4 to keep them)
    Current: self improvement (dex & end get +1s in another 3 years, made the throw to keep with it)

    Benefits: 8,000/yr Retirement Pay, Carbine, Lab Ship

    Ship:
    Spoiler
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    Basic Ship Characteristics
    Tonnage/Hull 400 tons. The ship is unstreamlined.
    The lab ship requires a crew of five: pilot, navigator, medic, and two engineers. The pilot also operates the pinnace. Gunners may be added to the crew if the ship is armed. Additional crew are carried to execute the research functions.
    It has jump drive-D, maneuver drive-C, and power plant-F, giving the ship a performance of Jump-2 and 1-G acceleration. There is fuel tankage for 90 tons, sufficient to supply the power plant and one Jump-2.
    One ship computer Model/2 with software package is installed adjacent to the bridge.
    2 hardpoints (4 possible). On the forward face of the pods are hardpoints for the turret weaponry if called for.
    No turrets or weaponry are installed, but two tons of space have been reserved for later installation of fire control equipment for the ship's two hardpoints.
    The ship carries one 40-ton pinnace and two air/rafts. Two air/rafts are carried in compartments on the ring hull. They provide access to world surfaces, both for specimen gathering and for routine errands. The 40-ton pinnace is carried at the end of a central spoke, making mating easy even if the ring is rotating.
    Refueling: Since the lab ship is unstreamlined, and cannot skim fuel itself, this task falls to the 40-ton pinnace. It is assigned the routine of skimming fuel from a gas giant and ferrying it to the ship. On worlds with refined fuel available, the pinnace ferries the fuel from the starport to the lab ship.
    There are twenty staterooms and no low berths. Cargo capacity is 23 tons. An additional 85 tons are available within the ship for use as lab space.
    The ship costs MCr159. It takes 16 months to construct.


    Let's say we're modestly successful and can spend 4.5 years of retirement pay on a robot helper.
    36,000 cr
    Spoiler
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    pilot-4, navigator-4, ship's boat-4, gravitics-4 [$7200 space-16/16/16/8] 72-54=18
    power interface, program interface, brain interface, video record & display, basic sensor package, voder [$6300 power-17 kg-15]
    low data logic (no learning, requires explicit commands), full natural language command [cpu-5 storage-15 $8000 int+2]
    linear cpu-5, standard storage-31(can only load 16 space of programs at a time) [liters-16.5 $9750 kg-3.6 power-1]
    urp-4 fuel cell [power+50 liters-60 kg-95 $1400 fuel-liter/hour-0.3d fuel-kg/liter-0.07]
    2x light arms 2x legs [20% chassis volume, power-4, liters-2, kg-12, $1070 dex+4 str+10]
    transmission-50 [power-25 liters-25 kg-50 $750, dex=4]
    chassis-6, large adult torso size, box, armor as mesh [150 liters, 15 kg, $1500]
    spotlight [power-1 kg-1 $50]
    500km radio [power-1.5 kg-1 $500]
    subtotal: $35970, power-0.5, kg-194, liters-47
    fuel space 100 hours [liters-30, kg-7.5]
    free space 16 liters -> let's put a bunch of little drawers and cabinets in it

    total: $35970, 201.5 kg, large adult torso size, box, armor as mesh, 2 arms, 2 legs, int 2, str 17, dex 8, edu 3, runs 100 hours on a fuel cell, has 16 liters of storage compartments. Two visual sensors, two audio sensors, a speaker for talking, bi-directional power cords, data/ethernet jacks, video camera & display screen, spotlight, and 500 km range radio. Skills are pilot-4, navigator-4, ship's boat-4, gravitics-4.
    Well it's pretty dumb and only runs one skill at a time, but it's good at doing what it's told and accepts natural language commands (although you do have to be pretty specific). Good for heavy lifting too. Plus we can buy more programs for it to use since it has to swap them out anyways. I suppose we could have gone for better CPUs and intelligence and financed it, but a $75k bot mortgages at $4500 a year for 20 years and this is just simpler.


    And from now on I'm referring to the DtD40k7e characters as Diplomat Bob and Gun Whore Bob...
    I dub thee bob's armada.
    Just a note i got adhd and autism.

  27. - Top - End - #27
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    Default Re: Magical MacGyver side-by-side comparison game

    Quote Originally Posted by NichG View Post
    You could do it like that, but the idea is to have a character that has matured fully into their schtick and is starting to need to advance horizontally.
    Yeah, that's... On the one hand, it's hard to call a 9th level 3e character "fully matured" compared to a Wizard 20+. OTOH, oldschool D&D, 9th level is where they start being forced into horizontal advancement (why does that sound dirty?).

    Hopefully, some other Playgrounders will play some of the same systems (obviously especially D&D) that I've made characters for, to give some range to the responses. And also some range to what power level they think is appropriate for this challenge, as mine might be kinda random.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ameraaaaaa View Post
    Some cool characters man. I'm especially excited to see how the vulcan, mtg, and m&m mutant can do. Depending on what challenges the "gm" gives us i can totally see any of these being useful.
    Those are certainly the 3 most likely to be able to solve the arbitrary challenges (the other M&M character being about equally likely, actually). The challenge of the thread, however, is to find out just how fun it is for each of them to succeed (or fail). Or, well, I suppose, how much of what kind of fun it is.

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    Default Re: Magical MacGyver side-by-side comparison game

    Quote Originally Posted by Ameraaaaaa View Post
    Ah a fellow rules light systems guy. Curious how james bond chuubo edition will compete with my trivia ninja risus edition.
    I probably could have made him "better" but where's the fun in that? I'm mostly curious to see how far his Gadgets will take him. Maybe I'll write up a Miraculous character, which will put the lie to "rules light" pretty quickly. Mortals are simple though!

    Quote Originally Posted by Quertus View Post

    Spoiler: MtG - don't ask
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    Also not really a character, just "can I McGyver a solution out of Magic cards?" I suspect that this not-a-character will give the strongest "Magical MacGyver" feel of any of my submissions.

    This is a really fun idea, and I'm not just saying that because I'd be obnoxiously good at it. Finally an adolescence compulsively memorizing Magic cards pays off! It'd be kind of interesting to give yourself a mana limit, so you can still have a "build". Or give yourself a score based on how much mana you used?
    Last edited by solidork; 2023-03-23 at 08:34 AM.

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    Default Re: Magical MacGyver side-by-side comparison game

    Quote Originally Posted by Ameraaaaaa View Post
    I dub thee bob's armada.
    I picked it up from the Reduced Shakespeare Company. If you don't want to remember a name, they're Bob.

    Also helps a bit in GMing. If I say an NPC's name is anything but Bob then they're important in some way, not just an extra from central casting.

  30. - Top - End - #30
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    Default Re: Magical MacGyver side-by-side comparison game

    Quote Originally Posted by solidork View Post
    This is a really fun idea, and I'm not just saying that because I'd be obnoxiously good at it. Finally an adolescence compulsively memorizing Magic cards pays off! It'd be kind of interesting to give yourself a mana limit, so you can still have a "build". Or give yourself a score based on how much mana you used?
    Yeah, putting all that memorized knowledge to use in other contexts does feel nice, eh? Ah, feel free to one-up me after I post my answers for this lack of a build. I suspect I was actually going to score myself on a) number of cards required; b) speed/effectiveness; c) real-world card cost.

    So, how much of their deck space did they need to dedicate to solving this problem, how quickly and thoroughly did they solve this problem, and how much would I have to spend to pick up these cards today?

    For that last one, I was secretly planning to try to limit myself to "cards I could have picked up for a dollar", with a clear preference for "card I could have picked up for a nickle". But... there's a lot of really expensive cards I used to be able to get quite cheap, so that's not as pauper a card list as it sounds.

    Feel free to use whatever limits you choose - your mana limit sounds much more... hmmm... "conventionally accessible", and, by giving yourself different constraints, you'll produce different answers than I do. Which might make reading our different responses more fun for everyone else?

    Or, heck, just enter your "mana limit mage" as its own entry, and then one-up my "pauper mage" after I post my answer!

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